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#76
caynes

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Ziekk wrote...

caynes wrote...

well when u ask why he took so long to patch up his hole, instead of lying he says no data, if that doesnt scream cant lie i dunno what does


I think that it was a...sentimentality that Legion does not understand he acted on, and therefore has no logical data as to his reasons for using his armor. People will say that I'm attributing human emotions on Geth, but it's quite obvious that they are much more than they seem.


that makes sense, think i get it your saying is that he himself cant understand why he did what he did right?

#77
77boy84

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caynes wrote...

77boy84 wrote...

caynes wrote...

77boy84 wrote...

Ebosian wrote...
So I start talking to him and he comes off with some "the enemy of my
enemy is my friend" crap.  And says that there is a virus that will
wipe them out.  So I am thinking "good" they deserve it for all they
did with the Quarians and how what they did to Tali's father.  There
was no way in Mass Effect I was going to let him be a teammate,
especially after my BFF just got court marshaled for treason for Geth
parts.  I didnt trust him and think he only wants to be friendly now
just to save the Geth.
 


Tali and the Quarians have it coming.
They tried to play God, and then when they accidentally made something smart, they tried to wipe it out.

Oh, and Tali's father was trying to hack the geth... Again, the quarians try to take down a race who's only crime is existing.

Sorry, Tali, and the rest of the Quarians are not in the right. They are the bad guys when it comes to the Quarian/Geth fiasco.


Tali and her ppl didnt try to play god they didnt set out trying to create life they just wanted the geth to do more complex things, i wouldnt call that playing godPosted Image


The Geth became self-aware. They have sentience, and can think like we do.
They weren't just mindless robots, and the Quarians thought they could completely wipe out all the geth. That is playing God in my eyes.


as a said before they were unaware of that sentience to some extent, they did it to spare the geth from being slaves, not saying the geth were wrong though


The sentience is WHY they wanted to shut them down. They knew the geth where becoming self-aware.

#78
Lucazius

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IMO Legion was the most interesting character in ME2.



Once I learned about the Heretics and how the geth "live", I realized the geth are a perfect democracy. Anyway, the majority of the geth doesn't wish to harm organics, only the heretics decided to join the reapers and they are only 5% of the total geth. Another interesting fact I learned from Legion is that the geth are caretaking the quarian homeworld, I don't know but maybe the geth think someday they'll give that world back to their creators.



I love Tali, and in my dreams I wish to reconciliate the quarians and the geth.




#79
caynes

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77boy84 wrote...

caynes wrote...

77boy84 wrote...

caynes wrote...

77boy84 wrote...

Ebosian wrote...
So I start talking to him and he comes off with some "the enemy of my
enemy is my friend" crap.  And says that there is a virus that will
wipe them out.  So I am thinking "good" they deserve it for all they
did with the Quarians and how what they did to Tali's father.  There
was no way in Mass Effect I was going to let him be a teammate,
especially after my BFF just got court marshaled for treason for Geth
parts.  I didnt trust him and think he only wants to be friendly now
just to save the Geth.
 


Tali and the Quarians have it coming.
They tried to play God, and then when they accidentally made something smart, they tried to wipe it out.

Oh, and Tali's father was trying to hack the geth... Again, the quarians try to take down a race who's only crime is existing.

Sorry, Tali, and the rest of the Quarians are not in the right. They are the bad guys when it comes to the Quarian/Geth fiasco.


Tali and her ppl didnt try to play god they didnt set out trying to create life they just wanted the geth to do more complex things, i wouldnt call that playing godPosted Image


The Geth became self-aware. They have sentience, and can think like we do.
They weren't just mindless robots, and the Quarians thought they could completely wipe out all the geth. That is playing God in my eyes.


as a said before they were unaware of that sentience to some extent, they did it to spare the geth from being slaves, not saying the geth were wrong though


The sentience is WHY they wanted to shut them down. They knew the geth where becoming self-aware.


key word, becoming

#80
caynes

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Lucazius wrote...

IMO Legion was the most interesting character in ME2.

Once I learned about the Heretics and how the geth "live", I realized the geth are a perfect democracy. Anyway, the majority of the geth doesn't wish to harm organics, only the heretics decided to join the reapers and they are only 5% of the total geth. Another interesting fact I learned from Legion is that the geth are caretaking the quarian homeworld, I don't know but maybe the geth think someday they'll give that world back to their creators.

I love Tali, and in my dreams I wish to reconciliate the quarians and the geth.

 i agree its too bad that to two most interesting character in ME2 are bitter enemies, but miranda is my favorite

#81
Herald of Galactus_

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i just finished my first play through today...and if we're going with the themes of making critical decisions and how they effect the future...from an RP perspective, I'd say Legion is the *most* important character in your squad, in terms of story.



In my first play through I recruited all members and achieved their side missions. I didn't really have a preferred order, so I tended to recruit the members in geographical order. I recruited Tali last, did some side missions in geth space, and then went to her trial.



I know that this is the spoiler forum, but some massive spoilers follow so i'll warn you anyway:



1. Talk to the admirals and they reveal the quarian race is contemplating waging full-scalle war with the geth. Some oppose this and others are for it. Tali's father was apparently an advocate for waging war and was developing the weapons.



2. If you go the paragon route and warn the tribunal not to war with the geth, in the Cerberus mission summary it indicates that shep may have saved the quarians from almost certain annihilation by warning against war. Summary goes on to mention that this will in turn allow the quarians to use their unmatched engineering skills to help against the reapers.



I then did the IFF mission, and was surprised to see Legion there. Now, in terms of an RP perspective, even if you were the Devourer of Geth in ME1, it's quite clear Legion is very, very different. He also saved your ass from husks...which further reinforces the newly-revealed confirmation on the derelict reaper that the husks are not geth tech, but rather reaper tech. This is pretty subtle, but it greatly alters the entire backdrop of ME1: in the midst of obliterating all those geth in ME1, they were usually with husks. But now you know that there's obviously a clear distinction between husks and geth. The geth didn't create the husks. Not only did they not create the husks, but there appears to be at least 1 geth that kills husks. which led my character to question why this geth not only has speech but also opposes the husks and apparently the reapers.



And, put in the Normandy's AI section, it was probably the most secure and fast way to render Legion harmless if he were dangerous. So you activate Legion and you learn *a lot* of interesting, important facts, that alters your perception of ME1.



1. Many geth were seduced by Sovereign and those literally branded heretics. Legion even quotes verbatim what Sovereign tells the player in ME1, about how the reapers created the mass relays and the citadel to compel galactic civilizations to develop along paths that the reapers desired. When approached by sovereign, most geth rejected his advances because they deemed it to be illogical to have their decision processes taken from them in terms of having their own path of development. Heretical geth sacrificed this ability to make decisions about their path of development in exchange for adopting sovereign's methods and goals.



2. Even the geth encountered in ME is not the "true form" of geth. The "true geth" are just millions or billions of software platforms that are networked together. They don't have physical bodies. The heretical geth are all software programs downloaded onto "mobile platforms" to do sovereign's bidding. Even Legion (as he reveals in subsequent convos) is the only "mobile platform" of the true geth operating in front of the perseus veil..the rest of the geth still behind the perseus veil.



3. Performing Legion's side quest also throws a new light on ME1. You can effectively decide whether to erase all the geth aiding sovereign (and implicitly, all geth that were of the same type that you encountered in ME1) or reprogram them to join Legion's true geth. In any case, the heretical geth appears to be over. In the cerberus mission summary, if you chose the paragon route of reprogramming rather than outright destruction, the summary will say while the heretical geth are now eliminated, their numbers and resources are now added to the true geth, making the true geth significantly stronger than before. This makes it ambiguous if it's good or bad.



Conclusion: It's clear that based on Tali's sidequest and Legion's sidequest, the decisions you make will somehow determine whether the quarians and the geth wage war, and if they do, which side will win. In my RP my character is trying to rally all the sapient/sentient races of the galaxy against the reapers. My shep saved the council in the interest of preserving strength and stability in the face of the impending crisis. My shep saved the rachni queen in ME1, which yielded a promise from an asari on illium that the rachni were rebuilding and would ally with me against he reapers. Shep preserved the partially-discovered cure for the krogan genophage so that the krogran would have something to unite them and have hope for the future (cerberus summary called the krogan invaluable shock troops against the reapers). And here my Shep advised the quarians not to go to war and my Shep determined that the illogical experiences of the heretical geth would be incorporated into the true geth, mathematically proving that the reapers are a threat to be met.



If you continue talking with Legion, he tries to show access the FTL communications to let Shep hear a recording. EDI lets the communique go through, and she is greatly humbled by the experience of connecting to a hive mind that is so vast it is the size of a galactic arm (in EDI's terms). My shep wanted such a formidable race to oppose the reapers...and not be wasted in what was relatively a minor bloodfued with the quarians.

#82
Feller1219

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Okay so I know this is totally the wrong thread for this but I haven't been able to find a straight answer. Can I do Legion's loyalty quest and save all of my crew. I understand that after you do the IFF that time is essential and I really want to do his quest and make sure that everyone stays alive.

#83
Herald of Galactus_

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Feller1219 wrote...

Okay so I know this is totally the wrong thread for this but I haven't been able to find a straight answer. Can I do Legion's loyalty quest and save all of my crew. I understand that after you do the IFF that time is essential and I really want to do his quest and make sure that everyone stays alive.


Yes. That's actually what I did on my first playthrough. I didn't even realize people on the crew could die until reading it here on the forums.

After you get the IFF watch the discussion between shep, jacob and miranda pertaining to Legion. EDI will tell you that it will take several hours to install the IFF. *Now is the time to do Legion's sidequest*

After the IFF debrief with miranda and jacob, go down to the AI room and talk with Legion. Have him explain all the stuff...then at the end of the convo, talk to him again. He will explain how the geth have a space station with the virus. Go do the sidequest. When you come back, EDI will say installation is complete but needs to be tested. Then go to the galaxy screen, where shep and the entire squad will be prompted to leave in the shuttle so EDI can test the IFF. Then the collectors will attack. After shep comes back, they'll discuss that they shouldn't dilly-dally before saving the crew.

Now, to save the crew you must go immediately to the Omega Relay.

#84
marshalleck

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Herald of Galactus wrote...

I then did the IFF mission, and was surprised to see Legion there. Now, in terms of an RP perspective, even if you were the Devourer of Geth in ME1, it's quite clear Legion is very, very different. He also saved your ass from husks...which further reinforces the newly-revealed confirmation on the derelict reaper that the husks are not geth tech, but rather reaper tech. This is pretty subtle, but it greatly alters the entire backdrop of ME1: in the midst of obliterating all those geth in ME1, they were usually with husks. But now you know that there's obviously a clear distinction between husks and geth. The geth didn't create the husks. Not only did they not create the husks, but there appears to be at least 1 geth that kills husks. which led my character to question why this geth not only has speech but also opposes the husks and apparently the reapers.
 


There has always been evidence that the geth weren't responsible for the technology that creates husks. In ME1 there was a UCW mission where ancient dragon's teeth had been uncovered at an archaeological dig site that was outside geth space and pre-dated all contemporary species. The teeth drove the researchers and scientists mad and eventually converted them.

Modifié par marshalleck, 04 février 2010 - 02:54 .


#85
Lmaoboat

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Wow, some of you people get WAY too into this.

#86
Fishy

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syren1987 wrote...

Ninjawaffle23 wrote...

well if he wanted to harm us he could have done it easily. I'm not sure if an AI like Geth would lie. I assume they would pretty much up front about their plans. I figure if you caught a heretic he would tell you how is going to eradicate his species. Also, if you do his mission he would not let you know about being able to destroy all the geth but the 1,183 true geth


Theres more true geth than that. The 1,183 true geth he speaks of are just the ones within legion, dont think of legion like a person, think of him more like a ship with 1,183 crewmen inside.



MEGA SPOILER






False ...

If you keep speaking with him . He clearly said that that he's an individual and not just a modem connected to a router.That he's actually unique!

If you keep talking to him . He also play  the firs ttime a geth asked a quarian if he have a spirit.It's was rather cute.
That basicly when the Quarian started to freak out.Also if you talk to the quarian .. You found that a lot of them don't hold a grudge against the geth and they completly agree with that they have done.
Like an admiral said - We wanted to kill them , of course they attacked us.


It's was barely 5 % of all the Geth that followed Saran . The other 95 % just want to be left alone and survive (By fighting the quarian  , since the quarian want em dead)


Also with some paragon chat . You basicly tell the quarian that they should stop their stupid war against the geth and help with the Reaper.The geth and quarian share the same homeworld.It's time for them to work together.This war lasted long enough.

The 1123 geth are the heretic  .. The geth that worked with Saren and The reaper.Half of em want to die and the other half want to be reprogrammed.

Modifié par Suprez30, 04 février 2010 - 03:02 .


#87
Herald of Galactus_

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marshalleck wrote...

Herald of Galactus wrote...

I then did the IFF mission, and was surprised to see Legion there. Now, in terms of an RP perspective, even if you were the Devourer of Geth in ME1, it's quite clear Legion is very, very different. He also saved your ass from husks...which further reinforces the newly-revealed confirmation on the derelict reaper that the husks are not geth tech, but rather reaper tech. This is pretty subtle, but it greatly alters the entire backdrop of ME1: in the midst of obliterating all those geth in ME1, they were usually with husks. But now you know that there's obviously a clear distinction between husks and geth. The geth didn't create the husks. Not only did they not create the husks, but there appears to be at least 1 geth that kills husks. which led my character to question why this geth not only has speech but also opposes the husks and apparently the reapers.
 


There has always been evidence that the geth weren't responsible for the technology that creates husks. In ME1 there was a UCW mission where ancient dragon's teeth had been uncovered at an archaeological dig site that was outside geth space and pre-dated all contemporary species. The teeth drove the researchers and scientists mad and eventually converted them.


yeah i remember the mission but if you didn't play that, you go with what the game presented. And it's not fully confirmed until the IFF mission....hints, but not confirmations.

Though I really do like how these little assignments can lend to the story. Did you play the assignment in ME2 where shep finds the prothean beacon and gets the images played?

#88
Feller1219

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Yeah I got that N7 mission done. I think I almost covered every mission and now that I know I can do Legion's loyalty quest safely I think I'm ready to go crawl through a creepy dead Reaper.

#89
Forge101

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Yea don't know why anyone would side with quarians after talking to legion. Like yea its ****s for tali and the quarians but they started the war the geth just defender themselves if the geth were really the attackers they would have destroyed the migrant fleet long time ago. An for mass effect 1 well those geth were completely different than the true geth which legion belongs too and if you do legions loyalty quest and actually listen to him and not try and hate him you will learn that the geth were being extremely mistreated by the quarians. Plus you know the attempted genocide of a geth as a species by the quarians didn't help much either.

#90
Notho

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Um, maybe because those Geth on the lab ship were pissed about being used as guinea pigs? I thought Tali finding her father dead was one of the saddest moments in the game, but he kind of brought it upon himself.



I believe a side or loyalty mission in the next game will be working out peace between the quarians and the geth. The quarians get their homeworld back and you have geth and quarians helping repel the Reapers. Everyone wins.

#91
Tony_Knightcrawler

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Missouri Tigers wrote...

Sorry, but Legion is an awful
character.  He was the final guy I picked up, I thought that I would be
launched straight into Omega 4 after getting the Reaper IFF (I thought
the extra squad slot was for a DLC character in the future) and then
this god damn Geth comes along trying to be nice, the same type of Geth
that condemned the quarians to their current fate.  I did his loyalty
mission and got his upgrade because I still wanted him to live knowing
he's an important character (and I also wanted everybody alive for an
achievement).  So after barely knowing him, I assumed he was pretty
good at Tech so I sent him to be the specialist on the final assault. 
I got everything as quickly as possible and he still died.  I blame him
for everything, because at the end of the level I also found Miranda
and Mordin dead (even though everybody was loyal and I had all
crew/ship upgrades).  Legion should have never been introduced.


This is because of the leaders you chose.

Modifié par Tony_Knightcrawler, 04 février 2010 - 04:57 .


#92
Peer of the Empire

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I ditched him onto Cerberus. Who knows what evil deeds he's committed

#93
Frotality

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well by this logic you should hate garrus becuase turians fought humans and tali becuase veetor tried to kill you. considering that every other race has tried to kill or control the geth, it is much more reasonable for legion to not trust YOU, but he saves your ass and in fact wnats the reapers gone as much as you do. there is a group of asari mercenaries often trying to kill you, but you sont hate all asari becuase of it, its pretty much the same situation with the geth, even though THEY have every reason to think that way.

#94
AK118

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wow people who dont' do legions loyalty misison will miss a lt. and have a huge consequence in ME3

#95
MerrickShep

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Legion is a unique geth platform, able to house 1,183 as opposed to the one hundred in other platforms. So he can speak and operate with organics.



The Geth beyond the Veil are without a doubt hostile and will attack any ship that goes beyond the Veil. they are reclusive and secretive but they do not wish to go to war with anyone their long term goal is to create a Dyson Sphere so that all geth may upload and become united.

#96
Dracotamer

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He's the best party member!

#97
kraidy1117

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GOD DAMMIT!! STOP NACRO!

#98
drunken pyromaniac

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kraidy1117 wrote...

GOD DAMMIT!! STOP NECRO!

Sorry, spelling police leaving now.Posted Image

#99
kraidy1117

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drunken pyromaniac wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

GOD DAMMIT!! STOP NECRO!

Sorry, spelling police leaving now.Posted Image


:mellow:<_< GTFO

#100
drunken pyromaniac

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kraidy1117 wrote...

drunken pyromaniac wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

GOD DAMMIT!! STOP NECRO!

Sorry, spelling police leaving now.Posted Image


:mellow:<_< GTFO

Well, you've mispelled it a lot. *blows kiss and runs away*