42 réponses à ce sujet

[Mimaiselphenai]

Kronner wrote...
Insanity is way too easy for Soldiers.

And then Barrier happened.

[TheBestClass]

Kronner wrote...

Hardened Adrenaline Rush
Shock Trooper

rest is up to you
Insanity is way too easy for Soldiers.

I always thought Commando was considered better. I don't know myself because I used Shock Trooper but everyone else seems to agree Commando is the superior evolution.

[vhatever]

TheBestclass wrote...

Kronner wrote...

Hardened Adrenaline Rush
Shock Trooper

rest is up to you
Insanity is way too easy for Soldiers.

I always thought Commando was considered better. I don't know myself because I used Shock Trooper but everyone else seems to agree Commando is the superior evolution.

Hmm. Not sure. I never use commando. I think it's an absolutely worthless choice. But you never know around here. I had to argue for a month + that soldiers were better on insanity than infiltrators. Kronner had it right, though. Stack health items, take miranda, maybe one point in concusive shot after you max warp/commando/hardened.

[TheUnusualSuspect]

vhatever wrote...

Widow is garbage for a soldier. Stop giving bad info. You probably don't even play on insanity.

I've definitely played on Insanity, with a Soldier, and the Widow.  It works fairly well, it's just a different combat style.

Widow + heightened adrenaline rush + commando + appropriate ammo power + Miranda bonuses allows you to one-shot many things on Insanity with a head-shot, and if not 1-shot, then strip their defences (for 1 defence enemies) in 1 shot, to quickly set up a warp detonation with Miranda + squaddie with pull, for group damage effects.

It's a more sit-back and control style of play with the Soldier, but still works very well.

As with most things in the game, it's all reasonably balanced provide you play to your chosen strengths, and there's rarely a single "right way" to do anything.

[FrostGun]

Hmm my build is



Commando

Hardened AR

Squad Disruptor

Inferno Ammo

Flash Bang

1 free point



Commando over Shock trooper because i find extra 15% power duration to be negligible with AR. Extra 10% storm speed is nice as it is passive.



If you choose revenant as your gun pick hardened AR if you pick claymore or widow pick heightened AR.

[Hiero Glyph]

FrostGun wrote...

Hmm my build is

Commando
Hardened AR
Squad Disruptor
Inferno Ammo
Flash Bang
1 free point

Commando over Shock trooper because i find extra 15% power duration to be negligible with AR. Extra 10% storm speed is nice as it is passive.

If you choose revenant as your gun pick hardened AR if you pick claymore or widow pick heightened AR.

Hardened AR is +100% weapon damage while Heightened AR is +140% weapon damage.  I don't really think that the a 50% health damage reduction is enough to warrant losing a 40% weapon damage bonus though.

[TheUnusualSuspect]

Hiero Glyph wrote...

Hardened AR is +100% weapon damage while Heightened AR is +140% weapon damage.  I don't really think that the a 50% health damage reduction is enough to warrant losing a 40% weapon damage bonus though.

It really depends.  Time slowdown with Heightened AR is 70%, so you only get 30% of your shots off

Hardened AR is 50%, so you get 50% of your shots off.

0.3 * 240 (72) is less than 0.5 * 200 (100)

Heightened AR is great for Sniper, if you're building a Sniper Soldier where rifle reload means you're out of your AR period after your first shot, but for all other scenarios, Hardened is better (well, except for maybe heightened + Claymore)

[swk3000]

Hiero Glyph wrote...

Hardened AR is +100% weapon damage while Heightened AR is +140% weapon damage.  I don't really think that the a 50% health damage reduction is enough to warrant losing a 40% weapon damage bonus though.

It depends. Fast-firing weapons like the Revenant actually get fewer shots off with Heightened, and the extra damage per bullet isn't enough to make up for the lost shots. Full-auto and fast-firing weapons like the Revenant and the Viper get better results from Hardened Adrenaline Rush. They also like Shock Trooper over Commando, as it gives them more health. This is because their weapons force them to spend more time out of cover, so they tend to take more damage. Going with Shock Trooper and Hardened Adrenaline Rush results in a much hardier character.

On the other hand, slower-firing weapons like the Widow/Viper and Vindicator get more damage out of Heightened. This is because the number of shots they fire out of Adrenaline Rush and how many they fire while in Adrenaline Rush doesn't change. They therefore don't care about the increased slowdown. They also prefer to make every shot count, so they generally go with the Commando evolutioin to get more damage into each shot. They're more fragile, and tend to have less ammo, so they make every shot count.

[Canned Bullets]

Inferno ammo with the Revenant is good against missions where armored enemies are common, really good against Collectors and boss fights just try to get the accuracy upgrade for it. Also if you're on the 360 version once you're about to rank up the 4th level of a power push A and X at the same time, you'll be able to get a fully ranked power and keep those squad points. Also, Reave is a good bonus power,good for stripping away Armor and Barriers, not so good against Shields though, and it disables organics that don't have any defenses and gives you health bonus.

Modifié par Canned Bullets, 14 avril 2010 - 05:13 .

[FrostGun]

Hiero Glyph wrote...

Hardened AR is +100% weapon damage while Heightened AR is +140% weapon damage.  I don't really think that the a 50% health damage reduction is enough to warrant losing a 40% weapon damage bonus though.

the reason for the increase to dmg is to counter the extra slow time dillation.

This means with a rapid firing weapon you are not really gaining anything with heightened AR. Thus rapid firing weapon do more damage with Hardened AR than Heightened AR. For weapons that has a single round per clip then Yes Heightened AR will by far outperform Hardened..

Example:

Say i have a gun that fires 10 times every 2 sec for 100 dmg per shot. Thats 1000 dmg over 5 seconds.

With hardened AR i shoot 50% less (because time dillation also affect fire rate) but do 100% more damage:
So thats 5 shots over 5 seconds for 200 dmg per shot total is 1000dmg.

Now with heightened Ar i shoot 70% less for 140% dmg increase.

That means i shoot 3 times in that 5 seconds for 240dmg each. Total is 720dmg..

There you just lost 280 damage for using Heightened AR rather than Hardened Ar with a fast firing weapon.

As previously said, AR DMG bonus is only to counter the time dillation effect. Revenant AR will get best bonus with Hardened AR while single clip guns (claymore/widow) will benefit most with heightened. I chose AR hence my using Hardened.

PS: example i posted was written out by another forums poster i cant remember the name. So i take no credit.

[FrostGun]

swk3000 wrote...

Hiero Glyph wrote...

Hardened AR is +100% weapon damage while Heightened AR is +140% weapon damage.  I don't really think that the a 50% health damage reduction is enough to warrant losing a 40% weapon damage bonus though.

It depends. Fast-firing weapons like the Revenant actually get fewer shots off with Heightened, and the extra damage per bullet isn't enough to make up for the lost shots. Full-auto and fast-firing weapons like the Revenant and the Viper get better results from Hardened Adrenaline Rush. They also like Shock Trooper over Commando, as it gives them more health. This is because their weapons force them to spend more time out of cover, so they tend to take more damage. Going with Shock Trooper and Hardened Adrenaline Rush results in a much hardier character.

On the other hand, slower-firing weapons like the Widow/Viper and Vindicator get more damage out of Heightened. This is because the number of shots they fire out of Adrenaline Rush and how many they fire while in Adrenaline Rush doesn't change. They therefore don't care about the increased slowdown. They also prefer to make every shot count, so they generally go with the Commando evolutioin to get more damage into each shot. They're more fragile, and tend to have less ammo, so they make every shot count.

 I know what you mean but i dont get damaged enough in Insanity to warrant a 10% boost to hp.. also the increase in power duration doesnt seem very worth it. Now i that i have flashbang i dont us AR every cooldown anymore anyway..

Hence i always go commando over shock trooper with all my soldier builds .. But thats just my preference.

Modifié par FrostGun, 14 avril 2010 - 05:32 .

[FrostGun]

Canned Bullets wrote...

Inferno ammo with the Revenant is good against missions where armored enemies are common, really good against Collectors and boss fights just try to get the accuracy upgrade for it. Also if you're on the 360 version once you're about to rank up the 4th level of a power push A and X at the same time, you'll be able to get a fully ranked power and keep those squad points. Also, Reave is a good bonus power,good for stripping away Armor and Barriers, not so good against Shields though, and it disables organics that don't have any defenses and gives you health bonus.

Thats kind of cheating is it not ?? lol

[swk3000]

FrostGun wrote...

Hiero Glyph wrote...

Hardened AR is +100% weapon damage while Heightened AR is +140% weapon damage.  I don't really think that the a 50% health damage reduction is enough to warrant losing a 40% weapon damage bonus though.

the reason for the increase to dmg is to counter the extra slow time dillation.

This means with a rapid firing weapon you are not really gaining anything with heightened AR. Thus rapid firing weapon do more damage with Hardened AR than Heightened AR. For weapons that has a single round per clip then Yes Heightened AR will by far outperform Hardened..

Example:

Say i have a gun that fires 10 times every 2 sec for 100 dmg per shot. Thats 1000 dmg over 5 seconds.

With hardened AR i shoot 50% less (because time dillation also affect fire rate) but do 100% more damage:
So thats 5 shots over 5 seconds for 200 dmg per shot total is 1000dmg.

Now with heightened Ar i shoot 70% less for 140% dmg increase.

That means i shoot 3 times in that 5 seconds for 240dmg each. Total is 720dmg..

There you just lost 280 damage for using Heightened AR rather than Hardened Ar with a fast firing weapon.

As previously said, AR DMG bonus is only to counter the time dillation effect. Revenant AR will get best bonus with Hardened AR while single clip guns (claymore/widow) will benefit most with heightened. I chose AR hence my using Hardened.

PS: example i posted was written out by another forums poster i cant remember the name. So i take no credit.

I'm pretty sure this was written out by me.

[mi55ter]

Khavos wrote...

It's Soldier; pick your points at random if you want, you'll still have little trouble.

Same goes for your squadmates.

This is so hilariously true I'm just going to quote it again, for posterity. What makes it funnier is how much of a pain Insanity is with other classes compared to the cakewalk it is for a soldier. I just took Reave for my bonus power. No looking back now.

[limpan21]

Actually shocktrooper is pretty horrible choice for a soldier no matter what build, 15% less damage from ammo powers and 6% less weapon damage means that things will die alot slower and eat up ammo way faster, and regarding highetened vs hardened, well yeah slow firing/1-shot-before-reload weapons benefit the most from the added slowing, however on insanity you will be using both sniper rifle and shotgun frequently (at least i did) even if you go with the revenant so once again its more of a preference thing, if you only plan on using revenant it might be worth to take hardened as you will need to be pretty close range in order to have a 100% hit ratio with it, and closing with the enemy is painful on the harder settings,

[JJM152]

Why do people insist on using "DPS" (damage per second) as some sort of metric for evaluating abilities? It's totally not appropriate for a game like this because if you're sitting out in the open unloading your "uber dps" weapon and always making head shots and never being hit by return enemy fire, then it doesn't frakking matter what gun you use, because you are Neo from the matrix.

[Simbacca]

4 Adrenaline Rush (whichever)
4 Heavy Concussive Shot (anti-barrier, combo with pull)
4 Squad Disruptor Ammo (anti-shield/synthetics)
4 Squad Incendiary Ammo (anti-armor/organics)
0 Cryo Ammo
4 Combat Mastery (whichever)
1 Slam (occasional warplosions)

4 Adrenaline Rush (whichever)
0 Concussive Shot
4 Heavy Disruptor Ammo (anti-shield/synthetics)
4 Inferno Ammo (anti-armor/organics)
4 Squad Cryo Ammo (cc)
4 Combat Mastery (whichever)
1 Slam (occasional warplosions)

There are many others, but I just don't see the need to dive into a bonus power with a Soldier. Perhaps Neural Shockwave (cc), Area Energy Drain (anti-shields, shield regen), or Area Reave (anti-barrier, anti-armor, health regen) could be useful but those would be fighting Adrenaline Rush for usage with the shared cooldowns.

Also, this may be personal opinion but I don't like the idea of a Soldier with a 2 Squad Ammo / 1 Heavy Ammo setup.  When trying to switch your squad to the most effective ammo type on the fly during missions with a variety of enemies and protections, you would have to take extra time to switch yourself back to your heavy ammo.  The 2 Heavy / 1 Squad and 2 Squad / 0 Heavy setups don't run into that extra ammo swapping time.

Modifié par Simbacca, 28 mai 2010 - 06:41 .

[Spartas Husky]

Hardened Adrenaline. +50 % dmg is a very helpful thing

Concussive Blast (in insanity the dmg diff between heavy and blast is so small, is a waste period, so might as well capitalize on its knock back power)



Squad Disruptor

Squad/inferno ammo. That really is up to you. I find it almost the same to have my squadies both have disruptor, and I have inferno, or to have everyone withs quad incendiary. Why?

1st If I have inferno I'll rip through enemy armo, which my squadies most likely will overheat their weapons.

But on the other hand:

2nd, everyone having incendiary squad ammo has the same effect, you burn through enemies at the same rate, but dont have the overheat part on it, so for me there is no 'right' choice, either way.



Combat Mastery: Commando. SOldiers dont use any type of skill that is based on timer, the only one is their adrenaline rush and 15% + for 5 seconds is like.. a third of a seccond. So commando is the way to go, that 15% dmg is better, since you are a dmg dealer based on punching, not on amount of punches thrown.



Bonus power, can be two.



IN my view, is either IMproved Barrier, or Improved Geth Shield.

1st Improved Barrier with upgrades at the end lasts around 4 minutes, and having +75% shields is very very useful, most likely you'll find that it feels your playing on veteran instead of insane because your shields just dont suddenly pop, so you got more breathing room.

This works, very very well, with Adrenaline Rush. poping with the viper is very effective.



2nd Improved geth Shield, if your a sniping this might be a bit more tricky, since you gota be very attentive to your watch, since the shield only lasts 60 secs. FOr me is plenty of time but you might not like it.



With Adrenaline increase dmg and 10%+ dmg on the shield, plus the commando combat mastery, does alot of good.



It really is up to you for special powers. Barrier allows you to fully concentrate on Adrenaline rush, Improved Geth shield forces you to be methodical and to be very accurate, every shot is more powerful but due to time constraints you gota make em count.



Personally I go for Improved GSB, I pop it before fighting, wait until a few secs to recharge, go in, and as asson as I see a foe I can pop Adrenaline and the fun starts.



Plus GSB and Barrier also give you that ace , just in case your low on hp, you can suddenly pop back your shields for last minute saver.



SOldiers rely on dmg from weapons, passive dmg so that you can pop Adrenaline rush all the time, any power impeding on Adrenaline rush's activation is really a liability because is taking precious recharge time that you could be using for Adrenaline RUsh.