3059 réponses à ce sujet

[Endurance_117]

Do people not know what Mixed Martial Arts is?

[Jimmy Fury]

Oh I nearly forgot.



To those saying the forums aren't the place to make such a request, I respectfully disagree.

True it's not the greatest option due to the inevitable arguments about things like who can win in a fight...

but Bioware is one of the few companies I know of that actually does pay attention to their forums to the point of including the things their fans request on them. They've even stated, on numerous occasions, that certain additions to games were made purely because it's what their forum posters wanted.

So we have to try.

Although... i still think we should try in the Spoiler forum so they can't use spoilers as an excuse for shutting down the thread...









(Ian Roberts would last a lot longer against Lesner than Endurance would... AH! must stop feeding the troll!)

[Arik7]

Jimmy Fury wrote...
Although... i still think we should try in the Spoiler forum so they can't use spoilers as an excuse for shutting down the thread...

That would silence those who refused to buy ME2 on principle.....

[jamnkick]

Arik7 wrote...

Jimmy Fury wrote...
Although... i still think we should try in the Spoiler forum so they can't use spoilers as an excuse for shutting down the thread...

That would silence those who refused to buy ME2 on principle.....

Maybe two threads with one on the spoilers and one in general?  

[JBrown82]

Way too much to read, and i misse dteh old threads so...





...has anyone considered the possibility(i hope someone else is this 'clever') that the story later entails Shepard bear offspring...hence no man love...think about the current options(i have not played me2 yet):



Male Shep: A woman or an Asari



Fem Shep: A man or an Asari



...and Asari can have a baby with anyone or anything(animate i assume)...



...therefore leaving baby shep a distinct possibility no matter what you choose...



...nevermind the series replay value of trying to change your resultant child's genetic make up

[Arik7]

JBrown82 wrote...

Way too much to read, and i misse dteh old threads so...


...has anyone considered the possibility(i hope someone else is this 'clever') that the story later entails Shepard bear offspring...hence no man love...think about the current options(i have not played me2 yet):

Male Shep: A woman or an Asari

Fem Shep: A man or an Asari

...and Asari can have a baby with anyone or anything(animate i assume)...

...therefore leaving baby shep a distinct possibility no matter what you choose...

...nevermind the series replay value of trying to change your resultant child's genetic make up

An offspring to somehow save the galaxy???  sounds unlikely.   In any case, gay people do have children sometimes, AND heterosexual sex is not really required for that.

Modifié par Arik7, 02 février 2010 - 04:30 .

[JBrown82]

(and perhaps the homosexual public out there should be happy they found a way to plausibly reporesent you in the story in anyway , rather than just giving you the complete blowoff, and lets be honest, for the bulk of gaming public, hot lesbian sex with a blue alien is just that...kinda hot and intriguing, on teh other hand, although i wouldn't be personally offended, it would be kind of offputting to me to have to watch manshep wrestle kaiden in the gally covered in peanut in oil, all the body hair...and grunting...not sexy)

[Jimmy Fury]

JBrown82 wrote...
...has anyone considered the possibility(i hope someone else is this 'clever') that the story later entails Shepard bear offspring...hence no man love...think about the current options(i have not played me2 yet):

Gay people bear offspring all the time. The bits all still work the same.

In fact, despite his sexuality my shep would be quite honored if a particular Asari would carry his child.

Ediiiit. Editing doesn't count as spamming right? or does it. I will stop if it does.

JBrown82 wrote...
 watch manshep wrestle kaiden in the gally covered in peanut in oil, all the body hair...and grunting...not sexy)

Sorry. Had to.
But seriously, nothing would force you to go through with the romance. I never romanced anyone in ME or DAO simply because those characters I felt would be most compatible with my character, were not options. 
I don't think I will ever comprehend this "If it's there I might have to see it!" mindset. I clearly lack the incorrect experience in this department. My straight friends are all way too secure in their sexuality. No offense.

Modifié par Jimmy Fury, 02 février 2010 - 04:44 .

[Arik7]

In DAO, my character had a romance with Zevran, yet he slept with Morrigan to save his life. Heterosexual sex or death? It was a tough decision! ;-)

[Endurance_117]

Gay people bear offspring, does not compute

[Goth Skunk]

Cripes! I had a beautiful post typed up and ready the last time this thread came up, but when I had finished, it was already locked!
I'll try again...

"I don't know what the secret to success is, but the secret to failure is trying to please everybody."
- Bill Cosby

"You can please some of the people some of the time, you can please some of the people all of the time, and you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can never please all of the people all of the time."
- Abraham Lincoln

Two statements, different in wording, identical in meaning. The former may have even been inspired by the latter, given the generations in which they're spoken.

The Good Doctors and Casey Hudson have all stated numerous times that one of the goals of Mass Effect is to put You in Commander Shepard's shoes. You are the protagonist, You are Shepard. I capitalize You because I'm referring to the identity of You. Mass Effect strives to make the experience of Shepard as open as possible. Having said that, there are going to be a few limitations.

Barring death, the Mass Effect storyline has finite moments which are unchangable. Every time this story is told, Eden Prime will be attacked, Nihilus will die, Saren will be exposed, Shepard will be made a Spectre, Shepard will have to make a decision that results in the death of a soldier under his command, and so on. Despite the efforts to make the game as open as possible, these points cannot be changed. As a result, we come to know that there is a plan in place, there is a core storyline that is unchangable no matter how you play the game. Along the way, there are many choices to be made. Choices which all have some sort of reward or consequence, whether small or large.

Love interests are not an integral part of the game, but they are an added bonus, perhaps one of the greatest examples of reward in the entire story. But I cannot stress enough, they are not an integral part of the main storyline.

It's not the love interests that make Mass Effect great, and nobody plays Mass Effect just to get it on in a virtual romance. But, as it has been demonstrated in these forums countless times, the notion of a possible gay male romance as Commander Shepard is a hot button, controversial topic. Here are some points to consider:

- Bioware is a business, and the goal of any business is to make money selling something the public wants. Bioware's product is video games with an epic story.
- It is in Bioware's best interest to maximize potential sales. To do this, the ideal mechanism is to create a story/game that appeals to the largest demographic possible.
- Though numerous people have varying opinions, everyone's money has the same impact. My money is just as valuable as a bigot's.

Based on the discussions that have taken place in these forums:
- There are people who are interested in seeing a possible homosexual romance option with their Commander Shepard. Even though there currently isn't one, these people grumble and complain, but nevertheless they purchase the product and play it.
- Simultaneously, there are primates who have made it perfectly clear that if there is even a hint of a male team mate flirting with their Shepard, they will not buy the game.
- If a gay romance option did exist, and it was found out after the fact that said primates purchased the game, and thus BioWare already had their money, I guarantee you that within days Fox News would have made it headline news. All said primates that had plans to purchase the game will suddenly change their mind, resulting in lost revenue for BioWare.
- Although it's a terrible double standard, two women getting it on is more socially acceptable than two men getting it on. Therefore, potential gay female relationships appeal to the demographic enough to be considered worthwhile.

I assure you, BioWare hears the cries for a gay male romance option. BioWare has nothing against sexual orientation of any kind. What it comes down to is a matter of impact. The controversy that was sparked by the FemShep/Liara scene, though shortlived, is evidence of how fast and how hard the primates work. Ultimately, said controversy resulted in a higher interest in Mass Effect because of the aforementioned tolerance of lesbianism in modern day society as opposed to male homosexuality. BioWare got lucky and breathed a huge sigh of relief. That being said, they dipped their feet in those waters with Zevran in Dragon Age: Origins. Though Zevran would've slept with anything with two legs and a pulse, it was still a bold risk. With Mass Effect being released so soon after, I believe BioWare wanted to take a safe route and keep controversy to a minimum.

I can't say one way or another, but there is still a third game yet to come out. Could they have a surprise in store? It's hard to say. Maybe if your Shepard dies, whoever replaces him may be written to be more willing to swing for the fences. I don't really want to speculate too much into it.

Finally, the best thing anyone can do is continue to express their support in a mature, civil manner, and hope to drown out those that oppose your point of view with numbers.

[biddypocket]

Jimmy Fury wrote...

JBrown82 wrote...
...has anyone considered the possibility(i hope someone else is this 'clever') that the story later entails Shepard bear offspring...hence no man love...think about the current options(i have not played me2 yet):

Gay people bear offspring all the time. The bits all still work the same.

In fact, despite his sexuality my shep would be quite honored if a particular Asari would carry his child.

Ew....

Come on man, Adpot. There are plenty of Turian orphans out there. The universe is overpopulated as it is. Not cool

[Endurance_117]

Goth Skunk wrote...

Cripes! I had a beautiful post typed up and ready the last time this thread came up, but when I had finished, it was already locked!
I'll try again...

"I don't know what the secret to success is, but the secret to failure is trying to please everybody."
- Bill Cosby

"You can please some of the people some of the time, you can please some of the people all of the time, and you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can never please all of the people all of the time."
- Abraham Lincoln

Two statements, different in wording, identical in meaning. The former may have even been inspired by the latter, given the generations in which they're spoken.

The Good Doctors and Casey Hudson have all stated numerous times that one of the goals of Mass Effect is to put You in Commander Shepard's shoes. You are the protagonist, You are Shepard. I capitalize You because I'm referring to the identity of You. Mass Effect strives to make the experience of Shepard as open as possible. Having said that, there are going to be a few limitations.

Barring death, the Mass Effect storyline has finite moments which are unchangable. Every time this story is told, Eden Prime will be attacked, Nihilus will die, Saren will be exposed, Shepard will be made a Spectre, Shepard will have to make a decision that results in the death of a soldier under his command, and so on. Despite the efforts to make the game as open as possible, these points cannot be changed. As a result, we come to know that there is a plan in place, there is a core storyline that is unchangable no matter how you play the game. Along the way, there are many choices to be made. Choices which all have some sort of reward or consequence, whether small or large.

Love interests are not an integral part of the game, but they are an added bonus, perhaps one of the greatest examples of reward in the entire story. But I cannot stress enough, they are not an integral part of the main storyline.

It's not the love interests that make Mass Effect great, and nobody plays Mass Effect just to get it on in a virtual romance. But, as it has been demonstrated in these forums countless times, the notion of a possible gay male romance as Commander Shepard is a hot button, controversial topic. Here are some points to consider:

- Bioware is a business, and the goal of any business is to make money selling something the public wants. Bioware's product is video games with an epic story.
- It is in Bioware's best interest to maximize potential sales. To do this, the ideal mechanism is to create a story/game that appeals to the largest demographic possible.
- Though numerous people have varying opinions, everyone's money has the same impact. My money is just as valuable as a bigot's.

Based on the discussions that have taken place in these forums:
- There are people who are interested in seeing a possible homosexual romance option with their Commander Shepard. Even though there currently isn't one, these people grumble and complain, but nevertheless they purchase the product and play it.
- Simultaneously, there are primates who have made it perfectly clear that if there is even a hint of a male team mate flirting with their Shepard, they will not buy the game.
- If a gay romance option did exist, and it was found out after the fact that said primates purchased the game, and thus BioWare already had their money, I guarantee you that within days Fox News would have made it headline news. All said primates that had plans to purchase the game will suddenly change their mind, resulting in lost revenue for BioWare.
- Although it's a terrible double standard, two women getting it on is more socially acceptable than two men getting it on. Therefore, potential gay female relationships appeal to the demographic enough to be considered worthwhile.

I assure you, BioWare hears the cries for a gay male romance option. BioWare has nothing against sexual orientation of any kind. What it comes down to is a matter of impact. The controversy that was sparked by the FemShep/Liara scene, though shortlived, is evidence of how fast and how hard the primates work. Ultimately, said controversy resulted in a higher interest in Mass Effect because of the aforementioned tolerance of lesbianism in modern day society as opposed to male homosexuality. BioWare got lucky and breathed a huge sigh of relief. That being said, they dipped their feet in those waters with Zevran in Dragon Age: Origins. Though Zevran would've slept with anything with two legs and a pulse, it was still a bold risk. With Mass Effect being released so soon after, I believe BioWare wanted to take a safe route and keep controversy to a minimum.

I can't say one way or another, but there is still a third game yet to come out. Could they have a surprise in store? It's hard to say. Maybe if your Shepard dies, whoever replaces him may be written to be more willing to swing for the fences. I don't really want to speculate too much into it.

Finally, the best thing anyone can do is continue to express their support in a mature, civil manner, and hope to drown out those that oppose your point of view with numbers.

If your Shepard dies you will play the canon John Shepard in the third game

[Deviija]

JBrown82 wrote...

Way too much to read, and i misse dteh old threads so...


...has anyone considered the possibility(i hope someone else is this 'clever') that the story later entails Shepard bear offspring...hence no man love...think about the current options(i have not played me2 yet):

Male Shep: A woman or an Asari

Fem Shep: A man or an Asari

...and Asari can have a baby with anyone or anything(animate i assume)...

...therefore leaving baby shep a distinct possibility no matter what you choose...

...nevermind the series replay value of trying to change your resultant child's genetic make up

Considering that the romances are optional content and not everyone does them, that would be a blow against people that aren't into sexing up their co-workers.   And, well, in ME2 the love interests include Drell, Quarian, and Turian.  So... unlikely to have kids.

[Hug-A-Tree]

Besides "I approve of as many options as possible" I haven't got much to add. I just really wanted to thank some of the no-gay folks for making me laugh so hard at all the really... pathetic excuses for coming out against it instead of just going "I am homophobic".



Well ok I do have something to add actually. I think people find it difficult to seperate their opinion on gay sexuality in real life and whether or not roleplaying a gay person should be an option ingame.



The real life thing, should just be kept out of the subject of having it in a specific game imo.



The option of having it in game shold be debated as any other suggestion for an in game feature. I for one think it would make for interesting characters and it would add to the games atmosphere since it would open the door for having the game deal with sexuality as a subject. Like how sci-fi usually deals with racism in the form of species-ism, that would make some interesting stories possible. But that might be more towards the general inclusion of characters with different sexuality, and not specifically towards a playable gay character, for which I could care less. The inclusion of the subject of sexuality however, I am all for, as it is one of the driving forces of our life and could therefore stimulate emotion.



I have yet to see a romance story like that I found intriguing... I mean... in RPG's at least, since there are never enough work put into them because they are always "optional" and then all the interactions are utterly stereotypical... I mean... the fight between the two girls in ME1... C'mon... if you break someones heart it affects them.. that doesn't really show much.



Hum... well I did have something to add I guess... but ... I think they should spend more time making deep friendships since they seem to be less suspence-of-disbelief smacking for people and could therefore be more forced upon the player. I'd find deep friendships more fascinating than shallow 3-scene "romances"... of either or all sexualities.



Its not like there is full frontal XXX action so... there really is no difference to me.

[RohanDaKitty]

Arik7 wrote...

Jimmy Fury wrote...
Although... i still think we should try in the Spoiler forum so they can't use spoilers as an excuse for shutting down the thread...

That would silence those who refused to buy ME2 on principle.....

If anyone has decided not to purchase this video game because of the lack of a gay male romance, they lack the maturity and intelligence to properly weigh in on issues facing the gay community any how.

As a gay guy I am embarrassed and ashamed that I could be linked with such in intolerant and ignorant person.

People treat this video game like it's a Government Run program to which they have a right to influence.

I respect Bioware's creative license 100%. It's their world and no-one has any right to make demands, just as if a Homosexual Only Space Opera RPG (HOSORPG?) were developed and heterosexuals demanded the inclusion of a female love interest.

Can't you see that by strong arming gay romance into something like this we are in fact working against other goals of the homosexual community?

We preach tolerance and acceptance, but fail to do it ourselves.

The hypocrisy is suffocating

[Arik7]

Goth Skunk, I did not buy the game on principle. While I am huge sci-fi fan, I don't want to endorse BioWare's latest decision with my money.  I may borrow the game, but i'm not going to buy it.

Many of those your so-called primates have DAO avatars and DAO profiles. I don't see them leaving in droves because there is just an option to have a M/M relationship. If you are not looking for one, it's not going to affect you. I don't see constant threads scomplaining about those options. Where was Faux news when DAO came out?

Modifié par Arik7, 02 février 2010 - 04:49 .

[RohanDaKitty]

Arik7 wrote...

Goth Skunk, I did not buy the game on principle. While I am huge sci-fi fan, I don't want to endorse BioWare's latest decision with my money.  I may borrow the game, but i'm not going to buy it.

...

That act in itself shows a lack of Principles if anything.

[Endurance_117]

Arik7 wrote...

Goth Skunk, I did not buy the game on principle. While I am huge sci-fi fan, I don't want to endorse BioWare's latest decision with my money.  I may borrow the game, but i'm not going to buy it.

Many of those your so-called primates have DAO avatars and DAO profiles. I don't see them leaving in droves because there is just an option to have a M/M relationship. If you are not looking for one, it's not going to affect you. I don't see constant threads scomplaining about those options. Where was Faux news when DAO came out?

A game has to be big in name to be a controversial news story, Dragon Age only sold around 3 million copies.

See GTA every time it comes out.

[Arik7]

RohanDaKitty, you can "respect" and financially support businesses that exclude gay people.... and that's your choice. As consumers, we all have different standards.

[biddypocket]

RohanDaKitty wrote...

Arik7 wrote...

Jimmy Fury wrote...
Although... i still think we should try in the Spoiler forum so they can't use spoilers as an excuse for shutting down the thread...

That would silence those who refused to buy ME2 on principle.....

If anyone has decided not to purchase this video game because of the lack of a gay male romance, they lack the maturity and intelligence to properly weigh in on issues facing the gay community any how.

As a gay guy I am embarrassed and ashamed that I could be linked with such in intolerant and ignorant person.

People treat this video game like it's a Government Run program to which they have a right to influence.

I respect Bioware's creative license 100%. It's their world and no-one has any right to make demands, just as if a Homosexual Only Space Opera RPG (HOSORPG?) were developed and heterosexuals demanded the inclusion of a female love interest.

Can't you see that by strong arming gay romance into something like this we are in fact working against other goals of the homosexual community?

We preach tolerance and acceptance, but fail to do it ourselves.

The hypocrisy is suffocating

I don't think that's a fair argument. You talked so much about
freedom of choice in your last post...is it not Ark's choice to refuse
to buy the game if he disagrees with the values of the company? I think
it is. You may disagree, but it doesn't show a lack of principle. It
just shows that he values  being represented in the mainstream media
more than the cheap thrill of a game that will lose its appeal after a
few days.

I also fail to see how it's working against other goals of the LGBT community.

I respect Bioware's creative license 100%. It's their world and no-one
has any right to make demands, just as if a Homosexual Only Space Opera
RPG (HOSORPG?) were developed and heterosexuals demanded the inclusion
of a female love interest.

And, this simply reinforces the heteronormativity of it all. By making that statement, you're essentially saying Mass Effect is a "Heterosexual only space opera RPG..." which, of course it isn't, it's just a "space opear RPG" in which the main character happens to be heterosexual. We're here to question why.

.....btw, what the hell is a "space opera"? Are we talkin' Madame Butterfly on Mars?