187 réponses à ce sujet

[TheBlackBaron]

David Gaider wrote...
Now, that said, am I saying that every ending ever for Dragon Age must be bittersweet? (Because that's what I would call the over tone of the endings.) Not at all. Different stories will no doubt hit different notes, because we'll want to try different things. I will say, however, that we could have gone a lot darker had we wished to -- the potential is certainly there -- so I'm by no means promising happy cloud fun times from here on in.

I was rather surprised there wasn't an ending that resulted in everybody dying in the most horrible of fashions while the Archdemon moped about the loss of his fabulous Old God hair.

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 02 février 2010 - 04:34 .

[tallon1982]

Isn't happiness what you make of it? I mean when you think about it how many happy endings are there in the real world? You have celebrities divorcing left and right, millionaires that are miserable where's the happy ending? Oh here's a big bummer for those in la la land...you will eventually die because no one can live forever. Do you think that's a happy ending?



Rather than whine about what didn't happen one should embrace what did happen. It's when we grasp for the what could have been that we forget what we have right now.

[le_cygne]

TheBlackBaron wrote...

I was rather surprised there wasn't an ending that resulted in everybody dying in the most horrible of fashions 

Dragon Age: Origins -- Happier Endings than Shakespeare™

[QuiTamGogh]

I can't believe no one's hit the obvious chord ... :::rolls up sleeves::: A man's gotta do what a man's gotta do. Ahem!



If I recall, each romance ends in a happy ending -- all you need to do is select the "come back to my tent" dialogue option.



ENCHANTMENT!

[tallon1982]

TheBlackBaron wrote...

David Gaider wrote...
Now, that said, am I saying that every ending ever for Dragon Age must be bittersweet? (Because that's what I would call the over tone of the endings.) Not at all. Different stories will no doubt hit different notes, because we'll want to try different things. I will say, however, that we could have gone a lot darker had we wished to -- the potential is certainly there -- so I'm by no means promising happy cloud fun times from here on in.

I was rather surprised there wasn't an ending that resulted in everybody dying in the most horrible of fashions while the Archdemon moped about the loss of his fabulous Old God hair.

Yea it's called Game Over.

[SusanStoHelit]

David Gaider wrote...

SusanStoHelit wrote...
But ... the real issue here is that for most of those posting about the lack of a happy ending - they want that ending with Alistair and Morrigan. Because those are the two 'favourite' romanceable characters, insofar as I can tell, anyway.

That's my impression as well. Some people seem to want a happy ending, no strings attached and nothing unpleasant involved in achieving that happy ending, with the romance of their choice. I get the desire behind wanting it -- but as far as I'm concerned there are plenty of "happy" endings. You are a hero, ending a Blight before it even truly began, and there are romances that do continue on just fine.

Not every romance can have a happy ending? And there's no way to be completely happy with no dark clouds on the horizon? Well there you go. This is not romantic fantasy -- which is what that notion is, regardless of whether there is an actual romance involved it is still a romantic ideal. And that's part of the point. We wanted our ending to be powerful, and memorable, and while I understand perfectly that some people simply want escapism that's just not what this game is meant to deliver.

Now, that said, am I saying that every ending ever for Dragon Age must be bittersweet? (Because that's what I would call the over tone of the endings.) Not at all. Different stories will no doubt hit different notes, because we'll want to try different things. I will say, however, that we could have gone a lot darker had we wished to -- the potential is certainly there -- so I'm by no means promising happy cloud fun times from here on in.

Thank you for your response, David. I appreciate all that. And as I said, I appreciate the endings, too. I'm not even particularly unhappy with my own endings, despite all appearances.

But I was trying to articulate why some people weren't happy. Because it seemed to me that their opinions have sometimes been dismissed out of hand without really being addressed. And some of the 'we like dark gloomy endings' people hadn't really explained why this was so.

I suppose I just couldn't resist the urge to - encourage debate, shall we say?

[TheBlackBaron]

tallon1982 wrote...

TheBlackBaron wrote...

David Gaider wrote...
Now, that said, am I saying that every ending ever for Dragon Age must be bittersweet? (Because that's what I would call the over tone of the endings.) Not at all. Different stories will no doubt hit different notes, because we'll want to try different things. I will say, however, that we could have gone a lot darker had we wished to -- the potential is certainly there -- so I'm by no means promising happy cloud fun times from here on in.

I was rather surprised there wasn't an ending that resulted in everybody dying in the most horrible of fashions while the Archdemon moped about the loss of his fabulous Old God hair.

Yea it's called Game Over.

That's not an ending, that's a shortcut to the "Load Previous Save" menu.

[tallon1982]

TheBlackBaron wrote...

tallon1982 wrote...

TheBlackBaron wrote...

David Gaider wrote...
Now, that said, am I saying that every ending ever for Dragon Age must be bittersweet? (Because that's what I would call the over tone of the endings.) Not at all. Different stories will no doubt hit different notes, because we'll want to try different things. I will say, however, that we could have gone a lot darker had we wished to -- the potential is certainly there -- so I'm by no means promising happy cloud fun times from here on in.

I was rather surprised there wasn't an ending that resulted in everybody dying in the most horrible of fashions while the Archdemon moped about the loss of his fabulous Old God hair.

Yea it's called Game Over.

That's not an ending, that's a shortcut to the "Load Previous Save" menu.

LOL fair enough... But what of those who didn't save? Failcake? lol

Anyway... rage on you angry little gnomes! Go forth and frolic in your fields of happy endings...And next time share the happy crack you are on!

[Monica21]

TheBlackBaron wrote...
I was rather surprised there wasn't an ending that resulted in everybody dying in the most horrible of fashions while the Archdemon moped about the loss of his fabulous Old God hair.

In all seriousness, this was exactly what I expected. After hearing how sad the ending was and then that one of my friends cried, I thought "wtf am I getting into?" Then I did the ritual, lived, and it was all good. It wasn't a fairy tale, but the game isn't supposed to be. I'm just glad my character and party members had the chance to live. *glares at NWN2*

[Cuddlezarro]

I'm just glad my character and party members had the chance to live. *glares at NWN2*

thankfully mask of the betrayer fixed that because all my favorite characters ended up surviving :3

Modifié par Cuddlezarro, 02 février 2010 - 05:09 .

[TheBlackBaron]

That's exactly what I was thinking of when I typed that, actually. NWN2 is one of the more gregarious example of "rocks fall, everyone dies" endings I've seen in games. Preferably, the above would only happen if you royally ****ed up. Like the suicide mission in ME2.

[SusanStoHelit]

Cuddlezarro wrote...

I'm just glad my character and party members had the chance to live. *glares at NWN2*

thankfully mask of the betrayer fixed that because all my favorite characters ended up surviving :3

Get thee behind me Satan! I could live with the NWN2 ending. Tragic death of hero while saving the world.  But to wake up in MotB, underground, and find I've had some ghastly ritual done to me that turned me into a freaking monster that killed people and that I couldn't control it. And they separated me from my lover with no knowledge of what happened to them - and expected me to romance someone else. I never finished it. Gave up in disgust.

[Cuddlezarro]

SusanStoHelit wrote...

Cuddlezarro wrote...

I'm just glad my character and party members had the chance to live. *glares at NWN2*

thankfully mask of the betrayer fixed that because all my favorite characters ended up surviving :3

Get thee behind me Satan! I could live with the NWN2 ending. Tragic death of hero while saving the world.  But to wake up in MotB, underground, and find I've had some ghastly ritual done to me that turned me into a freaking monster that killed people and that I couldn't control it. And they separated me from my lover with no knowledge of what happened to them - and expected me to romance someone else. I never finished it. Gave up in disgust.

you couldent control the curse? yes you could outside of the first chapter where you dont even know about it your not forced to kill ANY ONE (and even then you only devour a single spirit in chapter 1) theres a reason they added a "supress" which made the entire spirit meter trivial

and you can tell the romance options in the game that you arnt interested in them either not that the NWN2 OC romances where any good to begin with (and you do find out later on what happens to your entire party)

as a whole I found MoTB a *much* better experiance story and character wise than the original NWN2

Modifié par Cuddlezarro, 02 février 2010 - 05:29 .

[SusanStoHelit]

Cuddlezarro wrote...

you couldent control the curse? yes you could outside of the first chapter where you dont even know about it your not forced to kill ANY ONE (and even then you only devour a single spirit in chapter 1) theres a reason they added a "supress" which made the entire spirit meter trivial

and you can tell the romance options in the game that you arnt interested in them either not that the NWN2 OC romances where any good to begin with (and you do find out later on what happens to your entire party)

as a whole I found MoTB a *much* better experiance story and character wise than the original NWN2

I didn't know what was happening, kept resting/camping, the thing said that using suppress increased the hunger. It was a bit like waking up to find someone had addicted me to a drug while I was asleep. Yes, I could fight it, at a cost. And I never found out about my party, but like I said, I gave up in disgust. It wasn't that the characters or story were bad - it was that they screwed with my choices - again - and changed everything I'd decided for my character. I always meant to go back and just make a new character for MotB - and never did.

Like I said. Tragic endings are fine. So are happy ones. Even 'bittersweet' ones are okay. But don't mess with my characters. Npcs, fine. PCs - nope. If it's all going to be undone - don't port. Just start a new game with a new character.

[Thiefy]

SusanStoHelit wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

SusanStoHelit wrote...
But ... the real issue here is that for most of those posting about the lack of a happy ending - they want that ending with Alistair and Morrigan. Because those are the two 'favourite' romanceable characters, insofar as I can tell, anyway.

That's my impression as well. Some people seem to want a happy ending, no strings attached and nothing unpleasant involved in achieving that happy ending, with the romance of their choice. I get the desire behind wanting it -- but as far as I'm concerned there are plenty of "happy" endings. You are a hero, ending a Blight before it even truly began, and there are romances that do continue on just fine.

Not every romance can have a happy ending? And there's no way to be completely happy with no dark clouds on the horizon? Well there you go. This is not romantic fantasy -- which is what that notion is, regardless of whether there is an actual romance involved it is still a romantic ideal. And that's part of the point. We wanted our ending to be powerful, and memorable, and while I understand perfectly that some people simply want escapism that's just not what this game is meant to deliver.

Now, that said, am I saying that every ending ever for Dragon Age must be bittersweet? (Because that's what I would call the over tone of the endings.) Not at all. Different stories will no doubt hit different notes, because we'll want to try different things. I will say, however, that we could have gone a lot darker had we wished to -- the potential is certainly there -- so I'm by no means promising happy cloud fun times from here on in.

Thank you for your response, David. I appreciate all that. And as I said, I appreciate the endings, too. I'm not even particularly unhappy with my own endings, despite all appearances.

But I was trying to articulate why some people weren't happy. Because it seemed to me that their opinions have sometimes been dismissed out of hand without really being addressed. And some of the 'we like dark gloomy endings' people hadn't really explained why this was so.

I suppose I just couldn't resist the urge to - encourage debate, shall we say?

Seriously.

I couldn't agree 100% more.

Everyone here gets the idea it's a dark fantasy, but there's nothing wrong with wishing or hoping for a 'nice' ending. It won't detract from any of the other endings anymore just be exsisting, but I'm sure someone will probably argue that too.  What's really lame is how some people actually have some valid points, only to be met with "Well this is how it, STFU or GTFO," to paraphrase a few posts. I mean what the heck?

The only thing more absurd than that is how some players still try to justify their own play through is more cannon than other people's.

[Cuddlezarro]

I didn't know what was happening, kept resting/camping, the thing said that using suppress increased the hunger. It was a bit like waking up to find someone had addicted me to a drug while I was asleep. Yes, I could fight it, at a cost. And I never found out about my party, but like I said, I gave up in disgust. It wasn't that the characters or story were bad - it was that they screwed with my choices - again - and changed everything I'd decided for my character. I always meant to go back and just make a new character for MotB - and never did.

eh Suppress never increased hunger it lowered it that's the whole point of the suppression skill

you use it around around spirits(including ones you summon via items/spells) and it would fill your spirit meter up and cause it to drain alot slower

you only become "addicted" if you devourer every thing in your path

also how does it change everything about how you decided your character exactly? unless you played an evil playthrough and sided with the king of shadows which they couldent exactly allow because it destroyed the world so to speak

Modifié par Cuddlezarro, 02 février 2010 - 06:04 .

[Monica21]

Cuddlezarro wrote...
as a whole I found MoTB a *much* better experiance story and character wise than the original NWN2

Honestly, MoTB completely redeemed the NWN2 ending, at least for me. It was a very good game, once you understood the curse and how it worked. Not to mention that Gann was infinitely better as a romance option.

Sorry for momentary derailing. :/

[SusanStoHelit]

Cuddlezarro wrote...

I didn't know what was happening, kept resting/camping, the thing said that using suppress increased the hunger. It was a bit like waking up to find someone had addicted me to a drug while I was asleep. Yes, I could fight it, at a cost. And I never found out about my party, but like I said, I gave up in disgust. It wasn't that the characters or story were bad - it was that they screwed with my choices - again - and changed everything I'd decided for my character. I always meant to go back and just make a new character for MotB - and never did.

eh Suppress never increased hunger it lowered it that's the whole point of the suppression skill

you use it around around spirits(including ones you summon via items/spells) and it would fill your spirit meter up and cause it to drain alot slower

you only become "addicted" if you devourer every thing in your path

also how does it change everything about how you decided your character exactly? unless you played an evil playthrough and sided with the king of shadows which they couldent exactly allow because it destroyed the world so to speak

Umm, not the thread to debate this. It's too off-topic and I don't want to derail the thread. If you're really interested in my thoughts on the topic, you can pm me.

Edit: Darn Monica, ninja'd me.

Modifié par SusanStoHelit, 02 février 2010 - 06:08 .

[Cuddlezarro]

Monica21 wrote...

Cuddlezarro wrote...
as a whole I found MoTB a *much* better experiance story and character wise than the original NWN2

Honestly, MoTB completely redeemed the NWN2 ending, at least for me. It was a very good game, once you understood the curse and how it worked. Not to mention that Gann was infinitely better as a romance option.

Sorry for momentary derailing. :/

it also didnt help in vanilla NWN2 that the ending seemed like it was put together and voiced by a sleepy co-worker in an afternoon

PS Gann is awesome(infact he reminds me quite a bit of Zevran atleast ont he surface) even if iv never romanced him infact I loved all MoTB's NPC's

Modifié par Cuddlezarro, 02 février 2010 - 06:08 .

[Nonvita]

Thief-of-Hearts wrote...
Seriously.

I couldn't agree 100% more.

Everyone here gets the idea it's a dark fantasy, but there's nothing wrong with wishing or hoping for a 'nice' ending. It won't detract from any of the other endings anymore just be exsisting, but I'm sure someone will probably argue that too. ../../../images/forum/emoticons/uncertain.png What's really lame is how some people actually have some valid points, only to be met with "Well this is how it, STFU or GTFO," to paraphrase a few posts. I mean what the heck?

The only thing more absurd than that is how some players still try to justify their own play through is more cannon than other people's. ../../../images/forum/emoticons/wondering.png

No no, it really is fine to want some different endings. I don't think a happy ending couldn't fit in with the setting, I just think that the circumstances regarding why the endings are such as they are were pretty well explained. Now, of
course, the writers could have easily modified the story to make whatever endings they wanted, but I did think the twists at the end made for more interesting possibilities overall.

The reason that I personally like the darker aspect of the end is not because I have an aversion to happiness (heck, I was on vacation when I finished my first run of DA, so it wasn't the best time for getting so upset at a fictional story!), but because I think it makes you take a closer look at new things the next time around.

I know I gained a new appreciation for Zevran, and now I consider a romance with him to be a perfectly happy ending. I also found new ways to appreciate Alistair, not just as a romance but also as a good, respectable person (though I've also become more willing to bug the heck out of him now that I know how things go [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/angel.png[/smilie]). If the ending had given me exactly what I'd hoped for, I don't know that I would have bothered to explore as many new ways of approaching the story.

And every character I've made subsequently has had a happier ending with no bitter feelings. I just think of my first character as the tragic hero, but honestly she's still my favorite because of it.

David Gaider wrote...
I will say, however, that we could have gone a lot darker had we wished to -- the potential is certainly there -- so I'm by no means promising happy cloud fun times from here on in.

You mean my character doesn't get to bring Alistair back from the dead and have a happy love triangle with him and Zevran and go start a nug farm and raise lots of beautiful blonde children and live that way happily ever after until they all ride off into the sunset on pearly white halla? (That's not sarcasm, it's a serious question/concern.)

Modifié par Nonvita, 02 février 2010 - 06:53 .

[SusanStoHelit]

Nonvita wrote...
You mean my character doesn't get to bring Alistair back from the dead and have a happy love triangle with him and Zevran and go start a nug farm and raise lots of beautiful blonde children and live that way happily ever after until they all ride off into the sunset on pearly white halla? (That's not sarcasm, it's a serious question/concern.)

I like the way you think. *Evil chuckle*

[Thor Rand Al]

Sorry can't resist:



Lmfao how the thread got derailed... 1 of the reason's I love reading these

[TheBlackBaron]

Nonvita wrote...

David Gaider wrote...
I will say, however, that we could have gone a lot darker had we wished to -- the potential is certainly there -- so I'm by no means promising happy cloud fun times from here on in.

You mean my character doesn't get to bring Alistair back from the dead and have a happy love triangle with him and Zevran and go start a nug farm and raise lots of beautiful blonde children and live that way happily ever after until they all ride off into the sunset on pearly white halla? (That's not sarcasm, it's a serious question/concern.)

"Excuse me while I begin projectile vomiting."

[Maria Caliban]

I had a great ending. Defeated the Blight, became Hero of Ferelden, and rode off to more adventures with Leliana and Zevran.

[Thor Rand Al]

TheBlackBaron wrote...

Nonvita wrote...

David Gaider wrote...
I will say, however, that we could have gone a lot darker had we wished to -- the potential is certainly there -- so I'm by no means promising happy cloud fun times from here on in.

You mean my character doesn't get to bring Alistair back from the dead and have a happy love triangle with him and Zevran and go start a nug farm and raise lots of beautiful blonde children and live that way happily ever after until they all ride off into the sunset on pearly white halla? (That's not sarcasm, it's a serious question/concern.)

"Excuse me while I begin projectile vomiting."

   roflmfao