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[Sable Rhapsody]

Hopping in from the Garrus thread here. What do y'all think of Thane's moral code? And how does it affect his relationships with your Shepards?

I'm curious because for my FemShep, the drastic differences in their approaches toward morality were part of what kept me from considering him as a romance. In fact, they clashed so badly on that front that it kept them from even being friends. My Shep's a Paragade and a lot like Mordin--calculating and utilitarian. She thinks constantly about the consequences of her actions and strives for the greatest gain at the least cost; it makes her a fantastic Spectre but a problematic soldier.  Thane's delineation between the actions of the body and the state of the individual's soul really bothered her.

It's funny because I thought they were going to get along swimmingly at first, but they really just did not gel.  If a civilian stepped between HER and a high-priority target, and she thought killing the target would save more lives, she would've shot and deemed Irikah "acceptable casualties."   End of the day, Shep ended up thinking Thane was morally irresponsible, and he ended up thinking she was a cold-hearted b****.  Which is mostly true 

Modifié par Sable Rhapsody, 16 novembre 2010 - 10:57 .

[ravenimage]

My Shep was a pretty cold-hearted b**** -- on the battlefield at least. She cared deeply for her crew and knew it would satisfy the mission in the long run to have them all stabilized and focused, thus she went out of her way for their emotional well-being. She even mothered Grunt, a little. The only person she truly butted heads with was Zaeed, and it was brief.

Returning to your inquiry, my Shep understood Thane's need to separate body and soul. There was a discussion in this thread similar to your question, and what I think we decided was that the hanar trained Thane from a young age to be a weapon -- a killer -- and to protect him, they taught him to separate the body from the soul, to believe he was not the one killing all those people -- they were. The hanar. They regretted their need to do it, but they require the drell to fulfill combatant roles in their society.

My Shep is a killer. She knows it, everyone who knows her by reputation and capability knows it. She can say she kills for the greater good, to save the galaxy, to protect the helpless, but at the end of the day she's killed someone, and so has Thane. She isn't going to judge him. He was raised to fight and so was she. That's part of why they get along so well. They both do what they gotta do and their masters at it. It happens to be killing people.

Oh, and Thane probably could have eliminated his target with or without the interference of Irikah. He was just so taken aback by her bravery. It was one of those "love at first sight" things I guess. His purpose faltered, so his mission waned in light of a new fascination: the woman who had the gall to block his shot.

Modifié par ravenimage, 16 novembre 2010 - 11:27 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

ravenimage wrote...

Returning to your inquiry, my Shep understood Thane's need to separate body and soul. There was a discussion in this thread similar to your question, and what I think we decided was that the hanar trained Thane from a young age to be a weapon -- a killer -- and to protect him, they taught him to separate the body from the soul, to believe he was not the one killing all those people -- they were. 

Ahh, there's the catch.  OK--think I've just figured out why they don't get along as well as I'd hoped.  My FemShep's Earthborn.  Ran with gangs, probably killed people in self-defense as a kid, but without the luxury of separating the body from the soul.  She has a very different attitude toward killing--it's something that she's good at, something that she does quite frequently, but there has to be a reason for it, one that she can accept and claim as her own to justify all the death on her hands.  Protecting others, self-defense, preventing horrible things from happening, even sacrificing people for the greater good are valid reasons.  Revenge, anger, personal gain, and just following orders are unacceptable reasons for her.

Modifié par Sable Rhapsody, 16 novembre 2010 - 11:54 .

[kaimanaMM]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Revenge, anger, personal gain, and just following orders are unacceptable reasons for her.

Thane has killed once out of anger and revenge.  He holds himself personally responsible for killing the Batarians that killed his wife.  He never once tries to exonerate himself of that action based upon his philosophy that his body is a weapon.

Thane has never killed for personal gain.  (That we currently know of.)

Thane does, however, follow orders given to him by the Hanar government.  But, Shepard is in a very similar position. The Alliance orders Shepard to lock down a camp of biotic extremists by whatever means necessary, the Council orders Shepard to apprehend or eliminate Saren by whatever means necessary.  Neither Shepard nor Thane are senseless killers, but they are both killers.

My own Shepards are mostly the Earthborn background.  I said earlier, most of my own Shepard's share Thane's philosophy.  Shepard is a highly trained weapon in body and mind, trained by the Alliance.  My Shepards accept that their training, instinct and knowledge are a part of who they are, but it is not all they are.  As it is with Thane. Ultimately, his morality is a very alien thing.  Can it be seen as convenient?  Surely.  But Thane himself says that drell minds are different than human.  

As with Thane's memories.  Thane's ability to recall any moment in his life with perfect clarity can be seen as a detriment (Oh, he'll compare Shepard to Irikah.  Oh, he'll lapse into a perfect wife memory when talking to Shepard.)  Thing is, memories, after a while, have no emotion attached to them.  And Thane even recites, not so much as speaks, a monologue describing the events he's seeing.

For me and my Shepard(s), Thane fits them so well it's almost uncanny.

[ravenimage]

 

kaimanaMM wrote...My own Shepards are mostly the Earthborn background.  I said earlier, most of my own Shepard's share Thane's philosophy.  Shepard is a highly trained weapon in body and mind, trained by the Alliance.  My Shepards accept that their training, instinct and knowledge are a part of who they are, but it is not all they are.  As it is with Thane. Ultimately, his morality is a very alien thing.  Can it be seen as convenient?  Surely.  But Thane himself says that drell minds are different than human.  

Yup. Got to understand only humans think like humans, drell think another way. What humanity considers taboo or dishonorable is not always so to other species.

And not all Sheps are going to go hand-in-hand with Thane, hence multiple choice romances. From your Shep's personality, Sable Rhapsody, I think she and Garrus are an understandably good match. ;>

But if you need help falling in love with Thane, watch this: 

It oozes sex.

Modifié par ravenimage, 17 novembre 2010 - 01:33 .

[ravenimage]

I don't even know who Katy Perry is but I ended up downloading that song. XD

[Sable Rhapsody]

ravenimage wrote...
Yup. Got to understand only humans think like humans, drell think another way. What humanity considers taboo or dishonorable is not always so to other species.

And not all Sheps are going to go hand-in-hand with Thane, hence multiple choice romances. From your Shep's personality, Sable Rhapsody, I think she and Garrus are an understandably good match. ;>

But if you need help falling in love with Thane, watch this: 

It oozes sex.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I the player really like Thane.  It's just that your characters can surprise you.  You'd think you'd know what your own characters get up to, but my Shep startled me, especially upon the most recent replay when I was roleplaying every decision.  She and Miranda got along much much better than they did the first time, and she and Thane got along worse.  Which really surprised me, since in combat approach, she and Thane are so incredibly similar.

I need to make a Shep for him, but my second Renegon FemShep would eat any of the Lis for breakfast.  Drat. 

[ravenimage]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Oh, don't get me wrong, I the player really like Thane.  It's just that your characters can surprise you.  You'd think you'd know what your own characters get up to, but my Shep startled me, especially upon the most recent replay when I was roleplaying every decision.  She and Miranda got along much much better than they did the first time, and she and Thane got along worse.  Which really surprised me, since in combat approach, she and Thane are so incredibly similar.

I need to make a Shep for him, but my second Renegon FemShep would eat any of the Lis for breakfast.  Drat.

Hell yes. Funny enough (role) playing a spacer over a colonist like I normally do pushed my Shep even closer to Thane. Even if the dialogue and the decisions are essentially the same, it just seemed to all fit in better than before. As for the rest of the Normandy crew, I'm the kind of player who has to make friends with all of them -- even the ones who don't seem long-term to my Shep. I can't imagine my Shep and Miranda as BFFs in spite of them both being very similar and having mutual respect for each other. I can, however, see my Shep and Kasumi staying on close terms, even if they're polar opposites.

Modifié par ravenimage, 17 novembre 2010 - 02:01 .

[ravenimage]

Oh, and while we've steered the conversation in a "musical" direction, even though it's an unoriginal question, what song do you guys think represent Thane well?



And you can't pick E.T. by Katy Perry. Too easy.



For Thane / Shep: "My Skin" by Natalie Merchant.





For Thane / Kolyat: "Leave Out All the Rest" by Linkin Park

[Tentura]

ravenimage wrote...
...watch this: 

It oozes sex.

Wow.  How have I never seen this before.  So hawt.    What a perfect song choice.  Now there is no way I can come up with another song... at least not right now.  *goes off to purchase this song*

[JECWSU]

Tentura wrote...

ravenimage wrote...
...watch this: 

It oozes sex.

Wow.  How have I never seen this before.  So hawt.    What a perfect song choice.  Now there is no way I can come up with another song... at least not right now.  *goes off to purchase this song*

I don't think I could come up with another song either. That song fits Thane so well.

[Tasha vas Nar Rayya]

I'm not very into non-metal music. If it doesn't have an electric guitar then I haven't heard it So I dunno about songs that would represent Thane. Good to see you here sable rhapsody! I'm another Garrus regular who goes on this thread as well!

[Sable Rhapsody]

Tasha vas Nar Rayya wrote...

I'm not very into non-metal music. If it doesn't have an electric guitar then I haven't heard it So I dunno about songs that would represent Thane. Good to see you here sable rhapsody! I'm another Garrus regular who goes on this thread as well!

Thanks 

Is it bad that as soon as you said "electric guitar," I thought of Thane's dramatic entrance as shown at E3 before the game's release, with "Bad To the Bone" playing in the background?

...god I need sleep.

[Tasha vas Nar Rayya]

Tom Waits isn't it? Hehe, Thane doesn't strike me as a cowboy? Another question about Thane - can he swim? I've heard that the drell prefer dry conditions to make the chances better of them not getting Keprel's syndrome, but drell just look very fish-like... Not in a nasty way. They are a bit like green zora without the fins... (Big Zelda fan here

[JECWSU]

I don't know if Thane can swim. Maybe.

I also always thought he looked more reptilian.

[ravenimage]

BioWare's art concepts of Thane were between "reptile" and "tropical fish" I think. Rakhana was a desert planet, but it had oceans and presumably other bodies of water else what would the drell have drank?

I think Thane can swim. I don't think it's good for his health, mind you. The hanar are good swimmers -- I don't think they would train a master assassin just so he can be stopped by getting pushed into a pool.

EDIT: I know it's been said and joked about, but... Thane in Shep's quarters? ;>
http://movies.arjane...ube-hellboy.jpg

Modifié par ravenimage, 17 novembre 2010 - 07:05 .

[NeitiCora]

Damn I'm happy I'm not the only one buttdeep addicted to ET, especially coupled with that video. XD I'm so addicted that I drew this Shep/Thane pic and listed the song as the inspiration, and... Whaddaya know, like a day later the creator of that vid found me in dA and told me that a new version of Futuristic Lover is in the makes because they think there were flaws in the vid.

While I wholeheartedly endorse this, I'm afraid for my life. I might just... overheat and die.



Meanwhile, this is definitely one of the top songs on my Thane playlist. Shep/Thane, obviously:



I, too, think Thane swims just fine. He does say his training with the hanar was very thorough - I would assume that means preparing for every and all situation out there. That, and I would imagine a fair deal of his work happened on Kahje, too, even if he had to travel a lot.

[General Ashous]

I prefer Thane. Thane speaks and has such a great personality.