120 réponses à ce sujet

[Meat3h]

I dont see them adding any new characters in the squad but who knows what they decide. I think that some characters from both 1 and 2 will come back but others will be relegated to supporting cast, much like Wrex was in ME2. I just dont see the logic in adding even more deep characters in the final act of anything. Its the time when the game should tying off all the lose ends from 1 and 2

[Chrisimo79]

TudorWolf wrote...

Bioware are really going to have to choose whether to favour the fans or the newbs.

Mass Effect 2 had a new squad for that reason pretty much, limit the "wtf who is this?" factor for the new guys.
I'm seriously hoping that we see most of the past characters back. I'd be seriously let down otherwise

That's not true. New gamers who haven't played ME1 and ME2 could at least start with all Squadmembers from ME2. The players who played ME2 and lost squadmates will be the ones in question (whether they are favored)

Modifié par Chrisimo79, 02 février 2010 - 08:00 .

[Pauravi]

Man785 wrote...

I see where both of you are coming from, but I am coming from Bioware's point of view with the assumption that they will not dedicate resources into coding and voicing characters that may or may not be used in the game.

I am coming at it from Bioware's point of view, too, but a different angle.
Bioware is a developer that concentrates on storytelling and characters, and they have ever since Baldur's Gate.  I don't think that they will waste all the effort they put into developing the 15 potential squadmates through the course of ME1 and ME2 just to sideline every single one of them.  It would be a kick in the quad for those of us who tried so hard to bring our whole crew through the last mission and succeeded, and it smash people's emotional involvement in the story.  I think Bioware knows this -- it is no coincidence that two of the characters that people are most passionate about are Garrus and Tali, the ones who returned from ME1.  They will want to bring closure to the relationships we've had, or else people will be left feeling very unsatisfied.

I don't think everyone will come back... some characters have very good reason not to.  As much as I like Mordin, he is old and he may pass away.  Thane has a terminal illness, Wrex is leading his people, and Samara is a loner justicar (although she could make a small cameo for Paragon characters -- she does say that you could call on her if you needed her).  If you subtract just a few from the total number of characters that could possibly have survived through both games you end up with, say, 10 or 11 characters, which is just about the same number as in ME2.  I have no problem thinking that they will devote as much writing and resources to the climax of this epic series as they did to the second installment, even if not everyone will be able to take advantage of it on the 1st try.

Basically, my thought is that Bioware understands the type of branching story they conceived of from the beginning, and that they will be willing to dedicate the resources necessary to make it work, and work well.  They have certainly never been a developer to shy away from ambitious projects, and I don't think they're going to scrimp on development costs at the expense of everything they have built up.

[petipas1414]

Not sure how many years after ME2 ME3 will be... but I think Thane could be replaced with Kolyat... unless they have some DLC with Mordin curing Thanes disease or something.



Other than that, I dunno... I couldn't really see them NOT adding new people... but for those of us who have played both and has there Shep from the original ME... I think it would be really cool to have 100% friendly faces.

[cpolisch]

I 100% and with the OP. I could see 2-3 new people MAX, and that's only if almost everyone comes back from the 2 old games. I could see sidelining Jacob, because I didn't like him, but even he would make no sense to take out. What are they gonna do? "Well guys, there's this huge reaper threat still out there, but, HEY, you guys got other stuffs to do right?" I want the ME1 people back too, Liara and Ashley/Kaidan didnt' get enough screen time for them to do the same thing for them in ME3. How are they going to even reach a conclusion with that little screen time? They can't!

I certainly hope Bioware pulls through this time and decides the extra work is worth the thousands of people they'd make happy. Especially if they pull of the LIs thing, and if someone didn't like the old LIs, one of the 2-3 new guys could be one too.

ME1+ME2 squad is perfecty fine with me, and if they wanna subtract a few from them... like Samara or Wrex, that's fine. But at least the majority of them from both games.

[siltsonata]

For me, the biggest thing is that for most of the ME2 squad, leaving would be out of character. They've all seen the danger, they know that the galaxy could be destroyed if Shepard fails. It wouldn't be believable for them to abandon him/her now.



Of course, Thane may die, Mordin may retire to a non-squaddie position (fine by me, as long as he still has tons of dialogue) Zaeed may leave, maybe Wrex and Tali (sorry guys) might become envoys for their people to get everyone ready for the final battle.



Everyone else is something of a loner, and Shepard has earned their loyalty by leading them into hell and back. I just wouldn't believe it if, say Garrus or Jack (Loyalty earned) left, provided they survived ME2: These characters regard Shepard as pretty much their only friend (or the only person they trust) in the whole galaxy. Leaving Shepard to face the reaper threat alone is out of character for them.

[Chrisimo79]

Pauravi wrote...

Man785 wrote...

I see where both of you are coming from, but I am coming from Bioware's point of view with the assumption that they will not dedicate resources into coding and voicing characters that may or may not be used in the game.

I am coming at it from Bioware's point of view, too, but a different angle.
Bioware is a developer that concentrates on storytelling and characters, and they have ever since Baldur's Gate.  I don't think that they will waste all the effort they put into developing the 15 potential squadmates through the course of ME1 and ME2 just to sideline every single one of them.  It would be a kick in the quad for those of us who tried so hard to bring our whole crew through the last mission and succeeded, and it smash people's emotional involvement in the story.  I think Bioware knows this -- it is no coincidence that two of the characters that people are most passionate about are Garrus and Tali, the ones who returned from ME1.  They will want to bring closure to the relationships we've had, or else people will be left feeling very unsatisfied.

I don't think everyone will come back... some characters have very good reason not to.  As much as I like Mordin, he is old and he may pass away.  Thane has a terminal illness, Wrex is leading his people, and Samara is a loner justicar (although she could make a small cameo for Paragon characters -- she does say that you could call on her if you needed her).  If you subtract just a few from the total number of characters that could possibly have survived through both games you end up with, say, 10 or 11 characters, which is just about the same number as in ME2.  I have no problem thinking that they will devote as much writing and resources to the climax of this epic series as they did to the second installment, even if not everyone will be able to take advantage of it on the 1st try.

Basically, my thought is that Bioware understands the type of branching story they conceived of from the beginning, and that they will be willing to dedicate the resources necessary to make it work, and work well.  They have certainly never been a developer to shy away from ambitious projects, and I don't think they're going to scrimp on development costs at the expense of everything they have built up.

You make good points and I very much hope that you are right. I just don't want to get my hopes up

[samuraix87]

if you played paragon miranda and jacob will stay cause your not with cerberus



thane said illium was his last mission and he has no where to go



grunt will stay with shepard since he is grunts battlemaster



samara made on oath to shepard so she will stay



jack has nowhere else to go



garrus doesnt like c-sec so he will stay with you



mordin is working on the genophage and wants to stay and use the tech lab on the normandy



legion will stay since shepard saved him



tali is part of the normandy so she will stay



for people saying no one will stay or be cameos is wrong to a point

[Sereaph502]

Also, heres another thing to consider:



In ME1, all of your squad would have happily stayed with Shepard if it wasn't for the fact that the Normandy was blown up and Shepard was declared "dead"



It would take a pretty significant event like Shepard dieing to tear the crew of ME2 apart. Though yes, some people will probably move on. Like Samara, Mordin, and Thane.

[Druss99]

Id be gutted if the squad from ME2 didnt return. Liara and Ashley/Kaiden im not too fussed on.



I got the impression they are setting ME3 up to be about Shephard now trying to convince the galaxy the reapers exist and trying to gather armies. Much like dragon age. Most of the squad members on the Normandy have no real reason to leave, they know the dangers first hand. Most of them have stories that are set up to be potentially huge too like Legion and possible peace with the Quarians. I felt they left just enough of the characters story to be told to fill the dialogue in ME3.

[Sereaph502]

Druss99 wrote...

Id be gutted if the squad from ME2 didnt return. Liara and Ashley/Kaiden im not too fussed on.

I got the impression they are setting ME3 up to be about Shephard now trying to convince the galaxy the reapers exist and trying to gather armies. Much like dragon age. Most of the squad members on the Normandy have no real reason to leave, they know the dangers first hand. Most of them have stories that are set up to be potentially huge too like Legion and possible peace with the Quarians. I felt they left just enough of the characters story to be told to fill the dialogue in ME3.

I could see stuff like Shepard having Tali go back to the migrant fleet to try and convince the quarians, and maybe even send Legion along with her so they can try and convince them to stop fighting, but of course shepard would have the final say, and they'd join back up with you.

That would satisfy the "start the game with no squad and have to recruit them" quota as well as the returning ME1/2 quota.

[Inverness Moon]

Meh, there are two people guaranteed to be alive, as was said in an earlier post, Liara and the Virmire survivor. If you made terrible choices and everyone else but you died in ME2 and you import that into ME3 then you should be stuck with those two people for ME3. Otherwise in ME3 if you import you'll get the guaranteed two along with the squad mates that lived through ME2.

Edit: Of course perhaps if you don't have a minimum if X number of squad mates, we could get two or so additional ones like Kal'Reegar or someone else. I also mentioned in a previous thread that even if Legion died in ME2 we could still get it back in ME3 just because geth are software. If Legion made a backup of itself on the Normandy before the suicide mission then a mission in ME3 might involve acquiring a new mobile platform for Legion.

Edit 2: On second thought I think this is a great idea. If Legion dies the mission would involve getting a new body, if he lives then the same mission would involve getting its body repaired.

Modifié par Inverness Moon, 02 février 2010 - 08:26 .

[Pauravi]

Someone else made a good point here as well:

People are acting as if the writing and voice acting is the most resource-intensive part of the process, but that is far from the truth. It seems to me that they already have a great engine that they have tweaked to most people's liking. ME1 was a great experiment, and ME2 was the result of people's feedback. All the programming hours of designing and re-designing the battle and equipment systems have been done already and will likely not receive much more than a few tweaks.



Even if they were to include every single possible character that could have survived and gave them significant roles, it is likely that development costs would be less than either ME1 or ME2. Also, remember that designing a new character that is convincing is a matter of coming up with a unique personal style, a new voice actor, and the writing involved in designing a good way to bring them back into the story and attach them to Shepard. Bioware is simply not going to half-ass something like that, either, so there very well may be just as much, if not MORE cost associated with introducing one new character than there would be in bringing back 2-3 previous ones. I don't think it really saves them anything.

[XiNAVRO]

TudorWolf wrote...

Bioware are really going to have to choose whether to favour the fans or the newbs.

Mass Effect 2 had a new squad for that reason pretty much, limit the "wtf who is this?" factor for the new guys.
I'm seriously hoping that we see most of the past characters back. I'd be seriously let down otherwise

Should we really consider the 'new gamers' over the needs of fans of a trilogy?

Maybe if it was like KOTOR, where you had a new main character in the sequel and less of a connection to the first one, perhaps. But Mass Effect was planned to be a trilogy from birth and the decisions from the previous game was to be carried over to the next one.

If they can't figure out what the heck is going on, they can always grab the GOTY edition (or something along the lines) of ME1 and ME2.

Modifié par XiNAVRO, 02 février 2010 - 08:25 .

[xMister Vx]

I'd just like to add my vote - we don't need a lot of new characters in ME3. Yes, BioWare has more than enough talent and imagination to invent ten new excellent squadmates. However, it's actually more of a challenge to make the existing squadmates:

a) still interesting to old fans

accessible to new fans

But judging by the game sales, more or less the same crowd plays the ME franchise. They surely wouldn't want to disappoint them, and besides - aren't creators attached to their characters as well? They wouldn't want to give them minor roles in the most epic of the three games.



Then again, they could pull something like Shepard "dying", but that would be stretching our belief. What, does something nasty happen to Shepard every two years?

As I said before, some squadmates have valid reasons to quit after the mission, but for most it would feel pretty contrived.

[anskim]

I do need one extra sqaud mate,



The blue varen that follows you around on Tucahanka (if you feed him once he starts following you and you can use him in the pit fights). I just need a fearsome doggy in ME3, the space hamster doesn't cut it for me.

[kennyme2]

I also agree, need to get to know more about our crew, ME3 is for finishing up relationships/friendships

[DarthCaine]

Ashley/Kaidan and Wrex weren't squad mates in ME2 'cos they could die in ME1
Since the other LIs could die, Liara also isn't a squad mate
Tali and Garrus were the only ones that definitely could make it out of ME1 alive

Since any of ME2's squad mate can potentially die, I expect a whole new crew in ME3 from BioWare (since they always try to make your choices as meaningless as possible so that new players can adapt and it's easier for BioWare that way)

Modifié par DarthCaine, 02 février 2010 - 08:56 .

[OasisForever1991]

Wrex. That's all please.

[Peter_Stauffenberg]

Man785 wrote...
I see where both of you are coming from, but I am coming from Bioware's point of view with the assumption that they will not dedicate resources into coding and voicing characters that may or may not be used in the game. They were able to do this in ME 2 with Ashley and Kaiden because they were given side plots and weren't used in the main arch of the story. Wrex was also replacable, but did not have a large role in the main story. NPCs you run across are different than main story squadmembers.

I don't agree with this. 95% of the players lose 3 or less characters so they will have plenty of remaining characters to choose from. Remember that almost all players will use most of the squadmembers when importing their save game. We can pick the ones we like for the missions and with only 2 squadmembers per mission you will have several characters you rarely use at all.

So Bioware won't lose anything by making voice overs for all (or most) of the current squadmates. Most players will have a chance to use most of them and if they can't use one or two (due to deaths in ME2) it doesn't matter much.  What's important is that Bioware offers enough different character classes so you have all bases covered. I therefore predict that Bioware will introduce maybe 3 new characters (one soldier, one biotic and one engineer). This way Shepard can have a complete team for every mission.  This means the ones losing all squadmembers can still succeed with ME3. These players will simply lose the variety of choice that the players who saved most ME2 characters will have.

Bioware said that the choices you made in ME2 will have dire consequences in ME3. I think one of the choices is that losing squadmembers in ME2 means you have fewer characters to choose from in ME3.

We also have to think about the game story. Is it likely that most of Shepard's squadmembers would abandon him when he goes against the reapers?  They're loyal to him and his mission to stop the reaper invasion. So I think it would be poor storywriting if his companions just leave him to do something else. In happened in ME2 because they believed Shepard died. This won't happen now.  Some companions might not follow Shepard like Thane (dying from his illness) and maybe Zaaed, but most of them will go through fire for Shepard. Especially companions like Tali, Garrus, Miranda and Jacob will follow Shepard in his quest. Probably Grunt as well. Where would Jack go if she's not on the Normandy so I think even she would follow Shepard. With him she has purpose in life. Samara might go somewhere else, but I can't see something that would drag here to some other place. Legion seems to be too important to just let go. He's a geth and would be very important to getting their support against the reapers. Mordin seems like a companion that could be used to research something against the reapers. So maybe he becomes an NPC at a lab or something instead of a squadmate.

I think it would be an anti-climax is Shepard has to go on companion recruiting once again when he has many loyal squadmates he has already recruited. Bioware will save a lot of time if they can reuse the graphics for the companions and use the voice over from existing actors and actresses. Maybe those who signed in for ME2 also signed in for ME3?

Why make a trilogy where the actions in ME1 affect ME2 which affect ME3 and you reset the available companions for each game?  Then you have 3 separate games and not a true trilogy. For the trilogy to be believable then many characters should appear in each game.

Modifié par Peter_Stauffenberg, 02 février 2010 - 08:39 .

[Druss99]

Sereaph502 wrote...

Druss99 wrote...

Id be gutted if the squad from ME2 didnt return. Liara and Ashley/Kaiden im not too fussed on.

I got the impression they are setting ME3 up to be about Shephard now trying to convince the galaxy the reapers exist and trying to gather armies. Much like dragon age. Most of the squad members on the Normandy have no real reason to leave, they know the dangers first hand. Most of them have stories that are set up to be potentially huge too like Legion and possible peace with the Quarians. I felt they left just enough of the characters story to be told to fill the dialogue in ME3.

I could see stuff like Shepard having Tali go back to the migrant fleet to try and convince the quarians, and maybe even send Legion along with her so they can try and convince them to stop fighting, but of course shepard would have the final say, and they'd join back up with you.

That would satisfy the "start the game with no squad and have to recruit them" quota as well as the returning ME1/2 quota.

I see what your saying. I was thinking more like the vast majority of missions will involve you proving the threat is real in order to recruit these allies then a mission to gain their undivided loyalty. Such as recruiting the Krogan then uniting them so theres no infighting when they are facing the reapers. Recruiting the Geth and Quarians then somehow helping them find peace so they arent distracted by each other when fighting the reapers. Maybe convincing the Alliance to work with Cerberus.

Thats the only way I can see them getting around spending the whole game recruiting another team. It not only gives story progression but it uses the contacts your current and former squads had. Such as recruiting the Krogan army gets you Wrex. Using Miranda and Jacob to help deal with the Cerberus sides. Maybe even helping Liara take down the shadow broker to gain valuable inside information on how to unite the factions brings her back into your team too.

[Barhador]

I'm wondering how many squad member you guys actually want for ME3. I've put up a poll.

http://social.biowar...901/polls/1658/

Modifié par Barhador, 02 février 2010 - 09:00 .

[Man785]

Chrisimo79 wrote...

You make good points and I very much hope that you are right. I just don't want to get my hopes up

 Ditto

[TyDurden13]

Peter_Stauffenberg wrote...
Bioware said that the choices you made in ME2 will have dire
consequences in ME3. I think one of the choices is that losing
squadmembers in ME2 means you have fewer characters to choose from in
ME3.

Good point.  I keep waffling on how they should handle this.  You need at the very least 2 new squaddies for imported ME2 bloodbaths.  And really, new characters is part of the fun.  I say go with 4 new squadmates.  If you get the 4 newbies plus Liara and the Virmire survivor, that's a complement of 6 (the same number you had in ME1) even if you wiped the entire the ME2 team. 

Then there should be some ME2 characters who leave the crew.  Zaeed (was just there for the length of his contract), Samara (she does have to go back to being a Justicar), Thane (dying - I would think he's want to spend some time w/ his son), and Mordin (getting "too old for this **** - spends twilight years on Tuchanka working with the krogan or somewhere else where ehe can do some good).

That leaves seven from ME2 left (Miranda, Jacob, Jack, Tali, Garrus, Grunt, Legion), and a total of 13, which they shouldn't have too much trouble implementing.

As for players new to the series who could be missing out on a lot of the crew - it's an easy fix.  Just make it so "default" Shepard got all or most of the recreuitable ones through the mission.

Modifié par TyDurden13, 02 février 2010 - 09:20 .

[Draven2point0]

We need a new Squad member, a Hanar that and a Volus. One that is a a powerful biotic wind XD

Modifié par Draven2point0, 02 février 2010 - 09:25 .