339 réponses à ce sujet

[Sassymcgee]

Because advances in technology should be advances, not a weird excuse to go from essentially infinite ammo to shoving ammo into your game. Don't call them heatsinks. It's ammo.

If it was actually a heatsink technology(lol), then you could still use the old tech once you ran out. It would be more interesting if they did it by saying you have a very low number of 'reloads' and you had to decide when it would be most advantageous to use the heatsink, rather than waiting for your over heated weapon. THAT would of been fine, this is just a really bad excuse.

Modifié par Sassymcgee, 04 février 2010 - 06:23 .

[blank1]

If you people using snipers don't like how the starting sniper rifles have so little ammo, just use the sniper rifle you pick up during the Thane mission. No, not as strong per shot as the starting sniper rifle, but if you aim for the head, you end up having way more kills per ammo load. The Widow ought to have that little ammo, too. That thing is a damned heavy weapon, not a fkn sniper. It freakin' one shots Harbinger lolz.

[ReubenLiew]

Thane's mission isn't exactly that close either, so you're stuck with the first rifle for the better part of the game,

And that weapon has slow projectiles O_o

[blank1]

Sassymcgee wrote...

Because advances in technology should be advances, not a weird excuse to go from essentially infinite ammo to shoving ammo into your game. Don't call them heatsinks. It's ammo.

Read your codex on heatsinks and you'll see that thermal magazines are an upgrade the Alliance picked up fighting the Geth heritics. From a tactical perspective, having an immediate way to cooldown your weapon and keep up sustained fire is superior. I think people like you are just mad you can't just stick two frictionless materials in your assault rifle and just hold down the trigger forever now -- because that makes SO much sense.

Modifié par blank1, 04 février 2010 - 06:25 .

[finnithe]

The arguments put forward by the anti-heatsink people are just ridiculous. How can you possibly take issue with the fact that the AI doesn't run out of ammo? You know for a fact that the AI isn't that smart (and likely will never be in a ME game). If your companions ran out of ammo, you would be complaining even more about the ineffectiveness and stupidity of squadmates. Is it really hard to suspend your disbelief just a bit more? It was pretty apparent that combat in ME1 was broken, what with the ability to just sit back and snipe everything. I took out a Colossus, a dozen Armatures and many Geth Primes with my Infiltrator in ME1. Sure you might find this "fun", but it does not make for a good game. Some of you are just complaining that they fixed the system.

[Landline]

I think the perfect system would be a combination of thermal clips and overheating, best of both worlds.



Naturaly thermal clips would be far more efficient then running dry... but you'd never have to worry about not being able to shoot at all.

[KalosCast]

blank1 wrote...

Sassymcgee wrote...

Because advances in technology should be advances, not a weird excuse to go from essentially infinite ammo to shoving ammo into your game. Don't call them heatsinks. It's ammo.

Read your codex on heatsinks and you'll see that thermal magazines are an upgrade the Alliance picked up fighting the Geth heritics. From a tactical perspective, having an immediate way to cooldown your weapon and keep up sustained fire is superior. I think people like you are just mad you can't just stick two frictionless materials in your assault rifle and just hold down the trigger forever now -- because that makes SO much sense.

Actually, it makes a ton of sense. Physics, dawg.

And as has been stated, it's the poor way of implementation, the contradiction of lore, and the fact that the heatsinks don't behave like heatsinks that are the problem. You're retarded.

[blank1]

Landline wrote...

I think the perfect system would be a combination of thermal clips and overheating, best of both worlds.

Naturaly thermal clips would be far more efficient then running dry... but you'd never have to worry about not being able to shoot at all.

The only way this wouldn't be broken is if your cooldown for overheating would be like, 30 seconds.

[blank1]

KalosCast wrote...

blank1 wrote...

Sassymcgee wrote...

Because advances in technology should be advances, not a weird excuse to go from essentially infinite ammo to shoving ammo into your game. Don't call them heatsinks. It's ammo.

Read your codex on heatsinks and you'll see that thermal magazines are an upgrade the Alliance picked up fighting the Geth heritics. From a tactical perspective, having an immediate way to cooldown your weapon and keep up sustained fire is superior. I think people like you are just mad you can't just stick two frictionless materials in your assault rifle and just hold down the trigger forever now -- because that makes SO much sense.

Actually, it makes a ton of sense. Physics, dawg.

And as has been stated, it's the poor way of implementation, the contradiction of lore, and the fact that the heatsinks don't behave like heatsinks that are the problem. You're retarded.

I like how you say "it's physics, dawg" but don't actually know what you're talking about, fcktard. It's impossible to have a frictionless material, period. The implementation is fine -- it unbreaks a system that was retarded and broken. Go play your gay turned based combat RPG where you have to remember to eat and and drink every 5 hours if you think it's so broken -- ME2's gameplay beats the sht out of ME1's.

[ABCoLD]

Direwolf0294 wrote...

Why are people saying it breaks lore? It is explained that they made thermal clips after studying Geth technology. We all no Geth are extremly technologicaly advanced so it would make sence that thermal clips could be made from there technology. Maybe it was Reaper technology and they just say its Geth technology because they don't want to admit that theres Reapers.

What I don't like though is it is implied they got this Technology almost straight away. Shepard says that there is no thermal clip for the pistol he picks up when he wakes up. This means he knows what they are and that means that Thermal clips came around somtime in the month after Sovereign was defeted and the Normandy was destroyed. It would of been cool if Shepard hadn't of know about thermal clips and started asking why the hell the gun wasn't working and Miranda explained it to them.

You find Geth weapons in the first game, they don't use Clips.
The system they were using before was far more advanced than thermal clip technology.
I also hate that Shepard knows about Thermal Clips immediately...

My main problems with the system are based in Lore...
1.  Lack of a unified pool of universal thermal clip ammo.
2.  You're not allowed to 'reload' a partially expended clip by simply not firing the weapon.  Thermal clips never cool down.
3.  When you eject a clip you should lose remaining shots in the clip, other games have implemented this.  Leaving it in means it's an obvious and artificial 'bullet' mechanic.
4.  You're not allowed to use older weapons.  You can't go back to the old equipment you used two years ago and have a sink instead of a clip.

Beyond that:
The equipment system for weapons in this game is just a mess anyway.  This just adds insult to injury.  Also, is anyone else confused by the fact that the normandy can apparently manufacture Thermal Clips, but not heavy wepaon ammo?

[blank1]

Ragabul the Ontarah wrote...

Gameplay wise, it doesn't bother me. In fact, I rather like it.  My complaint is a continuity issue.  Why would guns in ME2 suddenly have become LESS efficient at controlling overheating than they were two years ago?  That makes no sense. 

It doens't have to be a continuity error. People are just used to having frictionless materials x 2 in their weapons so they never overheated. From a tactical perspective, the ability to immediately pop a heatsink and continue suppressive fire is superior to having to wait nearly 10 seconds for your gun to cool off every 40 shots. It also allows more flexibility with weapon design, since now heat isn't the primary limiting factor, which limits your ability to increase the power of weapons -- recoil is the only limiting factor now.

[Esternogligen]

I dont mind reloading, I do mind having tons of "ammo" for my SMG and none for my shotgun when the heat sinks are supposed to be universal.



Plus, if you're out of heat clips, why not just have the guns go back to building up heat and overheating after too many shots like ME1? Isn't that what should happen anyway since that's what the heat sinks are supposed to prevent?

[Darth_Ultima]

I don't mind for the most part but I have a few issues with the heat sinks and that is the amount of times you can fire before reloading. The Avenger has only 30 shoots before it needs a reload? That's no better then present day assault rifles. Why not 40 or 50 shoots. I also wish I could switch the fire modes on all the guns so that the avenger has burst fire and the vindicator has full auto. Sometimes burst fire is nice and sometimes you want to hold the trigger and spray. I also wish that they had a way of switching back to regular ammo so I don't have to look at the hologram still being active during cut scenes. On top of that I wish one of my squadmates could you the Revenant.

[blank1]

ABCoLD wrote...

Direwolf0294 wrote...

Why are people saying it breaks lore? It is explained that they made thermal clips after studying Geth technology. We all no Geth are extremly technologicaly advanced so it would make sence that thermal clips could be made from there technology. Maybe it was Reaper technology and they just say its Geth technology because they don't want to admit that theres Reapers.

What I don't like though is it is implied they got this Technology almost straight away. Shepard says that there is no thermal clip for the pistol he picks up when he wakes up. This means he knows what they are and that means that Thermal clips came around somtime in the month after Sovereign was defeted and the Normandy was destroyed. It would of been cool if Shepard hadn't of know about thermal clips and started asking why the hell the gun wasn't working and Miranda explained it to them.

You find Geth weapons in the first game, they don't use Clips.
The system they were using before was far more advanced than thermal clip technology.
I also hate that Shepard knows about Thermal Clips immediately...

My main problems with the system are based in Lore...
1.  Lack of a unified pool of universal thermal clip ammo.
2.  You're not allowed to 'reload' a partially expended clip by simply not firing the weapon.  Thermal clips never cool down.
3.  When you eject a clip you should lose remaining shots in the clip, other games have implemented this.  Leaving it in means it's an obvious and artificial 'bullet' mechanic.
4.  You're not allowed to use older weapons.  You can't go back to the old equipment you used two years ago and have a sink instead of a clip.

Beyond that:
The equipment system for weapons in this game is just a mess anyway.  This just adds insult to injury.  Also, is anyone else confused by the fact that the normandy can apparently manufacture Thermal Clips, but not heavy wepaon ammo?

This is a tired, old argument. You want hyper realism only in certain areas. Why can Tali die in-game 10 times, but not die of a horrible infection back on the Normandy? How can Shep get shot in the face, shields down, with a rocket and not have his face blown into tiny bits of gore? Why?

Because the game would suck if that were why. Besides, thermal clips aren't really a retcon anyways. More like a note thrown in the justify a switch to an ammo system which works better anyways.

I just think you RPG purists don't know how to aim.

[Zero9999]

Frankly I think its an elegant solution to a needed mechanic that doesn't break the story at all. I love having to switch weapons, makes shoot outs more interesting.

[Sassymcgee]

blank1 wrote...

Sassymcgee wrote...

Because advances in technology should be advances, not a weird excuse to go from essentially infinite ammo to shoving ammo into your game. Don't call them heatsinks. It's ammo.

Read your codex on heatsinks and you'll see that thermal magazines are an upgrade the Alliance picked up fighting the Geth heritics. From a tactical perspective, having an immediate way to cooldown your weapon and keep up sustained fire is superior. I think people like you are just mad you can't just stick two frictionless materials in your assault rifle and just hold down the trigger forever now -- because that makes SO much sense.

I read the codex as soon as I saw the new system.

It's their excuse. If it was implemented as I said I'd understand why. It would still allow ME to have a unique system that demonstrates that it's actually in the future and that something major has changed. If you notice I said 'almost infinite' demonstrating my understanding of the flaw of the first one and its implementation. Tell me which would you rather have. Ammo, because this is what the game acts as. Or infinite ammo, and a system that actually prohibits holding down your mouse compared to HOLD DOWN "R" HOLD DOWN "R" HOLD DOWN "R" SWITCH WEAPONS HOLD DOWN....
Trust me. The way you describe my assumed reasoning for preferring the older system doesn't hold up. I thought the other required much more tactical thought than this current change? Why? Because as it stands ME was the only game with the system, and then ME2 implemented an ammo system and called it heatsink and said it was an advancement in technnology. 

Once again, it WOULD be if several things did not happen.

"You run out of heatsink, you can no longer fire one shot"
"Your gun never cools down, so the heat sinks act as bullets and clips"

It's ammo. It's not tactical, it's god damn in every other game. Even if it was some tactical and strategic system, it's in every other game and unoriginal and tried to act as such with a new name. Come on. I can understand preferring an ammo system, thats not my position. I'm simply stating I liked the old because I felt IT required more thinking and it was actually original and made sense in the universe and its point in time.

[blank1]

edit

Modifié par blank1, 04 février 2010 - 06:40 .

[DamnedEyez]

My biggest issues were the clip scavenging during and after each battle, and that I couldn't fire at a reduced rate without them. I'm fine with the idea of using heat clips to speed up the fire rates, but I should be able to fire the gun a few times without...maybe the assault rifle fires at a single pull rate...the pistol fires at the basic sniper rifle speed, etc. It was just a contrived way of changing the guns to requiring ammo.

[Frotality]

blank1, ignoring your albiet justified rant...

it doesnt 'unbreak' it replaces it with something else that is ironically also broken... how do you go from infinite ammo to drinking water? as with pretty much every problem with ME1, its not the system thats wrong its the implementation, and oddly enough the same can be said of ME2's ammo system; it can work, but giving me 10 sniper rounds for 2/3 of the game doesnt. i WANT the original system fixed....it wsant so bad it needed to be replaced or so unfitting it needed to be imrpoved, a thought Bioware can apply to their design ME3, taking our puppy who chews our shoes and getting a new one that barks all night isnt a good change, its just a change.

[ABCoLD]

blank1 wrote...

I like how you say "it's physics, dawg" but don't actually know what you're talking about, fcktard. It's impossible to have a frictionless material, period. The implementation is fine -- it unbreaks a system that was retarded and broken. Go play your gay turned based combat RPG where you have to remember to eat and and drink every 5 hours if you think it's so broken -- ME2's gameplay beats the sht out of ME1's.

First off, the weapons are mass accelerators, so I'd like to know where you think friction actually enters this equation.  Beyond that, don't be such a potty mouth.

[The Governator]

Cutlass Jack wrote...

No its pretty easy to run out of 'ammo.' Try using a shotgun.

I dislike it immensely. Especially since I'm the only being in the galaxy operating with heat sink limitations. Neither my squadmates or enemies have to deal with it.

LOL, that's it precisely.  They don't run out of heat sinks, but *I* certainly do!  I hate having to expose myself to enemy fire to look for heat sinks.  

ME1 had the PERFECT science explanation for unlimited ammunition and had a counterbalance to it.  But noooooo, someone somehwere just HAD to complain and now we have frigging heat sinks.

[The Governator]

Zero9999 wrote...

Frankly I think its an elegant solution to a needed mechanic that doesn't break the story at all. I love having to switch weapons, makes shoot outs more interesting.

I like that the sidearm is useful now, but not that I must change weapons to continue a fight.