532 réponses à ce sujet

[MGIII]

I feel that Bioware has done a lot to balance the game, bridging the obvious gaps between classes so that there is no "right" way to play ME2. However, although opinion will inevitably come into any discussion about how to play the game, I'm hoping opinion will be much less prevalent when discussing the roles and abilities each class offers the player to combat the enemies in this game.

On Insanity difficulty, of course. Everything else doesn't require much more than paying attention to the game.

I myself have only played completely through the game as a Vanguard, and have adapted Charge into a sort of God mode. It just takes a bit of strategy and knowledge of enemy placements. There are preliminary claims that Infiltrators are the class to be, as are Sentinels. The prevailing opinion is that Vanguards and Adepts are trash, but I think that's more of a knee-jerk reaction to biotcs' nerfing than any true analysis of the characters.

What I want to stress, however, this not about which class is more fun or whether one is better than another. I want to avoid all that. What I want to achieve is a consensus on the peak ability each class has to offer in ME2's metagame.

Nothing more, nothing less.

Modifié par MGIII, 02 février 2010 - 10:57 .

[tommythetomcat]

BioWare could really use class discussion sub forms sometimes I just want to chop it up with my fellow Adepts and Engineers and not have to wad through 50 "hate me2" threads to find good discussions.

[MGIII]

The only decent discussion that came from all those threads is only centered on biotics and their role. Which is a shame considering biotics are only one third of the combat in this game.

[Hoffburger]

Infiltrators are by far the most optimal for speed runs and easy runs (provided you have aim and can headshot). Snipers completely destroy everything even on Insanity because of all the damage stacking. Basically here's how it goes as an Infiltrator:

You start off by maxing out Incineration because the starter weapons run out of ammo too quickly and are fairly weak without all the upgrades. You then go for maxed out Tungsten ammo. Once you get that get 2 ranks of Infiltrator and then get Assassin Cloak. You should still be using Incinerate over cloak (other than running away to find better cover). By the time you get the Widow you will have maxed out Assassin Cloak and be close to maxing out Assassin or already have it. Once you get the Widow you start using cloak + widow on bigger targets like blue sun legionnaires, harbingers, scions, etc. Keep using the heavy pistol or just Incinerate on normal targets. Nothing is more satisfying than being able to 2 shot scions and 1 shot harbingers.

For squad you want Miranda and Garrus. Garrus gets Overload, Concussive Shot (which works well on barriers), AP Ammo, and good damage and power damage bonuses. He also gets the sniper rifle. I choose Garrus over Thane or Zaeed because Garrus covers all 3 damage types while Thane and Zaeed only cover barriers and armor. Miranda is obvious because she has Warp, Overload, and a squad damage bonus.

But yea, basically you spam Incinerate until you get the Widow and then, depending on the situation, you use cloak over Incinerate.

Reasons for picking AP Ammo over Warp Ammo:

1. Nothing in the game has enough barrier to not get 1 shot by the Widow unless it has more Armor than barrier anyways (Praetorians).

2. There are significantly more enemies in the game with only Armor than there are enemies with only barrier, most enemies worth worrying about that have barrier also have armor.

3. AP Ammo does more damage.


A couple more things. You should always turn off active squad power use if you have someone with squad ammo (unless you don't have ammo yourself). Secondly, always keep Disruptor Ammo (you will only be able to get this towards the end of the game or in NG+) in your SMG. The SMG does virtually no damage to health on most enemies, but with Disruptor Ammo it tears shields and Geth to pieces. You should really only use it if you run out of ammo, which probably wont happen because Tactical Cloak lets you scavenge for ammo and the Widow gets 2 ammo per heatsink picked up.

Modifié par Hoffburger, 02 février 2010 - 11:18 .

[MGIII]

Maxing passives are obviously a given. The game gives enough points to max five talents.

Is disruptor ammo that important? I've dabbled with it on Zaeed's loyalty mission and it didn't seem too great. Also, Mrianda is probably the best squadmate in the game.

Modifié par MGIII, 02 février 2010 - 11:24 .

[Thrakkesh]

Disruptor ammo is a godsend once you start fighting inorganics on a regular basis. Geth made me want to cry on Insanity mode, and I'd hate to think of what it would have been like without it.

[Hoffburger]

MGIII wrote...

Maxing passives are obviously a given. The game gives enough points to max five talents.

Is disruptor ammo that important? I've dabbled with it on Zaeed's loyalty mission and it didn't seem too great. Also, Mrianda is probably the best squadmate in the game.

No, Disruptor Ammo is pretty forgettable, which is why you get AP Ammo. Disruptor Ammo is really only useful against the Heavy Mechs. Using a SMG with Disruptor Ammo will take out the shields instantly. But so will a couple Overloads or a single Widow shot.

[MGIII]

I killed Geth fast enough with the Viper SR. Of course, Miranda and Legion/Tali helped things with Overload and Attack Drones/AI Hacking, respectively.

[Hoffburger]

Viper is ok until you use the beastly Widow. Things die.

[Soruyao]

I used shield drain instead of an ammo type for my infiltrator. I didn't have any trouble with bosses because I had heavy weapons handy, and being able to strip shielded targets in one hit and then AI hack/ snipe them was very nice. The shield boost it gave me saved my life on several occasions.



I focused on active abilities like AI hacking and incinerate a lot over passive buffs like assassin cloak and ammo mods. (I left my ammo mods and cloak at 2. I only used cloak for escapes, and rank 2 was perfectly decent for that.)



I didn't have any trouble with the collectors or the bosses. My unbuffed SMG was enough to strip barrier down quickly, and maxed incinerate and sniping made short work of any armored targets and bosses.



I also want to add that cryo rounds at rank 2 were AMAZING. Everything I shot that was in health froze instantly and was shattered by my allies. I was for all intents and purposes oneshotting everything that was in health. It made my carnifex almost more deadly than my sniper. It was especially useful against husks! Area incinerate would take out the armor on several of them, and then one shot to the midsection froze and shattered them instantly.



I think that as time goes by, people will start to appreciate cryo rounds more, especially on infiltrators.

[MGIII]

Hoffburger wrote...

Viper is ok until you use the beastly Widow. Things die.

I should try it out then. I'd have to roll an Infiltrator, but I've been looking forward to doing that, so it's all right.

[Hoffburger]

Soruyao wrote...

I used shield drain instead of an ammo type for my infiltrator. I didn't have any trouble with bosses because I had heavy weapons handy, and being able to strip shielded targets in one hit and then AI hack/ snipe them was very nice. The shield boost it gave me saved my life on several occasions.

I focused on active abilities like AI hacking and incinerate a lot over passive buffs like assassin cloak and ammo mods. (I left my ammo mods and cloak at 2. I only used cloak for escapes, and rank 2 was perfectly decent for that.)

I didn't have any trouble with the collectors or the bosses. My unbuffed SMG was enough to strip barrier down quickly, and maxed incinerate and sniping made short work of any armored targets and bosses.

I also want to add that cryo rounds at rank 2 were AMAZING. Everything I shot that was in health froze instantly and was shattered by my allies. I was for all intents and purposes oneshotting everything that was in health. It made my carnifex almost more deadly than my sniper. It was especially useful against husks! Area incinerate would take out the armor on several of them, and then one shot to the midsection froze and shattered them instantly.

I think that as time goes by, people will start to appreciate cryo rounds more, especially on infiltrators.

Wrong thread. This is the Optimality thread, not the casual how did you complete Normal mode thread. You can only use 1 ability due to the retarded global cooldown so to be optimal you have to max out your passives. This means Ammo and Assassin. Energy Drain is terrible for any class because nothing in the game has enough shields to worry about, even heavy mechs have more armor than shields. Sure you could use Incinerate and Energy Drain to attempt to take down a Heavy Mech faster than without Energy Drain, but I assure you that AP Ammo will make the task much quicker because you can just 2 shot the thing.

[Hoffburger]

MGIII wrote...

Hoffburger wrote...

Viper is ok until you use the beastly Widow. Things die.

I should try it out then. I'd have to roll an Infiltrator, but I've been looking forward to doing that, so it's all right.

Well, to put it in perspective. The base rifle is 263 damage per shot with 1 ammo per heatsink picked up and 10 max ammo. The Viper is 81.9 damage per shot with 60 max ammo. The beast Widow is 368 damage per shot with 13 rounds max and 2 per heatsink picked up.

[Graunt]

MGIII wrote...

I feel that Bioware has done a lot to balance the game, bridging the obvious gaps between classes so that there is no "right" way to play ME2. However, although opinion will inevitably come into any discussion about how to play the game, I'm hoping opinion will be much less prevalent when discussing the roles and abilities each class offers the player to combat the enemies in this game.

On Insanity difficulty, of course. Everything else doesn't require much more than paying attention to the game.

I myself have only played completely through the game as a Vanguard, and have adapted Charge into a sort of God mode. It just takes a bit of strategy and knowledge of enemy placements. There are preliminary claims that Infiltrators are the class to be, as are Sentinels. The prevailing opinion is that Vanguards and Adepts are trash, but I think that's more of a knee-jerk reaction to biotcs' nerfing than any true analysis of the characters.

What I want to stress, however, this not about which class is more fun or whether one is better than another. I want to avoid all that. What I want to achieve is a consensus on the peak ability each class has to offer in ME2's metagame.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I would be greatly amused to hear how you played your Vanguard on Insanity and it felt like god mode for you.  I am currently (currently stopped with the Vanguard that is) on my nth death in the Archangel scenario (the hardest fight in this sequence...) and I don't have rank 4 charge yet because of my level.  I'm sure things improve a little, but with how quickly I go down even when charging to an enemy with half life, I just don't see it.  And usually I'll do this when my shields are depleted.

Anyway, right now I'm essentially breezing through Insanity as an Infiltrator.  Being able to one shot a double defense enemy in the head is somehow fine, but being able to pull someone with a shield is overpowered.

Modifié par Graunt, 02 février 2010 - 11:53 .

[MGIII]

Hoffburger wrote...

MGIII wrote...

Hoffburger wrote...

Viper is ok until you use the beastly Widow. Things die.

I should try it out then. I'd have to roll an Infiltrator, but I've been looking forward to doing that, so it's all right.

Well, to put it in perspective. The base rifle is 263 damage per shot with 1 ammo per heatsink picked up and 10 max ammo. The Viper is 81.9 damage per shot with 60 max ammo. The beast Widow is 368 damage per shot with 13 rounds max and 2 per heatsink picked up.

What's the RoF, if you know, offhand?

[MGIII]

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

I feel that Bioware has done a lot to balance the game, bridging the obvious gaps between classes so that there is no "right" way to play ME2. However, although opinion will inevitably come into any discussion about how to play the game, I'm hoping opinion will be much less prevalent when discussing the roles and abilities each class offers the player to combat the enemies in this game.

On Insanity difficulty, of course. Everything else doesn't require much more than paying attention to the game.

I myself have only played completely through the game as a Vanguard, and have adapted Charge into a sort of God mode. It just takes a bit of strategy and knowledge of enemy placements. There are preliminary claims that Infiltrators are the class to be, as are Sentinels. The prevailing opinion is that Vanguards and Adepts are trash, but I think that's more of a knee-jerk reaction to biotcs' nerfing than any true analysis of the characters.

What I want to stress, however, this not about which class is more fun or whether one is better than another. I want to avoid all that. What I want to achieve is a consensus on the peak ability each class has to offer in ME2's metagame.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I would be greatly amused to hear how you played your Vanguard on Insanity and it felt like god mode for you.  I am currently on my nth death in the Archangel scenario (the hardest fight in this sequence...) and I don't have rank 4 charge yet because of my level.  I'm sure things improve a little, but with how quickly I go down even when charging to an enemy with half life, I just don't see it.  And usually I'll do this when my shields are depleted.

Anyway, right now I'm essentially breezing through Insanity as an Infiltrator.  Being able to one shot a double defense enemy in the head is somehow fine, but being able to pull someone with a shield is overpowered.

Charge is effective because of how poor the enemy AI is, combined with the laughably short cooldown. In the time it takes to recharge a Charge, most enemies won't even get you to half health unless you are literally in the middle of four or five of them. If not, keep on trucking. Charge is literally the only reason I survived the Collector ship.

[Graunt]

MGIII wrote...

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

I feel that Bioware has done a lot to balance the game, bridging the obvious gaps between classes so that there is no "right" way to play ME2. However, although opinion will inevitably come into any discussion about how to play the game, I'm hoping opinion will be much less prevalent when discussing the roles and abilities each class offers the player to combat the enemies in this game.

On Insanity difficulty, of course. Everything else doesn't require much more than paying attention to the game.

I myself have only played completely through the game as a Vanguard, and have adapted Charge into a sort of God mode. It just takes a bit of strategy and knowledge of enemy placements. There are preliminary claims that Infiltrators are the class to be, as are Sentinels. The prevailing opinion is that Vanguards and Adepts are trash, but I think that's more of a knee-jerk reaction to biotcs' nerfing than any true analysis of the characters.

What I want to stress, however, this not about which class is more fun or whether one is better than another. I want to avoid all that. What I want to achieve is a consensus on the peak ability each class has to offer in ME2's metagame.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I would be greatly amused to hear how you played your Vanguard on Insanity and it felt like god mode for you.  I am currently on my nth death in the Archangel scenario (the hardest fight in this sequence...) and I don't have rank 4 charge yet because of my level.  I'm sure things improve a little, but with how quickly I go down even when charging to an enemy with half life, I just don't see it.  And usually I'll do this when my shields are depleted.

Anyway, right now I'm essentially breezing through Insanity as an Infiltrator.  Being able to one shot a double defense enemy in the head is somehow fine, but being able to pull someone with a shield is overpowered.

Charge is effective because of how poor the enemy AI is, combined with the laughably short cooldown. In the time it takes to recharge a Charge, most enemies won't even get you to half health unless you are literally in the middle of four or five of them. If not, keep on trucking. Charge is literally the only reason I survived the Collector ship.

Eh, so basically the Vanguard is probably the most struggling class until rank 4 in their class specific ability.  I can see how bouncing around would keep you alive, but it doesn't seem like it would do anything more than you being mobile "CC" while your team actually does the damage.  Charge in itself seems ok, but the implementation is poor because you really don't have a whole lot of viable options for damage once you're where you want to be.  Shotguns are very very mediocre in this game, and you don't need to charge into someone to use a submachine gun or sniper rifle.

Modifié par Graunt, 03 février 2010 - 12:01 .

[TheBestClass]

I'd just like to add that while Soldier with Inferno grenades may not be "optimal" it's still fun and felt better than slapping Reave or something on it. I do enjoy sticking to powers that seem like they would go with whatever class I play. Anyway, continue with your Infiltrator talk. I'm thinking of rolling one soon.

[Graunt]

Hoffburger wrote...

Infiltrators are by far the most optimal for speed runs and easy runs (provided you have aim and can headshot). Snipers completely destroy everything even on Insanity because of all the damage stacking. Basically here's how it goes as an Infiltrator:

You start off by maxing out Incineration because the starter weapons run out of ammo too quickly and are fairly weak without all the upgrades. You then go for maxed out Tungsten ammo. Once you get that get 2 ranks of Infiltrator and then get Assassin Cloak. You should still be using Incinerate over cloak (other than running away to find better cover). By the time you get the Widow you will have maxed out Assassin Cloak and be close to maxing out Assassin or already have it. Once you get the Widow you start using cloak + widow on bigger targets like blue sun legionnaires, harbingers, scions, etc. Keep using the heavy pistol or just Incinerate on normal targets. Nothing is more satisfying than being able to 2 shot scions and 1 shot harbingers.

For squad you want Miranda and Garrus. Garrus gets Overload, Concussive Shot (which works well on barriers), AP Ammo, and good damage and power damage bonuses. He also gets the sniper rifle. I choose Garrus over Thane or Zaeed because Garrus covers all 3 damage types while Thane and Zaeed only cover barriers and armor. Miranda is obvious because she has Warp, Overload, and a squad damage bonus.

But yea, basically you spam Incinerate until you get the Widow and then, depending on the situation, you use cloak over Incinerate.

Reasons for picking AP Ammo over Warp Ammo:

1. Nothing in the game has enough barrier to not get 1 shot by the Widow unless it has more Armor than barrier anyways (Praetorians).

2. There are significantly more enemies in the game with only Armor than there are enemies with only barrier, most enemies worth worrying about that have barrier also have armor.

3. AP Ammo does more damage.


A couple more things. You should always turn off active squad power use if you have someone with squad ammo (unless you don't have ammo yourself). Secondly, always keep Disruptor Ammo (you will only be able to get this towards the end of the game or in NG+) in your SMG. The SMG does virtually no damage to health on most enemies, but with Disruptor Ammo it tears shields and Geth to pieces. You should really only use it if you run out of ammo, which probably wont happen because Tactical Cloak lets you scavenge for ammo and the Widow gets 2 ammo per heatsink picked up.

Miranda/Garrus and Miranda/Zaeed seemed pretty much the only choices to me.  Garrus for the extra Overload and if you wanted to dump Tungesten for something else he could do it for the group, Zaeed with grenade/conc shot for husk swarms.  
I'll have to try your build order sometime, it seems a bit counter intuitive from a single character perspective, but if you're hitting rank 4 in ammo it's a pretty significant boost to your group. I went for more of an actual early snipe build and at only level 7 I'm one shotting crap on Insanity, although it's probably not as fast as just being able to use Incinerate over and over as well as having better Armor piercing shots that will end up being party wide due to the reliance on the cloak cooldown.

Also, what did you mean with the Disruptor ammo comment and not being able to get it until towards the end of the game?  Are you talking about the ability or just the gun you would use it with, or are you simply talking about putting more than one rank into it since you get it by default anyway?

Modifié par Graunt, 03 février 2010 - 12:32 .

[AlphaJarmel]

Hoffburger wrote...

MGIII wrote...

Maxing passives are obviously a given. The game gives enough points to max five talents.

Is disruptor ammo that important? I've dabbled with it on Zaeed's loyalty mission and it didn't seem too great. Also, Mrianda is probably the best squadmate in the game.

No, Disruptor Ammo is pretty forgettable, which is why you get AP Ammo. Disruptor Ammo is really only useful against the Heavy Mechs. Using a SMG with Disruptor Ammo will take out the shields instantly. But so will a couple Overloads or a single Widow shot.

Actually that's the whole point of Garrus.  You chose the squad share for his AP specialization and max out disrupter for inorganics.  Disrupter is absolutely amazing maxed out as it tears apart a Geth Hunter in one clip with the SMG.

[MGIII]

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

I feel that Bioware has done a lot to balance the game, bridging the obvious gaps between classes so that there is no "right" way to play ME2. However, although opinion will inevitably come into any discussion about how to play the game, I'm hoping opinion will be much less prevalent when discussing the roles and abilities each class offers the player to combat the enemies in this game.

On Insanity difficulty, of course. Everything else doesn't require much more than paying attention to the game.

I myself have only played completely through the game as a Vanguard, and have adapted Charge into a sort of God mode. It just takes a bit of strategy and knowledge of enemy placements. There are preliminary claims that Infiltrators are the class to be, as are Sentinels. The prevailing opinion is that Vanguards and Adepts are trash, but I think that's more of a knee-jerk reaction to biotcs' nerfing than any true analysis of the characters.

What I want to stress, however, this not about which class is more fun or whether one is better than another. I want to avoid all that. What I want to achieve is a consensus on the peak ability each class has to offer in ME2's metagame.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I would be greatly amused to hear how you played your Vanguard on Insanity and it felt like god mode for you.  I am currently on my nth death in the Archangel scenario (the hardest fight in this sequence...) and I don't have rank 4 charge yet because of my level.  I'm sure things improve a little, but with how quickly I go down even when charging to an enemy with half life, I just don't see it.  And usually I'll do this when my shields are depleted.

Anyway, right now I'm essentially breezing through Insanity as an Infiltrator.  Being able to one shot a double defense enemy in the head is somehow fine, but being able to pull someone with a shield is overpowered.

Charge is effective because of how poor the enemy AI is, combined with the laughably short cooldown. In the time it takes to recharge a Charge, most enemies won't even get you to half health unless you are literally in the middle of four or five of them. If not, keep on trucking. Charge is literally the only reason I survived the Collector ship.

Eh, so basically the Vanguard is probably the most struggling class until rank 4 in their class specific ability.  I can see how bouncing around would keep you alive, but it doesn't seem like it would do anything more than you being mobile "CC" while your team actually does the damage.  Charge in itself seems ok, but the implementation is poor because you really don't have a whole lot of viable options for damage once you're where you want to be.  Shotguns are very very mediocre in this game, and you don't need to charge into someone to use a submachine gun or sniper rifle.

Charge puts you in shotgun range, which is quite the boon. Charge works best with squad help, yes, but it isn't necessary to use them.

The reason Shotguns are mediocre to you because their optimal range is one where the life expectancy is the shortest.

Modifié par MGIII, 03 février 2010 - 12:52 .

[Graunt]

MGIII wrote...

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

I feel that Bioware has done a lot to balance the game, bridging the obvious gaps between classes so that there is no "right" way to play ME2. However, although opinion will inevitably come into any discussion about how to play the game, I'm hoping opinion will be much less prevalent when discussing the roles and abilities each class offers the player to combat the enemies in this game.

On Insanity difficulty, of course. Everything else doesn't require much more than paying attention to the game.

I myself have only played completely through the game as a Vanguard, and have adapted Charge into a sort of God mode. It just takes a bit of strategy and knowledge of enemy placements. There are preliminary claims that Infiltrators are the class to be, as are Sentinels. The prevailing opinion is that Vanguards and Adepts are trash, but I think that's more of a knee-jerk reaction to biotcs' nerfing than any true analysis of the characters.

What I want to stress, however, this not about which class is more fun or whether one is better than another. I want to avoid all that. What I want to achieve is a consensus on the peak ability each class has to offer in ME2's metagame.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I would be greatly amused to hear how you played your Vanguard on Insanity and it felt like god mode for you.  I am currently on my nth death in the Archangel scenario (the hardest fight in this sequence...) and I don't have rank 4 charge yet because of my level.  I'm sure things improve a little, but with how quickly I go down even when charging to an enemy with half life, I just don't see it.  And usually I'll do this when my shields are depleted.

Anyway, right now I'm essentially breezing through Insanity as an Infiltrator.  Being able to one shot a double defense enemy in the head is somehow fine, but being able to pull someone with a shield is overpowered.

Charge is effective because of how poor the enemy AI is, combined with the laughably short cooldown. In the time it takes to recharge a Charge, most enemies won't even get you to half health unless you are literally in the middle of four or five of them. If not, keep on trucking. Charge is literally the only reason I survived the Collector ship.

Eh, so basically the Vanguard is probably the most struggling class until rank 4 in their class specific ability.  I can see how bouncing around would keep you alive, but it doesn't seem like it would do anything more than you being mobile "CC" while your team actually does the damage.  Charge in itself seems ok, but the implementation is poor because you really don't have a whole lot of viable options for damage once you're where you want to be.  Shotguns are very very mediocre in this game, and you don't need to charge into someone to use a submachine gun or sniper rifle.

Charge puts you in shotgun range, which is quite the boon. Charge works best with squad help, yes, but it isn't necessary to use them.

I know that it puts you into shotgun range, and as I said, shotguns are pretty mediocre in this game and completely unnecessary.  Maybe fully upgraded and at level 25 they have a use, but what are you supposed to do up until that point?

Modifié par Graunt, 03 février 2010 - 12:33 .

[MGIII]

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

I feel that Bioware has done a lot to balance the game, bridging the obvious gaps between classes so that there is no "right" way to play ME2. However, although opinion will inevitably come into any discussion about how to play the game, I'm hoping opinion will be much less prevalent when discussing the roles and abilities each class offers the player to combat the enemies in this game.

On Insanity difficulty, of course. Everything else doesn't require much more than paying attention to the game.

I myself have only played completely through the game as a Vanguard, and have adapted Charge into a sort of God mode. It just takes a bit of strategy and knowledge of enemy placements. There are preliminary claims that Infiltrators are the class to be, as are Sentinels. The prevailing opinion is that Vanguards and Adepts are trash, but I think that's more of a knee-jerk reaction to biotcs' nerfing than any true analysis of the characters.

What I want to stress, however, this not about which class is more fun or whether one is better than another. I want to avoid all that. What I want to achieve is a consensus on the peak ability each class has to offer in ME2's metagame.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I would be greatly amused to hear how you played your Vanguard on Insanity and it felt like god mode for you.  I am currently on my nth death in the Archangel scenario (the hardest fight in this sequence...) and I don't have rank 4 charge yet because of my level.  I'm sure things improve a little, but with how quickly I go down even when charging to an enemy with half life, I just don't see it.  And usually I'll do this when my shields are depleted.

Anyway, right now I'm essentially breezing through Insanity as an Infiltrator.  Being able to one shot a double defense enemy in the head is somehow fine, but being able to pull someone with a shield is overpowered.

Charge is effective because of how poor the enemy AI is, combined with the laughably short cooldown. In the time it takes to recharge a Charge, most enemies won't even get you to half health unless you are literally in the middle of four or five of them. If not, keep on trucking. Charge is literally the only reason I survived the Collector ship.

Eh, so basically the Vanguard is probably the most struggling class until rank 4 in their class specific ability.  I can see how bouncing around would keep you alive, but it doesn't seem like it would do anything more than you being mobile "CC" while your team actually does the damage.  Charge in itself seems ok, but the implementation is poor because you really don't have a whole lot of viable options for damage once you're where you want to be.  Shotguns are very very mediocre in this game, and you don't need to charge into someone to use a submachine gun or sniper rifle.

Charge puts you in shotgun range, which is quite the boon. Charge works best with squad help, yes, but it isn't necessary to use them.

I know that it puts you into shotgun range, and as I said, shotguns are pretty mediocre in this game and completely unnecessary.  Maybe fully upgraded and at level 25 they have a use, but what are you supposed to do up until that point?

I'd say I was level 18 around the time I used it and Charge extensively on the Collector's ship, so it was quite the blessing for me. Its damage is nothing to laugh at. It two shots weaker enemies at a range of about seven feet or less.

[AlphaJarmel]

http://social.biowar.../index/895465/1

^There is some weapon stats to put into perspective which is better for which class and position.

Modifié par AlphaJarmel, 05 février 2010 - 10:55 .

[sinosleep]

Shotguns are fine, I 2 shot fully armored enemies with the claymore shotgun just fine and dandy.