532 réponses à ce sujet

[MANoob]

Graunt wrote...
The majority of the enemies in the game with only one protection will die to a headshot with just the base rifle and a cloak.  And that's at the lower levels without any upgrades. 

In early-mid game any 'above average' enemy like centurion takes at least 2.

Once you have fully upgraded weapons and are beyond the starter garbage
rifle, you can one shot anything besides a scion, harbinger and
pratorean without using cloak. 

Only trash mobs. Not geth hunters etc.

With how often you have to crouch in
the heavy firefights, you aren't missing out on too many shots over
time having to wait for the cloak cooldown. 

Well, that depends, In mid range fights (so that enemies are in explosion radius) sentinel doesn't have to crouch much, especially with 6 seconds cd on tech armor. Soldier with hardened rush can stay out of cover much longer than infiltrator too.

And targeting
time is a non issue at rank 4 Operative.  You wouldn't just pop it
randomly and hope you have something to hit anyway.

Thats in case if your victim doesnt take cover the moment you target it, and it happens quite often

[sinosleep]

Well, good to see that no one responded to my post about all the wasted damage with sniper rifles. Or what the difference is between me one shotting every standard mob in the game with the claymore and you one shotting every standard mob with the widow. Or how if anything is really all that big and bad I could and more than likely would just whip out a heavy weapon like the particle canon and roast it in no time flat any way. I mean come on, here at level 11 with the katana shotgun every swears sucks I 3 shot a harbringer.

www.youtube.com/watch

Not only that, but I take down his whole worthless crew without using a single squad power (with which I would have coasted though even quicker) in all of about 60 seconds. Yeah, vanguards are so slow.

Modifié par sinosleep, 06 février 2010 - 11:52 .

[MANoob]

sinosleep wrote...

Well, good to see that no one responded to my post about all the wasted damage with sniper rifles. Or what the difference is between me one shotting every standard mob in the game with the claymore and you one shotting every standard mob with the widdow. Or how if anything is really all that big and bad I could and more than likely would just whip out a heavy weapon like the particle canon and roast it in no time flat any way. I mean come on, here at level 11 with the katana shotgun every swears sucks I 3 shot a harbringer.

www.youtube.com/watch

Not only that, but I take down his whole worthless crew without using a single squad power (with which I would have coasted though even quicker) in all of about 60 seconds. Yeah, vanguards are so slow.

Well played!

Been messing with the vanguard myself, and altough I'm not very good with it yet, I think that he can finish many fights faster than any other class. Its still pretty risky, so probably it will take more reloads than if you turtle with some defensive class, but its much more fun too.

[Hoffburger]

The Viper fires less than 2 rounds per second, not 4. Use refire rate, not RoF because the RoF values are wrong for the Widow for sure.



@sino, I have yet to see a video of you showing the difficulty before starting a mission, you always show it mid mission, which means nothing because changing it mid mission doesn't do anything. You take waaaay too little damage and do way too much damage with that shotgun for it to be Insanity. This leads me to believe that you aren't playing on Insanity or have modified your armor/weapons (I seem to recall you talking in the shotgun mod thread, I could be wrong).



Also I have 1 shot harbingers on Insanity using Warp Ammo, full upgrades, all of the weapon damage armor, and Miranda's bonus. Sometimes they have a sliver of life left, but I have 1 shot them. This could mean that sniper rifles don't actually do that same damage at all distances, someone on my squad plinked him without me noticing (would have to be Miranda because I would notice Garrus hitting him with a sniper rifle), or something else.

[sinosleep]

LOL, that's ****ing hilarious. When all else fails, accuse THE ONE PERSON providing video evidence of cheating. You guys are priceless. My game is 100% vanilla, no mods, no cheats being as I DETEST cheating and don't care or much modding. Just check out any of my posts in the vanguard specific threads and you'll see I think all of the weapons are just fine on insanity.

God, If I waste my damned time make a video of running through the entirety of the mission you guys will find some kind of way to try and invalidate it. Why do I even ****ing bother? 

p.s. As for one shotting harbringers, one it seems the rest of the tthread disagrees with you that it can even be done, and if it could, were you doing it at level 11? Cause I just 3 shotted a harbringer and provided video evidence of it at level 11 with the lowest teir shotgun.

Modifié par sinosleep, 07 février 2010 - 12:17 .

[Ingahootz]

sinosleep wrote...

LOL, that's ****ing hilarious. When all else fails, accuse THE ONE PERSON providing video evidence of cheating. You guys are priceless. My game is 100% vanilla, no mods, no cheats being as I DETEST cheating and don't care or much modding. Just check out any of my posts in the vanguard specific threads and you'll see I think all of the weapons are just fine on insanity.

God, If I waste my damned time make a video of running through the entirety of the mission you guys will find some kind of way to try and invalidate it. Why do I even ****ing bother? 

You play Vanguard pretty well. That's the next class I want to try. I just want to mention something though, I didn't see you 3 shot a Harbinger with a shotgun. I saw you 3 shot him when he had no barrier up. That doesn't mean that the shotgun isn't doing great damage, but I think it would have taken you 4 shots to kill him if he had barrier up.

[Hoffburger]

sinosleep wrote...

LOL, that's ****ing hilarious. When all else fails, accuse THE ONE PERSON providing video evidence of cheating. You guys are priceless. My game is 100% vanilla, no mods, no cheats being as I DETEST cheating and don't care or much modding. Just check out any of my posts in the vanguard specific threads and you'll see I think all of the weapons are just fine on insanity.

God, If I waste my damned time make a video of running through the entirety of the mission you guys will find some kind of way to try and invalidate it. Why do I even ****ing bother? 

Just sayin, when I take bursts of fire like you do with my Vanguard, he dies a helluva lot quicker.  I also don't do nearly as much damage and I aim for the head.

[sinosleep]

Ingahootz wrote...

sinosleep wrote...

LOL, that's ****ing hilarious. When all else fails, accuse THE ONE PERSON providing video evidence of cheating. You guys are priceless. My game is 100% vanilla, no mods, no cheats being as I DETEST cheating and don't care or much modding. Just check out any of my posts in the vanguard specific threads and you'll see I think all of the weapons are just fine on insanity.

God, If I waste my damned time make a video of running through the entirety of the mission you guys will find some kind of way to try and invalidate it. Why do I even ****ing bother? 

You play Vanguard pretty well. That's the next class I want to try. I just want to mention something though, I didn't see you 3 shot a Harbinger with a shotgun. I saw you 3 shot him when he had no barrier up. That doesn't mean that the shotgun isn't doing great damage, but I think it would have taken you 4 shots to kill him if he had barrier up.

Look at the video again, the last shot I took he had a SLIVER of health. I took him down from full barrier to a sliver in 3 shots. I guess technically I 4 shotted him, but I could have very easily just meleed the last of his life away.

[MANoob]

Hoffburger wrote...
Just sayin, when I take bursts of fire like you do with my Vanguard, he dies a helluva lot quicker.  I also don't do nearly as much damage and I aim for the head.

And I can't one shot Harbinger on insanity . Maybe you can provide a video to prove that ?

[MGIII]

Hoffburger wrote...

The Viper fires less than 2 rounds per second, not 4. Use refire rate, not RoF because the RoF values are wrong for the Widow for sure.

@sino, I have yet to see a video of you showing the difficulty before starting a mission, you always show it mid mission, which means nothing because changing it mid mission doesn't do anything. You take waaaay too little damage and do way too much damage with that shotgun for it to be Insanity. This leads me to believe that you aren't playing on Insanity or have modified your armor/weapons (I seem to recall you talking in the shotgun mod thread, I could be wrong).

Also I have 1 shot harbingers on Insanity using Warp Ammo, full upgrades, all of the weapon damage armor, and Miranda's bonus. Sometimes they have a sliver of life left, but I have 1 shot them. This could mean that sniper rifles don't actually do that same damage at all distances, someone on my squad plinked him without me noticing (would have to be Miranda because I would notice Garrus hitting him with a sniper rifle), or something else.

I can believe four rounds per second. It shoots about as fast as you can pull the R-trigger/fire button.

[Ingahootz]

Hoffburger wrote...

sinosleep wrote...

LOL, that's ****ing hilarious. When all else fails, accuse THE ONE PERSON providing video evidence of cheating. You guys are priceless. My game is 100% vanilla, no mods, no cheats being as I DETEST cheating and don't care or much modding. Just check out any of my posts in the vanguard specific threads and you'll see I think all of the weapons are just fine on insanity.

God, If I waste my damned time make a video of running through the entirety of the mission you guys will find some kind of way to try and invalidate it. Why do I even ****ing bother? 

Just sayin, when I take bursts of fire like you do with my Vanguard, he dies a helluva lot quicker.  I also don't do nearly as much damage and I aim for the head.

His damage out put seems fine to me. He's taking normal damage from what I can tell too. It's mostly charge that's stopping him from dying. He also took cover quite a bit in that video.

[Ingahootz]

MGIII wrote...

Hoffburger wrote...

The Viper fires less than 2 rounds per second, not 4. Use refire rate, not RoF because the RoF values are wrong for the Widow for sure.

@sino, I have yet to see a video of you showing the difficulty before starting a mission, you always show it mid mission, which means nothing because changing it mid mission doesn't do anything. You take waaaay too little damage and do way too much damage with that shotgun for it to be Insanity. This leads me to believe that you aren't playing on Insanity or have modified your armor/weapons (I seem to recall you talking in the shotgun mod thread, I could be wrong).

Also I have 1 shot harbingers on Insanity using Warp Ammo, full upgrades, all of the weapon damage armor, and Miranda's bonus. Sometimes they have a sliver of life left, but I have 1 shot them. This could mean that sniper rifles don't actually do that same damage at all distances, someone on my squad plinked him without me noticing (would have to be Miranda because I would notice Garrus hitting him with a sniper rifle), or something else.

I can believe four rounds per second. It shoots about as fast as you can pull the R-trigger/fire button.

There's no way it shoots that fast. I can mash the shoot button pretty fast and it's not firing every time I hit it. I think he's hit the nail on the head as far as its fire rate goes (believe he checked the ini file to see its RoF as well).

[Hoffburger]

MANoob wrote...

Hoffburger wrote...
Just sayin, when I take bursts of fire like you do with my Vanguard, he dies a helluva lot quicker.  I also don't do nearly as much damage and I aim for the head.

And I can't one shot Harbinger on insanity . Maybe you can provide a video to prove that ?

It will be a while because I just started NG+ with my Infiltrator so I'd have to start a new one since the enemies are harder on NG+.


Also, I could be wrong about the Vanguard as I've only played mine up until you get Garrus and Mordin so all of the upgrades might make a big difference. All I know is that on my Soldier the Assault Shotgun didn't do that much damage and on my Vanguard I take way more damage.

[Graunt]

sinosleep wrote...

Well, good to see that no one responded to my post about all the wasted damage with sniper rifles. Or what the difference is between me one shotting every standard mob in the game with the claymore and you one shotting every standard mob with the widow. Or how if anything is really all that big and bad I could and more than likely would just whip out a heavy weapon like the particle canon and roast it in no time flat any way. I mean come on, here at level 11 with the katana shotgun every swears sucks I 3 shot a harbringer.

www.youtube.com/watch

Not only that, but I take down his whole worthless crew without using a single squad power (with which I would have coasted though even quicker) in all of about 60 seconds. Yeah, vanguards are so slow.

Because you don't one shot rocket launching enemies that are on an unreachable wall with the Claymore, and you can with any rifle.  You keep trying to make people believe that somehow the "anything you can do I can do better" doesn't apply to the Vanguard and it really does.  And yeah, the video displays how you are supposed to play a Vanguard and like always, the downside of repeatedly almost dying.  Don't get me wrong, it's definitely intense to charge around and almost die, but not and kill crap, but the critical mission failure screen happens way too much with this class.  High reload vs reward, hmm.

Also, I could be wrong about the Vanguard as I've only played mine up
until you get Garrus and Mordin so all of the upgrades might make a big
difference. All I know is that on my Soldier the Assault Shotgun didn't
do that much damage and on my Vanguard I take way more damage.

I don't have the Claymore yet and it takes 2-3 head shots on an unprotected enemy to kill them with a shotgun, so I normally just use the damn SMG because it stunlocks them in between punches.  With protection the non "elite" weapons don't do jack with this class up close.

Oh, btw I just reread your post.  There's no way in hell you're using the katana at level 11 and doing that much damage, there's absolutely no way.  I just watched it again two times and you can't knock a barrier down to 1/2 with just a charge.  Something fishy is going on.

Modifié par Graunt, 07 février 2010 - 12:42 .

[sinosleep]

Except you just saw it. It's why I do the character screen before or after missions. The mission with the blue sons is level 9 katana, the mission with the collecters and harbringer is lvl 11 with the katana. Believe what ever the hell you want, I am the ONLY ONE providing video evidence. I've put up with all of you people's BS requests but I should have just listened to my own advice in another thread where I said I could post a video of me killing 50 guys in 2 minutes and you guys would figure out a way to invalidate it.

First people said there wasn't enough ammo, and yet I never ran out. Then I paused to much so I stopped. Then I used my squad's abilities (even though that's the obvious intent of a SQUAD BASED GAME) so I stopped using them as well. They cried about my using the pistol so I stopped and I use the crappiest shotgun in the game when everyone says shotguns suck. 

So now that I've defeated every dumb obstacle thrown my way, the last resort is to get accused of cheating. All of you can post videos or shut the hell up. Seriously. Post a video, or SHUT THE HELL UP cause you have no say. I've put up with all your garbage demands and shown that vanguards can do well and now all you can do is accuse me of cheating cause you suck at the game.

Modifié par sinosleep, 07 février 2010 - 12:46 .

[MGIII]

Graunt wrote...

Because you don't one shot rocket launching enemies that are on an unreachable wall with the Claymore, and you can with any rifle.  You keep trying to make people believe that somehow the "anything you can do I can do better" doesn't apply to the Vanguard and it really does.  And yeah, the video displays how you are supposed to play a Vanguard and like always, the downside of repeatedly almost dying.  Don't get me wrong, it's definitely intense to charge around and almost die, but not and kill crap, but the critical mission failure screen happens way too much with this class.  High reload vs reward, hmm.

Optimality =/= easier. Optimality assumes the class is being played at peak capacity. Sure, some classes will take more skill to use than others, but that's outside the discussion of cold hard facts when it comes to otpimality.

[MANoob]

Graunt wrote...

"anything you can do I can do better"

And what is this godlike class that can do everything better than anyone {smilie}? This discussion was entirely about speed. Let's speak aboutt survivability (especially now that you've mentioned it).



Infiltrator is definetely not the best class in this aspect, just because if you're flanked and your cloack recharges you're dead. If you're blown out of cover you're dead as well, because you can't take a lot of damage.



P.S. Just finished engineer playthrough with a royal total of 9 reloads per entire game (I counted). I'm sure you won't believe it though.

[Graunt]

MANoob wrote...

Graunt wrote...
"anything you can do I can do better"

And what is this godlike class that can do everything better than anyone {smilie}? This discussion was entirely about speed. Let's speak aboutt survivability (especially now that you've mentioned it).

Infiltrator is definetely not the best class in this aspect, just because if you're flanked and your cloack recharges you're dead. If you're blown out of cover you're dead as well, because you can't take a lot of damage.

P.S. Just finished engineer playthrough with a royal total of 9 reloads per entire game (I counted). I'm sure you won't believe it though.

Why wouldn't I believe it?  You can beat the game without using class specific abilties, that's not what's being discussed.  Now go play a Vanguard and you'll see exactly what I mean.  It would be funny if he could show a video of his entire playthrough, because what you're not seeing is all the times he did die.

Modifié par Graunt, 07 février 2010 - 12:55 .

[MGIII]

MANoob wrote...

Graunt wrote...
"anything you can do I can do better"

And what is this godlike class that can do everything better than anyone {smilie}? This discussion was entirely about speed. Let's speak aboutt survivability (especially now that you've mentioned it).

Infiltrator is definetely not the best class in this aspect, just because if you're flanked and your cloack recharges you're dead. If you're blown out of cover you're dead as well, because you can't take a lot of damage.

P.S. Just finished engineer playthrough with a royal total of 9 reloads per entire game (I counted). I'm sure you won't believe it though.

That..doesn't really matter though. Dying is more about not making mistakes, and having patience, than anything else. classes have little to do with it. They can make it easier to survive, yes, but the best defensive capability is something all classes have access to, which is cover.

[vhatever]

Hoffburger wrote...

The Viper fires less than 2 rounds per second, not 4. Use refire rate, not RoF because the RoF values are wrong for the Widow for sure.
.

Viper fires 4 shots a second. Go test it. A clip will take you 3 seconds to unload. Oh, wait, I forgot, you've got/hofflamer mode turned on, so  you get to make stuff up and pretend it's true.

[MGIII]

Graunt wrote...

MANoob wrote...

Graunt wrote...
"anything you can do I can do better"

And what is this godlike class that can do everything better than anyone {smilie}? This discussion was entirely about speed. Let's speak aboutt survivability (especially now that you've mentioned it).

Infiltrator is definetely not the best class in this aspect, just because if you're flanked and your cloack recharges you're dead. If you're blown out of cover you're dead as well, because you can't take a lot of damage.

P.S. Just finished engineer playthrough with a royal total of 9 reloads per entire game (I counted). I'm sure you won't believe it though.

Why wouldn't I believe it?  You can beat the game without using class specific abilties, that's not what's being discussed.  Now go play a Vanguard and you'll see exactly what I mean.  It would be funny if he could show a video of his entire playthrough, because what you're not seeing is all the times he did die.

Playing a Rushdown Vanguard does come with a higher propensity of dying, but that issue can be easily mitigated by attack the right targets in the right order. You should take out Heavy weapon carriers first. Then anything else that can stun you. Then, after that, Charge at your leisure.

[vhatever]

You'll get killed more with a vanguard on one of the toughe r missions playing like that due to the "can't get a lock" thing than my soldier would through an entire plauthrough.

[MANoob]

Graunt wrote...
You can beat the game without using class specific abilties, that's not what's being discussed. 

In fact, I used combat drone extensively, because it pwns.

Now go play a Vanguard and you'll see exactly what I mean.  It would be
funny if he could show a video of his entire playthrough, because what
you're not seeing is all the times he did die.

Starded it allready. Was pretty tedious at the beginning, I almost gave up cause I played like a crappy soldier or sentinel. But it gets better later on (although I'm using barrier as my bonus power and I get squad ammo on one of the NPCs). Charge recharges your barrier, so the trick is to survive its cd somehow. With full barrier/charge and cd upgrades it may be very doable.

MGIII wrote...
 Dying is more about not making mistakes, and
having patience, than anything else. classes have little to do with it.
They can make it easier to survive, yes, but the best defensive
capability is something all classes have access to, which is cover.

In fact there are several scenarios in which cover doesn't help (and these are the only ones when I die). And your ability to survive these is highly dependant on your class.

Modifié par MANoob, 07 février 2010 - 01:07 .

[vhatever]

You'd be better off with the geth shield. You ican ncrease its bonus by 50%.

[MANoob]

vhatever wrote...

You'd be better off with the geth shield. You ican ncrease its bonus by 50%.

Geth shield is tech, and i don't have the money to buy both biotic and tech upgrades yet. Will swap it later.

Modifié par MANoob, 07 février 2010 - 01:10 .