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Mass Effect 2, obviously pushed out the door early


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#276
yoomazir

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Icinix wrote...

I don't believe so. DLC is being used to keep people coming back to the game, and as something to help combat piracy and get them a slice of the used game sales (with Cerberus card). DLC is something to keep people interested, ever since way back with Total Annihilation. It's about keeping the game in the news, so other people will buy the game after prime time sales is passed.


Well seeing how ME1 had vehicule missions and in ME2  you will need to get the DLC to have it, I still say the game was rushed beyond salvation.

#277
Matshelge

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Resurecting a thread that died off 13 days ago.



classy move OP, classy move.

#278
Jewsapalewsa

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Plasma Prestige wrote...

This game is definitely not rushed, and I don't see how you could draw that conclusion. The only way you could make such a poor assumption is if you base this completely off what you think is bad, rather than what is actually bad. Such an enormous game with virtually no screen-tearing, pop-in, or framerate issues is NOT rushed. That would take months of technical editing. Mass Effect 2 is a phenomenal game, and although it may not be as hefty in some RPG aspects as the first, it is better than the first in almost every way.


Wait, your comment was pretty condescending.  The only way we could have our opinion that the game was rushed is if we "base this completely off what you think is bad, rather than what is actually bad"(which we can only assume is what you think is bad).  So we are wrong simply because our opinion of bad is not your opinion of bad?   Wow. 

#279
DaveTheJackal

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Blame the xbox 360. They have to make it fit on that often diskless hunk-o-junk, and therefore savage cuts to story line etc. have to be made so it fits nicely on a DVD or two.

The same reason you'll never see anything like Uncharted 2 on it.

Modifié par DaveTheJackal, 22 février 2010 - 12:07 .


#280
DaBigDragon

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This is a beautifilly done game. Pushed out the door early? What? This game seems much more polished and smoother than the first game. What do you mean it was rushed out early?

You can't tell me the first game runs smoother than the second one without lying.

#281
Skemte

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yoomazir wrote...

Icinix wrote...

I don't believe so. DLC is being used to keep people coming back to the game, and as something to help combat piracy and get them a slice of the used game sales (with Cerberus card). DLC is something to keep people interested, ever since way back with Total Annihilation. It's about keeping the game in the news, so other people will buy the game after prime time sales is passed.


Well seeing how ME1 had vehicule missions and in ME2  you will need to get the DLC to have it, I still say the game was rushed beyond salvation.


... Yeah because clearly vehicle missions in which you trudged around countless generic deserts and wastelands in one of the worse handling vehicles known to man was certainly something sorely missedImage IPB

#282
Costin_Razvan

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I don't believe so. DLC is being used to keep people coming back to the game, and as something to help combat piracy and get them a slice of the used game sales (with Cerberus card).





DLCs help combat piracy? Hah. Every DLC of the game was able to be found on torrents the day the game was launched, with a hack to boot.

#283
Ryzaki

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Costin_Razvan wrote...

I don't believe so. DLC is being used to keep people coming back to the game, and as something to help combat piracy and get them a slice of the used game sales (with Cerberus card).



DLCs help combat piracy? Hah. Every DLC of the game was able to be found on torrents the day the game was launched, with a hack to boot.


Well the used game sell part is right at least.

#284
Your Synthetic Superior

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kiyyto wrote...

Plasma Prestige wrote...

This game is definitely not rushed, and I don't see how you could draw that conclusion. The only way you could make such a poor assumption is if you base this completely off what you think is bad, rather than what is actually bad. Such an enormous game with virtually no screen-tearing, pop-in, or framerate issues is NOT rushed. That would take months of technical editing. Mass Effect 2 is a phenomenal game, and although it may not be as hefty in some RPG aspects as the first, it is better than the first in almost every way.


You are blind.
Just because a game has no visible bugs doesn’t mean it wasn’t rushed. It means that it was bug tested.
Have you noticed how level design was minimized, to such a degree that exploration is completely dead?
These planets feel like levels, not planets.

The mini quests are a joke. They feel like 1 year ago EA said to BioWare - “We need this game out in 2010. No exceptions.”

Instead of making the Mako better and improving the side quests so the relate to the story, they threw something entirely irrelevant together, boring even, and pasted it into the holes in the story board where more development time was needed.

NPC quests are ridiculous. You actually only walk across the other side of a room to finish the quest!

The inventory system was murdered and we have a very simple system pasted in its place. This didn’t happen because it is better for the player.

Look at all the things that people complain about and you’ll see, if you’re a gamer, that you’d also like them if they were improved, not removed. Mass Effect had problems but it was cohesive. This game is not cohesive.

Finally, level complete screens?
Are you kidding me?
This game was pushed out the door.


You not liking the game mechanics does not equate to the game being rushed. Everything you list is things you didn't like that were working as intended and would have still been in the game if it released a year from now. Try to comprenhend the difference.

One ACTUAL BUG that made me think it was rushed was the floating up into the air and getting stuck in a 5 meter radius. That is a serious bug because it causes you to have to reload from a previous save. Do you have anything like that to build your case upon?

#285
Icinix

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Costin_Razvan wrote...

I don't believe so. DLC is being used to keep people coming back to the game, and as something to help combat piracy and get them a slice of the used game sales (with Cerberus card).



DLCs help combat piracy? Hah. Every DLC of the game was able to be found on torrents the day the game was launched, with a hack to boot.


It doesn't stop the people who are prepared to download full cracked games, but it does help stop the ones who get a mates DVD and burn it.  They decide they like the game, if they want more they'll have to buy it.  In that sense it does help combat it.

#286
FataliTensei

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I agree with OP, ME2 feels like it was pushed out the door early.



I don't know much about EA, but I do know they have a reputation for ruining studios like BioWare. We can only hope BW will be an exception I guess >_>

#287
Saetanigera

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Fallout 3 is THE open world RPG. It had one setting and could afford to fully flesh it out. Successfully pulling this off for ONE (relatively) small piece of real estate was a massive undertaking.
Since Mass Effect 2 has multiple planets, races, and goals there was NO WAY they could have poured in that much detail 30 times (on any sane budget). That's what it would have taken to fully integrate the mako into the gaming world people expect today. If they had included the mako again people would have complained about the low quality, loss of connection to the main story, and recycled content. It was LESS lazy to make actual content than it would be to copy paste recycled content into ME2.
There are hundreds of RPGs with crappy graphics, massive inventories, and almost endless content (that you could have bought for $5 dollars or less) but you wanted to play a game that gave you consequences for your choices in a highly cinematic environment. That is precisely what this game delivers.
"I think it's a testament to how good ME2 is (and to a degree, how good ME1 was) when a lot of the criticism thrown at ME2 would be nitpicks for any other game." - raichualuvsong
It amazes me that so many people say "Bioware failed because I bought ME1 and ME2 and am anxiously awaiting to play ME3 to see if they fixed things I didn't like in ME2 after playing it 2-3 times to the 5-6 times I played ME1". When those people are your critics you did an AMAZING FREAKING JOB.

Modifié par Saetanigera, 22 février 2010 - 03:50 .


#288
yoomazir

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Skemte wrote...

yoomazir wrote...

Icinix wrote...

I don't believe so. DLC is being used to keep people coming back to the game, and as something to help combat piracy and get them a slice of the used game sales (with Cerberus card). DLC is something to keep people interested, ever since way back with Total Annihilation. It's about keeping the game in the news, so other people will buy the game after prime time sales is passed.


Well seeing how ME1 had vehicule missions and in ME2  you will need to get the DLC to have it, I still say the game was rushed beyond salvation.


... Yeah because clearly vehicle missions in which you trudged around countless generic deserts and wastelands in one of the worse handling vehicles known to man was certainly something sorely missedImage IPB


beats scanning anyday son.

Modifié par yoomazir, 22 février 2010 - 04:00 .


#289
Ryzaki

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People need to stop hating on sandbox games. Honestly.

#290
mp84

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yoomazir wrote...
Well seeing how ME1 had vehicule missions and in ME2  you will need to get the DLC to have it, I still say the game was rushed beyond salvation.


lol, Mass Effect didn't have vehicle missions, they had a vehicle which was a little more intergral part of the game, in terms that usually every mission required some vechicle for travelling. In this one, the missions didn't require you to use a vehicle, so that's why they decided to make it DLC instead, and also give it hopefully mission specfic stuff too which could or could not be interesting.

Also, to say this game was rushed, is absurd, to me rush games, is like Empire Total War, where the AI was broken, lots of damn bugs and framerates issue. You wanna see a rush game, check that one out. This one, besides minor clipping problems, there was virtually  no flaws to speak of in a techinical aspect. (Ya there's that  stupid glitch where you begin walking on air, but that happens few and far between)

But that's just my opinion.. I seriously think those pepole who just hate ME 2 will never see beyond their problems, or will never like it no matter how many praise it, or how many pepole buy it, because a lot of people have this nostalgic point of view of the first game. Which is a great game, don't get me wrong, but to knock ME 2, is just silly, as that's all a great game as well.

#291
addiction21

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Ryzaki wrote...

People need to stop hating on sandbox games. Honestly.


Haters hate
Pigs fly
chickens moo
Its just natural

#292
Athelius

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I preffered this game to ME1- the random missions were fewer, but they had decent stories and unique levels.



In ME1 the random missions were all pretty much identical- go to planet, enter identikit base, kill stuff and find something.

Compare that to some of the randomly found missions in ME2- the ME2 ones are much more fun.

#293
Guest_DrathanGervaise_*

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addiction21 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

People need to stop hating on sandbox games. Honestly.


Haters hate
Pigs fly
chickens moo
Its just natural

Yo' dawg, I herd der was haters in dissun place so I sayz, "Well, haters gonna hate." and I moved on.

Prepare the Waffles.

Modifié par DrathanGervaise, 22 février 2010 - 04:37 .


#294
K4mrr4

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I agree with the OP but for different reasons. The secondary missions in ME2 are far way better than in ME1, and the fact that there's no vehicle in the sequel is not enough to say the game was pushed out. But I still think it may be that way because of other things, like not being able to acces some areas of the Normandy before there's some character in there. This suggest that if you'd be able to get in there the model of the char will be in, even before it should be. It may be explained in other ways, but if that's true it's quite a symptom of the game being pushed forward. Also the overall poor quality of the music in the game (not lasting enough to fill the credits for example) may be easilly explained due to little time for developing it.

All in all, this smells like very tight release dates, maybe forced from "the guys at the top" (read as EA). The good point is that if the game really lack something due to being pushed forward, we can still have some of those fixed via DLC or patches.
I started a thread (it was dead before it was out I think) were to post petitions for patches and DLCs. For example the Normandy issue I said before can be fixed by a patch. Maybe we could be readed by the devs and give them some ideas.
If you want to post there here's the URL:
Mass Effect 2 DLC and patch support

Modifié par K4mrr4, 22 février 2010 - 05:04 .


#295
Legbiter

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I loved unloading the Cain on the Mako when I encountered it in ME2. And the OP is either a congenital retard or trolling if he thinks ME2 is an example of a rushed game. Sorry, but there's no way to sugarcoat that observation.

#296
rwilli80

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You can not compare a game to its original, especially with this rabid of a fan base. You have to look at the game is if it were just Mass Effect. If this was the first Mass Effect game you wouldn't be complaining. It is a different game get over it, they are not going to go back. You never go back in anything in life.



I enjoy the pace of ME2 over ME1(with the exception of the load screens, but that's another issue)

I enjoy the planet scanning.

Although I did enjoy driving around in the Mako.

I like the armor customization.

I like the limited weapons, I hated digging through my inventory to find the best weapon in ME1.

I also like I can change ammo mid battle without going to the inventory screen.



All in all ME2 is better gameplay wise, were as ME1 was a deeper game.

#297
yoomazir

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Legbiter wrote...

I loved unloading the Cain on the Mako when I encountered it in ME2. And the OP is either a congenital retard or trolling if he thinks ME2 is an example of a rushed game. Sorry, but there's no way to sugarcoat that observation.


why don't you take your guess for yourself  "genius"?

#298
Darth Drago

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How can you not believe that Mass Effect was rushed out to the stores? All the evidence is right in front of you.

-Pop-ups at the end of Tali’s loyalty quest that stay on the screen telling you to “Press B to end mission”. You have dialog options that can and should be resolved but yet it seems you are practically forced out of this by the constant reminder to end the mission. Having this pop-up over your dialog choices is unforgivable.

-Pop-ups whenever you scan a planet that tells you to “Press RT (right trigger) to launch a probe.” when that information is already on the screen.

-Pop-ups when you invite your love interest to the captains quarters “press B to continue”. Don’t we get it yet that pressing “B” will end practically every event/mission yet? Also, to continue what? Nothing is continued in any context, its ended first so you can continue the game.

-Having to feed fish but not your pet rodent?

-Odd Plot Holes. An example from the first mission where you meet Jacob and Miranda. The Cerberus symbol plastered about on everything and why Shepard doesn’t recognize it but yet later Jack spots it and knows immediately who the symbol stands for. Even though we didn’t see the symbol in the first game Shepard should have recognized it considering their history from the mission in the first game. The dialog from Miranda about how this is the last shuttle when you can plainly see three other shuttles in that room. Even how Shepard suddenly starts the game wearing armor and if as a female Shepard, with any makeup on as well seems odd at least to me.

-A severe shortage of side quests. So many planets with so little to do.
ME1 had 20 citadel, 38 UNC, 3 squad mate and 9 main quest planet (not adding in different ones for paragon/renegade and background exclusives) -70 in total.
ME2 had 3 Normandy, 25 main planet (some only available from a imported game) and 13 N7 quests -41 in total.

-Loyalty and recruiting quests conveniently bundled at the same planets.
On Omega- recruit Zaeed, Mordin, Archangel and later if chosen Morinth also Samara’s loyalty mission.
On Illium you recruit Samara and Thane and have Miranda’s loyalty mission here.
On Tuchanka you have both Grunt’s and Mordin’s loyalty missions.
On the Citadel you have both Archangel’s and Thane‘s loyalty mission.

-Talking to EDI on deck 4 about “what this area of the ship?” it replies with “…rearm and repair Normandy’s embarked ground vehicle and shuttle.” Clearly the developers already had the Hammerhead already well into development.

-The sealed rooms reserved for Zaeed and Kasumi.

-Zaeed not even having a recruitment quest. He’s just standing right there before you even get a real chance to play the game.

-All the Cerberus Network downloads for Zaeed, Cerberus armor with the shotgun and the Normandy crash site either available at launch day or shortly after. With Kasumi and the Hammerhead coming soon.


*** Edit add on

- Unless I’m the only one who noticed it, my game manual is also botched as well. All the pages are in it and in order, yet when it comes to the deck descriptions it the info suddenly goes missing after you get the one line about deck 3 (page 18) and there is no mention at all about deck 4.

But I guess I’m just nitpicking when I notice things that obvious.



Downloads should not be used to finish the game by adding stuff in it that should have been in it to begin with. EA’s Madden Football is a perfect example with you having to pay to get to have an online franchise. Downloads are used to give players a reason to replay a game or enhance what’s already there with new levels, quests and equipment and so on. -Yes the Cerberus armor and shotgun are in this category of things but they feel like after thoughts since they were released so soon after the game came out.

Modifié par Darth Drago, 22 février 2010 - 09:04 .


#299
Jaysonie

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Darth Drago wrote...


How can you not believe that Mass Effect was rushed out to the stores? All the evidence is right in front of you.

-Pop-ups at the end of Tali’s loyalty quest that stay on the screen telling you to “Press B to end mission”. You have dialog options that can and should be resolved but yet it seems you are practically forced out of this by the constant reminder to end the mission. Having this pop-up over your dialog choices is unforgivable.

-Pop-ups whenever you scan a planet that tells you to “Press RT (right trigger) to launch a probe.” when that information is already on the screen.

-Pop-ups when you invite your love interest to the captains quarters “press B to continue”. Don’t we get it yet that pressing “B” will end practically every event/mission yet? Also, to continue what? Nothing is continued in any context, its ended first so you can continue the game.

-Having to feed fish but not your pet rodent?

-Odd Plot Holes. An example from the first mission where you meet Jacob and Miranda. The Cerberus symbol plastered about on everything and why Shepard doesn’t recognize it but yet later Jack spots it and knows immediately who the symbol stands for. Even though we didn’t see the symbol in the first game Shepard should have recognized it considering their history from the mission in the first game. The dialog from Miranda about how this is the last shuttle when you can plainly see three other shuttles in that room. Even how Shepard suddenly starts the game wearing armor and if as a female Shepard, with any makeup on as well seems odd at least to me.

-A severe shortage of side quests. So many planets with so little to do.
ME1 had 20 citadel, 38 UNC, 3 squad mate and 9 main quest planet (not adding in different ones for paragon/renegade and background exclusives) -70 in total.
ME2 had 3 Normandy, 25 main planet (some only available from a imported game) and 13 N7 quests -41 in total.

-Loyalty and recruiting quests conveniently bundled at the same planets.
On Omega- recruit Zaeed, Mordin, Archangel and later if chosen Morinth also Samara’s loyalty mission.
On Illium you recruit Samara and Thane and have Miranda’s loyalty mission here.
On Tuchanka you have both Grunt’s and Mordin’s loyalty missions.
On the Citadel you have both Archangel’s and Thane‘s loyalty mission.

-Talking to EDI on deck 4 about “what this area of the ship?” it replies with “…rearm and repair Normandy’s embarked ground vehicle and shuttle.” Clearly the developers already had the Hammerhead already well into development.

-The sealed rooms reserved for Zaeed and Kasumi.

-Zaeed not even having a recruitment quest. He’s just standing right there before you even get a real chance to play the game.

-All the Cerberus Network downloads for Zaeed, Cerberus armor with the shotgun and the Normandy crash site either available at launch day or shortly after. With Kasumi and the Hammerhead coming soon.



Downloads should not be used to finish the game by adding stuff in it that should have been in it to begin with. EA’s Madden Football is a perfect example with you having to pay to get to have an online franchise. Downloads are used to give players a reason to replay a game or enhance what’s already there with new levels, quests and equipment and so on. -Yes the Cerberus armor and shotgun are in this category of things but they feel like after thoughts since they were released so soon after the game came out.


Small nitpicks and complaints. Dosent prove the game was rushed.

#300
selfsurf

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probably been mentioned before, but this is one of the very few games that bioware has strayed from the bioware formula. give it time