95 réponses à ce sujet

[AtreiyaN7]

You know what...the ME1 inventory was pretty terrible. Ever get get stuck in the black inventory screen when you're overloaded with items and are then forced to omni-gel everything down to escape from it? Yeah, that was wonderful. I wanted to spend time doing that on my fourth-sixth ME1 runs...as I've said many a time now, I eventually got to a point where I despised omni-gelling hundreds of items. I also got tired of constantly checking mods just to make sure I hadn't forgotten to upgrade from VII to VIII or whatever, so thank the gods for research upgrades that take the place of mods.

[Killian Kalthorne]

I will tell you guys one thing, I will never use Garrus in my party. I refuse to use a character that wears damaged armor into a fight. Period. Also, what the hell is up with the rest of the NPCs when it comes to armor. The only two that seems to be wearing actual armor is Zaeed and Jacob. It makes no sense to bring a half naked chick to a gun fight no matter how powerful her biotics are.

The armor and gear system in ME2 MAKES NO SENSE WHATSOEVER.

Modifié par Killian Kalthorne, 01 février 2010 - 06:36 .

[LyonVanguard]

The inventory system in ME1 wasn't perfect, but in return they completely took away the option to add armors to different characters, toggle helmets etc.

Good job to everyone who complained about the inventory system. It needed improvement and refinement not total elimination.

[NSIBystander]

Cpl_Facehugger wrote...
One thing that was great about the previous game was that you could customize the looks of your party. It was awesome to see, for instance, Ashley and Kaidan in actual armor complete with helmets. They really looked like professional soldiers. Now we've got Miss "high heels and sexy-suit" Miranda Lawson running around looking like some kind of model in a combat zone. I haven't gotten Jack yet, but I bet she's going to be even more rage inducing than Miranda.

The party members not wearing actual armor doesn't bother me as much, since most of the people who aren't wearing armor are biotics.  In fact, if you look at Jack's squad screen (which I realize that you haven't gotten her yet), it doesn't give a Shield value like others do, it gives a Barrier value, implying that she is using her biotics for defense.  I haven't doubled checked this with the other biotics, but I imagine it's similar.

[Killian Kalthorne]

LyonVanguard wrote...

The inventory system in ME1 wasn't perfect, but in return they completely took away the option to add armors to different characters, toggle helmets etc.
Good job to everyone who complained about the inventory system. It needed improvement and refinement not total elimination.

Exactly.  All they had to do is get rid of the Grade System.  Let Phoenix Armor just be Phoenix Armor, and drop the I - X.  Let Heat Sinks be just Heat sinks and drop the I - X aspects.  That is the onlyh thing they needed to do.  The Gear and Equipment system they have is sickening.  I do prefer ME1's over ME2's hands down.

What I really find disappointing is that I can't customize my NPCs' looks.  In ME I do my best to color coordinate my squad.  All party members using the same armor type.  It makes them look more militaristic and professional.

Modifié par Killian Kalthorne, 01 février 2010 - 06:40 .

[Rum Monkey]

I disagree, the Inventory system in ME1 was terrible! Not sortable or collapsible, all I was doing was sitting there turning things into omni gel for hours it seemed like! The Planet scanning thing so far in ME2 though I think is a mite dull.

[ME2Shephard]

Twitchmonkey wrote...

ME2Shephard wrote...
Obviously you never thought to use Inferno Rounds with Frictionless Materials in ME1. You get massive amounts of attack power against both synthetics and organics plus your equipment never overheats. Just food for thought the next time you plan to play through the first game. Now I will agree with you that evetually, and by eventually I mean 40+ hours into the game, will you start turning everything into omni-gel. There is still alot of game play involved before you result in those actions from the first game. I enjoyed it more. Gave me more options with worthless weapons. But with that being said. I like how they had certain classes only able to use certain weapons. However the lack of customization made the game a bore to me.

Also the second point you claimed is way inaccurate. I will give a build of a soldier that can only die to husks in the first game. I literally kill Thresher Maws and Geth Colossus's faster outside of the MAKO than inside because of how much Damage Protection my character has and how strong the character actually is. The stat system worked. It gave the game more of an RPG element in ME1 where in ME2, I felt like I bought Gears of War with John Shepard as the main character!

I'd say these are all arguments for ME2s approach to things. By limiting how much you can min-max your build, the game is consistently challenging (assuming you're on an appropriate difficulty level). You certainly do improve over time, and you can really notice the difference between the different levels of a skill, but it's much harder to become a walking god in ME2, which really makes insanity a good challenge.

I understand your argument there but there are ways to still keep the stat system like they had it and still make the game challenging. First off with all RPG's its about how you build your character to determine how good he is. Its also about the Weapons and Armor your character has equipped. That is a major role in determining what a RPG is. The only reason my character was like that was because of the character build. That IMO is a true basis for RPG. Bioware did something really inventive by introducing a stat system to a TPS which made the expierence more special to me in the first game. True I do like the how much more difficult the second game is but the fact that they took the stat system out just made it another TPS and it wasn't a better expierence to me than the first game was.

[badmammajamma04]

Facehugger, I agree with you. Although the thermal clips are to me more of a minor nuisance, the armor customization of your squad was sad to lose. Although I don't mind looking at miss Sexy-suit McHigh-heels, in ME1 it was awesome to suit up my dudes in Colossus or some other bad****-looking armor that was different from the normal styles. I liked making the transition from medium to heavy armor and how that made you look, as well as the functionality of it all. I liked slapping on some Devlon armor when on a planet with a harsh atmosphere... unfortunately this level of complexity isn't in ME2.

Of course there is some nice customization with your own suit, and different chestplates/armor components have some different performance bonuses; you can't really feel the performance improvement of these components. The stats are all too behind-the-scenes.



As for the OP's post, he seems to be referring to the "inventory system" as the complexity of equippable components and upgrades for your squad's armor and weapons. Although his word choice is incorrect, that is what he is saying was good compared to ME2. And I believe it was. The actual inventory system as we know it from ME1 was unanimously bad and I don't think anyone's arguing that. The system of managing your looted items (inventory) via one huge list that doesn't group similar items together and makes you scroll through 10 of the same upgrade type before going to the same upgrade just 1 rank higher? Yea that sucked.

[DarthCaine]

I prefer most of the changes (except no armor for squad mates)

[durasteel]

My only problem with ME2 is the shortage of credits. Starting out broke is one thing, but ending the game broke is pretty weak, in my opinion. That's it, my only problem.



With regard to the inventory issue, I don't miss it at all. After my first couple of play-throughs of ME1, I started using cheat codes to give everyone level x of their starting armor so that I wouldn't ever have to play "dress up the sqauddie" again. It was also lame that your squad members would revert to their starting armor in cut scenes, so it was less distracting to just keep them in the same make and model through the game.



Another annoying thing about the inventory was that it would get full, and you would have to stop and omni-gel some junk before you could pick up more junk.



I did want to slap some bondo on Garrus' armor though, I'll admit that. And Legion.. seems like it would have been a good idea to fix that hole up before getting into another firefight.

[Killian Kalthorne]

Exactly. Bioware, what were you guys thinking when you decided to design characters with HUGE GAPING HOLES in their armor or wearing NO ARMOR AT ALL!?!?!?

I like games that make sense and that makes no sense at all. 

Modifié par Killian Kalthorne, 01 février 2010 - 07:00 .

[badmammajamma04]

Killian Kalthorne wrote...

Exactly. Bioware, what were you guys thinking when you decided to design characters with HUGE GAPING HOLES in their armor or wearing NO ARMOR AT ALL!?!?!?

I like games that make sense and that makes no sense at all. 

You're tellin me, brotha!  At least give Miranda some crotch-armor circa Fergie from the 2010 Grammys!(http://www.pynkceleb.../comment-page-1)

[Twitchmonkey]

ME2Shephard wrote...
I understand your argument there but there are ways to still keep the stat system like they had it and still make the game challenging. First off with all RPG's its about how you build your character to determine how good he is. Its also about the Weapons and Armor your character has equipped. That is a major role in determining what a RPG is. The only reason my character was like that was because of the character build. That IMO is a true basis for RPG. Bioware did something really inventive by introducing a stat system to a TPS which made the expierence more special to me in the first game. True I do like the how much more difficult the second game is but the fact that they took the stat system out just made it another TPS and it wasn't a better expierence to me than the first game was.

The thing is, ME has never felt like a series that is meant to be based on build. You could create an uber build in ME, but that seems like more of an accident than anything. If you want to be a walking god based on your stat choices, then DA delivers more of that experience. In ME and especially ME2, stat choices let you alter how your character plays, but it's meant to be difficult if you choose a high difficulty and you're meant to depend on your own skills to a certain extent. Otherwise it might as well just be KotOR with asari.

Exactly.  All they had to do is get rid of the Grade System.  Let
Phoenix Armor just be Phoenix Armor, and drop the I - X.  Let Heat
Sinks be just Heat sinks and drop the I - X aspects.  That is the onlyh
thing they needed to do.  The Gear and Equipment system they have is
sickening.  I do prefer ME1's over ME2's hands down.

What I
really find disappointing is that I can't customize my NPCs' looks.  In
ME I do my best to color coordinate my squad.  All party members using
the same armor type.  It makes them look more militaristic and
professional.

The problem with that system still is that one armor becomes obsolete when the better one is found, whether it's Colossus I or X, it is still going to be better than a comparable Phoenix or Explorer, thus really limiting choice mosre than anything.

In ME2, assuming you didn't go with one of the special bonus armors (which themselves are more unique than the ones from the first game) then you are able to augment your default armor set which different pieces which allow you to define your character's focus. I agree that more squadmate options would be nice, but neither option is good in that case. I'd like to see a 4-5 different sets per party member that would all have a different focus and could be found in certain story missions.

[Killian Kalthorne]

And what about the rest of the party?

[Twitchmonkey]

Killian Kalthorne wrote...

And what about the rest of the party?

Was that directed at me? I just said in my post, they should earn 4-5 different sets of armor with different skills focuses in certain story portions. This is more of a visual thing than anything, as it works more like a swappable version of the upgrade system and you'll likely choose one armor and stick with it, but at least you can feel like the different armors have some purpose other than visual.

[drstg]

i think a compromise could have happened with the inventory problem. instead of 200 different wepons, 40 should have been used in ME2. for example have the choice between the storm and the avalanche as well as spectre gear and what ever else.



weapon stats would have been nice as well. you literally don't have to change weapons at all in ME2 which seems like a waste.



i do enjoy the new upgrade system. it was a refreshing approach to that aspect of the game.



and i am willing to bet that many who complain that in ME1 you only created omni-gel with new weapons and upgrades only did that once they aquired spectre gear. or on their second play-through. it was great in ME1 when you reached a level new weapons became available that performed better than old ones.

[AtreiyaN7]

I never campaigned to change the inventory system on the forums myself. However, I certainly didn't mind it being yanked at all for the reasons I stated. I like the weapons loadout too. Now even if you had the armor back with this hypothetical drop the I-X idea, then if you're being sensible, you'd still pick Colossus because it's superior to everything else, or are you seriously telling me you'd pick a lesser armor because of its color or for some other silly reason? This is if you had whole suits without interchangeable pieces.

[Veex]

Killian Kalthorne wrote...

1)  The complete lack of a proper inventory system.  ME1 had a very good inventory system which allowed a great deal of varied gear options.  At the very least you don't have your people running around in damaged armor like poor Garrus in ME2.  FOr godsakes, who smegged up idea was that?!?!  No one with half a brain would go out in battle with damaged equipment.

You can tolerate your squad lugging around 150 suits of armor and rifles but you can't comprehend Garrus fighting in damage gear? Realism is paramount to you when it fits your argument I see. Stop being a hypocrit.

[ME2Shephard]

"Twitchmonkey wrote...

The thing is, ME has never felt like a series that is meant to be based on build. You could create an uber build in ME, but that seems like more of an accident than anything. If you want to be a walking god based on your stat choices, then DA delivers more of that experience. In ME and especially ME2, stat choices let you alter how your character plays, but it's meant to be difficult if you choose a high difficulty and you're meant to depend on your own skills to a certain extent. Otherwise it might as well just be KotOR with asari"



Then why have the stat system in the first game? If it was "meant" to be a TPS to begin with, why have a stat system? The fact is, whether people want to believe it or not, that it was supposed to be a RPG along with a TPS, which they did. They made a brilliant game and series off of enginuity. Now it was like Bioware/EA looked at Gears and was like "hmmmm, people like this game right.... Lets go with this format but keep skill wheel. Thats what made this game different from the rest of TPS's." Bioware representatives(when they were still with microsoft) had a lot to say about the game design when the first one came out. Verbatim they said themselves, that they wanted to do something new yet still keep the fans that had grown to love Bioware. That is from their mouths. The game was supposed to be a balance between both styles. Now it isn't and I personally don't enjoy the new direction that Bioware is taking this franchise.

[Killian Kalthorne]

You have your three baseline types.



Light, Medium, and Heavy armors. Each baseline type will have a number of hardpoints for modification and upgrades. Light having the least, with heavy the most. Also the bulk of the armor would effect speed and movement of the character. Modifying the individual armor would be like ME2, but instead of being able to just modify Shepherd's armor you will be able to modify everyone's armor.

[Killian Kalthorne]

Veex wrote...

You can tolerate your squad lugging around 150 suits of armor and rifles but you can't comprehend Garrus fighting in damage gear? Realism is paramount to you when it fits your argument I see. Stop being a hypocrit.

Because the bulk of that crap would be at... wait for it... AT THE NORMANDY'S CARGO HOLD.

Hmmmph.  Idiot.,

[badmammajamma04]

Veex wrote...

Killian Kalthorne wrote...

1)  The complete lack of a proper inventory system.  ME1 had a very good inventory system which allowed a great deal of varied gear options.  At the very least you don't have your people running around in damaged armor like poor Garrus in ME2.  FOr godsakes, who smegged up idea was that?!?!  No one with half a brain would go out in battle with damaged equipment.

You can tolerate your squad lugging around 150 suits of armor and rifles but you can't comprehend Garrus fighting in damage gear? Realism is paramount to you when it fits your argument I see. Stop being a hypocrit.

No need to troll it out, Veex.  His argument is perfectly valid- it just strikes him harder than your own point does. 

I too was disappointed when I found out that he wasn't going to get a new set of armor.  Lugging around "150 suits" is no less of a logical problem, but less of a big deal to me (and I'm guessing him).  I guess it's less "in your face".

[Walker White]

Despite everyone raving about the story, I really think that the squadmate commentary is a major problem in ME2. Your squad members rarely talk.



In ME1, almost anytime you had a conversation, it went (1) Shepard, (2) person being talked to, (3) squad member comment, (4) back to Shepard. Now your squad mates will talk only a one or two times the whole mission. I barely know that my squad mates are there.



In ME1, you would bring a character Wrex along because of his running commentary about the world. Now there is so little NPC commentary that there is no reason to bring someone along other than combat.

[Veex]

Killian Kalthorne wrote...

Because the bulk of that crap would be at... wait for it... AT THE NORMANDY'S CARGO HOLD.

Hmmmph.  Idiot.,

Really? So you never got the "you're nearing the 150 item limit" while on a planet? Now you're just lying. No point in this discussion whatsoever.

[Twitchmonkey]

ME2Shephard wrote...
Then why have the stat system in the first game? If it was "meant" to be a TPS to begin with, why have a stat system? The fact is, whether people want to believe it or not, that it was supposed to be a RPG along with a TPS, which they did. They made a brilliant game and series off of enginuity. Now it was like Bioware/EA looked at Gears and was like "hmmmm, people like this game right.... Lets go with this format but keep skill wheel. Thats what made this game different from the rest of TPS's." Bioware representatives(when they were still with microsoft) had a lot to say about the game design when the first one came out. Verbatim they said themselves, that they wanted to do something new yet still keep the fans that had grown to love Bioware. That is from their mouths. The game was supposed to be a balance between both styles. Now it isn't and I personally don't enjoy the new direction that Bioware is taking this franchise.

It's always been a hybrid between a TPS and an RPG and it continues to be so, it's just a matter of where the balance lies. Neither game has the level of restriction of a game like DA:O, as you got on in levels in ME1 you could max out several skills and when you got to 60 you can have like 8 different skills maxed and be a god, in DA:O you only have 20 levels and can't afford to mispend one skill point. ME2 is a bit more extreme than that, but in many ways it forces you to choose a path much more than in ME1 because you just don't have the same amount of levels. However, when you do upgrade a skill, you really feel it, it makes a real difference, it's not just an extra 1% duration. It makes you feel like you're really getting better at something, which is the point of skill progression.

Despite everyone raving about the story, I really think that the
squadmate commentary is a major problem in ME2. Your squad members
rarely talk.



In ME1, almost anytime you had a
conversation, it went (1) Shepard, (2) person being talked to, (3)
squad member comment, (4) back to Shepard. Now your squad mates will
talk only a one or two times the whole mission. I barely know that my
squad mates are there.



In ME1, you would bring a
character Wrex along because of his running commentary about the world.
Now there is so little NPC commentary that there is no reason to bring
someone along other than combat.

This is something I can agree with. ME2 needed more banter, not less.

Modifié par Twitchmonkey, 01 février 2010 - 07:32 .