1228 réponses à ce sujet

[sprybry]

fangedwolf wrote...

It would be beneficial though for them to post an update on what is actually going on, rather than leaving all of it to hearsay.

and therein lies the rub.  no communication - at least not from bioware's side.  and it's not just damage to rto only.  there seems to be a considerable amount of damage done to their ps3 fanbase, as a whole.  so much for the 'equitable" support.  no news, no update, no dlc...

[Golbez21]

I agree if they put RTO with Awakining I think I'd be a little happier about the situation. I just wish they would say something.

[fangedwolf]

I wish they would say something to, though in terms of including it in the ps3 version of awakenings, I highly doubt that would happen, not only because they would lose out on money, but also because.. gods can you imagine the uproar from pc/xbox users? lol

[DarthJake88]

They would be so mad it would almost be funny wolf. There would be such an uproar because THEY had to pay for it and we didnt. of course if they put a code in the NEW boxes of awakining than anyone who gets it used would have to wait, kind of offsetting it but no one would really see it that way lol. And all this could be avoided if some communication opened up.

[Funny_chan]

Maybe not everyone knows this yet, but the last time they answered about this RTO issue was 5 days ago...

Victor Wachter wrote...

You know, we can talk about
blame, priorities and timelines all we want. But I also want you to
understand our intentions. If we set priorities, particularly about
developing a bug fix for one console before another, it's not because
we have any favor toward one or the other. As it has been explained to
me, it made sense within the project to resolve the issue that delayed
RtO's final release on the Xbox first, so we would have some experience
to refer back to when fixing it for the PS3. It's not bias, it'st just
the way our development process worked best for this case.

Even
if you do want to look at it from a corporate point of view, the PS3
delay for RtO also delays revenue to our company. And nobody likes
that, right? We do want this out as soon as it can be, but we have to
wait until we receive certification.

I'm quoting just in case someone missed it. [smilie]../../../../images/forum/emoticons/joyful.png[/smilie]

[ShugLAF]

Thanks, I know I missed it so much appreciated

[fangedwolf]

lol I totally missed that post to.

[Frittison]

 You know what, two things Funny_Chan.


1)Copy and pasting your identical reply in every thread you can find with RtO and PS3 in the title actually detracts from your credibility and that of Mr. Wachter. You also REposted his comment in the same thread he posted it.


2)If you read the thread from which that comment pertains, AND bother to do a little research yourself, you would find there is a huge discrepancy between what the different entities at Bioware are telling their customers.

posted by Eurypterid:
Abriel, you're really spinning this in the worst possible light you can. I'm not sure why you're choosing to do so though. Did they decide to work on the fix for the XBOX before the PS3? Yes, and it's explained why in the dev posts I linked. Does that mean they're treating PS3 owners as second class citizens or that PS3 owners are getting the shaft? I hardly think so.
But the reason it's taking so long for the PS3 version to come out isn't entirely BioWare's fault. In fact, if they shoulder any blame at all for that, it's minimal. The game has been sent to Sony for certification at least 11 days ago now. Could BioWare have decided to work on the PS3 version first, then send it for certification, then work on the other versions? Possibly, although from the way it was explained, that wouldn't have been the optimal way to go about it. Would that have meant they were treating XBOX and PC owners as second class citizens? Again, hardly. In any business there are decisions to make. Just because the particular decision might be more advantageous for one group over another doesn't mean the latter are being slighted.

So by Eurypterid's math that means the PS3 version was submitted to certification at around the time that RtO was releasing on PC/Xbox 360, but there is a catch with what Eurypterid said. On January 29, 2010 Mr. Wachter posted a reply sent to him by a Mr. Fernando which stated.

Victor Wachter:
The issue we saw on 360, which was introduced with the title update, also exists on the PS3 patch that was planned to go out with the Return to Ostagar DLC for PS3 – it is a console agnostic issue. However, the title update / patch itself (without the issue) is needed for both platforms in order to fix some main game items, as well as enable functionality for Return to Ostagar, and future functionality that benefits upcoming DLC. This meant we were unable to simply go ahead and release the PS3 version independent of pulling the 360 version, we now needed to re-open the PS3 version as well before that went public.

Once we were able to resolve the issue for 360 and delivered the second title update to MS for final certification then work began in earnest on the short hop to moving this across to PS3 and directing the test focus there. The nature of the issue was such that it required the same programmers and made more sense for that particular ‘nut’ to be cracked on the 360 first to really understand how to fix it once and for all, so this was not something we could do in parallel for both platforms.

Lastly, Sony's certification time simply takes longer than Microsoft's. It is also worth mentioning again that as we saw with the original RtO dates, even once in Cert until we actually pass an issue can still be found anytime either by ourselves or Sony/MS which would re-start the process all over again. In practical terms, what that means is that until we are virtually on the last days of certification it is not easy to provide an estimated release date – and we’re not there yet.

What we can do is update you once we get there with Sony certification, as we did with the 360 updates.

In essence what we are being told here is that the original-original decision was to program RtO first for Xbox 360 / PC (since they're nearly identical to program for) and PS3 second. Once the bug was found both DLC were pulled and sent back to the coding monkeys to fix some title screen code or some such. Now as the problem was code side all resources had to be pulled and focused entirely on the fix. This tells me there were two teams each working on their respective consoles, but 360/PC got more attention.
This is not because of some mysterious happenstance, but because Bioware made a business decision, one that others on these forums have made it a point to press, to focus on Xbox 360/PC first to "maximize" initial release day DLC sales in the quickest way possible. There was no consideration to reaching the broadest customer base possible; if it were the case work would have begun on PS3 first in order to ensure a simultaneous launch. However that would have postponed xbox and pc by several weeks most likely pushing it all into a February time window, this is before the bug fix fiasco. For Bioware this was not acceptable.
The way I read all this is that Bioware wanted money sooner rather than later. They threw the PS3 adopters under the bus and released the content on xbox/PC first. 
Now I wanted the PS3 version initially, then switched over to PC when I heard it would release two weeks after xbox and PC got theirs. Upon hearing just before release that PS3 would launch same day I switched my pre-order back to PS3. Now here I am again in the same boat but already having committed to a product just to get shafted. The same shafting I wanted to avoid 8 months ago. 
So perhaps its the fact we're all spoiled and got our game same day as everyone else because of a concerted effort on bioware AND sony's part to progress the game ahead two weeks faster than originally planned. Funny how that works out eh? 
Perhaps Bioware should learn from this and focus on the longer developments first instead of the quick buck. Perhaps they wouldn't incur the wrath of 1/3 of their customer base.
Bioware is not squeeky clean here. They dropped the ball, made a bad decision, and now have a black eye as a result of it. Their first outting on the PS3 and they fail to make the grade in the first real test on their ability to bring equal content in equal time to an audience.

For the TLDR crowd:
*Bioware made a decision to put xbox/PC ahead of PS3 knowing PS3 certification process took longer.
*Bioware decided to pull PS3 coders to fix an issue present in the source code and not the console specific code, but still chose to apply the fix to xbox/PC first, and then go back to PS3.
*There is a communication issue as to just exactly when the PS3 version was sent to cert'. If it was 11 days prior to a Feb 9 posting that would put it at around Jan 29. However that would mean it took Microsoft only 5 days to certify a download.If Mr. Wachter is to be believed then the patch was applied the same week as the bug was found and then sent to Microsoft first then work began on the PS3 porting resulting in another weeks' delay.

[falloutgod13]

All I can say is that if you live in US, Canada, or Europe(I know it's not a country but I'm not about to list them all) and you chose a PS3 over a 360 then you can only blame your self. Most people whining about what console gets better attention consider themselves avid gamers. They should have done their research and did the math. PS3 is popular overseas in places like Japan. So if you own a Mac or a PS3 that's your prerogative. Get a PC and run windows or buy a 360. Otherwise stop whining because you decided to purchase a platform that's not popular.



I haven't gotten to play Assassin's Creed 2 yet because I don't own a PS3. You don't see me whining about it on their forums. Course that might have something to do with the fact that it will eventually come out for PC. Yeah, I'm rubbing it in but you're the ones that bought those platforms so deal with it.

[Paul143]

ps3 console is the best...... bioware is damn, and they blame sony certification is the cause of delay of rto for ps3.... no certification that takes almost a month just to certify the game.

[scorpius45]

@falloutgod13 I think you will find in europe there are more PS3's than 360's.

[fangedwolf]

scorpius45 wrote...

@falloutgod13 I think you will find in europe there are more PS3's than 360's.

I thought that to.  Of everyone I know ps3's are by far the most popular gaming system.

[awsome_robot]

falloutgod13 wrote...

All I can say is that if you live in US, Canada, or Europe(I know it's not a country but I'm not about to list them all) and you chose a PS3 over a 360 then you can only blame your self. Most people whining about what console gets better attention consider themselves avid gamers. They should have done their research and did the math. PS3 is popular overseas in places like Japan. So if you own a Mac or a PS3 that's your prerogative. Get a PC and run windows or buy a 360. Otherwise stop whining because you decided to purchase a platform that's not popular.



I haven't gotten to play Assassin's Creed 2 yet because I don't own a PS3. You don't see me whining about it on their forums. Course that might have something to do with the fact that it will eventually come out for PC. Yeah, I'm rubbing it in but you're the ones that bought those platforms so deal with it.

spoken like a true fanboy. you completely missed the whole point. its NOT that it hasn't come out on the ps3 its WHY. if bioware would have given a release date in the future, then that would be the end of it. but bioware has contradicting reports on "when" it was sent to sony cert, plus, according to the sony eu blog, sony is waiting on bioware to give a release date. if you don't fully understand the issue at hand don't bother posting about "whiners"... that makes you an ignorant.

Modifié par awsome_robot, 16 février 2010 - 02:16 .

[Wasteland]

I still have a problem to find any content on my page: under downloadable content - even if i buy points on teh bioware page. Or to say so: I have a lot of points, I have registred contents (so my profile),but i cannot find the way to download. Please help.

[Funny_chan]

Frittison wrote...

 You know what, two things Funny_Chan.


1)Copy and pasting your identical reply in every thread you can find with RtO and PS3 in the title actually detracts from your credibility and that of Mr. Wachter. You also REposted his comment in the same thread he posted it.


2)If you read the thread from which that comment pertains, AND bother to do a little research yourself, you would find there is a huge discrepancy between what the different entities at Bioware are telling their customers.

I have read that thread entirely, thank you very much. I even posted there. We should not consider however what the person with the Moderator tag said (Eurypterid), as they are as clueless as us. They only serve as moderators in the forums, they do not participate in the production of the games.
By the way, I did not say that what Victor posted is the entire true. This is something you'll have to decide yourself. I just wanted to quote him because many fellow PS3 owners were saying that the last Bioware's official response about PS3's RTO was two weeks ago, when in fact Victor posted this 5 days ago.
I don't understand why you tried to attack my credibility. If you care to read my profile you'll see I'm a PS3 owner as much as many of us here.

Modifié par Funny_chan, 16 février 2010 - 02:58 .

[Draecko]

I don't care why, how or what. But my God, this RTO for PS3 is taking ages.

[Fangirl17]

If its not this week then I give up.

[Phosphorus213]

falloutgod13 wrote...

All I can say is that if you live in US, Canada, or Europe(I know it's not a country but I'm not about to list them all) and you chose a PS3 over a 360 then you can only blame your self. Most people whining about what console gets better attention consider themselves avid gamers. They should have done their research and did the math. PS3 is popular overseas in places like Japan. So if you own a Mac or a PS3 that's your prerogative. Get a PC and run windows or buy a 360. Otherwise stop whining because you decided to purchase a platform that's not popular.

I haven't gotten to play Assassin's Creed 2 yet because I don't own a PS3. You don't see me whining about it on their forums. Course that might have something to do with the fact that it will eventually come out for PC. Yeah, I'm rubbing it in but you're the ones that bought those platforms so deal with it.

 First of all hot shot I would like you to check the reviews this particular game alone got on each system the Xbox version was considered inferior but that's ok because it was on an inferior system.  That's why avid gamers choose the better system we can not help it that it makes devs work harder to send out a product, kinda glad to hear that though since they are grabbing up $60 at the gate and then what ever DLC you decide to purchase.  I hope they have to work for the money and that it just doesn't fall from the sky for them.  I had to work for the $60 dollars why shouldn't they.  I would also like to point out that as I am an American working in NATO I work in an environment that encompasses most of those nationalities you just listed and out of the 280 people that we have here only 4 Americans have an Xbox as their only console system.  No Brits have them at all and a couple eastern block countries run them because when they first got a system they could not afford the 600 euro PS3 but as their Xboxs lock up they all switch over especially since the PS3 is region free this lets dutch (The Netherlands) guys trade games with Americans and Canadians or Brits to switch off with Germans so as you can see the PS3 is way more popular in a land where so many nations are bunched so close together.  I am not sure what made you think the Xbox was more popular it was when it was cheaper but now not so much thanks for you opinions though just next time check you facts.

[Cancermeat]

I just dont like how they say "coming soon", thats a marketing tool word that makes me even more mad about the whole thing

[kyohei021]

3 things, frittison thanks for that post  it helped to shade some light on the current topic for me.
fangirl17 i also agree with you if its not out this week i think im moveing on without RTO,
Phosphorus213 i agree with you also since i too am a PS3 owner and i love it.
 

[Xionraserai]

pay for xboxlive = lol, is all i say about this

[xxSylphxx]

Victor,

At this point I think it's quite a bit more than a delay in revenue at stake. As others have stated the convergence of DLC being useless in Awakenings and RtO coming out on PS3 (at best) shortly before Awakenings I think results in a significant reduction in people purchasing RtO from today forward. The only way I can see to spark additional interest at this point would be if Awakenings release on PS3 was delayed or if future patches to Awakenings allowed for DLC content to be imported. However the cost of delaying Awakenings on PS3 I think would be far greater than any potential revenue from the DLC. Whether or not it was BioWare's intention to make PS3 users feel like second class citizens I believe they have succeeded in making many PS3 users feel that way. I for one feel that way.

Things could be done to change that perception (that BioWare does not value it's PS3 customers). At this point I doubt RtO being available for purchase on PSN this instance would do anything towards repairing that. It would do nothing for me. I have mentioned numerous things I think WOULD help repair the damage done. My post count is fairly small. Of late, beyond helping a few people in the PS3 tech forum, all of my posts here have centered around this one issue. Please Victor, consider the points I have made, because I really believe you (BioWare as a whole) are underestimating the potential loss here as a result of how this issue has been and continues to be handled.

Modifié par xxSylphxx, 16 février 2010 - 08:19 .

[awsome_robot]

xxSylphxx wrote...

Victor,

At this point I think it's quite a bit more than a delay in revenue at stake. As others have stated the convergence of DLC being useless in Awakenings and RtO coming out on PS3 (at best) shortly before Awakenings I think results in a significant reduction in people purchasing RtO from today forward. The only way I can see to spark additional interest at this point would be if Awakenings release on PS3 was delayed or if future patches to Awakenings allowed for DLC content to be imported. However the cost of delaying Awakenings on PS3 I think would be far greater than any potential revenue from the DLC. Whether or not it was BioWare's intention to make PS3 users feel like second class citizens I believe they have succeeded in making many PS3 users feel that way. I for one feel that way.

Things could be done to change that perception (that BioWare does not value it's PS3 customers). At this point I doubt RtO being available for purchase on PSN this instance would do anything towards repairing that. It would do nothing for me. I have mentioned numerous things I think WOULD help repair the damage done. My post count is fairly small. Of late, beyond helping a few people in the PS3 tech forum, all of my posts here have centered around this one issue. Please Victor, consider the points I have made, because I really believe you (BioWare as a whole) are underestimating the potential loss here as a result of how this issue has been and continues to be handled.

all true, but i think you were too kind on your comments, i'm REALLY close to say exactly the way i feel... i think i'll get banned.

[Xionraserai]

it is very sad that bioware obviously doesnt pay any attention to this thread and the whole RTO for PS3 situation anymore while in the very same time opening new threads releasing awakening related stuff

means they still reading in the forum and keep posting everything but cant afford one single minute after all this time to say something about the entire RTO issue indeed very sad

[falloutgod13]

Japan sales figures



Based on figures from Famitsu/Enterbrain, as of 17 December 2009 (2009 -12-17)[update]:[28]



1. Wii – 9,048,012

2. PlayStation 3 – 4,020,563

3. Xbox 360 – 900,000 (as of 20/02/2009) [29]



[edit] United Kingdom sales figures



Based on figures from GfK Chart-Track, as of 3 January 2009 (2009 -01-03)[update]:[30]



1. Wii – 4.9 million

2. Xbox 360 – 3.2 million

3. PlayStation 3 - 1.5 million



[edit] United States sales figures



Based on figures from the NPD Group, as of 1 November 2008 (2008 -11-01)[update]:[31]



1. Wii – 13.4 million

2. Xbox 360 – 11.6 million

3. PlayStation 3 - 5.7 million



http://en.wikipedia....sales_figures_5



Check my facts? I don't run my mouth before I do like some people. Eat my shorts.