220 réponses à ce sujet

[AdmiralCheez]

Okay, I was going to just leave you alone until I hit the last sentence.

ReconTeam wrote...

 Besides for the whole military discipline matter I believe the gay population will be significantly smaller by that time due to genetic modification and medical advances.

Military discipline = NO SEX WHAT-SO-F*CKING-EVER.

As for the second part...  My God, what the hell is wrong with you?  Are you telling me that I need to see a doctor because I like women as much as I like men?  That I have a disease because I am somewhat attracted to people of my own gender?  That my DNA is broken and needs to be fixed because I can find love and happiness with another girl?

This is the crap I won't stand for.  I'm not gonna sit here and let jerks like you tell me I'm sick in the brain, that it's wrong for me to want people with similar "problems" to be fairly represented in the mainstream media.  Like it or not, people of all genders and sexual orientations play videogames.  It's time for the developers to stop tiptoeing around it and at least acknowledge the fact.

And if they can't, at least admit it and tell us why.

[Xilizhra]

ReconTeam wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
Now I'm curious: would you support this?

Support what? Such a thing being forced on grown adults? No, because despite my beliefs they are adults who can make their own decisions.

No, it being used on fetuses.

[Infinite Legend_]

there's also that one Turian(the one that laughs at the Vorcha) who has a human male walk in to a room while he is sitting on a bed in one of the Lotsb videos.

Modifié par Infinite Legend , 17 décembre 2010 - 01:49 .

[AdmiralCheez]

Infinite Legend wrote...

there's also that one Turian(the one that laughs at the Vorcha) who has a human male walk in to a room while he is sitting a bed in one of the Lotsb videos.

Gavorn's up to his tricks again, I see.

[jwalker]

Wait ... people actually believe that being gay is because some sort of genetic disorder that needs to be cured ?

That's just a lame attempt of masking homophobia with 'science'



*facepalm*

[jlb524]

jwalker wrote...

Wait ... people actually believe that being gay is because some sort of genetic disorder that needs to be cured ?
That's just a lame attempt of masking homophobia with 'science'

*facepalm*

Indeed.

I think Joker should be an m/m option in ME3...I might actually finish my ManShep to romance him then.

[Xilizhra]

Damn it, I have to leave before I get to see Recon Team's response to my question. Oh well. Carry on without me, comrades.



Liara 4ever.

[Infinite Legend_]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Infinite Legend wrote...

there's also that one Turian(the one that laughs at the Vorcha) who has a human male walk in to a room while he is sitting a bed in one of the Lotsb videos.

Gavorn's up to his tricks again, I see.

Maybe him and Dudeshep can hang out, I mean if I can't have Garrus he'll make a good replacement  (he seems to like humans to boot)

[C9316]

I wouldn't mind. If they include F/F it's only fair to include M/M. But at least add colored dialouge so you aren't dragged into a gay romance unintentionally. Also why are we talking about gene therapy? Last time I checked sexual orientation was a choice.

[MisterDyslexo]

jwalker wrote...

Wait ... people actually believe that being gay is because some sort of genetic disorder that needs to be cured ?
That's just a lame attempt of masking homophobia with 'science'

*facepalm*

Of course there's a lot of people who feel that way because of homophobia, but there are some theories for and against doing this. One reason for is that since homsexuality is sorta sterility, that it hurts the human race, and is anti-human even though it goes along with darwinism. Of course a lot of people have theories that there are reasons for homosexuality. One is that it keeps the population from becoming too high. Another one (which I find very interesting) is one that has to do with courting. Since homosexuals, human or animal, seem to have higher intelligence, understanding, etc (if you belive legit studies that is anyways), its that darwinism favoured them to pass on their genes, and will only be swaye enough to the oppisite sex if the mate is equally genetically superior over the rest. Now while I'm sure some people saying "But its science!" are homophobic, surely not all of them are. To be a scientist you generally have to be a progressive thinker.

Modifié par MisterDyslexo, 17 décembre 2010 - 02:02 .

[Eromenos]

ReconTeam wrote...

Eromenos wrote...
Each of your contentions is illogical, but even if one of them were real it still does not give BioWare any excuses to exploit women and the queer community while proclaiming that their hands are clean.

They had a choice to not portray adult intimacy. They had a choice to not dabble into something they can't do right by. To not play with F/F just for titillation while simultaneously denying even any hint of M/M. They opened themselves to criticism. You don't need to make their excuses for them.

Well I'm guessing we won't see eye to eye when it comes to what is "logical." However they are not "exploiting" anybody in the slightest by not including something. Their hands are clean. If people of a certain ethnic descent are not featured in ME are those people also being exploited by Bioware?

I wouldn't say that ME's been particularly strong on racial diversity. Put it this way- I gagged when I heard a few from Lord of the Rings' all-white cast crowing about how their characters were symbolic of cooperation and peace between different races. Yet what did the Big Bad's human armies look like?

Fictional allegories are little more than evasive tactics to preserve systems of disparity that have outlived their illusions. The X-Men universe understandably resonates with the queer community, but we've not seen any M/M or F/F behavior onscreen(the mass media telecommunications) in any way, much less the way Wolverine/Jean/Cyclops do around each other. Instead X-Men "played with" the coming-out scenario in one movie using a straight mutant who fit the mold of a CW-denizen, with a girlfriend onstage and on-hand. That is exploitation. That is hypocrisy.

Are there any good reasons to exclude? No. Any bad reasons? Yes. BioWare is choosing to hit all of them.

Modifié par Eromenos, 17 décembre 2010 - 02:00 .

[MisterDyslexo]

C9316 wrote...

I wouldn't mind. If they include F/F it's only fair to include M/M. But at least add colored dialouge so you aren't dragged into a gay romance unintentionally. Also why are we talking about gene therapy? Last time I checked sexual orientation was a choice.

A lot of scientists, geneticists or otherwise, would disagree with you. There's a lot of evidence pointing towards the fact its genetic, and moreso in the X chromosome, than there is that its a choice. There's a quickly growing wave among phycologist thinking that its not a choice as well.

[AlexMBrennan]

@MisterDyslexo: I fear that you may be heading into very dangerous territory here. At least quote the studies; I don't trust secondary sources (e.g. popular media), and certainly not some guy on the internet

[Bio Addict]

rynluna wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
I think they mean as prenatal gene therapy.

Who would want to do that to their kids, then?  *waits for people to argue that being gay isn't easy*  It's not but I'm not going to alter someone's genes because I'm afraid they'll turn out gay.  There's nothing wrong with being gay.

I've seen this discussion crop up in other places before.  The arguement goes that, no matter where most people fall on the spectrum of tolerance towards homosexuals, there probably aren't that many heterosexual couples out there that dream of having gay kids as their life experiences would be too different from their own and they would'nt have any grandchildren.  I imagine if a heterosexual couple who had no problem with gays, supported gay rights, and never uttered a homophobic comment in their entire lives were told that their unborn child was going to be gay but could be made straight through routine gene therapy they'd probably opt for the therapy.

[Inquisitor Recon]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
Military discipline = NO SEX WHAT-SO-F*CKING-EVER.

Yes but matters become even worse from a morale standpoint if for example two male superior officers happen to be doing it.

As for the second part...  My God, what the hell is wrong with you?  Are you telling me that I need to see a doctor because I like women as much as I like men?  That I have a disease because I am somewhat attracted to people of my own gender?  That my DNA is broken and needs to be fixed because I can find love and happiness with another girl?

What the hell is wrong with me? I am trying my hardest to be civil when it get reactions like yours. I gave my honest opinions on the matter and if your going to take it personally so be it. Yes yes I am a horrible person for my views despite the fact that I am not suggesting doing anything against one's will. I think I'm going to drink blood from a human skull or something equally suitable now.

This is the crap I won't stand for.  I'm not gonna sit here and let jerks like you tell me I'm sick in the brain, that it's wrong for me to want people with similar "problems" to be fairly represented in the mainstream media.  Like it or not, people of all genders and sexual orientations play videogames.  It's time for the developers to stop tiptoeing around it and at least acknowledge the fact.
And if they can't, at least admit it and tell us why.

I'm not saying your sick or it makes you a bad person or anything like that. I just view the matter differently than you do. The mainstream media at least here in the United States has no such problem with homosexuality, but regardless the gaming industry doesn't owe explanations. The beast goes where the money is.

jwalker wrote...

Wait ... people actually believe that being gay is because some sort of genetic disorder that needs to be cured ?
That's just a lame attempt of masking homophobia with 'science'

*facepalm*

A weak response, you know that right? Go ahead and tell me why I am "homophobic" by the 'scientific' defintion of yours.

Modifié par ReconTeam, 17 décembre 2010 - 02:14 .

[MisterDyslexo]

AlexMBrennan wrote...

@MisterDyslexo: I fear that you may be heading into very dangerous territory here. At least quote the studies; I don't trust secondary sources (e.g. popular media), and certainly not some guy on the internet

Ok I'll steer clear of dangerous waters.

Still, I want to hear the response from ReconTeam. I willing to hear him out if his argument's civil and isn't something along the lines of "Ewww! Teh gheys r icky!!!"

Modifié par MisterDyslexo, 17 décembre 2010 - 02:13 .

[Eromenos]

transcendent12 wrote...

Maybe they picked out the relationships out of the hat and M/M got the short straw due to development cost and time. While it might alienate some communities and the liberals it is quite representative of society. I don't really know any gay people, maybe a few bi and I don't get the urge to find some new friends which are gay just to make everything nice and even. When you write a story you don't go, right we need 3 gay men, 3 lesbians, 3 bi sexual, 3 straight. tick tick tick. Granted bioware opened the door to relationships but that doesn't mean they have to contrive something outside an original story to cater for every demographic including those who want shepard to have relationships with cats and dogs. (indeed, not that liberal)

What could be more original than backing up a Marine/Navy commander who achieves the impossible, perhaps greatly out of love for another man or for another woman? That's a choice some of us would be happy to explore, in the same way that you probably do with NPCs of the opposite sex. Most of the dialogue doesn't specify the protagonist as male or female anyway. It's absolutely doable, BioWare even shipped with the framework in place. And not for the first time.

[shumworld]

I support M/M relationships. If we got a F/F relationships then it's only fair.



Other then that this thread is getting really ugly, the Mods or Devs need to lock this thread down.

[Pacifien]

For the person who resurrected this thread, it is preferable for one to start a thread anew rather than respond to one that hasn't received any posts in months. But for this topic, you would have likely been redirected to this thread that is currently ongoing.

I remind everyone that real life sociopolitical discussions really have no place in this gaming forum. This is laid out in the Site Rules.

And while I'm at it, if you find a thread that is in need of a moderator's attention, you will have far better luck getting that moderator's attention if you report the thread via a PM. Thank you.

Modifié par Pacifien, 17 décembre 2010 - 02:15 .