87 réponses à ce sujet

[Zemore]

for the most part my para and rengade points are pretty even renegade has topped off a bit more than para and everything turns out fine for me i have enough points to do most of the charm/intimidate checks at least the ones that affected the game char wise only ones i can remember not having lighted up were involving morinth

[Dragoncloud]

Also had that problem, finished Miranda's loyalty mission and levelled up right after it (which would give me the necessary paragon points to convince them, but no way to lvl up in a cutscene/at mission end). So anyhow, i decided to tell Miranda to back down, afterwards i got my lvl, spoke to miranda in her quarters and had the option to tell her Jack was 'special' and needed 'special' attention, convincing her that it was all a charade to keep Jack happy, keeping loyalty for both.

[pedal2metal]

I agree. I had same thing happen to me w/Jack & Miranda which irritated me.

One RPG that rewarded neutrality nicely was KOTOR 2.

[pedal2metal]

I agree. I had same thing happen to me w/Jack & Miranda which irritated me.

One RPG that rewarded neutrality nicely was KOTOR 2.

[pedal2metal]

I agree. I had same thing happen to me w/Jack & Miranda which irritated me.

One RPG that rewarded neutrality nicely was KOTOR 2.

[pedal2metal]

I agree. I had same thing happen to me w/Jack & Miranda which irritated me.

One RPG that rewarded neutrality nicely was KOTOR 2.

[Amethyst Deceiver]

ReubenLiew wrote...

I'd like a system where both the paragon and renegade options are always open for you to pick, but if your score isn't high enough it will fail.

it worked like that in fallout. you get a percentage of success based on how much points you have in that particular persuasion skill. you could easilly exploit it though by saving and constantly reloading until you get it successfully.

[TLK Spires]

neutrality never changed the fate of a galaxy.

[antiotter]

uv23 wrote...

Agh that is annoying. So there's basically no way of keeping my entire crew alive unless I'm either a goody two shoes or a sociopath. Frustrated doesn't quite say it...

That's one of the things I liked about Fallout 3.  There's a Perk called "Impartial Mediation" which gives you a huge bonus to Speech checks if you have neutral Karma, because you can always see every arguement from both sides.

[aeetos21]

The Jack/Miranda tiff was the biggest dialogue problem with me. I don't know how I managed to get both renegade and paragon options on my first playthrough but on my second and third (no matter how high either meter was) I got zilch for options.



I really hope BW is more reasonable in ME3 about these conversations. Convincing Saren to kill himself, that I can see needing a full meter for but to break a fight between two alpha female types personalities? Yeah you'd need a decent meter but you shouldn't have to be Drizzt or Lex Luthor either.

[adam_grif]

TLK Spires wrote...

neutrality never changed the fate of a galaxy.

We're not talking about taking the neutral dialogue option every time, we're talking about sometimes being Paragon and sometimes being Renegade, as you find fits the situation best. Like being paragon to your love interest and your crew to keep them happy and mission ready, but being Renegade to people who threaten you.

The idea that you should always be one or the other is naive.

[ReubenLiew]

Amethyst Deceiver wrote...

ReubenLiew wrote...

I'd like a system where both the paragon and renegade options are always open for you to pick, but if your score isn't high enough it will fail.

it worked like that in fallout. you get a percentage of success based on how much points you have in that particular persuasion skill. you could easilly exploit it though by saving and constantly reloading until you get it successfully.

Yeah, but we can eliminate that problem by eliminating the random chance and put it as a fixed number. Like you need exactly this amount of paragon to pass this particular persuasion check.

[medlish]

Two playthroughs here with unimported Shepard. Also payed attention to the +Paragon/Renegade skill. Both times problem with the argument between Jack and Miranda.

One of them always dies at the end of the suicide mission. If I leave the unloyal one at the door they lie dead on the floor in a cutscene while retreating. If I take her with me she dies buried under the debris. I even bought every upgrade which I had available at the end.

[Vicious]

I was 90% Paragon and 80% Renegade, definetly damn near neutral in that I erred on the side of 'good' but generally picked renegade convo options just to be a dick.

I had enough Renegade to shut up Jack and Miranda, and enough Paragon to shut up Tali and Legion. It worked out incredibly well.

Simple fact: If a companion is not loyal they will be crushed by Debris at the end.

Modifié par Vicious, 04 février 2010 - 12:19 .

[TLK Spires]

adam_grif wrote...

TLK Spires wrote...

neutrality never changed the fate of a galaxy.

We're not talking about taking the neutral dialogue option every time, we're talking about sometimes being Paragon and sometimes being Renegade, as you find fits the situation best. Like being paragon to your love interest and your crew to keep them happy and mission ready, but being Renegade to people who threaten you.

The idea that you should always be one or the other is naive.

ok.

neutraility never changed anything.

[Ciry]

Jackal904 wrote...

adam_grif wrote...

I don't want to be Satan-Hitler, nor do I want to be Jesus-Ghandi. I want to be Commander Shepard, and I want to be able to play him or her as I please without getting punished for not being at one extreme or the other.

Great statement. Hopefully Bioware sees this and takes it into consideration. I know exactly how you feel. Sometimes I want to be a jerk and sometimes I want to be a nice guy, but if you don't have enough renegade or paragon points you get screwed.

I ran into this too.

My best playthrough in ME1 was with a purely Ruthless femShep. But she wasn't cruel or anything – if it didn't somehow complicate the mission she would, for example, comfort a grieving mother, help a sick batarian, ect. But if somebody got in her way during a mission she had no qualms about "removing" them. Ruthless practicality instead of Ruthless cruelty – AND she was always nice to her comrades-in-arms.

Tying the persuade/intimidate skills to the morality scale eliminates this and many other nuances I like to make in my head while playing.

I would like a hybrid system for this – a "Speechcraft" skill, which would improve the morality scores in conversations  "under the hood", while keeping the actual meter as it is.

[adam_grif]

Vicious wrote...

I was 90% Paragon and 80% Renegade, definetly damn near neutral in that I erred on the side of 'good' but generally picked renegade convo options just to be a dick.

I had enough Renegade to shut up Jack and Miranda, and enough Paragon to shut up Tali and Legion. It worked out incredibly well.

Simple fact: If a companion is not loyal they will be crushed by Debris at the end.

How did you get both of them so high?!?!

[Sigh_Blaise]

I wasn't polarized paragon. I completed it with about 75% paragon and 25% renegade, but I kept everyone loyal without any probs. I had spent some time before Miranda and Jack's argument to talk to them so maybe that made a difference?



I like the new way of building charm and intimidate. I always hated wasting points on the off-chance a conversation option would come up.

[Zhijn]

uv23 wrote...

Agh that is annoying. So there's basically no way of keeping my entire crew alive unless I'm either a goody two shoes or a sociopath. Frustrated doesn't quite say it...

I know its abit annoying that you just cant tell em that we on a frickin suicide mission, get your heads in the game ect.

However if you really want to be neutral you can use a trainer from (cheathappens.com) that Add Paragone and Renegade to your character. Its ofc unfortune one have to cheat in that way but crew will be happy and survive, we stay neutral. =)

What i plan to do after my renegade game.

[Kuari999]

Put on the Death Mask and see if that helps also btw.  Its bought from Tuchanka

Modifié par Kuari999, 04 février 2010 - 12:36 .

[PARAGON87]

Think of this. Whole team loyal, did all loyalty missions, and Legion was the only one who died for me.



Then I look at Wikia to see what's wrong, and they say it's who I chose as fire team lead! (Chose Samara, seemed like good decision!).

[Cajeb]

On my first Playthrough I was 75% Paragon and 100% Renegade. I actually used a Paragon diffusal on Tali and Legion

[adam_grif]

Cajeb wrote...

On my first Playthrough I was 75% Paragon and 100% Renegade. I actually used a Paragon diffusal on Tali and Legion

HOW DID YOU GET BOTH OF THEM SO HIGH?!?!?!?!?!


My first playhtough ended with 60% renegade 35% Paragon.

[Kuari999]

PARAGON87 wrote...

Think of this. Whole team loyal, did all loyalty missions, and Legion was the only one who died for me.

Then I look at Wikia to see what's wrong, and they say it's who I chose as fire team lead! (Chose Samara, seemed like good decision!).

While Samara has experience, she has none leading..  People I chose?

Garrus/Tali
Garrus/Samara
Thane escort
Mordin and Tali with me killing the Reaper.

[Cajeb]

I'm not sure? I was generally Renegade in all the small actions but I got some huge Paragon boosts like for rewriting Geth. Plus I started with some from Importing from ME1. Then I maxed out the skill that boosts your Renegade/Paragon.