220 réponses à ce sujet

[MrBiggens]

guys, does it really matter? your talking about an hour of total playtime (talking to your LI and cutscene). its a sidequest that you get an achievement. play the damn game and stfu u ****ing ****gots. jesus christ

[elearon1]

What are you talking about? There are no real F/F relationships in ME2.



You get a quick, uncomfortable kiss and the vaguest of references to your relationship with Liara ... then a meaningless erotic dance from your assistant Kelly - who isn't really even a character. (they bring this home by not giving you badge credit for a relationship even if she comes to your room ... it is more of a one night stand than anything else)



I am more offended by the fact that the only thing even vaguely F/F like on board your ship is a meaningless and tasteless one night stand. (though I could see where there might be a comedic element to that, since you'd never expect it of Kelly - but that was overshadowed by my disappointment) I know it isn't Bioware's intention to suggest that's the only kind of relationship a homosexual woman could have, but that is the way it comes across.



Jack - who even states that she has had girlfriends in the past - outright shoots you down when you think you're on that road - stating she doesn't like women. (thus contradicting her previous statements)



I had thought that - if anyone would be available for a Fem love interest it would have been Tali - but no such luck there either. (though when she states the reasons you couldn't link up together, your sex is nowhere in that list)



Yeah, I was disappointed with most of the LI options in ME2 ... they aren't represented as well as in the first game - or their other games, such as Dragon Age. Considering how much more three dimensional many of the characters in this game were I find that an odd decision.

[Kyero]

a little hint Eleron, Girlfriend doesnt always mean lesbian when a girl says it.



Girlfriend = a girls best friend.

[Erode_The_Soul]

MrBiggens wrote...

guys, does it really matter? your talking about an hour of total playtime (talking to your LI and cutscene). its a sidequest that you get an achievement. play the damn game and stfu u ****ing ****gots. jesus christ

It doesn't matter how important it was to the total playtime of the game. Each individual player has a different experience from one another; for many people, the romantic aspect of the game helped shape their character, and played an important role regardless of how long the game allowed them to engage in the relationship.

But, none of that even matters in the context of this conversation because we're just having a discussion about possible reasons why homosexual options were left out. There's no need to be derogatory.

[elearon1]

Yes yes, I'm aware ... but it seemed very promising until after that conversation ... even if they didn't have sex it would have been nice for Tali to share a moment with you seeing her without the helmet. (not you the player, but the character. She can't link up because you're not wearing a suit, but she could have sat and talked and shared an intimate friend time ... seeing as you may die soon)

[Vinditater]

Clearly you weren't paying attention during the Lore session of the Advanced Training Videos. It clearly states if two dudes back-hug, a new Reaper/Archdemon is born and a horrible Blight/Space Tragedy ensues.

[agrue]

Obvious answer: Morinth has a ****.

[jamnkick]

Huh, while I can understand why Bioware would exclude a full m/m and f/f romance (and one that doesn't kill you) I'm still miffed by the fact that there wasn't any in ME2. ): I like to have options for my characters, even if it means making several different player characters just to see what would happen.

Modifié par jamnkick, 30 janvier 2010 - 05:33 .

[GreyWolf83]

I don't see the problem, either. I personally wouldn't choose the m/m option, but I still think that it should be available for those who might want to go that route.



And as far as it being left out because watching a sci-fi version of Brokeback Mountain might offend some people...I don't quite see this as being a proper justification for leaving the option out of the game. After all, you wouldn't exactly be *forced* to have your male Shep participate in a homosexual relationship, now, would you? It would merely be an available option for the players to choose for themselves.

[Kyandid]

There's also the possibility that Bioware left it out for just this game, in order to hook the action-gamer market without anything that might cause too many gripes, and intends to include it in the climax of the series, ME3.



Whatever the case, I still can't come up with a reason that actually seems rational.

[-Area51-Silent]

consider what defines the sex of different races. The idea in the game is that some races have no defined sex, and that very well could be the case. like, I went completely Cpt.Kirk in the 1st ME and went with Liara'Tsoni and even though the preception of a female is there, the idea of an Omni-sex race is as well, where there is no sexual definition (An entire race of homosexuals due to no hetero-existance). The fact that they are female-like is more out of necessity than anything else, because as blessed as men are, we cannot actually produce an offspring (by that mean birth it).



So there ya go! you could call it whatever you want, but outside of human interactions it would be difficult, I suppose they threw that into Dragon Age;Origins, and you could say a bit does exist in...



*SPOILER*

















Miranda, considering her Origin of being only from her fathers DNA and what not. To be honest most of the crew's preferences are fairly unknown, they hand out some personal information, but not very much in the ways of sex (outside of the ones that want to jump your bones upon entry.) least thats my view.

[hawat333]

Yay! Finally! I really hoped for a thread like this, as I didn't see one in the last thirty minutes!



Hey, I'd prefer they made more LI's available rather then made some homosexual ones. Just to add another opinion.



But I really don't get the great wuss-wuss about it. Is this really the point of the game? Ok, I understand that for teenagers seeing two boobs rubbed together is everything in a videogame, but come on, drop it. There are enough topics about it.



If anything, I demand Krogan M/M action!

[DirkD13]

I agree too, I thought bioware had successfully gotten past all the homophobic bull**** with DAO, and now they completely do a 180 with mass effect 2. I have not started a playthrough on a fem shep yet, but it will be the easiest playthrough for me not to cheat on liara.



Personally I want to know where the supposed 'sexual content' is in this game. All I have seen is kissing fully clothed the entire time. The only scene that is remotely sexual is the one with Miranda.

[mcvxiii]

Kyandid wrote...

No homosexuality in KotOR was a-okay. It was a different time back then, and going through with something like that would've stepped on a ton of people's toes. It doesn't make it quite right, but 100% understandable why Bioware wouldn't go that route. Sure, after a male and a female, I felt Carth was a douche compared to Bastila, but I can forgive them for the inequality.

In all fairness that had more to do with LucasArts than BioWare. Anything Star Wars related needs their seal of approval to go forward. I have yet to encounter anything resembling a m/m romantic relationship in anything Star Wars beyond atrociously written fan/slash fiction. Star Wars is like its inspiration the old movie serials, intended mostly for a pre-adult audience and the conventions of that era. The romantic relationships in Star Wars are corny, corny, corny and wouldn't be out of place in the 30s or 40s.

I don't that this has anything to do with EA at all. EA does have and had it's faults but they have never shied away from m/m romantic relationships in the past in some of their games. I think it has more to do with ecomonical/resources decisions than anything else. Based on past post of those at BioWare when this was brought up they seem to believe, rightly or wrongly, that the gay male game buying demographic is very small and that is the demographic that would mostly play a m/m romantic relationship. I give those at BioWare much credit for their including m/m romantic relationships in some of their past games.

Modifié par mcvxiii, 30 janvier 2010 - 07:50 .

[Sinborn]

Hrm. Honestly, there are no male characters in the cast that would rationally engage in such a relationship. Or maybe, just maybe, Bioware was focusing on building the game instead of sating the vocal minority. Call it intentional oversight if you want, but it really isn't that big of a deal. If you personally feel segregated just because ME2 did not cater to your sexuality in a fictional universe, then you're suffering from a complex.



On the other hand, you could get something like the Kelly and have a relationship emptier than a husk. In all fairness, neither same-sex pairs got a fair shot at romance.



Remember people, Bioware doesn't rate its own games. The ESRB does. Go QQ at them for your lack of ho-yay.

[Kilroy867530]

EA, Bioware, somebody somewhere doesn't think the savior of the universe should be sleeping with dudes in his off-time. It's really as simple as that. As a gay, does that bother me? Eh. It might if there were anyone worth sleeping with on the Normandy. 'Cept Joker. But Shepard would probably break him.

[Speakeasy13]

Kilroy867530 wrote...

EA, Bioware, somebody somewhere doesn't think the savior of the universe should be sleeping with dudes in his off-time. It's really as simple as that. As a gay, does that bother me? Eh. It might if there were anyone worth sleeping with on the Normandy. 'Cept Joker. But Shepard would probably break him.

Um, Garrus and Thane would make good options. The former because there is already a firm bromance between the two, and the latter because, well, he fits the stereotype. At least I would do both of em in a heart beat if I were Shepard. Wrex too, if only he were on the Normandy with me. Like Garrus, the bromance is alrdy there. And gosh do I like husky big men with a heart of gold.

Personally? I don't believe in stereotypes. Gay men come in all shapes and forms, and to say that "some1 doesn't look gay" is unfair to say the least. No1 looks gay or not gay. They just are or are not.

[mcvxiii]

Sinborn wrote...

Hrm. Honestly, there are no male characters in the cast that would rationally engage in such a relationship..

Hm. Honestly that is your opinion. Every character can be interpreted in as many ways as there are people interpreting them and perhaps it is really isn't that big of a deal... to you. If they are catering to Talimances or Garussexers, both groups whom I do believe are in a ' very vocal minority" of players then a same sex male relationship imo is  not too much to ask.

Hm. Honestly you seem to be the one with some sort of "complex".

[FifthReplicant]

Yeah, this situation is pretty upsetting. I would have been fine with one F/F or no F/F relationships at all.  But two F/F and no M/M?  This makes it seem like Bioware has something against M/M gay relationships.  This is especially disappointing since dialogue was recorded for a M/M relationship with Mordin, but obviously excluded.

I was really looking forward to the game, but this has really tarnished it a bit for me.  I like playing as male shepard and I'd really like to romance a dude.

At this point I'm wondering if anyone would be oboard with signing a letter requesting an official response from Bioware on this?  I think the gay fans of Bioware deserve some response as to why it was cut or why it is not in.  

[-Area51-Silent]

Think of it this way, if you chose Liara its not really gay, its not really straight..it just is. Secondly, this is their story to tell the way they choose to tell it, if you choose not go to down the line of the romantic subplot because you don't want to, then don't.



While I do understand some of the sexual promiscuity that a few of the female characters have (while I agree that it makes no sense to have F/F and not M/M) the story is very much theirs to curb the way they want to. Perhaps it wasn't that they couldnt find a way to make Shepard that way but the male counter-parts on the ship based on the complex relationships that your shipmates are supposed to have. The only viable solution would be Samara. consider this:



Jacob: Used to be interested in Miranda (wouldn't work)

Garrus: Had a wife (still wouldnt work)

Mordin: If you listen to the bachelor party for the Salarian, sexual encounters are purely for breeding

Thane: Had a wife, still has a kid

Zheed: doesnt really talk to you :-(

[EchoTango]

I never realized there were so many ridiculously-easily-offendable gay guys who played Mass Effect

[TaliZorah]

-Area51-Silent wrote...

Jacob: Used to be interested in Miranda (wouldn't work)
Garrus: Had a wife (still wouldnt work)
Mordin: If you listen to the bachelor party for the Salarian, sexual encounters are purely for breeding
Thane: Had a wife, still has a kid
Zheed: doesnt really talk to you :-(

Eh.. what?

Let me guess, you haven't played Jade Empire, right?

You know, it's not THAT rare that men who are (or were) married fell in love with another dude.

It's often like "Hey, look, I'm not gay or something like that, but YOU are... well, quite special. An exception."

.... Sky, for example, was like that.

[-Area51-Silent]

Perhaps thats true in context, I have never played Jade empire, you are correct. I suppose anything is possible but not if they didnt built it into the characters psyche. Consider this as well (though its a weak argument it still works) The reason they cut back on the sex scenes was more than likely because of the massive fire they caught from the media over "ZOMG PIXLE BOOBIES" which is the most absurd thing but I'm not in charge so oh well.

When Dragon Age:Origins came out they caught a heap load of fire from various places because the M/M relationship that was possible, but not over the F/F relationships that were possible. I hate to say they are curbing their games to avoid media fire, but...They are curbing their games to avoid media fire. They didnt recieve as much fire for the F/F relationships but I saw several articles come out about he M/M relationship (stupid double standard I know, i didnt write the rules).

When game companies finally realize that the media has no bearing, and most people who agree with the statements being made more than likely wont buy the game anyway while those that play the game for the pure purpose and allow relationships to grow using what used to be the "+17 rating" to allow passion to be some how displayed between two people without some stick up their butt reporter and irresponsible parent trying to bring em down like a drug dealer by an elementary school, we will never get the purity of storytelling that we are looking for.

lengthy statement I know, I just hate doublestandards and censorship.

Modifié par -Area51-Silent, 31 janvier 2010 - 01:04 .

[JMKnave]

I think it's much simpler than all of that. LIs have been around for a long time when it comes to Bioware. We're talking back to BG and BG2 and they've experimented with all of the above since then in many of their games.

I think the limited options probably has to do with this being a trilogy. This is one of the few games where you can import a character from a previous game, along with several large choices that affect the entire world the game is set in. While it's amazing to have your choices actually impact the entire ME universe, it can also be a nightmare when it comes to implementation because you actually have to account and write for each and every one of the possible outcomes.

I think this is also the reason why the ME1 relationships were sort of "ended" abruptly in ME2. I think they realized that with ME1 being a success and the opportunity for the trilogy being realized, some of the decisions they made in the first game weren't feasible to carryover through to the end. So in essence, ME2 was a "clean the slate" kinda deal with LIs. Limiting LIs to 3 per gender is much more controllable for the future. And don't forget that your choices and your party members that survive, including any LIs, could very well continue in ME3. I suspect that because of this, ME3 may very well be much more open in the LI department.

Modifié par JMKnave, 31 janvier 2010 - 01:12 .