109 réponses à ce sujet

[Flacracker]

stuman89 wrote...

Textron wrote...

The points I've seen:

1. We see that the Collector (Prothean) reaper, named Harbringer, was controlling the collecters and the collector general.

2. It looks like the reapers turn the most dominant life form (humans this time) into a reaper every 50,000 years when they retake the galaxy.

Thoughts:
1. Humans are the biggest threat to the reapers from their perspective. Cerberus and TIM are working on strengthening Humanity more. As a story twist, could TIM have dreams of making humanity into the immortal masters of the galaxy like the Reapers are? His interest in Reaper technology, and in making humanity THE defacto powerhouse of races is interesting. Also, his eyes lead me to assume, he's not entirely human.

2. It might be that the reapers could have controlled human minds with a Human reaper, like the Collector reaper (Harbringer) did to the Collectors (Protheans). Maby with the intention of controlling Shepard.

3. Knowing that they as reapers would be Marching in to finish the fight soon before the current races become too aware and powerful, they were attempting to proactively gather as much of the dominant race as possible to create a reaper.

4. They still could use (need?) a reaper in the system capable of opening the mass relay at the citadel again so that they can get through fast.

Remember, the Protheans couldnt be made into a Reaper for some odd reason that we havent been told. The Reapers made them into the Collectors because that was all they could do with them besides wiping them out.

Who said protheans couldn't be made into reapers?

[pvt_java]

HoboJ wrote...

Ever since seeing the human reaper I've wondered. How the hell would it fly if it were completed. A rocket out its ass? Jetpack? Rocket feet?

 Since it was said that it would require millions more humans to complete, I assumed that it was merely a shell, and would look a bit different when complete. It didn't look exactly like a human, it had tentacles at the end of it's arms, and had no body below it's torso. I assume that the propulsion system would be at the end of it's spine.

[TheShizzo]

Listen to Mordin when you are doing his loyalty quest, I think it comes the closest to explaining it. Humans have a lot of variable, more so than the other alien races, things affect us much more greatly both good and bad, perhaps it was the most effective means of using that great variable affect to make something more powerful.

[ShadowWolf_Kell]

Textron wrote...

The points I've seen:

1. We see that the Collector (Prothean) reaper, named Harbringer, was controlling the collecters and the collector general.

2. It looks like the reapers turn the most dominant life form (humans this time) into a reaper every 50,000 years when they retake the galaxy.

Thoughts:
1. Humans are the biggest threat to the reapers from their perspective. Cerberus and TIM are working on strengthening Humanity more. As a story twist, could TIM have dreams of making humanity into the immortal masters of the galaxy like the Reapers are? His interest in Reaper technology, and in making humanity THE defacto powerhouse of races is interesting. Also, his eyes lead me to assume, he's not entirely human.

2. It might be that the reapers could have controlled human minds with a Human reaper, like the Collector reaper (Harbringer) did to the Collectors (Protheans). Maby with the intention of controlling Shepard.

3. Knowing that they as reapers would be Marching in to finish the fight soon before the current races become too aware and powerful, they were attempting to proactively gather as much of the dominant race as possible to create a reaper.

4. They still could use (need?) a reaper in the system capable of opening the mass relay at the citadel again so that they can get through fast.

Point 2 is largely irrelevant given the nature of indoctrination.

I think something that's being overlooked is that humans were being harvested to actually build more Reapers.  I don't think the Reapers can actually reproduce without using organic materials within the process.  Despite the numbers EDI estimates, that doesn't mean that they can't round up humans then use them purely as genetic cloning stock from that point onward.  And given the fact that the Keepers themselves are endlessly recycled and cloned ot keep the Citadel going, I think it's fairly safe to say that the Reapers definitely have that technology perfected.

I think there's less signifigance to the Reaper you destroy in the game compared to how it's being constructed.  It's a glimpse into the motives for the Reapers for the time being.  The current cycle has been interrupted.  It's inevitable that they plan to complete it.  The Citadel is simply ease of access, but I highly doubt it's the only way for the Reapers to enter the Milky Way.

As for the end scene with all the Reapers, that can be taken many ways.  I didn't see it as them all slumbering.  I saw it them being awake and massing for invasion.

[ShadowAldrius]

SunfighterG8 wrote...

Lets be honest though. Bioware knew their end boss looked exactly like a terminator....and they didnt want to get sued....

So thats why it has a 3rd eye.....

Uh, James Cameron hasn't copywrited the human skeleton.

They did it to make it more visually interesting, and yes, probably to distinguish it from a Terminator. But I don't think 'lawsuit!!' was the reason.

I don't think they invade the galaxy TO reproduce, I think gathering up living organics is just HOW they reproduce.  So they were going through the process to create another vanguard to replace Sovereign. And I think humans were chosen for any number of reasons, genetically they were probably the only ones who would actually work for the process.

Because in certain playthroughs humans AREN'T the dominant species in the galaxy. It's still the salarians (scientifically), turians (militarily) and asari (diplomatically). So it has to be something else. It could be the role they played in killing Sovereign, but I think it's genetic.

Modifié par ShadowAldrius, 01 février 2010 - 12:56 .

[Fallout_IX]

The Reapers might want to enslave humanity like they did the Protheans. There has to be more than 1 alien race around every 50,000 years, so maybe they assimilate one to be like the collectors and kill off the rest?



Another reason i thought of this was because of the plague on Omega, it kills off every alien race apart from humans and the Vorcha said they were working for the Collectors.

[jimmyjoefro]

Just thought of this, what if the Reapers do not normally convert species to Reapers? What if they were building the human-reaper simply to do the job that Sovereign failed to do, activate the Citadel?  That would explain why the all seem to resemble some kind of cuttlefish, and not a mixture of all kind of species.

Modifié par jimmyjoefro, 01 février 2010 - 01:00 .

[lltoon]

jimmyjoefro wrote...

Just thought of this, what if the Reapers do not normally convert species to Reapers? What if they were building the human-reaper simply to do the job that Sovereign failed to do, activate the Citadel?

How? By squeezing his fingers through a Presidium window to press the 'activate mass relay' button?

Modifié par lltoon, 01 février 2010 - 01:02 .

[Garuda One]

ARK of ILKS wrote...

Shishio_sama wrote...

The way i understand it, every 50,000 years the reapers wipe out the dominant intelligent life at the time and render them down to make a new reaper.

Every REAPER shown in the reaper armada at the end looked just like sovereigh.

Fix'd

[jimmyjoefro]

lltoon wrote...

jimmyjoefro wrote...

Just thought of this, what if the Reapers do not normally convert species to Reapers? What if they were building the human-reaper simply to do the job that Sovereign failed to do, activate the Citadel?

How? By squeezing his fingers through a Presidium window to press the 'activate mass relay' button?

Probably something similar to this?

Modifié par jimmyjoefro, 01 février 2010 - 01:10 .

[Bryy_Miller]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

HoboJ wrote...

Ever since seeing the human reaper I've wondered. How the hell would it fly if it were completed. A rocket out its ass? Jetpack? Rocket feet?

Sovereign had none of those things, why would a Human-Reaper? Anyway:

Assimilating humans; who have proven themselves worthy because of Shepard's actions in ME1.

Reapers are our salvation through our destruction; according to Harbinger. So yeah, assimilation into Reaper god-hood.

Also, I doubt very much that they would look like a giant human after the torso had been fully grown. Think of it as a masthead on a ship.

[Telemachus78]

So the can shrink it down and send it back in time to kill Sarah Conner which every one knows she is the great, great, great, etc, etc Grandmother of Commander Shepard hahahahaha couldnt resist.

[Prometheus-BC]

Is it possible that the race itself becomes the reaper? That the idea of them as destroyers is actually more like "the essence of this race will now transcend its mortal state"? That each of these races that over millions of years were cleaned out was an artificial process of ascension? The first reaper may have been a civilization that outgrew the galaxy - they could no longer sustain themselves, and so distilled their memories, feelings, their very core essence into an artificial lifeform. Not an AI. As Sovereign said, each reaper 'ship' was a nation. That strikes me not as arrogance but as an expression of the composition of their form? So this civilization, now flying free amongst the stars, decides to 'assist' other civilizations at their peak to ascend into reapers too.



If the reapers just needed biological material, they could have stayed in the galaxy and just set up farming and used that. Clearly, they need advanced lifeforms for this purpose.



This is just conjecture.

[i7206]

Did I miss something? When was it mentioned that Harbinger is a Prothean Reaper? I assumed it was the Reapers leader controlling the head honcho of the Protheans/Collectors.

[Myrmedus]

ShadowAldrius wrote...

SunfighterG8 wrote...

Lets be honest though. Bioware knew their end boss looked exactly like a terminator....and they didnt want to get sued....

So thats why it has a 3rd eye.....

Uh, James Cameron hasn't copywrited the human skeleton.

They did it to make it more visually interesting, and yes, probably to distinguish it from a Terminator. But I don't think 'lawsuit!!' was the reason.

Got to say I agree with this. Conceptually the Human Reaper is sound and it needs to look human for impact, to truly get across the fact that this is a human 'god' if you will. The fact that ends up making it look like another machine based upon the human skeleton is irrelevant; besides, let's face it, our skeleton and especially our skull look pretty ****ing intimidating.

i7206 wrote...

Did I miss something? When was it
mentioned that Harbinger is a Prothean Reaper? I assumed it was the
Reapers leader controlling the head honcho of the
Protheans/Collectors.

It wasn't...people are just assuming because it looks insect-like and the Protheans are insect-like....

Modifié par Myrmedus, 01 février 2010 - 02:03 .

[jimmyjoefro]

The Collectors are insectoid. The Protheans looked like humans with tentacle beards.

[fredders]

The Human Reaper was tiny in comparison to a complete Reaper, which makes me think that by the time the construction is complete they all take the Cuttlefish-like shape. The human like stucture would just be the core of it, hence each Reaper being an individual nation. Each Reaper has a different core (based on the species appearance), but pretty much the same exterior, therefore they all think differently and have, to some extent, different ambitions / desires. At least, thats what im expecting to be revealed in ME3. But im probably totally wrong!

[Tal-N]

Consider that the Reapers are artifical life. They think like machines because they are machines. When they see one of their own destroyed by an organic it is natural to conclude that the organic has something superior to the Reaper design. Therefore the humans reveal a weakness in the Reapers. The solution, therefore, is to adapt the Reaper design to include what is human. The end result will be superior to both humans and the older design of Reaper.



Think of it as Reaper 2.0 while Sovreign was Reaper 1.0



Plus you have to admit, it looked totally badass lol

[Terminus Pi]

There never was a prothean Reaper. It is said in the game that they weren't able to create a prothean reaper, so instead of destroying the protheans, they repurposed them.

In the end cinematic, where you see the reaper fleet, you can see that they are all slightly different. Reapers are at least 2Km long, as was said about the derelict reaper, but the human reaper is some 150-200m long only. This seems to aid the theory that it's humanoid shape will be integrated in to a more squid-like form, like the others. It is then called a "human" reaper, because it is based on human genetic material.

I think that the need for humans is more of a genetic thing. That would explain why the collectors were gathering all kinds of beings - to find a species that would be genetically compatible for the construction of a reaper. The protheans couldn't be made into a reaper, despite being significantly more advanced than humans, posing a larger threat, which also indicates that there may be some specific genetic requirements for the construction of a reaper.

Further, in a conversation with Legion, we come to understand that the Geth came into contact with sovereign a few thousand years ago, which hints that the Geth may know reapers better than other species. Legion hints in this conversation that the reapers are somewhat similar and yet different to the geth. Each reaper is an independent nation, which suggests that reapers may be a large collection of software programs on a mobile platform that requires some sort of machine/organic structure to function. They differ from the geth in that they get all their strength without having to be networked.

And now for some wild speculation: it looked to me as if Legion is some sort of prototype created to try to mimic the way a reaper works (minus the organic parts) - being able to house a much larger number of programs, therefore making it far more intelligent than his fellow Geth when not networked. And sure enough, behold that Legion also has an uncanny obsession with Shepard. What is it with highly evolved AIs and Shepard? lol

[Hyper Cutter]

Terminus Pi wrote...

 That would explain why the collectors were gathering all kinds of beings - to find a species that would be genetically compatible for the construction of a reaper

Supported by Harbinger's comments about the races of your squadmates.

I suspect that there might be a fixed number of Reapers in existence at any one time, and they only start trying to build a new one if an existing one is lost. It's probably not coincidence the Human Reaper project started not long after Sovereign was killed at the Battle of the Citadel...

[archonambroseus]

That the Protheans were "incompatible" with the Reaper design makes sense.  Think back to how you discover that the Reapers are the Collectors.

[Tiggerous]

I thought that they'd have two reasons for making a human reaper, the first being so they'd have someone to activate the citadel mass relay. The second so that the reaper would look human like. They obviously think of humans as a threat, and when all the other races see a reaper in human shape maybe they figured they'd all turn on humanity. Humans wouldn't be such a threat then.

[StarcloudSWG]

Reaper concept art

This is from the art book that came with the digital deluxe edition. You'll notice the way the "human" part is nestled in the "shell" part.

And if you look closely at Sovereign's death scene, you'll see something similar as Sovereign starts to fall from the Citadel Tower. 

Modifié par StarcloudSWG, 21 décembre 2010 - 02:34 .

[Nu-Nu]

I don't think they kill every space-faring species just to feed, they come back to reproduce as well. Did they not try to make protheans into a reaper but were unsuccessful or so EDI speculates, so they ended up just being empty husks slaves to the reapers.  And in me3 we actually find out that harbringer is a successful  prothean reaper.

Modifié par Nu-Nu, 21 décembre 2010 - 02:42 .

[The Unfallen]

^ This.



I personally think the Human-Reaper was a prototype, and not all Reapers are made this way.