2439 réponses à ce sujet

[Derumiel]

didiware wrote...

I think it's very likely Liara will be a squadmate in ME3. In a way it's a good thing she's not one in ME2. That way she couldn't die on the Collector ship and is the only member from ME1 that can't die beacuse of various choices done by Shepard.
Quite smart move. I wouldn't be surprised if she ends up in the squad.

Ok, the good point is that Liara could'nt die during ME2. And I think that highly improves her "chances" to reappear in our squads in ME3. I truly hope so......

[Pineappletree]

Derumiel wrote...

Ok, the good point is that Liara
could'nt die during ME2. And I think that highly improves her "chances"
to reappear in our squads in ME3. I truly hope so......

Regarding this I'd like to quote Casey Hudson (Project Director for ME2, in case you didn't know the name):

People are worried that the love interest from the first game is not
recruitable as a squad member in the second game. I think people put too
much emphasis on whether importance to the story is equated to whether
they are a squad member. In Mass Effect 2,
it really is about preparing for a suicide mission. It's true that
people on your squad are most likely going to die in this final mission.
It's not all that hard to make your character survive, but you can die
as a permanent death at the end. I think people will have trouble
keeping everybody alive. That's a lot trickier.

Because we wanted to make sure the love interest can remain an important
and integral part of the story, we want that to continue into the third
game. We have some really important things we want to resolve there.
That means we can't have these characters that were your love interests
in this suicide mission potentially getting killed and then blocking off
that opportunity. They're part of the story. They're part of the
ongoing love story but they're not your squad members so that we can be
sure that we can bring that love story to its conclusion.

and

In Mass Effect, as a female Commander Shepard you could have a
romance with the female-looking yet asexual asari, Liara. That love
story will continue into Mass Effect 2 (and Mass Effect 3)
if you had started it in the first game, though things will be a bit
rocky between you this time around because you’ve been away for two
years.  You’ll be able to conclude that story with Liara in Mass
Effect 3, though keep in mind that your romances in Mass Effect 3
will have an impact on how that plays out.

Sources:
http://uk.xbox360.ig.../1055366p1.html
http://www.destructo...ns-163035.phtml

Modifié par FdL_Ananas, 15 février 2010 - 06:19 .

[Nozybidaj]

FdL_Ananas wrote...

Derumiel wrote...

Ok, the good point is that Liara
could'nt die during ME2. And I think that highly improves her "chances"
to reappear in our squads in ME3. I truly hope so......

Regarding this I'd like to quote Casey Hudson (Project Director for ME2, in case you didn't know the name):

People are worried that the love interest from the first game is not
recruitable as a squad member in the second game. I think people put too
much emphasis on whether importance to the story is equated to whether
they are a squad member. In Mass Effect 2,
it really is about preparing for a suicide mission. It's true that
people on your squad are most likely going to die in this final mission.
It's not all that hard to make your character survive, but you can die
as a permanent death at the end. I think people will have trouble
keeping everybody alive. That's a lot trickier.

Because we wanted to make sure the love interest can remain an important
and integral part of the story, we want that to continue into the third
game. We have some really important things we want to resolve there.
That means we can't have these characters that were your love interests
in this suicide mission potentially getting killed and then blocking off
that opportunity. They're part of the story. They're part of the
ongoing love story but they're not your squad members so that we can be
sure that we can bring that love story to its conclusion.

and

In Mass Effect, as a female Commander Shepard you could have a
romance with the female-looking yet asexual asari, Liara. That love
story will continue into Mass Effect 2 (and Mass Effect 3)
if you had started it in the first game, though things will be a bit
rocky between you this time around because you’ve been away for two
years.  You’ll be able to conclude that story with Liara in Mass
Effect 3, though keep in mind that your romances in Mass Effect 3
will have an impact on how that plays out.

Sources:
http://uk.xbox360.ig.../1055366p1.html
http://www.destructo...ns-163035.phtml

You realize almost all of that is double talk, half truths, and outright false?

[Mox Ruuga]

Because we wanted to make sure the love interest can remain an important
and integral part of the story, we want that to continue into the third
game. We have some really important things we want to resolve there.
That means we can't have these characters that were your love interests
in this suicide mission potentially getting killed and then blocking off
that opportunity. They're part of the story. They're part of the
ongoing love story but they're not your squad members so that we can be
sure that we can bring that love story to its conclusion.

LOL! Yeah, right... "ongoing love story" indeed. Did anyone spot an ongoing Shepard/Liara love story in ME2?

I hope somebody remembers to bring up this quote to the devs when Garrus and Tali are revealed as squaddies in ME3.

[Shadowcat101]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

Shadowcat, great artwork. You wouldn't happen to have a DeviantArt account by any chance, would you?

yes i do.

http://shadowcat1001.deviantart.com/

[Mighty_BOB_cnc]

Supposedly, there was a dev post here on the forums sometime this week that confirmed Liara as a squaddie in ME3... supposedly.

[WilliamShatner]

Asari are anything but asexual.  Does he even know what that word means?

[Driveninhifi]

It's pretty obvious that Liara will be a squadmate in ME3 and there will be a huge romantic reunion between her and Shepard. Honestly, there really isn't anywhere else to take the relationship.

There's a TON of potential for her character. There was a ton of potential for compelling conversation in ME2 that they elected not to pursue, which is disappointing. They could be saving it for DLC, I dunno.



I really think they needed an editor or someone more objective to look at their handling of the ME1 LIs and say "Hey, this doesn't really work - we either need to develop this better or not include it." It's really, really tough to be objective when you are in the middle of a long project. It's very clear they didn't have that and the game suffered because of it. They really wanted a fight or troubled piece to the relationship, but that's not what they implemented. It's barely passable for Ash/Kaidan, but the handling of Liara feels extremely unnatural.

I mean, having your love interest admit they've put themselves through hell primarily out of guilt and grief for you - and not being able to comfort them or reaffirm your feelings is incredibly artificial. That's perhaps the MOST natural thing to say/do in that situation and for the writers to remove that dialogue option is an extremely poor decision. It makes the exchange unbelievable and frustrating.

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

Im probably one of the most vocal critics of her role in ME2 Driven, yet I agree, and clearly so do many others. Some actual worthwhile responses would have gone a long way towards making the appearance bearable at least. I get it that Bioware chickened out and left her dialogue as only ambiguous, and can be taken as spoken by your Shepards romance partner, or simply by someone who admitted an interest in your Shepard. But Shepards response? Easily one of the most flat, pathetic and outright stupid responses in the entire game if you had Shepard romance her.

Yes, thats right Liara, my Shepard really gives a **** about his mission when youve just poured your heart out telling him how you put yourself through hell, and beat yourself up after emerging alive, and all for him. He totally wouldnt want to comfort you in a more personal and meaningful way. Bioware really do sometimes write Shepard as a total ****** and then force it on the player. Its a shame to see they couldnt completely avoid that in ME2.

That scene was just begging for a paragon interrupt to hug her, but no, they had to reserve that for Tali.

Modifié par Dinkamus_Littlelog, 15 février 2010 - 09:22 .

[KumoriOokami]

WilliamShatner wrote...

Asari are anything but asexual.  Does he even know what that word means?

I think he was trying to say that they aren't female not that they were asexual.  ../../../images/forum/emoticons/wondering.png
Yeah I really don't know what he was trying to say with that comment... o_O  I mean it's pretty obvious from the night before Ilos scene that Asari aren't 'traps' or something like that... ^^....  (Though it would be funny to me if they were lol)

And obviously that wouldn't be -asexual- anyway... >_<  but  of course any of this is trying to make sense of comments that don't make any sense. 

[Nozybidaj]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

Im probably one of the most vocal critics of her role in ME2 Driven, yet I agree, and clearly so do many others. Some actual worthwhile responses would have gone a long way towards making the appearance bearable at least. I get it that Bioware chickened out and left her dialogue as only ambiguous, and can be taken as spoken by your Shepards romance partner, or simply by someone who admitted an interest in your Shepard. But Shepards response? Easily one of the most flat, pathetic and outright stupid responses in the entire game if you had Shepard romance her.

Yes, thats right Liara, my Shepard really gives a **** about his mission when youve just poured your heart out telling him how you put yourself through hell, and beat yourself up after emerging alive, and all for him. He totally wouldnt want to comfort you in a more personal and meaningful way. Bioware really do sometimes write Shepard as a total ****** and then force it on the player. Its a shame to see they couldnt completely avoid that in ME2.

That scene was just begging for a paragon interrupt to hug her, but no, they had to reserve that for Tali.

I've taken to just letting Tali cry, no hug.  Its more interesting that way.

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

Nozybidaj wrote...

I've taken to just letting Tali cry, no hug.  Its more interesting that way.

I have to have Shepard hug her at that point. Liz Srokas performance is just too damn good and convincing not to. And besides, I like Tali, in both ME1 and ME2 (though I slightly prefer ME1, since she actually talked to my Shepard, not just demanded a romance or shell ignore my Shepard). Tali is sweet and very likeable, and its a shame many of her fans dont follow her example. (Yeah, that last part is a semi-joke, since there is some truth to it)

Modifié par Dinkamus_Littlelog, 15 février 2010 - 09:27 .

[KumoriOokami]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

I've taken to just letting Tali cry, no hug.  Its more interesting that way.

I have to have Shepard hug her at that point. Liz Srokas performance is just too damn good and convincing not to. And besides, I like Tali, in both ME1 and ME2 (though I slightly prefer ME1, since she actually talked to my Shepard, not just demanded a romance or shell ignore my Shepard). Tali is sweet and very likeable, and its a shame many of her fans dont follow her example. (Yeah, that last part is a semi-joke, since there is some truth to it)

I also can't help but /comfort/ poor Tali there ^^... Luckily(or maybe unluckily?) I usually play as femShep so Tali is willing to act more like her normal self around my toon. ^^;

[Mox Ruuga]

WilliamShatner wrote...

Asari are anything but asexual.  Does he even know what that word means?

Nope. The Codex explicitly states that "Asari are not asexual". The guy doesn't know the lore of his own game...

[Driveninhifi]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

Im probably one of the most vocal critics of her role in ME2 Driven, yet I agree, and clearly so do many others. Some actual worthwhile responses would have gone a long way towards making the appearance bearable at least. I get it that Bioware chickened out and left her dialogue as only ambiguous, and can be taken as spoken by your Shepards romance partner, or simply by someone who admitted an interest in your Shepard. But Shepards response? Easily one of the most flat, pathetic and outright stupid responses in the entire game if you had Shepard romance her.

Yes, thats right Liara, my Shepard really gives a **** about his mission when youve just poured your heart out telling him how you put yourself through hell, and beat yourself up after emerging alive, and all for him. He totally wouldnt want to comfort you in a more personal and meaningful way. Bioware really do sometimes write Shepard as a total ****** and then force it on the player. Its a shame to see they couldnt completely avoid that in ME2.

That scene was just begging for a paragon interrupt to hug her, but no, they had to reserve that for Tali.

Yes, I think that it is the absolute low point of the game if Liara was the love interest. There are two many missing pieces (which is why I think they needed an editor or overseer).
I think they needed 3 things to really make the conversation believable:
A line of dialogue where she shows some vulnerability to Shepard and admits she's had a very hard time and hates what's she had to do and become. (This would go a long way to show the player this really is the same character they are interacting with.)
The option for Shepard to comfort her and reaffirm his/her feelings (obvious).
More explanation about what happened - perhaps a line indicating that she feels Feron sacrificed himself not just for her, but for Shepard as well (and also their relationship), and that she could not forgive herself if she abandoned her pursuit and denied that sacrifice. (This would make her rationale for staying seem more believable; plus, it now makes the player part of the pursuit, instead of it just being about her. I really don't believe Liara would be able to deny Shepard if he/she said "I love you and I need you to come with me now," but if the player believes Feron sacrificed himself for their own personal Shepard, they now have a vested interest in seeing justice done.)

[Mighty_BOB_cnc]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

I've taken to just letting Tali cry, no hug.  Its more interesting that way.

I have to have Shepard hug her at that point. Liz Srokas performance is just too damn good and convincing not to. And besides, I like Tali, in both ME1 and ME2 (though I slightly prefer ME1, since she actually talked to my Shepard, not just demanded a romance or shell ignore my Shepard). Tali is sweet and very likeable, and its a shame many of her fans dont follow her example. (Yeah, that last part is a semi-joke, since there is some truth to it)

Yesterday I made a quicksave point right before walking into that scene just to let her cry it out and see how the dialog was different.  It was really interesting to hear her frustrations with her father.  For example, he wouldn't bother to take the sick-leave days and spend an afternoon with Tali in an open-air room ever when she was growing up.  He was always too busy and stuff. 

But then I reloaded from the quicksave and I always do the interrupt hug.  (I'm glad they added hugs!  ME1 had moments where hugs were needed!)

Too bad they didn't give Liara an interrupt hug, although if only one of them were to get the interrupt, then I think Tali deserves it because it was a terrible discovery for her and she was absolutely breaking down.  (Ideally they'd both get one.)

[Fiannawolf]

Hmm, what should I do? Leave the Love achievement in the dust til number 3? Its not like its hard to get You know...I might just do that! Just to make a point about my various Sheps. I have no clue when Ill be able to import my solo shep. Shes still in 1.

[zarr25]

Driveninhifi wrote...

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

Im probably one of the most vocal critics of her role in ME2 Driven, yet I agree, and clearly so do many others. Some actual worthwhile responses would have gone a long way towards making the appearance bearable at least. I get it that Bioware chickened out and left her dialogue as only ambiguous, and can be taken as spoken by your Shepards romance partner, or simply by someone who admitted an interest in your Shepard. But Shepards response? Easily one of the most flat, pathetic and outright stupid responses in the entire game if you had Shepard romance her.

Yes, thats right Liara, my Shepard really gives a **** about his mission when youve just poured your heart out telling him how you put yourself through hell, and beat yourself up after emerging alive, and all for him. He totally wouldnt want to comfort you in a more personal and meaningful way. Bioware really do sometimes write Shepard as a total ****** and then force it on the player. Its a shame to see they couldnt completely avoid that in ME2.

That scene was just begging for a paragon interrupt to hug her, but no, they had to reserve that for Tali.

Yes, I think that it is the absolute low point of the game if Liara was the love interest. There are two many missing pieces (which is why I think they needed an editor or overseer).
I think they needed 3 things to really make the conversation believable:
A line of dialogue where she shows some vulnerability to Shepard and admits she's had a very hard time and hates what's she had to do and become. (This would go a long way to show the player this really is the same character they are interacting with.)
The option for Shepard to comfort her and reaffirm his/her feelings (obvious).
More explanation about what happened - perhaps a line indicating that she feels Feron sacrificed himself not just for her, but for Shepard as well (and also their relationship), and that she could not forgive herself if she abandoned her pursuit and denied that sacrifice. (This would make her rationale for staying seem more believable; plus, it now makes the player part of the pursuit, instead of it just being about her. I really don't believe Liara would be able to deny Shepard if he/she said "I love you and I need you to come with me now," but if the player believes Feron sacrificed himself for their own personal Shepard, they now have a vested interest in seeing justice done.)

yeah... what those guys said. it seems like that wouldnt have been a very hard thing to add either.

[speedy111280]

Fiannawolf wrote...

Hmm, what should I do? Leave the Love achievement in the dust til number 3? Its not like its hard to get You know...I might just do that! Just to make a point about my various Sheps. I have no clue when Ill be able to import my solo shep. Shes still in 1.

I got it by importing my only Shep from ME1 that didn't romance Liara and proceeded to have him cheat on Ashley, because I only romanced her to see the scene.  All my femSheps romanced Liara ( I deleted the only one that romanced Kaidan) and are staying 100% faithful to her, they don't even flirt with Kelly, just randomly stare longingly at Liara's photo.

[Nastrod]

Nozybidaj wrote...

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

Im probably one of the most vocal critics of her role in ME2 Driven, yet I agree, and clearly so do many others. Some actual worthwhile responses would have gone a long way towards making the appearance bearable at least. I get it that Bioware chickened out and left her dialogue as only ambiguous, and can be taken as spoken by your Shepards romance partner, or simply by someone who admitted an interest in your Shepard. But Shepards response? Easily one of the most flat, pathetic and outright stupid responses in the entire game if you had Shepard romance her.

Yes, thats right Liara, my Shepard really gives a **** about his mission when youve just poured your heart out telling him how you put yourself through hell, and beat yourself up after emerging alive, and all for him. He totally wouldnt want to comfort you in a more personal and meaningful way. Bioware really do sometimes write Shepard as a total ****** and then force it on the player. Its a shame to see they couldnt completely avoid that in ME2.

That scene was just begging for a paragon interrupt to hug her, but no, they had to reserve that for Tali.

I've taken to just letting Tali cry, no hug.  Its more interesting that way.

Even if you do not want to have Tali as a LI you can still be a good friend and hug her. The girl just saw her dead father no reason to leave her hanging.

[Mighty_BOB_cnc]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

Liara had it worse in ME1, she had to suffer the trauma of watching Benezia struggle against indoctrination, then slowly die in front of her. If there were interrupts in back in ME1, that would've been another perfect time to hug Liara and console her.

Oh no doubt, if there had been one in that scene then I would have used it without fail.