82 réponses à ce sujet

[newcomplex]

Stoko981 wrote...

Behindyounow wrote...

Yes. What was the difference between two sets of heavy armour besides colour? Some meaningless stats that didn't affect the game anyway.

Yeah, I know exactly what you mean. 500+ shield strength vs 100 shield strength? No difference there at all, totally meaningless. I stuck with the first heavy armour I found in the game and never even bothered looking at any others I might have picked up

Thats exactly the problem, the only difference was a number, so upgrading was deciding which number was higher.   The only thing that factored into it.

Look at ME2s armor system, the game asks you to make choices as opposed to "Use if armor bar is green"

[puggini]

Vrashk wrote...

And seriously, whoever it was that claimed he enjoyed not having to bother running around poking crates and looking for loot... aren't you doing that in ME2?

At least for me, with there being so much less loot (scans) around, everytime I leave a mission I feel like running back and checking through the area again, to make sure I didnt miss something during the fighting.

But meh... I'm gonna go back to the game now!

I do that.

But the games too linear to even make that necessary. Everything's so straightforward, there's no exploration. Everytime you go into a room with those strategically placed crates you know there's about to be a fight.

[WillieStyle]

spitfiredjd wrote...

I like how you make a seemingly quasi intelligent post and then add some snide remake at the end.  Anyways isn't that part of role playing? Playing "dress up" as you call it...

There's nothing wrong with playing "dress up." Do what you want. I was just pointing out that folks in this thread were talking about different things:
-When it comes to improving the effectiveness of your gear in a steady fashion that affects gameplay: ME2 > ME1.
-When it comes to playing "armor lottery" or outfitting your squad in matching gear: ME1 > ME2.
Which you prefer depends on what you want out of the game.

After an encounter in an RPG is always fun for me, where you get to see what kind of loot got dropped, that is completly missing here in the game. 

Again, this speaks to the psychological disconnect between folks arguing in this thread.
For some people, the act of finding loot is merely a means to an end: getting upgrades that affect gameplay.  These people hated the ME1 system because there were very few gameplay-affecting items to pick up mixed in with tons of "vendor trash" you had to sell or turn into omnigel.
For others, the act of finding loot is itself a fun experience. It's like opening presents on Christmas.  Finding that one piece of Predator/Collussus armor makes omnigelling 27 pieces of crap armor worth it.
It's very hard for Bioware to please both kinds of people.  I for one like the direction they took, but I can understand why the "dressup lottery" folks are upset.

[Pocketgb]

puggini wrote...

Everyone keeps saying that once you had the Colossus X armor the game was pointless beyond that point. I didn't find the Colossus armor until I was a level 59. By that point I had 100+ hours invested. It was so rare to find, and it made me want to continue playing to get the best armor and weapons for my squadmates.

Reaching the peak of having the "best gear" did indeed feel like an accomplishment. Too bad that it meant you had no reason to pick up anything.

But it's more than that. It's the gear progression as a whole, and it's the same every single time: start with Hahne-Kadar weapons, pick up Elkoss Combine brand weapons (or ERC, probably the only "balanced" choice of weapons in the whole game), ya-dadadada, all the way to Collosus/Spectre grade. Yawn.

Mezinger wrote...

Nobody is making you upgrade to the better armour...

Um, the game is?

Modifié par Pocketgb, 31 janvier 2010 - 05:01 .

[NasherUK]

I miss the customization too. The system that replaces it just isn't much fun and seems a bit pointless :/

Also it might be just me, but the actual combat seems slightly worse. I don't remember all enemies in ME1 shooting with 100% accuracy (didn't they have some spread to make it look realistic?) and I swear the squadmate AI was better, in ME2 they seems to get stuck, shoot at walls, stand out in the open and do very little amounts of damage.  I also found it extremely easy, even on hard.  I must have died no more than 6 times through the whole game.

I think they made ME2 in to to much of a shoot-em-up and less of an RPG, luckily it has a good story behind it to make it stand out.

Modifié par NasherUK, 31 janvier 2010 - 05:06 .

[TileToad]

Wow, I never knew people hated the first ME so much... Everything was wrong in that game apparently. You might start to wonder what on earth made them consider the second one.

[konfeta]

Nobody is making you upgrade to the better armour... that's a real choice... you prefer Ashley in her white and red getup but you found new camo-stuff that you don't like the look of as much but it's got better shields... go ahead leave her in her standard armour... that's a choice and it is a standard RPG element...

Alright, I see what the problem is then. However, Bioware cut out aesthetics of customizing armor looks in favor of spending time on developing other stuff. It's a choice they made, for better or for worse. They simply took a direction that saved them massive time on developing multiple art assets for multiple armors.

I can't blame them, because in ME1, the traditional RPG elements were done very poorly gameplay wise, so I don't "miss them" in ME2. They could have attempted to fix the old system and expand it, or they (as they did) remove it and concentrate on other aspects. While it would be nice to have a fully fledged paper doll system of equipment for Sheppard and the squad, it wasn't what attracted me to ME1, so it's removal doesn't bother me. I can see why it would bother a more tradional RPG player, but the only thing I can say, "Dragon Age is that-a-away." The ME series is Bioware's forage in a different direction with different emphasis.

The only thing I truly miss from ME1 are the weapon/armor mods you (should be able to) switch on the fly (which was one of the few things they did more right than wrong), but it's not fatal.

Perhaps DLC or ME3 will try to include more of what you want, but that is a long shot.

Modifié par konfeta, 31 janvier 2010 - 05:07 .

[puggini]

Pocketgb wrote...

puggini wrote...

Everyone keeps saying that once you had the Colossus X armor the game was pointless beyond that point. I didn't find the Colossus armor until I was a level 59. By that point I had 100+ hours invested. It was so rare to find, and it made me want to continue playing to get the best armor and weapons for my squadmates.

Reaching the peak of having the "best gear" did indeed feel like an accomplishment. Too bad that it meant you had no reason to pick up anything.

But it's more than that. It's the gear progression as a whole, and it's the same every single time: start with Hahne-Kadar weapons, pick up Elkoss Combine brand weapons (or ERC, probably the only "balanced" choice of weapons in the whole game), ya-dadadada, all the way to Collosus/Spectre grade. Yawn.

Mezinger wrote...

Nobody is making you upgrade to the better armour...

Um, the game is?

How is that less interesting than having 5 weapons the entire playthrough? There's basically nothing you can find. You have pretty much everything from the very start. Aside from getting the damage upgrades, you're already done. It feels more like MW2, getting damage bonuses in small increments as you level up...

[Oloos]

Sometimes, i think people restrain the RPG genre to "pimp my character" and forgot the rest.



ME2 IS a damn good game and a damn good RPG. That's all.



ME1 got my bored quite often, in mE2, never. What else do you want ?

[konfeta]

How is that less interesting than having 5 weapons the entire playthrough?

It's not "more interesting," it's "less horrible." Amputating a festering limb is just as valid of an action as trying to cure it.

ME1's system was tedious, painful, and frustrating. It had all of the disadvantages of the traditional system compiled with a poor U.I. while missing out on almost all of the real gameplay benefits of that system. In ME2, it is streamlined. Yes, dumbed down and cut out. But I'd rather have a stump than rot. More resources dedicated to other stuff that actually differentiated ME from other games.

You hate this answer, but you have to face it. Mass Effect is no longer trying to be a "traditional" RPG. For better or for worse, it is now different. Shed a manly tear, and leave it in peace.

Yes, it would have been awesome if Bioware pulled a miracle and progressed ME1's system into something that was great. But Bioware's production values and resources aren't up to that standard, nor does their goal for this game lies on that path.

Modifié par konfeta, 31 janvier 2010 - 05:13 .

[Pocketgb]

puggini wrote...

How is that less interesting than having 5 weapons the entire playthrough?

Because you're not horrendously gimped from the start. Anyone leveling a Soldier using ARs can tell you this, and the only way to make the gunplay even slightly enjoyable is getting better gear and leveling up your stats. Uck.

And personally, I like using the Avenger for the entire game in ME2 because I become drawn to it. It was there with me at level 1 when I first started the game, and it will stay at my side for every time I'm a Soldier. 

[WillieStyle]

puggini wrote...

Pocketgb wrote...

puggini wrote...

Everyone keeps saying that once you had the Colossus X armor the game was pointless beyond that point. I didn't find the Colossus armor until I was a level 59. By that point I had 100+ hours invested. It was so rare to find, and it made me want to continue playing to get the best armor and weapons for my squadmates.

Reaching the peak of having the "best gear" did indeed feel like an accomplishment. Too bad that it meant you had no reason to pick up anything.

But it's more than that. It's the gear progression as a whole, and it's the same every single time: start with Hahne-Kadar weapons, pick up Elkoss Combine brand weapons (or ERC, probably the only "balanced" choice of weapons in the whole game), ya-dadadada, all the way to Collosus/Spectre grade. Yawn.

Mezinger wrote...

Nobody is making you upgrade to the better armour...

Um, the game is?

How is that less interesting than having 5 weapons the entire playthrough? There's basically nothing you can find. You have pretty much everything from the very start. Aside from getting the damage upgrades, you're already done. It feels more like MW2, getting damage bonuses in small increments as you level up...

This isn't true. Every weapon has at least 2 better versions you can find.  For instance, you start with the standard sniper rifle. You can get a semi-auto sniper rifle.  Then you can get a bolt-action sniper rifle later on in the game. 
Ah the beauty of the widow-maker.  God I love that weapon.

[Baxus359]

I thought the game was fine, but I like to tweak the graphics manually in the config file. I tried to edit the config, and apparently that game can't start if it has been edited in any way. That's my only complaint. Other than that this game is pretty awesome.

Modifié par Baxus359, 31 janvier 2010 - 05:17 .

[jpetrey123]

so much arguing i think ill join in me-"Bicker bicker bicker" myself-"argue argue argue"



this game is fun regardless of armor customization, the old inventory was indeed a mess, and this much improved.

[WOLFGIR2]

I didn't like the customization in the first game because it was too much of a necessity. It felt too much like they are trying to please teh Diablo looters and story wise people in one stroke.

When you played you suddenly went to inventory and realised you had picked up a tonne of stuff you hadn't seen. Nah, ME games are not something I prefer for looting and stuff-making, ME is for me a joyride and a good story. ME2 is more to my liking, but they could please start making next game for PC players and keep some of the good things, like weapons buttons and keyboard shortcuts to journal etc...

[Sidney]

Oloos wrote...

Sometimes, i think people restrain the RPG genre to "pimp my character" and forgot the rest.

They do and you see it here. It is like they really want Barbie Fashion Designer except with a lot more sharp objects so they can have their guy look just so.....


Even in all the BG2 glory people want to recall there were very few special weapons and a lot of dross you filtered through. I don't mind handling drops for top end items but in a game w/o magical weapons there's not much purpose and after a guy has been shotgunned, warped and hit with inferno rounds I don't expect much to be left over to pick up.

[ranger614]

Jack > You.

[Pocketgb]

Sidney wrote...

I don't mind handling drops for top end items but in a game w/o magical weapons there's not much purpose and after a guy has been shotgunned, warped and hit with inferno rounds I don't expect much to be left over to pick up.

At least that guy was nice enough to drop a thermal clip before he was turned into crispy crumbs

[sammy_dude]

puggini wrote...

And criticism is how developers learn what to improve in their next installment. I doubt they want people oogling about how much they love the game without expressing any gripes they might have.

This is one good reason I'm complaining so much  I love ME1 and 2 but much could be done for 3 to be worth while

[Johnson45]

Pocketgb wrote...

puggini wrote...

How is that less interesting than having 5 weapons the entire playthrough?

Because you're not horrendously gimped from the start. Anyone leveling a Soldier using ARs can tell you this, and the only way to make the gunplay even slightly enjoyable is getting better gear and leveling up your stats. Uck.

And personally, I like using the Avenger for the entire game in ME2 because I become drawn to it. It was there with me at level 1 when I first started the game, and it will stay at my side for every time I'm a Soldier. 

Personally I dumped that gun at the Normandy and picked something up which was much more badass... coughreaper weapon stashcough

[bconk55]

puggini wrote...

Behindyounow wrote...

So switching your armour for another piece of the same armour but differently coloured counts as customisation?

LOL

You had different tiers of armor I-X. Different varieties, all of which looked different. Different classes, light-heavy. And you could put on modifications (all of which had different tiers and uses). So no, I don't think they were 'same pieces of armor that looked different.'

Don't make it more than it was. Most people decided what armor and upgrades they would be wearing very early in the game (hell, a few models were vastly superior, and then it was just minor choices over stat distrubution) and then just switched out I for II, II for III, III for IV, etc. That is no more depth than the upgrade system, it is the illusion of depth.

I'm all for reintroducing the inventory, I'm all for customization, but don't pretend ME1 was something it wasn't. Tacking on a menu and calling it inventory does not make it any more robust than the upgrade system. Hell, I'd take a branching upgrade system over a return to the old inventory.

Modifié par bconk55, 31 janvier 2010 - 08:09 .

[ChuckNorris18]

 

[ChuckNorris18]

Your wish might one day be granted if you want it enough.

[purple_zebralemon]

Once you got the predator armor.. You were done with your so called customization. That was it.. Nothing special. Least now I can have good armor throughout the game.. And I can have green with purple camo and assorted chest pieces, etc etc. The armor custom is better in me2. Imo of course.