Hm, a lot of people say use three ranged, one tank... I went the other way. Me, Alistar, Sten and Wynne. On Normal, placed my tanks on her sides (with Alistar taking a beating being closer to the front and keeping her occupied.) Had the Juggernaut armor on Alistar and whatever fire-resistant armor/accessories I could find, and found it to be quite easy. Just keep up on the healing with Wynne and poultices and you should be fine.
Kinda proud I did it without "cheating", so to speak. Did it on normal, on level 16, I believe.
How do I kill Flemeth?
Débuté par
Ninjaphrog
, nov. 05 2009 07:21
Retour en haut
#52
Posté 24 novembre 2009 - 11:41
Darth_Shizz
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My experiences from flemeth fights on nightmare, around level 8-10
Though I won't claim this to be a comprehensive list of her attacks and their effects, after some watching...and waiting...and watching...and even more watching, this is what I've observed:
Sweep - Flemeth uses her claws to deal low-moderate damage and a knockdown effect in a (roughly) 90° forward arc. Having Indomitable/shield wall + expertise active will result in a knockback.
Slap - Flemeth swipes her tail, causing moderate damage and a knockdown effect in a (180°) backwards arc. Having Indomitable/shield wall + expertise active will result in a knockback.
Massive Attack - Flemeth lashes out at a target, dealing moderate damage and a knockback in a small area.
Grab - Flemeth picks up a character in her mouth, dealing HUGE damage. A few things to note about this move; unlike an ogres grab, which tends to target characters that hit a certain health %, this seems quite random. Believe me when I say this, the damage really is insane. From what I've gathered, she'll do roughly 9-10 instances of damage. At an armour rating of around 30 (low level tank), each instance will hit for roughly 20-30 damage, whereas a rating of around half that, will eat damage in the late 30s to early 40s, which is a huge difference over 9 attacks. It's not all bad news though, as she'll only target characters in a 180° forward arc.
Buffet - Flemeth leaps into the air, and uses her wings to knock down in a moderate area around her. It may also target a character at range and pull them towards her, much like the revenant skill...though this seems to rarely be used over dragon breath/fire spit. Having Indomitable/shield wall + expertise active will negate this.
Roar - As the name suggests, she roars, stunning in a huge area (could well be the whole map) as well as causing a short attack/damage debuff (at least I think it is...I've not been able to check properly). Having Indomitable active will result in just the debuff.
Fire Spit - Flemeth spits a ball of fire, dealing moderate impact damage in a small area (think stone fist), coupled with a low DoT in a large area.
Dragon Breath - Flemeth breaths fire. No, really? Yes, yes she does
This is a pretty odd skill, as the aoe is MUCH wider than the animation would have us believe...for visual reference, check out the video link and watch Wynne around 18 seconds in. Mages beware...the damage isn't horrible for a tank that has half decent resists and a shedload of health, but for a mage with a much smaller health pool, this can be deadly!
Tactically, I can't stress enough the importance of positioning, as it'll definitely make or break the encounter.
Archer - Any archers you have will want to sit by Flemeth's hut, though keep an eye out for the hill, as it may occasionally block your shots.
Healer - These guys can be incredibly finicky about where they cast from, especially where line of sight is concerned. In past playthroughs, my melee has occasionally managed to push Flemeth back too far, resulting in my mage having to run right up to them to heal...regardless of whether they get close enough to eat a big sweep attack or a fireball/breath, your healer taking damage and a knockdown is probably not something you want. Another thing to watch out for is them taking damage from Dragon Breath; typically, you'll want the healer to sit fairly close to your melee, so unless you're lucky, or very well positioned, chances are they'll get hit once or twice throughout the fight. Make sure you have lesser poultices at hand to remedy this.
Useful spells - Heal (naturally), Lifeward, Regeneration, Heroic defence, Forcefield (I hate it personally). Don't be afraid to blow a group heal/regen/heal/lifeward combo on a grabbed tank, as keeping him alive is essential.
Mage DPS - Same deal as with the healer. Hills can really freak them out, so try to stay at the same level as Flem, but far enough back that you can avoid her ranged attacks (standing with your back to the hut should be fine) As I don't have too much experience with these guys against Flemeth (especially not on nightmare where the innate resistances of enemies are higher than any other difficulty), it's pretty hard to give any surefire advice regarding them. However, assuming you can get your magic high enough to punch through her resistances, I can't see why tossing out disables (a cone of cold should be the easiest option) wouldn't be a viable option for when she decides to grab.
Tank - This is the character you'll want to have squaring off against Flemeth due to his moderate armour and health values. In the video, Sten had 31 armour and took around 200 damage per full grab over a few seconds. Because of this burst damage, you'll rarely want to let them drop below about 170 health, or 60% of the average level 10 warriors health pool. This should be about 1-2 heals short of the damage a grab will do, but be sure to bear in mind the other high damaging attacks Flemeth has. Always try to keep her focussed on the tank, and save a taunt for if and when she loses interest. Also, if you can, try to turn her off at an angle facing away from your mage/s. That way, they should avoid any Fire Breath damage. However, you'll also need to avoid turning her too far, as her "Slap", much like fire breath, has a very wide AoE.
Melee DPS - You have two choices for this one. If you're a highly armoured damage dealer, then you can cut down on the knockbacks by standing off to the side of the dragon. On the one hand, you'll find yourself being knocked back far less than if you stand in a flanking position. On the other hand, you'll leave yourself open to being chewed on for a big chunk of health (a full grab took around 90-95% of my PCs pool at 13 armour and 270 health). While it's dangerous to attack her front-arc as a low health/armour character, it's still a good idea to move there when you want to pull off a special attack. This way, you have a good chance to avoid being interrupted and wasting stamina, whilst only giving Grab a small window of opportunity.
P.s. NEVER, I repeat, NEVER cluster these guys together, especially not in front of her.
Though I won't claim this to be a comprehensive list of her attacks and their effects, after some watching...and waiting...and watching...and even more watching, this is what I've observed:
Sweep - Flemeth uses her claws to deal low-moderate damage and a knockdown effect in a (roughly) 90° forward arc. Having Indomitable/shield wall + expertise active will result in a knockback.
Slap - Flemeth swipes her tail, causing moderate damage and a knockdown effect in a (180°) backwards arc. Having Indomitable/shield wall + expertise active will result in a knockback.
Massive Attack - Flemeth lashes out at a target, dealing moderate damage and a knockback in a small area.
Grab - Flemeth picks up a character in her mouth, dealing HUGE damage. A few things to note about this move; unlike an ogres grab, which tends to target characters that hit a certain health %, this seems quite random. Believe me when I say this, the damage really is insane. From what I've gathered, she'll do roughly 9-10 instances of damage. At an armour rating of around 30 (low level tank), each instance will hit for roughly 20-30 damage, whereas a rating of around half that, will eat damage in the late 30s to early 40s, which is a huge difference over 9 attacks. It's not all bad news though, as she'll only target characters in a 180° forward arc.
Buffet - Flemeth leaps into the air, and uses her wings to knock down in a moderate area around her. It may also target a character at range and pull them towards her, much like the revenant skill...though this seems to rarely be used over dragon breath/fire spit. Having Indomitable/shield wall + expertise active will negate this.
Roar - As the name suggests, she roars, stunning in a huge area (could well be the whole map) as well as causing a short attack/damage debuff (at least I think it is...I've not been able to check properly). Having Indomitable active will result in just the debuff.
Fire Spit - Flemeth spits a ball of fire, dealing moderate impact damage in a small area (think stone fist), coupled with a low DoT in a large area.
Dragon Breath - Flemeth breaths fire. No, really? Yes, yes she does
This is a pretty odd skill, as the aoe is MUCH wider than the animation would have us believe...for visual reference, check out the video link and watch Wynne around 18 seconds in. Mages beware...the damage isn't horrible for a tank that has half decent resists and a shedload of health, but for a mage with a much smaller health pool, this can be deadly!Tactically, I can't stress enough the importance of positioning, as it'll definitely make or break the encounter.
Archer - Any archers you have will want to sit by Flemeth's hut, though keep an eye out for the hill, as it may occasionally block your shots.
Healer - These guys can be incredibly finicky about where they cast from, especially where line of sight is concerned. In past playthroughs, my melee has occasionally managed to push Flemeth back too far, resulting in my mage having to run right up to them to heal...regardless of whether they get close enough to eat a big sweep attack or a fireball/breath, your healer taking damage and a knockdown is probably not something you want. Another thing to watch out for is them taking damage from Dragon Breath; typically, you'll want the healer to sit fairly close to your melee, so unless you're lucky, or very well positioned, chances are they'll get hit once or twice throughout the fight. Make sure you have lesser poultices at hand to remedy this.
Useful spells - Heal (naturally), Lifeward, Regeneration, Heroic defence, Forcefield (I hate it personally). Don't be afraid to blow a group heal/regen/heal/lifeward combo on a grabbed tank, as keeping him alive is essential.
Mage DPS - Same deal as with the healer. Hills can really freak them out, so try to stay at the same level as Flem, but far enough back that you can avoid her ranged attacks (standing with your back to the hut should be fine) As I don't have too much experience with these guys against Flemeth (especially not on nightmare where the innate resistances of enemies are higher than any other difficulty), it's pretty hard to give any surefire advice regarding them. However, assuming you can get your magic high enough to punch through her resistances, I can't see why tossing out disables (a cone of cold should be the easiest option
) wouldn't be a viable option for when she decides to grab.Tank - This is the character you'll want to have squaring off against Flemeth due to his moderate armour and health values. In the video, Sten had 31 armour and took around 200 damage per full grab over a few seconds. Because of this burst damage, you'll rarely want to let them drop below about 170 health, or 60% of the average level 10 warriors health pool. This should be about 1-2 heals short of the damage a grab will do, but be sure to bear in mind the other high damaging attacks Flemeth has. Always try to keep her focussed on the tank, and save a taunt for if and when she loses interest. Also, if you can, try to turn her off at an angle facing away from your mage/s. That way, they should avoid any Fire Breath damage. However, you'll also need to avoid turning her too far, as her "Slap", much like fire breath, has a very wide AoE.
Melee DPS - You have two choices for this one. If you're a highly armoured damage dealer, then you can cut down on the knockbacks by standing off to the side of the dragon. On the one hand, you'll find yourself being knocked back far less than if you stand in a flanking position. On the other hand, you'll leave yourself open to being chewed on for a big chunk of health (a full grab took around 90-95% of my PCs pool at 13 armour and 270 health). While it's dangerous to attack her front-arc as a low health/armour character, it's still a good idea to move there when you want to pull off a special attack. This way, you have a good chance to avoid being interrupted and wasting stamina, whilst only giving Grab a small window of opportunity.
P.s. NEVER, I repeat, NEVER cluster these guys together, especially not in front of her.
Modifié par Darth_Shizz, 24 novembre 2009 - 11:50 .
#53
Posté 24 novembre 2009 - 11:47
tmp7704
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I didn't know what to expect in that fight so i brought 3 rogues (Zevran, Leliana and PC) and Wynne. When Flemeth shapeshifted it was bit of an "oh ****" moment.
But then i gave all my rogues bows, spread them around the base of hill where Flemeth was sitting and put Wynne some way behind them.
For some reason Flemeth decided to just sit on her hill and just trade shots with my rogues throughout the whole fight. So it took a handful of lyrium potions but no one really died...
But then i gave all my rogues bows, spread them around the base of hill where Flemeth was sitting and put Wynne some way behind them.
For some reason Flemeth decided to just sit on her hill and just trade shots with my rogues throughout the whole fight. So it took a handful of lyrium potions but no one really died...
#54
Posté 24 novembre 2009 - 11:52
Darth_Shizz
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tmp7704 wrote...
I didn't know what to expect in that fight so i brought 3 rogues (Zevran, Leliana and PC) and Wynne. When Flemeth shapeshifted it was bit of an "oh ****" moment.
But then i gave all my rogues bows, spread them around the base of hill where Flemeth was sitting and put Wynne some way behind them.
For some reason Flemeth decided to just sit on her hill and just trade shots with my rogues throughout the whole fight. So it took a handful of lyrium potions but no one really died...
That's one way to do it unfortunately. I guess she's slightly wary of knocking down her house.
#55
Posté 26 novembre 2009 - 03:40
Titius.Vibius
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Tank in front, Alistair in front, Leliana back as usual, Mama Wynne rear healing the group.
#56
Posté 26 novembre 2009 - 04:58
Galian84
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I did it when my group was lvl17-18...it was myself (ranger), Wynne, Zevran, and Alistair.
I had Alistair in the front, tanking Flemeth and facing her away from the rest of the group, Zev at her sides backstabbing (at the very edge of the flanking/backstab area...I wasn't sure if she tail whipped but I didn't want to risk it), myself shooting my bow at range, and then Wynne doing nothing but heal-spamming, pretty much, and nuking every now and then when there was no one in need of healing. Took a while and like 2-3 lyrium potions, but she did end up going down on my first go at her.
I had Alistair in the front, tanking Flemeth and facing her away from the rest of the group, Zev at her sides backstabbing (at the very edge of the flanking/backstab area...I wasn't sure if she tail whipped but I didn't want to risk it), myself shooting my bow at range, and then Wynne doing nothing but heal-spamming, pretty much, and nuking every now and then when there was no one in need of healing. Took a while and like 2-3 lyrium potions, but she did end up going down on my first go at her.
#57
Posté 29 novembre 2009 - 08:30
Diamaht
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Ninjaphrog wrote...
Hay guys...
I'm stuck at where you need to kill Flemeth for Morrigan....How the HELL do you kill her? Is there a trick, or do you simply need to be higher level?
If you do it with a tank in the group the key is to keep moving. I brought two tanks, a healer and a rogue, when she transformed I spread everyone out and charged her with my main character to tank, switching Alister to use a bow. My original plan was to use the tanks to keep her on her back and pummel her with melee but that all changed when she transformed lol.
You need heavy armor on the tank or you will die fast. The key to keeping the tank alive is to set your healer to heal at 75% and keep moving. Have everyone attack at range and keep your tank on the move around her. She will constantly shift position when you go to the side in melee which cuts her dps in half. In the mean time if your tank gets to 50% take a potion, I used about 12 potions during the battle at lvl 12.
So keep your entire party at range and have your tank melee and keep him flanking.
That's what worked for me for what it's worth.
#58
Posté 01 décembre 2009 - 09:54
LordAsael
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Just finished this with Dwarf Noble Warrior Tank. The first attempt I got roflstomped, completely unprepared for this. The rest of my party was Leliana, Shale, and Wynn ... Shale was meant to be hurling rocks, but after a few deaths of my character Revive was on cool down and I switched Shale to tank. Leliana basically finished her off.
Some things that I did find to be useful, increase the healing threshold in Wynn's tactics, especially for the tank. Others have mentioned it previously, but I don't think that you can overstate the importance of that. Most people recommend setting the threshold for 50%, but that can leave you in some trouble and result in multiple deaths as I experienced.
Any fire resist that you can equip is invaluable for your tank. Doesn't hurt to equip some resistance to everyone, in the event placement get frakked up, either from your tank getting knocked around, killed, et cetera. Every little bit helps.
Preparation makes this a fun encounter. This is my first full playthrough (started a mage and frakked up my spec) and this was the first encounter that I had that felt like a true accomplishment. It's a shame that my dwarf doesn't particularly care for Morrigan. He's got a thing for the velvety softness of the party's bard.
With that said, I probably should have just taken the deal that Flemeth was offering, but my character is too honourable to double cross a party member in that fashion.
Some things that I did find to be useful, increase the healing threshold in Wynn's tactics, especially for the tank. Others have mentioned it previously, but I don't think that you can overstate the importance of that. Most people recommend setting the threshold for 50%, but that can leave you in some trouble and result in multiple deaths as I experienced.
Any fire resist that you can equip is invaluable for your tank. Doesn't hurt to equip some resistance to everyone, in the event placement get frakked up, either from your tank getting knocked around, killed, et cetera. Every little bit helps.
Preparation makes this a fun encounter. This is my first full playthrough (started a mage and frakked up my spec) and this was the first encounter that I had that felt like a true accomplishment. It's a shame that my dwarf doesn't particularly care for Morrigan. He's got a thing for the velvety softness of the party's bard.
With that said, I probably should have just taken the deal that Flemeth was offering, but my character is too honourable to double cross a party member in that fashion.
#59
Posté 12 décembre 2009 - 06:17
Keth Balderk
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I just finished this fight with my protagonist (DW warrior) at L15, Wynne, Shale, and Leliana at L14. I had to reload once. I used a few lyrium potions and a few healing potions. Wynne mainly contributed heals and rejuvenation. Protagonist did about 3/4 of the damage before dying. Shale tanked. It wasn't pretty, but the job got done on normal.
I appreciate the info provided by Darth-Shizz.
It seems like some of these advised tactics from other people are taking advantage of the AI or perhaps even a bug (in the case of the dog). For instance, force fielding a taunting tank is lame in my opinion, because the dragon *should* just attack someone else. Similarly, a dragon run by any person would jump on an archer and use his damaging specials rather than "trade" blows with him from a mountain top - or cook the lot of them with feiry blasts.
I am curious how this game scales combats to level and number of party members. Does anyone know?
I appreciate the info provided by Darth-Shizz.
It seems like some of these advised tactics from other people are taking advantage of the AI or perhaps even a bug (in the case of the dog). For instance, force fielding a taunting tank is lame in my opinion, because the dragon *should* just attack someone else. Similarly, a dragon run by any person would jump on an archer and use his damaging specials rather than "trade" blows with him from a mountain top - or cook the lot of them with feiry blasts.
I am curious how this game scales combats to level and number of party members. Does anyone know?
#60
Posté 12 décembre 2009 - 06:40
Darth_Shizz
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Keth Balderk wrote...
I appreciate the info provided by Darth-Shizz.
It seems like some of these advised tactics from other people are taking advantage of the AI or perhaps even a bug (in the case of the dog). For instance, force fielding a taunting tank is lame in my opinion, because the dragon *should* just attack someone else. Similarly, a dragon run by any person would jump on an archer and use his damaging specials rather than "trade" blows with him from a mountain top - or cook the lot of them with feiry blasts.
I am curious how this game scales combats to level and number of party members. Does anyone know?
Glad to hear that someone found it useful.
In terms of level scaling, there's not much point in me trying to explain it when you can find in-depth information on the mechanics here:
http://dragonage.gul...allenge_scaling
Hope that's what you're looking for man.
P.s. Next stop, Flemeth at hard!
Modifié par Darth_Shizz, 12 décembre 2009 - 06:40 .
#61
Posté 14 décembre 2009 - 10:13
Zamav
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I just killed Flemeth on Nightmare without anyone going down. My party setup was;
PC: Two Handed Warrior L10 (rest is either 9 or 10)
Alistair: Average gear, DPS with a shield
Shale: Main tank with chipped fire crystals
Wyne: Healer/Buffer and support DPS
I taunted it and kept threathen openon Shale, that way Shale never lost the aggro. Positioned Wyne just above the little cliff, PC to rear right leg, and Alistair to the rear left . Since my character had indomitable, he didn't get knocked down or stunned, only got pushed back by some attacks.
I had grand total of 25 health potions, 18 of them were lesser and 2 of them were grand. But, I had over 200 lyrium potions, so I setup Wyne to drink a lyrium potion after falling below 50%. I spammed Regeneration on Shale, Heroic Offense on my PC.
On my first try I was moving Alistair and PC between attacks to reduce the total damage my party takes, but, Flemeth sooner or later grabbed them 1 by 1, even grabbed my character 2 times in a row after surviving the first one.
Trick is to not to move anyone from their positions, if they get knockbacked, just allow them to re-approach themselves. If you move too much, Flemeth will grab you and the one she grabbed will be dead 99% of the time. Just stay put and shrug of the damage. Its not really much even with average equipment like mine.
You need to micro manage your potions and heals, but otherwise, its very easy.
PC: Two Handed Warrior L10 (rest is either 9 or 10)
Alistair: Average gear, DPS with a shield
Shale: Main tank with chipped fire crystals
Wyne: Healer/Buffer and support DPS
I taunted it and kept threathen openon Shale, that way Shale never lost the aggro. Positioned Wyne just above the little cliff, PC to rear right leg, and Alistair to the rear left . Since my character had indomitable, he didn't get knocked down or stunned, only got pushed back by some attacks.
I had grand total of 25 health potions, 18 of them were lesser and 2 of them were grand. But, I had over 200 lyrium potions, so I setup Wyne to drink a lyrium potion after falling below 50%. I spammed Regeneration on Shale, Heroic Offense on my PC.
On my first try I was moving Alistair and PC between attacks to reduce the total damage my party takes, but, Flemeth sooner or later grabbed them 1 by 1, even grabbed my character 2 times in a row after surviving the first one.
Trick is to not to move anyone from their positions, if they get knockbacked, just allow them to re-approach themselves. If you move too much, Flemeth will grab you and the one she grabbed will be dead 99% of the time. Just stay put and shrug of the damage. Its not really much even with average equipment like mine.
You need to micro manage your potions and heals, but otherwise, its very easy.
Modifié par Zamav, 14 décembre 2009 - 10:19 .
#62
Posté 14 décembre 2009 - 11:40
TAquinas
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I wasn't planning 2 kill her so brought a party I hadnt used(2 level them up): me dog sten and oghren...my companiens had no items except what they began with. Then I decided she must die anyway. I just ran in with all 3 companiens while sneking myself in into backstab position. The dragon clawed a bit on sten. I didn't want to waste healing on characters I didn't like. She finally picked him up to chew...rip sten. Meanwhile I stabbed. Flemeth at half life. Next went a wing buffet sending us all sprawling and some aggro on me...average health potion. I ran and dragon chewed on dog...dog didnt die and dragon breathed...I stabbed....20% left. Tail slap and down I go...dog dies....oghren dies and then I killed her. I was on hard difficulty and it was one of the easier big fights(1 average health potion...) Not sure why everyone says use ranged. U get sick damage in h2h when they do the special moves like chew or breath fire.
#63
Posté 24 décembre 2009 - 05:39
Dragoness75
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Does she actually have to be killed?
#64
Guest_LostScout_*
Posté 24 décembre 2009 - 06:18
Guest_LostScout_*
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No, you can negotiate with her, I sometimes let her live and it doesn't seem to have any negative consequences. Maybe in the sequel.
#65
Posté 24 décembre 2009 - 06:38
MOTpoetryION
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with weapons and alot of pots lol.
tibius vibius wrote .....
and liliana in back
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
One of the best positions for liliana
tibius vibius wrote .....
and liliana in back
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
One of the best positions for liliana
Modifié par MOTpoetryION, 24 décembre 2009 - 06:59 .
#66
Posté 25 décembre 2009 - 05:42
Dragoness75
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I managed to talk to her and I am going onto the Dwarf quests. Would I be able to go back and kill her after I finish
#67
Posté 26 janvier 2010 - 01:46
Amatti
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OMG.. that was awsome.. i jumped onto the dragons head and done a huge fatality.. skewered it through the back of the head.. no potions.. no deaths.. and only i took any damage.. but came out of its mouth alive everytime.. Arcane Warrior rulez..
#68
Posté 26 janvier 2010 - 01:53
Amatti
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all this thread made it sound realy hard.. but this dragon almost just fell o'er.. the first one was hard.. but once i had superior dragon plate.. pffft.. was just like a weekend BBQ lvl 15 A/W and Spellweaver
#69
Posté 26 janvier 2010 - 04:25
zedex26
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it's not THAT hard in Normal... first playthrough so I don't know how hard and nightmare are... but I managed to beat her at level 9... without using a single potion... well Wynne's lyrium potions not included
video here
commentary on the video sidebar and annotations
video here
commentary on the video sidebar and annotations
Modifié par zedex26, 26 janvier 2010 - 04:25 .
#70
Posté 08 février 2011 - 11:33
Frocharocha
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if u can't kill her.Try beat at easy mode.And at other waltroghts play at Hard dificult or Nightmare.Try use Shale.2 mages and 1 warrior.use resistance to fire.I beat her at level 9 first time.Sten and me die but shale killed her without problems.2 waltrought i beat her at level 13.
