532 réponses à ce sujet

[Mr.Skar]

sinosleep wrote...

I LOVE the shotgun and have yet to run out of ammo for it with my vanguard as evidenced in my videos. Hell, in my latest video Jacob dies almost immediately so I don't even have half my squad to help me, used the shotty to kill everything in site other than whittiling down ONE shield with the pistol and still didn't run out of ammo for my shotgun. Even with the most basic shotgun in the game I can two shot fully armored/shielded enemies and with good use of squadmate abilites, charge, and the pistol for any ranged shots I always seem to have plenty of ammo for it.

See I like the extra option of the AR. The shotgun can put the hurt on, but the way the current Vanguard is (no biotic skills aside from Charge and bonus Reave that I like) the extra gun felt necessary. Nice range, good damage and accuracy made it hard to pass up when the opportunity came.

[AlphaJarmel]

I'm already aware the quality sucks.

Modifié par AlphaJarmel, 05 février 2010 - 08:46 .

[Graunt]

sinosleep wrote...

Is this better?

Much, MUCH less pausing, whole lot more charging.

Yes, that's actually a lot more exicting to watch than your first video, but it still shows how fragile a Vanguard is except under "optimal" conditions i.e. you keep charging solitary enemies, and even if you're caught in the crossfire have a place to duck before the final shot that would kill you hits.  Still though, thanks for uploading that.

And I stand corrected on the claim that you ever said you 1-2 shot anything.  Speed reading too quickly over things ftl.

You're level 30?  That's not a whole lot faster than what I did at level 4.  Sadly I don't have a webcam to record it or I would.  I need to get a stopwatch or something and get the exact time because I know yours is slightly faster but hardly much at all.  I basically just headshot everything I could and the slowest parts were the turrets and the heavy mech.  Do the enemies scale with level in this, or are they static?

Modifié par Graunt, 05 février 2010 - 09:27 .

[AlphaJarmel]

Yea Insanity + is pretty brutal. Everything scales so it's that much harder. You also lack all of your weapon upgrades and defensive upgrades as well.  However they factor in if you have the upgrades so you're at a severe disadvantage. So it's much harder to just speed past everything.

Modifié par AlphaJarmel, 05 février 2010 - 09:33 .

[vhatever]

Haha. I see hofflamer is in here with his normal braggadocio. I finished normal mode with my soldier on a speed run without losing any crew members or sheppard dieing in the suicide mission: 7 hours 22 minutes.

If you think an iniltrator can come anywhere close to that time, just try it.

Infiltrator is arguably just as good as a soldier for the second half of the game, but the first half the soldier is better if you know what you are doing.

Modifié par vhatever, 05 février 2010 - 09:41 .

[Graunt]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

Yea Insanity + is pretty brutal. Everything scales so it's that much harder. You also lack all of your weapon upgrades and defensive upgrades as well.  However they factor in if you have the upgrades so you're at a severe disadvantage. So it's much harder to just speed past everything.

Oh, I didn't realize there was actually a higher difficutly than Insanity.  I thought you simply played Insanity with an imported ME2 character that you initially beat the game with.  Where exactly is the plus option, because I never got it when I beat the game.  Do you have to beat it on Insanity first before you get Insanity+?  If all you mean is just playing on Insanity with a higher level character then ok, that also might be why I wasn't seeing any drastic speed differences if they scale with level.

Haha. I see hofflamer is in here with his normal braggadocio. I
finished normal mode with my soldier on a speed run without losing any
crew members or sheppard dieing in the suicide mission: 7 hours 22
minutes.

If you think an iniltrator can come anywhere close to that time, just try it.

Infiltrator
is arguably just as good as a soldier for the second half of the game,
but the first half the soldier is better if you know what you are doing.

I don't remember him arguing that the Solider was inferior at all, in fact, he's been saying pretty much the whole time that both the Infiltrator AND Solider are the top two Insanity classes.  It's pretty obvious why the Solider would be so strong anyway.

Modifié par Graunt, 05 février 2010 - 09:47 .

[vhatever]

Yes.. you have to beat the game because you are importing an ME2 character. Only way to import an ME2 character is to beat the game with them. NG+.



Incredibly difficult mode for the more squishy classes.

[AlphaJarmel]

Graunt wrote...

AlphaJarmel wrote...

Yea Insanity + is pretty brutal. Everything scales so it's that much harder. You also lack all of your weapon upgrades and defensive upgrades as well.  However they factor in if you have the upgrades so you're at a severe disadvantage. So it's much harder to just speed past everything.

Oh, I didn't realize there was actually a higher difficutly than Insanity.  I thought you simply played Insanity with an imported ME2 character that you initially beat the game with.  Where exactly is the plus option, because I never got it when I beat the game.  Do you have to beat it on Insanity first before you get Insanity+?

Haha. I see hofflamer is in here with his normal braggadocio. I
finished normal mode with my soldier on a speed run without losing any
crew members or sheppard dieing in the suicide mission: 7 hours 22
minutes.

If you think an iniltrator can come anywhere close to that time, just try it.

Infiltrator
is arguably just as good as a soldier for the second half of the game,
but the first half the soldier is better if you know what you are doing.

I don't remember him arguing that the Solider was inferior at all, in fact, he's been saying pretty much the whole time that both the Infiltrator AND Solider are the top two Insanity classes.  It's pretty obvious why the Solider would be so strong anyway.

Insanity + is the imported ME2 character option.  It uses the New Game + feature, that's why it's called Insanity +.  If you notice Insanity scales based on your level so it scales up to level 30.  That's why it's much easier to beat the game on Insanity using a fresh new character than an imported ME2 character.

[vhatever]

Graunt wrote...

I don't remember him arguing that the Solider was inferior at all, in fact, he's been saying pretty much the whole time that both the Infiltrator AND Solider are the top two Insanity classes.  It's pretty obvious why the Solider would be so strong anyway.

Oh, no?

Hoffburger wrote...

Infiltrators are by far the most optimal for speed runs and easy runs (provided you have aim and can headshot). Snipers completely destroy everything even on Insanity because of all the damage stacking. Basically here's how it goes as an Infiltrator:

[Graunt]

vhatever wrote...

Yes.. you have to beat the game because you are importing an ME2 character. Only way to import an ME2 character is to beat the game with them. NG+.

Incredibly difficult mode for the more squishy classes.

I see, so starting on Insanity with a level 1 isn't the same as importing a high level character and the game won't treat you as though you should have all fhe weapon and armor upgrades?  I already knew you could import ME2 characters and play the later difficulties, but I always start out at level 1 when I bump up the difficulty.  Definitely going to just play Insanity with an imported character that I leveled up through Insanity to see how much harder it is.

Oh, no?

How does your quote outline a Soldier being weaker? So he's biased towards the Infiltrator, but he also says plenty about the Soldier.

Modifié par Graunt, 05 février 2010 - 09:55 .

[vhatever]

Graunt wrote...


How does your quote outline a Soldier being weaker? So he's biased towards the Infiltrator, but he also says plenty about the Soldier.

Do you want that with a formal proof and accompanying flow chart? how about you just read the quote instead.

[MANoob]

Hoffburger wrote...
You start off by maxing out Incineration because the starter weapons run out of ammo too quickly and are fairly weak without all the upgrades. You then go for maxed out Tungsten ammo. Once you get that get 2 ranks of Infiltrator and then get Assassin Cloak. You should still be using Incinerate over cloak (other than running away to find better cover). By the time you get the Widow you will have maxed out Assassin Cloak and be close to maxing out Assassin or already have it. Once you get the Widow you start using cloak + widow on bigger targets like blue sun legionnaires, harbingers, scions, etc. Keep using the heavy pistol or just Incinerate on normal targets. Nothing is more satisfying than being able to 2 shot scions and 1 shot harbingers.

So basically you play like an extremely squishy sentinel or a droneless engineer for the first half of the game. In other words, you suck.

And 1shoting harbinger from widow on insanity is BS. It takes 3 shots, 3+ for scions and no, i don't suck at aiming and I headshot with infiltrator 95% of the time.

Modifié par MANoob, 05 février 2010 - 10:03 .

[AlphaJarmel]

I can two shot Harbinger with the Widow on Insanity. One to take out the Barrier and one for the armor. If I try to oneshot him, I can take him down to half armor or lower. So yes depending on the scenario, I can see a person doing a oneshot on Harbinger.

[Graunt]

vhatever wrote...

Graunt wrote...


How does your quote outline a Soldier being weaker? So he's biased towards the Infiltrator, but he also says plenty about the Soldier.

Do you want that with a formal proof and accompanying flow chart? how about you just read the quote instead.

What is your malfunction anyway?  I read the damn quote and it still doesn't say anything about Soldiers being weaker (I'm sorry, much weaker since your logic is that if he thinks the Infiltrator is the cat's meow, nothing else comes close period), he's just emphasizing how strong the Infiltrator is.  I'm sorry if nowhere in this thread did he highlight anything about the Soldier for you, obviously that means he didn't say anything about them anywhere ever and must think they suck right?

So basically you play like an extremely squishy sentinel or a droneless
engineer for the first half of the game. In other words, you suck.

And
1shoting harbinger from widow on insanity is BS. It takes 3 shots, 3+
for scions and no, i don't suck at aiming and I headshot with
infiltrator 95% of the time.

I started over and found that missing a few from cloak and operative in the earlier levels is offset by the fact that Incinerate gives you an ammoless option that also does quite a number to armor.  I don't think it's necessarily faster but it does require less scavanger hunting in the middle of drawn out fights.

Modifié par Graunt, 05 février 2010 - 10:16 .

[vhatever]

He didn't need to even mention soldier specifically. You really can't be this stupid, can you? Are you a hoffbot?

[Graunt]

vhatever wrote...

He didn't need to even mention soldier specifically. You really can't be this stupid, can you? Are you a hoffbot?

You assume too much and your ignorance is part of the problem.  He's brought up the Soldier plenty of times and I can't help it that you didn't see it so you insist on sticking your fingers in your ears and covering your eyes.

Infiltrators are by far the most optimal for speed runs and I believe nothing else comes close in comparison.  The gap is so far in fact that there may as well not even be any other classes in the game for doing this.  That's definitely what I believe, and I dare anyone to argue that point.

Is that really what you see?  By the way, he said "snipers".  That should clue you in.

Modifié par Graunt, 05 février 2010 - 10:23 .

[MANoob]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

I can two shot Harbinger with the Widow on Insanity. One to take out the Barrier and one for the armor. If I try to oneshot him, I can take him down to half armor or lower. So yes depending on the scenario, I can see a person doing a oneshot on Harbinger.

Thats probably with some fire support from NPCs or pehaps ypu are using a personal ammo version rather than squad version. In case of squad AP ammo it clearly takes 3 shots. And how can you 'try to oneshot' someone? You either can oneshot someone with all damage bonuses or no. Ofc you can oneshot anyone if he has 10% health.

Graunt wrote...
I started over and found that missing a few from cloak and operative in the earlier levels is offset by the fact that Incinerate gives you an ammoless option that also does quite a number to armor.  I don't think it's necessarily faster but it does require less scavanger hunting in the middle of drawn out fights.

I really don't argue abot this choice, I just say that in this case both sentinel and engineer will be better for the entire first half of the game at least.

Modifié par MANoob, 05 février 2010 - 10:26 .

[vhatever]

The statement "Infiltrators are by far the most optimal for speed runs and easy runs " leaves little to be assumed.



Good god damn. I can't believe I've wasted several posts on this completely freaking obvious statement that was made. You are either really dumb, a troll, or a hoffbot.

[Graunt]

vhatever wrote...

The statement "Infiltrators are by far the most optimal for speed runs and easy runs " leaves little to be assumed.

Good god damn. I can't believe I've wasted several posts on this completely freaking obvious statement that was made. You are either really dumb, a troll, or a hoffbot.

You're so obtuse it's unbelieveable.  It's like you came to this thread right after your fresh high from beating the game with a Soldier just to rub it into someone's face that you thought said something they never did and made a jackass out of yourself.  It's going to be funny when he actually replies to your idiocy directly.

Hell, right on the very first page of the biotics megathread he briefly nods to the Soldier and it's only one of many through that and other threads.  

Hoffburger wrote...

I have yet to die as an adept on hardcore, it's just stupid to have to use warp 20 times or have to empty half of my ammo to bring down their armor and shields before I can do anything with my biotics. I tried an infiltrator and headshots with the sniper rifle, disruptor ammo, and incenerate just completely dominate anything an adept has because it simply 1 shots them once they get into health. I'm sure soldier is the same way.

Oh wait, what's that on page two?

Hoffburger wrote...

There are NO enemies without shields and armor on the non-easy mode
difficulties. Shockwave is terrible, singularity is terrible, warp is
the only thing worth using, and if you think the game is easy mode as
an adept then you haven't played a soldier or an infiltrator. 1 shot
headshots and both classes can slow down time....right.......

Hoffburger wrote...

I have also played an infiltrator and yes, you can 1 shot normal
enemies with a headshot. It takes 2-3 warps as a biotic to accomplish
the same feat. No, ammo isn't hard to come by, especially if you have
good aim. Tactical cloak means you don't need barrier or fortify so you
can use an offensive bonus. Soldier and infiltrator are far and away
the most optimal classes for hardcore/insane, but that really isn't the
overall point.

etc etc, but yeah man, you're totally right.

Modifié par Graunt, 05 février 2010 - 11:35 .

[AlphaJarmel]

MANoob wrote...

AlphaJarmel wrote...

I can two shot Harbinger with the Widow on Insanity. One to take out the Barrier and one for the armor. If I try to oneshot him, I can take him down to half armor or lower. So yes depending on the scenario, I can see a person doing a oneshot on Harbinger.

Thats probably with some fire support from NPCs or pehaps ypu are using a personal ammo version rather than squad version. In case of squad AP ammo it clearly takes 3 shots. And how can you 'try to oneshot' someone? You either can oneshot someone with all damage bonuses or no. Ofc you can oneshot anyone if he has 10% health.

I just checked it takes three shots with the Infiltrator due to Barrier.  However once Barrier is gone or there is 1/4 of it left then it's a one shot deal.  It's probably doable with two shots if you have warp ammo but yes it's not a one-shot deal. A Soldier could definitely do it in two shots though with Warp ammo and then squad AP ammo.

Modifié par AlphaJarmel, 05 février 2010 - 10:56 .

[vhatever]

I think the closest thing to a "one shot" on the insanity habringer is if you first soften him with a warp/reave.



Hofflamer tends to make all sorts of sweeping claims that never have any factual basis.



I don't think he's ever even played on insanity, actually, though likes to pretend he has.

[MGIII]

These petty arguments would be extinguished if we had some hard numbers on enemy HP totals.



Do they reveal them in any of the PC files?

[Skemte]

Graunt wrote...

MGIII wrote...

I feel that Bioware has done a lot to balance the game, bridging the obvious gaps between classes so that there is no "right" way to play ME2. However, although opinion will inevitably come into any discussion about how to play the game, I'm hoping opinion will be much less prevalent when discussing the roles and abilities each class offers the player to combat the enemies in this game.

On Insanity difficulty, of course. Everything else doesn't require much more than paying attention to the game.

I myself have only played completely through the game as a Vanguard, and have adapted Charge into a sort of God mode. It just takes a bit of strategy and knowledge of enemy placements. There are preliminary claims that Infiltrators are the class to be, as are Sentinels. The prevailing opinion is that Vanguards and Adepts are trash, but I think that's more of a knee-jerk reaction to biotcs' nerfing than any true analysis of the characters.

What I want to stress, however, this not about which class is more fun or whether one is better than another. I want to avoid all that. What I want to achieve is a consensus on the peak ability each class has to offer in ME2's metagame.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I would be greatly amused to hear how you played your Vanguard on Insanity and it felt like god mode for you.  I am currently (currently stopped with the Vanguard that is) on my nth death in the Archangel scenario (the hardest fight in this sequence...) and I don't have rank 4 charge yet because of my level.  I'm sure things improve a little, but with how quickly I go down even when charging to an enemy with half life, I just don't see it.  And usually I'll do this when my shields are depleted.

Anyway, right now I'm essentially breezing through Insanity as an Infiltrator.  Being able to one shot a double defense enemy in the head is somehow fine, but being able to pull someone with a shield is overpowered.

  Why would you use charge during that scenerio anyways?

[Mr.Skar]

Man all this talk of the Infiltrator makes me want to finish my optimal FemShep ME1 run fast so I can play one. Clearly the new changes in gameplay focus have brought only good things for Soldier and Infiltrator. Soldier on Vet is a cake walk, can't wait to take him through Insanity.



No takers on my Soldier question? Still curious on how the different evolved Adrenaline Rush versions work. Making everything seem to hold still seems neat, 'cause I'm not that great a shot, but resisting pain while in this mode seems handy as well.

[MGIII]

Mr.Skar wrote...

Man all this talk of the Infiltrator makes me want to finish my optimal FemShep ME1 run fast so I can play one. Clearly the new changes in gameplay focus have brought only good things for Soldier and Infiltrator. Soldier on Vet is a cake walk, can't wait to take him through Insanity.

No takers on my Soldier question? Still curious on how the different evolved Adrenaline Rush versions work. Making everything seem to hold still seems neat, 'cause I'm not that great a shot, but resisting pain while in this mode seems handy as well.

It's really only there to be a fallback if your either a) screw up, or want to play ME2 gung-ho. Effective use of cover is still by far and away the best mitigation of damage, and everything else just makes it easier to not suck.

You should be killing everything before they get near you.