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Let's just call it "soldier effect" and delete player biotics


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#151
tetracycloide

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MGIII wrote...

The only option if you want biotics to affect mobs with shields and armor moreso than it already does is to significantly increase the enemy count in any given encounter, make their biotics significantly more potent against you, and improve the AI. "Increasing the health: shields/armor ratio" would be game breaking, and frankly, ineffectual. Unless you keep the shield/armor threshold of damage the same, but it would only make it take longer to kill enemies.


There's actually another option.  Two simple changes would fix a lot of what is broken with the adept class, at least in my opinion.  The two primary arguments I've seen that they are broken are:

1. Warp is best power against a target with shields/barrier/armor until you get Reave at which point it's either Warp or Reave depending on the type of defense.

2. Skills employ a global cooldown i.e to cast one thing the player must give up the ability to cast anything else for 3-4 secs depending on cooldowns.

This could be fixed with three simple changes:

1. Fix AoE biotic powers so that a shielded/barriered/armored foe that walks into the AoE gets the DoT just like they would if they were hit directly with it.

2. Add this very tiny low damage DoT over the duration of the biotic power to every biotech ability in the game.

3. Remove the global cooldown.

Given that abilities would still have their individual cooldown, would still not have their CC effects on armored/barrier/shielded targets, would still require cast time, would still require travel time, would not have a hidden opportunity cost of missing the chance to cast a reave or warp instead, would only apply a tiny DoT (like singularity currently does already), and biotic explosion would be usable by combining warp + any power on any target no matter their level of defense (against shields/barriers/armor the force of this explosion could be balanced if necessary).

Honestly, even if all that's changed is the global cooldown on biotics is removed or at least adjusted so that specific groups share a cooldown but not everything a lot of the complaints would stop.  Many would remain, I'm sure, but there would be far fewer 'why am I only casting warp for 90% of every fight' problems.

#152
grumpymooselion

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Roxlimn wrote...
So really, the problem IS only at Insanity, even if there is a problem at all, which Janan Pacha has not presented convincingly.


I have. You ignore it every time I spell it out for you.

He has not said how many seconds, exactly, Shockwave and Sing work at the higher levels, and why that duration is insufficient. Note that Tactical Cloak itself only works for about 6 seconds at the highest level. Knocking back a group of enemies for even 2 seconds would be effective CC.


It doesn't knock them back. Shockwave on targets with defense causes a slight stutter in their movement for a split second. Not a full second a split second. I have said this before. That is an amount of time. This is an example of you ignoring what is spelled out for you.

As for singularity, there's a slight immob and slight damage to their defense, and again so brief and so slight that measuring is pointless. You're asking for a numbers on things that do not give us numbers, and in the face of already being told that their durations are absolutely brief. The cooldown on a fully specced singularity with full points into an Adept's class abilities will result in a cooldown of just over two seconds. The duration of the effect against a target with Defenses up is less than that. It is in fact that brief.

I have said this before, further proving that any time anyone spells it out for you - you ignore them. Further proof is that you point me as if I'm one of a few people speaking on this, when there are in fact many in this thread and other threads all over this forum. This is not an isolated issue. I am not some loan forum goer with a problem that is, "Just mine" but instead one person talking about the issue amongst many other Forum Goers.

Your time should be spent taking out their shields, not throwing powers at enemies with defenses up that will only result in completely ineffective results.

tetracycloide wrote...

MGIII wrote...

The
only option if you want biotics to affect mobs with shields and armor
moreso than it already does is to significantly increase the enemy
count in any given encounter, make their biotics significantly more
potent against you, and improve the AI. "Increasing the health:
shields/armor ratio" would be game breaking, and frankly, ineffectual.
Unless you keep the shield/armor threshold of damage the same, but it
would only make it take longer to kill enemies.


There's
actually another option.  Two simple changes would fix a lot of what is
broken with the adept class, at least in my opinion.  The two primary
arguments I've seen that they are broken are:


You'll note he calls for enemy Biotics to increase in effectiveness against you, when their effectiveness against you (a shielded target) is already greater than the effectiveness of your biotics against them (as shielded targets).

1. Warp is best
power against a target with shields/barrier/armor until you get Reave
at which point it's either Warp or Reave depending on the type of
defense.


Yes.


1.
Fix AoE biotic powers so that a shielded/barriered/armored foe that
walks into the AoE gets the DoT just like they would if they were hit
directly with it.


Not a horrible idea.

2. Add this very tiny low damage DoT over the duration of the biotic power to every biotech ability in the game.


I'm not sure that's a great idea.  If this DoT only effected Armor/Shields/Barriers I could get behind it.

3. Remove the global cooldown.


I would actually say make each power have their own separate cooldown but, at the same time, keep the global cooldown . . . yet bring it down to something short say 1 to 2 seconds.

Given
that abilities would still have their individual cooldown, would still
not have their CC effects on armored/barrier/shielded targets, would
still require cast time, would still require travel time, would not
have a hidden opportunity cost of missing the chance to cast a reave or
warp instead, would only apply a tiny DoT (like singularity currently
does already), and biotic explosion would be usable by combining warp +
any power on any target no matter their level of defense (against
shields/barriers/armor the force of this explosion could be balanced if
necessary).


One would note Singularities DoT/short immob against targets with defenses up is beyond laughable. However, the Warp Detonation would make up for it. being able to leave an effect on a shielded target would make warp detonations viable on armored/shielded/barriered targets without need for Reave.

Honestly, even if all that's changed is the global
cooldown on biotics is removed or at least adjusted so that specific
groups share a cooldown but not everything a lot of the complaints
would stop.  Many would remain, I'm sure, but there would be far fewer
'why am I only casting warp for 90% of every fight' problems.


Honestly it would be infinitely less frustrating if shielded targets just took partial effect from those Biotics. You have a Biotic throw on a non-shielded target that will send them flying to the sun. Wouldn't just giving it enough force to knock back (but not send flying - and not a knock down, note: a knock back would still leave them on their feet they'd just be sent sliding back an amount determined by your point investment) and doing slight damage to the defense in question be enough to make it useful on Insanity?

I don't know how that would translate to pull.

As for Slam, I'd like to see it be fully effective against targets with Defenses in terms of "It picks them up and slams them down" with the point that, obviously, it would be doing damage to the defense in question and possibly half its normal damage.

Of all the Adept's powers though, the one I feel that should always be useful . . . isn't. Warp is nice, but it's not our class defining power. Singularity is. Singularity should be our big gun. Even if they had to up its cooldown . . . I'd prefer it be a very, very nasty ability for enemies to deal with. In fact if Warp had to be made useless for us in order to make singularity always useful, I'd take it. Each class only gets one class defining skill. Of all the ability any class gets, the one that should really be absolutely useful is their one unique power/ability.

Singularity should, of course, have lesser effect on a shielded target, since that's where Bioware seems to want to go . . . but it should also still be quite effective. I'd like to see enemies with Defenses up be pulled toward it, slowly, unless they move away. Moving away they would be distracted, and, because of the pulling effect, they'd move slower. In addition to this I'd like to see the damage portion made more . . . potent. Actually, no, not absolutely more potent - I'd like to see it more potent purely against defenses. Doing double what it does now against defenses.

The best thing though would, as said earlier, just be the AoE abilities that are persistent effecting enemies that come into them, and not just the enemies that were there when it's cast. It's a bit funny to watch enemies walk into a singularity after it is cast and not be affected by it at all.

Modifié par Janan Pacha, 31 janvier 2010 - 03:20 .


#153
AtreiyaN7

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Is this another thread on the subject? In my opinion, this complaining comes from people who don't want to accept that you have to use your powers in a more tactical and strategic manner. Said people seem to be ticked off that they're no longer quite so godlike and actually have to think a bit about what they do and when they do it. I can tell you that my powers worked fine for my Vanguard and that I used all of them to great effect depending on the situation. Got husks? Use shockwave to tear them apart/toss them around. An enemy has a barrier? I'll have someone on the squad warp them and/or charge, etc. Or maybe this is the same thread I posted in before, but I'm tired so if I'm repeating myself then oops. :P I stayed up until 3AM to finish the suicide mission.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 31 janvier 2010 - 03:21 .


#154
The Rickstah

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Sidetrack here



Anyone have tips on how to ideally build an INFILTRATOR. What squad members to use,best powers,best powers evolve,

#155
grumpymooselion

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AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Is this another thread on the subject? In my opinion, this complaining comes from people who don't want to accept that you have to use your powers in a more tactical and strategic manner..


If your powers were working for you, you were likely playing on the casual setting. Sorry, but Tactics has nothing to do with it. Most of the Biotics - Do. Not. Work. Against. Targets. With. Defenses. - and ALL the enemies have defenses on the higher difficulty settings.

There is not argument.

It is a fact that many of the biotic powers do not work on enemies with defenses. Period.

You will end up using nothing but Warp until you either pick up Barrier or Reave. In which case you will then end up using nothing but Warp and Reave or Warp and Barrier. No matter how many times you use throw or pull or Slam or whatever you like, on an enemy with defenses, it will not work. It will not work. Let's say it again, it will not work. No amount of tactics changes that they will not work.

"Oh but they work when defenses are down!"

Once their defenses are down, sneezing hard will kill something. It doesn't matter by then.

#156
Hoffburger

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The Rickstah wrote...

Sidetrack here

Anyone have tips on how to ideally build an INFILTRATOR. What squad members to use,best powers,best powers evolve,


Reave, Squad Disruptor Ammo (If you want to try and keep your squad alive, otherwise go with the higher damage version), Tactical Cloak (Assassination one), and the +power damage passive.

Squadmates are Samara with Reave and power damage passive and Miranda with Warp/Overload and the squad damage bonus passive.

No way any other character + squad will be more optimal for completing Insanity. 2 Reaves and Warp cover anything with armor or barriers. Overload + Disruptor Ammo covers shields and synthetics. Tactical Cloak gives you that "oh ****" button to find better cover (cover is the best defense in the game, barrier/fortify/geth shield sucks).

Here's how the battles pan out:

1. Samara spams Reave always, no matter what the target is.

2. Miranda spams Overload on shields and sythetics, Warp on everything else.

3. You spam Tactical Cloak + sniper rifle on synthetics or shields, Reave on everything else.

4. Nuke stuff when you want comedic relief.

#157
AdamNW

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Vanguard > Soldier

I don't see any need for any soldier skill but Cyro ammo.  The AR's are barely better than the SMG's, and there really isn't a need for SR's if you have Pistols.  You also get the benefit of having Charge and Shockwave, which are amazing when used together.

Modifié par AdamNW, 31 janvier 2010 - 03:34 .


#158
bblasphemous

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they should nerf mages too.

#159
AfrikA1

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As soldier I used cryo ammo maxed out giving the ability to my whole team.
With the X-76 machine gun you chew though shields and armor so fast you freeze enemies no problem. Since you can only use biotic powers on unshielded enemies any way, it's like giving the solder a power to incapacitate any thing instantly if they dont' have shields up.
A machine gun with an 80 magic bullet clip works way faster than casting a power with a cool down. Not to mention a frozen enemy die in 1 shot because they shatter.

I find that on my vanguard using charge is suicide.

Modifié par AfrikA1, 31 janvier 2010 - 03:55 .


#160
The Rickstah

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@Hoff



What's "Reave"?

& I'm lvl 8 so is it good to evolve any of the things you just mentioned.



Also who should I use instead of Samara. I haven't gotten her yet.



I play on veteran & truthfully,cloak & sniping doesn't seen TOO valuable. I use it once in a while for mobs but othet than that it's just for ****s & gigs.



Inciteration any good? Operative? Cryo? AI hack(lol)?





Gimme the 411


#161
Hoffburger

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On veteran it won't really matter. It's pretty easy. If you want to be super optimal I would max out Incinerate until you get Reave (no spoilers, you'll have to figure it out, shouldn't be hard though). You should be able to max out Incinerate and Disruptor Ammo right before you get Reave. Once you get Reave, respec and put the Incinerate points into Reave.



Sniping is great because it 1 shots lesser enemies with a headshot and once you upgrade the sniper rifle and disruptor ammo you murder synthetics, especially the heavy mechs.

#162
The Rickstah

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Any points on operative early on?


#163
Fuzzyrabbit

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First play through was a sentinel. Playing a soldier now. I see no excessive variation in difficulty. Different play styles, advantages and disadvantages. I'm having fun with both, and in a single player game that is honestly all that matters.

#164
steve1945

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Played a soldier in ME2 and ill never play anything else.



Im sorry you want to cry about it tc I really am. But me being a ayran superman I dont care for your disgusting untermensch biotics.

#165
jpetrey123

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this thread is still around!!! stop feeding them troll juice!!

#166
vhatever

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This forum really needs a god damn age limits.

#167
Zigaroma

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It's always about the "Fps kiddies". Whats to say they wouldn't want powers and **** Borderlands has powers in it and if I recall that's an FPS that did very well. Biotics suck, they have always sucked......deal with it! I was an infiltrator in ME 1 and will be one until they aren't in the game any more. :P

If your so butt hurt about the soldiers being OP (god is this wow now?) then play as a soldier.

#168
MANoob

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Hoffburger wrote...
No way any other character + squad will be more optimal for completing Insanity.


Engineer + Garrus (Mass AP ammp) + Thane?
(Both cheaters have infinite sniper ammo while a drone with 1.5 second cooldown will keep enemies distracted for eternity and area incinerate will anhilate husks. Just get them the 1st sniper rifle and make sure they use it).
Sentinel + Garrus (Mass AP ammo again) + whatever?
(You'll hardly ever die as a sentinel, even if smth flanks you or throws you out of cover. Hell, I killed a scion in melee as a Sentinel and that was on insanity)
Im sure there are other crazy combinations.

#169
Guest_Shavon_*

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Huh, I forgot how much the Op like trollbaiting, whoops.