62 réponses à ce sujet

[shortman00]

On my first playthrough, I sided with Jack and, not knowing it at the time, screwed up my chances with Miranda and lost her loyalty. I didn't ever get enough Paragon or Renegade points to get her loyalty back, but she DID survive the final mission, so I think having completed the crews' loyalty missions increases their chances of survival (but having either Jack or Miranda NOT LOYAL has no bearing on whether they survive, as long as you finish their loyalty mission).



I'm currently on my second playthrough, and I sided with Miranda during the argument this time (I'm trying to get the Paramore achievement). Now, Jack is pissed and I'm trying to regain her loyalty. Here's some advice that I'm trying to work out:



Finish both Jack and Miranda's loyalty missions, then, if you don't have at least 80% Paragon or Renegade points, do Samara's loyalty mission. During the mission, SIDE WITH SAMARA and let her kill Morinth. You'll be presented with the dialog option to ask if she's OK or not. Then, she'll ask if you're ready to leave, and select 'Not Yet'. You'll get +2 Paragon; this can be repeated over and over until you get as many as you need to fill up your Paragon meter. You can't save while in Morinth's apartment after the fight, so if you want to do this, you'll have to do it in one sitting. Beware, however, that trying to fill up your Paragon meter with this method will take A LONG TIME.



I've heard, though, that having either 100% Paragon or Renegade can't bring back either Jack's or Miranda's loyalty if you weren't able to stop the argument WITHOUT having to choose a side. Still trying it out, though.

[archurban]

jack is wrong decision by cerberus. I don't understand how 'smart' illusive man chose her as dossier. she is completely disaster no matter what she is loyalty or not. since I have known this fact, I don't care her anymore. I just go with Miranda. but I still get 'no one left behind' achievement easily. just don't do anything with her for final mission. choose different. you will be fine.

[Nightvision91]

I allowed Jack to destroy the Cerberus facility. On my cannon Shepard it was clear that I was not a fan of Cerberus. Thankfully I had enough Paragon that I defused the situation between the two.

[Rekondo]

Does it have anything to do with difficulty maybe? I mean, I'm almost full on Pargon, playing veteran, and I cant seem to get the paragon choice... >:C

[Jackal904]

For the love of god people. Look at how old the last post is before you decide to comment.

[Pacifien]

Rekondo wrote...
Does it have anything to do with difficulty maybe? I mean, I'm almost full on Pargon, playing veteran, and I cant seem to get the paragon choice... >:C

It's not the difficulty, it's how many paragon choices you have made in the game versus how many have been available to you. This is how some people have managed to get a full paragon bar without ever having the choice available to them.

My first suggestion would be to retrain your powers if your passive class power isn't the one that gives you the 100% paragon/renegade boost. If that doesn't work, you may be able to regain loyalty if you still have quite a few missions to go and you choose every single paragon option possible, then go to talk to the one whose loyalty you lost.

If that doesn't work, keep in mind that you don't need their loyalty in order for them to survive the suicide mission. Just don't give the nonloyal squadmate any of the key roles and don't take them with you.

For the math explanation, think of the conflict needing 70% of the paragon points that were available to you up until that point. Say you've managed 70 points and 100 total points were available. You have your 70%. Alternatively, say you've managed 70 points but 120 total points had been available. Now you don't have the 70% required to get the paragon option. Do the missions earlier, less likely to have missed more of the total paragon points, ratio of your points to total points is greater.

[FROST4584]

You don't need that amount of paragon 70% or above. The longer you wait to do loyality missions after they ask for your help , the higher the amount of paragon or rengade, it will take to resolve a issue. If you wait to do Jack/Miranda's loyality mission to long ,the requirements in the fight will go up high enough it will make you choose between.

The best thing to do is do every loyality mission as soon as possible. In case of Miranda and Jack all you need is a small amount of paragon or renegade so you won't have to choose between the two, The same with Tali and Legion. I've also noticed this when it comes to character's loyality missions. The longer you wait, the more options will be greyed out so you can't choose them.

Bottom line: Do loyality missions AS SOON as they become a option. DO NOT wait to do these.

Time plays a major factor in Mass Effect 2. Just like the time you have left to save your crew from the Collectors. The longer you wait the more bad things will happen.

Modifié par FROST4584, 10 juin 2010 - 05:58 .

[JaegerBane]

FROST4584 wrote...

You don't need that amount of paragon 70% or above. The longer you wait to do loyality missions the higher the amount of paragon or ren, it will take to resolve a issue. If you wait to do Jack/Miranda's loyality mission to long the requirements in the fight will go up high enough it will make you choose between.

The best thing to do is do every loyality mission as soon as possible. In case of Miranda and Jack all you need is a small amount of paragon or renegade so you won't have to choose between the two, The same with Tali and Legion. I've also noticed this when it comes to character's loyality missions. The longer you wait, the more options will be greyed out so you can't choose them.

Bottom line: Do loyality missions AS SOON as they become a option. DO NOT wait to do these.

It does seem like this is the issue. I've always done the missions in a recruitment-loyalty-side mission order, and I've never had a problem with it.

That said, I've never had a problem with Tali vs Legion either, and that's often the last thing I do before heading through the Omega 4 Relay.

[Pacifien]

The 70% figure in my post was just a theoretical number, and it didn't refer to 70% filling of the paragon bar so much as 70% of the paragon points available to you. If you wait until the very last second to do these loyalty missions, you can still get the charm option to pop up if you were a mad paragon chooser throughout the whole game, maximizing the amount of paragon options you can possibly get.

But most players aren't going to go for maximum paragon choices. They might be generally paragon, but some choices give them less paragon points than others and sometimes there's the occasional renegade interrupt thrown in. This is why it's easier to do the missions sooner, because you're less likely to have missed more of these maximum paragon point options.

Also, I've seen it said that it's easier to get the renegade option for Miranda/Jack while it's easier to get the paragon option for Tali/Legion.

Modifié par Pacifien, 10 juin 2010 - 06:08 .

[Collider]

ME2's persuasion system is stupid.

[Jackal904]

Collider wrote...

ME2's persuasion system is stupid.

It makes sense, it's just too limiting. I have to be a saint or a total dick or else I'll miss out on important charm/intimidate options. I just want to make decisions and choose the dialogue options that I want to. Not the options that give me the most paragon or renegade points.

Modifié par Jackal904, 10 juin 2010 - 08:01 .

[Pacifien]

I don't think they should limit your ability to resolve situations in whatever manner your Shepard sees fit, but allowing a paragon or renegade solution should allow Shepard to be a lot more creative with how he goes about it. Possibly leading to better monetary reward. That way there's still an incentive to try to get the paragon/renegade points, but you're not going to be punished for it.

Or they should completely overhaul the entire system, but I've mentioned that in some other thread awhile back and I don't feel like retyping what I thought. But Bioware should totally listen to me because... I can make them a great cake. I'm not lying.

[FROST4584]

Pacifien wrote...

The 70% figure in my post was just a theoretical number, and it didn't refer to 70% filling of the paragon bar so much as 70% of the paragon points available to you. If you wait until the very last second to do these loyalty missions, you can still get the charm option to pop up if you were a mad paragon chooser throughout the whole game, maximizing the amount of paragon options you can possibly get.

But most players aren't going to go for maximum paragon choices. They might be generally paragon, but some choices give them less paragon points than others and sometimes there's the occasional renegade interrupt thrown in. This is why it's easier to do the missions sooner, because you're less likely to have missed more of these maximum paragon point options.

Also, I've seen it said that it's easier to get the renegade option for Miranda/Jack while it's easier to get the paragon option for Tali/Legion.

Sorry I mis understood

[Collider]

Jackal904 wrote...

Collider wrote...

ME2's persuasion system is stupid.

It makes sense, it's just too limiting. I have to be a saint or a total dick or else I'll miss out on important charm/intimidate options.

That is essentially why I think it is stupid. Persuasion shouldn't be tied to how many paragon or renegade points Shepard has. We should be, as you said, able to choose whatever we feel is appropriate for Shepard. Instead of paragon and renegade points being the prerequisite for charm/intimidate, they should just have a persuasion skill.

Another stupid thing in ME2's system is that if you wait too long neither charm nor intimidate are available to you..and Shepard could have 99% paragon or renegade. 

I just want to make decisions and choose the dialogue options that I want to. Not the options that give me the most paragon or renegade points.

I agree with that.

Modifié par Collider, 10 juin 2010 - 09:45 .

[Vaampyren]

JUST got to this point in the game as well, i have a mix feeling, first i felt like why the hell do i have to chosse between them so early on, after all i havent played it for that long yet but after 2 day not i feel like ok it real life stuff like that happends and we make choices so now i dont think about it as much.
So i cant decide for sure if this is a bad or good thing

I felt like i was making Jack be on the good side and let her trust me , also i want to have an afair with Miranda if its possible so by this choice i do feel bad either way i decide and i dont think i have the time to play the game a second run sadly.

O well the game rocks, back to play (was just hoping if there was a way to make them both happy but it seems people just need some luck).

[Nadiah]

Really easy as a renegade, I was never able to get both loyal as a paragon, but I only had 3 bars of renegade and was able to get both loyal. The Tali/Legion one is harder for the renegade than the paragon though. I had to have full renegade to get Legion back on my side after taking tali's side.

[SammyJB17]

Nadiah wrote...

Really easy as a renegade, I was never able to get both loyal as a paragon, but I only had 3 bars of renegade and was able to get both loyal. The Tali/Legion one is harder for the renegade than the paragon though. I had to have full renegade to get Legion back on my side after taking tali's side.

Did it today as a paragon (Miri and Jack). Just stay mostly paragon. I killed Sidonis and still could do it.

[Bogsnot1]

Jackal904 wrote...

For the love of god people. Look at how old the last post is before you decide to comment.

I think this person summed it up best.....8 months ago.

[Naldaen]

Blargh.

Modifié par Naldaen, 15 février 2011 - 10:40 .

[Thia102]

Easiest solution. Let Jack and Miranda fight. Build up your paragon by doing all the missions you can (do not do Derelict Reaper). Then go to the tech lab on the Normandy. From there go to the research terminal, to Prototypes, then redistribute your points to all the bottom powers you can. It should majorly boost your paragon from where it was at previously. Then talk to the team mate with the lost loyalty. You should now have the option to choose Paragon and calm them down. Afterwards, you can go back to the tech lab and redistribute your points however you like.

I thought my game was doomed, until I found this trick. I know it was mentioned previously, but I thought I would go a little more in depth with it. Happy gaming! 

[Thia102]

I should mention that you don't necessarily have to do every mission to do that trick. I still had DLC, as well as some side missions I haven't completed, and was still able to regain the loyalty of Miranda.

[InkognitoY]

My paragon was about 95% when the fight occurred, and I still didn't get the charm option. So I loaded a previous save and did Jacks Loyalty mission again, but this time I didn't bring Miranda along, hoping that was the reason I didn't get the option. I was wrong, so I decided to side with Jack.

Luckily, I decided to go talk to Miranda after I reached 100% paragon and then I got the option to talk her into being loyal to me again.

[Lapis Lazuli]

I've done it with minerals. I know it works if you're an infiltrator. If you have plenty of minerals to waste, then just go retrain your powers and assign max points to your 'operative' power. When you go to talk to Jack (assuming you've dissed her), all the dialogue options will appear. You can smooth it over. Then go retrain your powers back the way you want them. They'll both be loyal.

[themonty72]

InkognitoY wrote...

My paragon was about 95% when the fight occurred, and I still didn't get the charm option. So I loaded a previous save and did Jacks Loyalty mission again, but this time I didn't bring Miranda along, hoping that was the reason I didn't get the option. I was wrong, so I decided to side with Jack.

Luckily, I decided to go talk to Miranda after I reached 100% paragon and then I got the option to talk her into being loyal to me again.

 Im glad I read this

Modifié par themonty72, 16 juillet 2011 - 08:39 .