87 réponses à ce sujet

[uv23]

I hadn't thought of the level scaling issue. I knew this applied to enemies but I wouldn't have thought it would apply to charm and intimidate. I bet thats the issue. I did the Jack loyalty quest last.

[ERJAK2]

uv23 wrote...

Agh that is annoying. So there's basically no way of keeping my entire crew alive unless I'm either a goody two shoes or a sociopath. Frustrated doesn't quite say it...

Put more points into the class specific skill that gives para/renagade score. Or change specializtion to the +100% one.

[Svest]

uv23 wrote...

I hadn't thought of the level scaling issue. I knew this applied to enemies but I wouldn't have thought it would apply to charm and intimidate. I bet thats the issue. I did the Jack loyalty quest last.

I don't know for sure that its correct, just a sense I'm getting from reading this thread.  It could be other factors, such as what you did during their loyalty quests, but I suspect its level based.  Or maybe based on how many other missions you have done so far?

[tmp7704]

adam_grif wrote...

Yes we know that. But you can't have everybody being loyal to you

My Shepard was 4:3 paragon:renegade at end of game and she had everyone loyal except Zaeed. And Zaeed only because i chose to save the people in factory rather than do what he wanted.

I don't remember exactly how the part with Miranda and Jack went but i think i did Miranda's loyalty quest early, then picked up Jack, told them both to knock it off when they had a fight, then did Jack's loyalty quest. It was more related to how missions were laid out on the map, i wasn't even aware you can lose loyalty with these choices.

[Gilsa]

I finished the game with both renegade and paragon barely starting the last bar. They were pretty even. I had both options available for the Jack/Miranda fight and only the paragon one available for Tali/Legion. I did not have my skill high enough for the last persuade check in the Samara/Mordin fight and was surprised to read later that Mordin would have been a team option for me if I had passed it.



I did max out my class specialist skill pretty early on and I'm pretty sure I didn't finish Jack's loyalty quest until it was closer to the end. Checking up on someone's loved one seemed more important than blowing up a base because of a grudge.



I am not a neutral player. I prefer taking a stand on something rather than waffle in the middle so my business dealings were all renegade/no patience for BS. Crew and bystanders got paragon responses. Innocent people as collateral damage is also a no-no. If someone owned up to their mistakes, they got leniency. There are a lot of moments in the game where people appreciate that Shepard has the balls to call it like it is. Sometimes it goes too far, but there's the middle option to fall back on if the dialogue seems like it can get too harsh.)

[roku]

i was able to finish the game with zero casualties and all shipmates saved and i did not have everyones loyalty. miranda and zaeed were not loyal.



just pick the ones for the special taskes that do have loyalty. for example...i did not have mirandas loyalty, so i chose garrus to lead the second team.



easy.



i dont really see why people are having so much trouble with this.



if you sided with miranda and dont have jack loyal, then dont use jack for the bubble...use samara/morinth instead.

[slowbird]

I can't get Jack to stay loyal even with a nearly full Paragon bar at the time of the argument, WTF?

I don't know how to keep her alive in the final battle either. I didn't use her for anything, she just stayed behind with the rest of them to guard the door.   Would it help if I had Miranda in my party so that she and Jack are separated?

Modifié par slowbird, 05 février 2010 - 02:02 .

[Kolaris8472]

This is exactly why I only want there to be 1(!) bar for persuasion.



If my Renegade is 75% and Paragon 55%, the game thinks I'm some sort of conflicted weak-willed ninny when I've been playing the same consistent character the whole time (good to my friends, merciless to my enemies). I come to Samara's loyalty mission and find myself bumbling despite having a combined total R/P much higher than either bar filled all the way.



And what's worse, there was no real way to make up for this (imo) oversight in the system by throwing points at an associated skill.

[slowbird]

stillnotking wrote...

uv23 wrote...
I was very careful in this second playthrough. I didnt' activate the EFF until all loyalty missions were complete, but them I got hit by the bombshell: Miranda and Jack's fight. My Paragon meter was about three quarters and renegade just under half, but neither was enough to negotiate the argument.

3/4 Paragon with 4 points in your class skill is more than enough to resolve the Miranda/Jack and Tali/Legion arguments.  If it's not giving you the option with your score that high then your game is bugged.  I see this complaint all the time on the forums, but I have personally resolved the argument with only 3 bars of Paragon.

I think lacking the 4th point in the class skill is what causes most people to fail this check.

Yeah I definitely think there's a bug with how the Paragon/Renegade options scale with your level for the Jack/Miranda fight.  It seems to affect femshep more than maleshep though I could be wrong about that.

[Tony_Knightcrawler]

Is it that hard to negotiate it? I wonder what the default Shep will be in ME3... Tali dead? Legion dead? Jack dead? Miranda dead? Everyone dead but the ME1 team?

Modifié par Tony_Knightcrawler, 05 février 2010 - 03:59 .

[ToshiStation38]

I'm pretty neutral and I was able to use the intimidate in that scene. Try to get it later rather than sooner.

[Spinnazie]

You don't need everyone to be loyal for your squad to all survive.



/thread

[KiLLLLeR150]

I had the same exact problem as some of you guys.  I was trying to play my own Command Shephard.  For the most part, he's nice, but not always.  Too bad I had no idea of the consequences of the Jack/Miranda fight.  I had about 70% Paragon, 20% Renegade and I couldn't Charm my way out of it.  I was pissed to learn it ruined my relationship with Miranda (although it keeps me faithful to Ashley... who I thought parted ways with me as a lover).  I then played pure Paragon, ended up with 90% and STILL couldn't Charm Miranda.  I played twice at the end, with different team configs; both times saw Miranda die.  That was absolutely unacceptable for my Shepard.  I was so pissed that I have to make a new game, play the same exact way, and do Jack's loyalty quest just before the IFF so I could keep everyone's loyalty (except Zaeed's... who doesn't matter).

After reading here, I realize I don't have to anymore.  I had a save after the fight where I picked Miranda's side (I picked against her originally because I didn't think she'd take it so hard... GEE better read a guide before I play on my own... bs).  I completely forgot about respecing.  Hopefully that'll get me to 100%, get Jack's loyalty back, and survive completely intact.

FFS, for 2 shipmates that had my loyalty, and through all the **** we've been through, I shouldn't have to be that damn persuasive.

And in case that doesn't work... how can I keep my non-loyal Miranda alive??  She died when she was with me against the Human-Reaper, and she died when she was with Garrus's other team.

EDIT: I was able to keep Miranda alive.  I used her personally in the first two attacks, then took Jack and Legion.  Maybe she didn't die because the person she hates so much wasn't with her.
Jeez, the instant I respecced and became a Shock Trooper, my paragon jumped a good chunk.  Could instantly gain Jack's loyalty back.  If only you could have normal control before the argument...

Modifié par KiLLLLeR150, 06 février 2010 - 06:49 .