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[Hanover Fist 1970]

Basic Tactics

As your characters learn new spells and talents, pre-built tactics (like Archer, Defender, or Scrapper)

start to appear when you select an option from the Presets pull-down menu. For example, the Healer

preset might appear empty for Morrigan at first, but tactics fill in automatically when she learns the Heal

spell. Select a tactics preset that corresponds to the sorts of actions you want the character to take.

Behavior

The behavior pull-down menu in the top-right corner of the tactics screen controls the character’s

general approach to combat, like when to attack, what distance to try to keep from enemies, when to

give chase, and when to switch between ranged and melee weapons. Essentially, tactics are specific

actions, while behaviors are generic reactions.

Custom Tactics

You can also create your own customs sets of tactics or modify the presets (but note that if you modify

one of the presets, then click SAVE PRESET, it no longer automatically fills up when you learn new

abilities—to preserve that feature, play around with the custom slots instead).

Let’s say we want the character to use a health poultice when his or her health falls too low. First, click on

a condition slot on the left side of the screen. From the menu that appears, first select which character you

want to evaluate. For this condition, we want to check the character’s own health, so pick SELF. Now another

menu opens; select HEALTH then < 50%. That’s your first condition: whenever that character’s health is less

than half, the game sees that this condition is true and activates the corresponding action.

Now you need to set up the action. Click on the slot on the right side of the screen next to the

condition you just created, then select “Use health poultice: least powerful.” (Save your strong

health poultices for the really dire situations; if this one isn’t strong enough, the condition activates

again and use another poultice.)

That’s it! Tactics always evaluate from the top down, so urgent requirements like healing should usually

go at the top. You can move a tactic up or down by dragging the number in front of it.

Tactics are particularly powerful when they help different party members support each other. For

example, if Morrigan is in your party and knows a healing spell, you can tell her to monitor all your party

members simultaneously and heal anyone in need. Since mages are weak in close combat, you can

then direct your warrior to always attack enemies who are targeting the mage (Enemy > Attacking Party

Member > Attacking Morrigan).

As your characters level up or learn additional ranks in the Combat Tactics skill, you gain more

condition/action slots on the screen, permitting more complicated battle plans.



Copied strait from the PDF manual.

[stoezgallamyn]

Holy crap, it's the exact same thing I wrote in your other tread! No one ever tries to help, ever, and certainly didn't in that thread! Definitely not me, I'm an unhelpful jerk!

stoezgallamyn wrote...

I can't believe I'm about to do this, but, all the good insults have been taken, so, here we go.



First,
the name of the character you're using is up at the top left. This is
pretty obvious, how you missed it, I don't know. Anyway, the whole
thing is set up as if/then statement. As in, "If this situation
happens, then do this".



Now, the left hand side of the
screen is your target's behavior (the "if" statement). There are a lot
of options here, but, really you're deciding what enemy to respond to.
If you choose "Enemy: Nearest", you target the nearest enemy. If you
choose "Morrigan attacked by melee attacker" you will target the
nearest opponent attacking Morrigan with melee attacks. Simple enough.



The
right hand side of the screen is your chosen action against the target,
or the "then" statement. Here is where you select what ability to use,
what weapons to switch to, or what modes to toggle on. With the
examples we used earlier, putting "Attack" with the target "Enemy:
Nearest" means your character will target the nearest enemy, move up,
and attack it. If you do "Shield Bash" for the "Morrigan attacked by
melee enemy", you will target an enemy attacking Morrigan in melee and
use Shield Bash on it. Again, pretty simple.



The
important thing is that they work in order. If tactic number one comes
up, your character will do that and ignore the following tactics. If it
does not, the character checks number two. So, putting "Enemy: Nearest
/ Attack" as your first option means your characters will never do
anything else, as there will always be a nearest enemy to attack in
combat. Generally accepted wisdom is to put healing-related things in
the first slot.



Now, personally, I think it's better
just to put everyone on "Enemy: Nearest / Attack", with some heal
spells at the front if you have them, and just give manual commands.
But, I like to micromanage, so, maybe that's just me. Do whatever works
for you.



As a note, I'm still not convinced you're not a
troll, so, I will not be responding to this again. I've given you ALL
the information you need on this system. If you can't figure it out
from this, don't expect me or anyone else to help further.

[V Delerious]

Wrexing has a good explanation.



Think of tactics as your character's behavior. Basically they are the things your character will do under certain conditions during combat.



You can have them do very specific things like use certain abilities at certain times etc. Attack certain enemies. Heal when a party member is at so much health etc.





The If/then statements listed are great examples

[Retriraver]

beyondconfused wrote...


How exactly do you set anything up in the tactics Menu and execute it?
Every time I ask this people have been doing nothing but saying what the tactics menu does, and or saying what the left and right sides do.

Great...and....

Now how do you set up the left or right sides for a specific character, and then once it's been set up, how do you execute it?

Explain what options you have to choose from on both sides, then using those options give a written example for each side, explaining:

1. Which character you are setting it up for, and how you know you are setting it for that character.

2. What options you are setting for that character.

3. Then explain how those options get executed when you have and what you do not have control of that character you set those options for.

4. Then explain exactly what is going to happen once those options you got set are actually going to do.


So there are 2 characters in my party, me and my dog,

Now we are just standing there and there are no monsters/enemies......I open my tactics menu and I do...what with it?

Now lets say I encounter monsters/enemies........I open my tactics menu and I do......What with it..?

A. You don't open your tactics menu after you get into battle. Generally you set the parameters BEFORE you go running around getting into battles. That's the whole point. You have the tactics tool so that you don't have to tell your party members to do every little thing during battle. What if you don't want to pause all the time and heal someone who has low HP? THAT is the kind of thing the tactics tool is for...

#1- To set up tactics for a specific character, you go to your tactics menu and click the arrow till you are on the character you want to set commands for. THAT character is the one you are assigning tactics for. The LEFT side is where you assign a target for that character to target, the RIGHT side is where you assign the action you want your character to perform on the target you have selected.

Once you set this up, you don't do anything to execute it! That is the whole point! You set up that set of rules so that you DON'T have to execute it yourself. It does it automatically.

Let's say I want to set up a tactic for a healer. I want my group to stay above say 50% HP to be safe during battle. I go to my mage healers tactics screen. I click on the first bar on the left section. I scroll through the TARGET options and select ally>>>>   health>>>>   <50% hp. I click on the top right section bar. I select the use ability button, then I select the Heal ability. This will automatically have my mage healer heal anyone in the party who falls below 50% HP.

#2- You are not setting any option for that character. You are setting a rule for that character. That character will perform the action you selected on the target you selected when the parameters are met. I.E The rule I set for the mage healer was to heal any party member below 50% hp with the heal spell. Falling below 50%hp activates that rule becuase That is the parameter I set in the tactics menu.

For example in my game I set my rogue to automatically disrup with dirty tactics anyone who attacks my healer. To do this I first went to my rogue tactics screen and then I selected:
LEFT side I chose enemy>>>>> attacking party member>>>>>>>>my healer
RIGHT side I selected the dirty tactics ability.
So now if any enemy attacks my healer, my rogue will automatically disrupt that enemy with  dirty tactics ability.

This all goes for any target or any action you so choose to set on each of your characters in each of their tactics menus.

#3- The rules you set in each characters tactics menu execute ON THERE OWN. That's the point of the tactics options. All your character will automatically do whatever you assigned in your tactics menu unless you take control of them, then you can have them do whatever you want. You have priority.

If you don't want to have to tell all your characters to attack each time you run into enemies, you could set the first tactic to all of your characters to target party leaders target (which would be you) and then click attack on the action side and save it.

#4- You run into monsters right? Now since you set tactics for all of your characters to attack your party leaders target, once you start attacking a target, all of your party members will attack your target too. That is what the tactics you set are telling them to do. And if one of your party members gets below 50% hp, well since you set your mage to heal anyone below 50% hp, well then your mage will automatically heal anyone below 50% hp.....

There ya go.

[Grahamers]

Now we are just standing there and there are no monsters/enemies......I open my tactics menu and I do...what with it?

Now lets say I encounter monsters/enemies........I open my tactics menu and I do......What with it..?

These two phrases indicate what yoru confusion is.  You don't do anything with the tactics menu while in combat.  It is a list fo rules that the selected character will follow whenever they are in combat, so you don't open it while in combat, you set it up before combat.
Imagine that it is a series of "If...then..." rules.  Example, here are some tactic rules you might set up nfor a rogue: 


1. IF my health drops below 50%, THEN drink the weakest health potion in our inventory.
2. IF I am surrounded by 3 or more enemies, THEN use my "Dual Weapon Sweep" attack.
3. IF the health of my enemy is greater than 90%, THEN use my "Dirty Fighting" stun attack..

Etc.

During combat, the compute CONSTANTLY checks to see if any of the IF conditions you set up for each chracter in their tactics window are true.  It starts with the condition on teh top of the list and goes through them in order until it finds one that is true.  When it finds one that is true, it stops there and executes teh command you have associated with that condition.  There is no manual internevntion needed by you and there is no noticible effect going on since the compute does these checks (presumably) many times every second of combat.

So, in the example of the the tactics for a rogue that I listed above, here are some scenarios that might play out:

(I use the term "rounds" to mean the passes taht the computer makes
through the tactics ruels.  I do not mean to bring to mind the
turn-based games like NWN where you have rounds of play.)


ROUND 1

Lets assume we go into combat and I don't give my rogue any instructions other than she is free to move on her own. 

Now let's assume that she gets hit by a lightning bolt which drops her health to 51% and at the same time she is surrounded by three deadspawn. Two of which are at 100% health, but the other one is at 5% health after having been it by an AOE on the way to get me.  What happens?  Let's do what the computer does and find out.

Is the the condition for rule #1 true?  No, my character is NOT below 50% health, so the computer moves on to rule number 2.

Is the condition for rule number 2 true?  Yes.  She is surrounded by at least 3 enemies.  Since this rule is true, the computer stops right there and makes my rogue execute the command I associated with the rule that is true, which, in this case, is "use my Dual Weapon Sweep attack."  So my rogue uses that skill. 

Does the computer ever get to rule number three on this split second pass through the rules?  No.  It stopped at rule 2 because it was true and it executed the rule two instructions.  Now the computer starts over and does another check as soon as I am done with me Dual Weapon Sweep move (which is over in a split second anyway). 

ROUND 2
Let's assume that during the time when I did my Dual Weapon Sweep move, I got hit by one of the enemies and I am now at 50% health and that I hit all three of my enemies.  One of them died and the other two are at 92% health now.  (Got to love Dual Weapon Sweep!)  What does the computer do now?  It starts the check again. 

Is rule #1 true?  No.  I am still not less than 50% health.  I am exacvtly 50% health, so the computer moves on. 

Is rule #2 true?  No.  Now I am not surrounded by three or more enemies.  I have two enemies around me.  The computer moves on.

Is rule #3 true?  Yes!  The enemy I have targeted has 90% or more health.  The computer stops here and executes the instructions I gave for rule #3 which is to use my Dirty Fighting move.  Then, it starts the check ALL over again.  (You can see how this happens many times each second!)

ROUND 3
Lets assume that while I was executing my Dirty Fighting move, I hit the target and stunned him and he is now at 87% health,  but I got hit so my health is at 40%.  The computer starts the checks again fromt he top.

Is rule #1 true?  Yes!  I am at less than 50% health.  The computer stops right there and executes the instructions I gave for rule #1 which is to use the weakest healing poition I have.  My rogue drinks teh potiona nd is brought back up to 100% health and the computer does what?  Starts checking the rules all over again!

Is rule #1 true?  No I am at 100% health.  The computer moves on.

Is rule #2 true?  No.  I am not surrounded by 3 or more enemies.  The computer moves on.

Is rule #3 true?  No.  My target is at 87% health.  The computer moves on.

Wait.  that's the end of my ruels!  What does the computer do?  It let's me do my normal melee attack and it starts at the top of the rule list again and checks to see if any rules are true.  This goes on many times each second for every character in yoru party as long as theya re fighting. 

Hope this helps!

Modifié par Grahamers, 05 novembre 2009 - 05:48 .

[Evolution13]

Guys, beyondconfused has been at this for *at least* 10 hours. I've watched people explain the tactical system in terms a tax collector could understand. I myself have gained a greater understanding of the tactical sytem from some of the more well thought out replies. If he still doesn't get it after all this He is beyondhelp and beyondhope! People have made youtube videos especially for him and he still doesn't get it.

Of course, it's more likely that he's just a troll. That everyone keeps feeding him is beyondbelief!

[Denlath Vestor]

Grahamers wrote...

Now we are just standing there and there are no monsters/enemies......I open my tactics menu and I do...what with it?

Now lets say I encounter monsters/enemies........I open my tactics menu and I do......What with it..?

These two phrases indicate what yoru confusion is.  You don't do anything with the tactics menu while in combat.  It is a list fo rules that the selected character will follow whenever they are in combat, so you don't open it while in combat, you set it up before combat.
Imagine that it is a series of "If...then..." rules.  Example, here are some tactic rules you might set up nfor a rogue: 

...
...
...

Excellent explanation! Concise and crystal clear. Detailed examples. Boy I hope that takes care of this poor sot's issues now...

[Grahamers]

Which is why I made my a seperate thread to help more people:

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/9/index/98039

[Grahamers]

Denlath Vestor wrote...

Excellent explanation! Concise and crystal clear. Detailed examples. Boy I hope that takes care of this poor sot's issues now...

thanks!

[beyondconfused]

make a video with narration about what you are doing in the tactics menu, and narrate how the chaarcters are using the options that are in this menu, as well as the actions being used, and narrate that that character is now doing in the game.what I did in the menu, and this is how it got executed

[Razcalking1978]

Oh, you poor, helpful fools. beyondconfused will not appreciate anything that any of you have written here. Because he's a troll. He does not actually need your help. Your kind words are humorous food for his twisted soul.

[Grahamers]

beyondconfused wrote...

make a video with narration about what you are doing in the tactics menu, and narrate how the chaarcters are using the options that are in this menu, as well as the actions being used, and narrate that that character is now doing in the game.what I did in the menu, and this is how it got executed

Known this.  Your trolling has actually ended up helping alot of people, so yoru goal to ****** us off has actually just made the community wiser and more informed.  Now, good day, sir.







I SAID GOOD DAY!

[Guy4142]

beyondconfused wrote...

make a video with narration about what you are doing in the tactics menu, and narrate how the chaarcters are using the options that are in this menu, as well as the actions being used, and narrate that that character is now doing in the game.what I did in the menu, and this is how it got executed

Just go away or get a bit of common sense, mabey go back to school?
I know how it works and i haven't even played the game, infact i knew how it would work the first time it was mentioned. don't play FFX  you'll be screwed then.

[Sansin]

That's cool how the OP can actually become MORE stupid as the thread goes on...



...a true /troll sign!!

[carlosjuero]

beyondconfused wrote...

make a video with narration about what you are doing in the tactics menu, and narrate how the chaarcters are using the options that are in this menu, as well as the actions being used, and narrate that that character is now doing in the game.what I did in the menu, and this is how it got executed

No. Just... No.

If you cannot be bothered to read the information that has been kindly provided by people (who have much more patience than I) then a video will not help you.

Not everyone has to enjoy all the features of this game, but if you ask for help.. and receive it.. please do not disregard the help that has been provided.

[Evolution13]

People were making him videos 10 hours ago..

[Holy Mortar]

Really... I've seen some annoying people, but this is the worst case. I never reported. NEVER!!! [omg, capslock!] But this person will get my vote I suppose...

[AS_Dodger]

Grahamers wrote...

beyondconfused wrote...

make a video with narration about what you are doing in the tactics menu, and narrate how the chaarcters are using the options that are in this menu, as well as the actions being used, and narrate that that character is now doing in the game.what I did in the menu, and this is how it got executed

Known this.  Your trolling has actually ended up helping alot of people, so yoru goal to ****** us off has actually just made the community wiser and more informed.  Now, good day, sir.







I SAID GOOD DAY!

Actually, this is true!  

[l8ytouyto8yfgp876t68_]

childofbhaal wrote...

beyondconfused wrote...

Ok I am letting you know, everything you posted above is all 100% unclear because you are epic failing to explain HOW THE LEFT AND RIGHT SIDES GET SET UP AND USED everyone only keeps saying what the left and right sides are used for......

You are acting monumentally stupid.

You click. That is HOW you set up the tactics. You CLICK the row you want to set on the left side, you navigate the pull down option to the condition on which you want an action to take place. Eg. health <50%. One you have set that condition, THEN you set the action you will take on the left side, by CLICKING on the row you just set the condition and navigating the menu to pick you option.

Its like say:
How do I get to the subway
*I give you the direction*
*You respond* NO! THAT IS THE WAY TO THE SUBWAY. HOW DO I GET THERE. HOW DO I MOVE MY LEGS.

So idiotic. He probably won't even read the answer.

Nice....couldn't have put it better myself.

[Lominia]

AS_Dodger wrote...

Grahamers wrote...

beyondconfused wrote...

make a video with narration about what you are doing in the tactics menu, and narrate how the chaarcters are using the options that are in this menu, as well as the actions being used, and narrate that that character is now doing in the game.what I did in the menu, and this is how it got executed

Known this.  Your trolling has actually ended up helping alot of people, so yoru goal to ****** us off has actually just made the community wiser and more informed.  Now, good day, sir.







I SAID GOOD DAY!

Actually, this is true!  

very true. i haven't played yet & all this info has been really useful.

just hope the game is half as amusing as this guys threads

[thepayne78]

Playing it on the PS3 myself and I have not really bothered with the tactics. The only tactic I have changed is to have characters heal themselves when health is below 50%. Did not even bother reading the manual myself just went into the tactics menu and just started fooling around to see what the different options where.