1679 réponses à ce sujet

[Sigilius]

I saw a copy of it on, like, page 105 of the Liara as a Squadmate in ME3 v2 thread. I'll post a link in a while.



But I've found something else, on a more depressing note. Readers, read my above post for the good news!



I've found acknowledgement of your relationship with Liara in this game. When you complete the Observer quest, you get 4,500 credits from Liara...



If you romanced her, you get 5,000.



That's it.



Just saying. But I am genuinely pleased about my above post. Crazy-eye picture right...



Here. http://img696.images...nshot00127.jpg/

[onelifecrisis]

I totally agree with the OP, and I'm really p!ssed off about this. ME2 is a great game overall, but Shepard's reunion with (LI) Liara made no sense at all, as evidenced by the sheer amount of speculation in this thread. Why didn't I have any dialogue options to tell Liara how Shepard feels about her? Why does she kiss Shepard and then act all business like and refer to him as her "friend"? I'm not asking for more speculation from anyone here, I'm simply pointing out that the way her conversations pan out makes no sense. Would it have killed BioWare to record a few different lines of dialogue for ME1 imports who had romanced her? I don't care what the dialgue says... well okay obviously I do care what it says, but I care more about it (not) being there. Has she moved on? If so, she should say so (and not give Shepard that bizarre kiss). Does she still have feelings for Shepard? If so, there should be some way to get her to express them, or at least an option for Shepard to express his/her feelings. And yes, I have seen all the different dialogue options.

Also, as stated by many here, Liara's character hasn't developed, it's done a 180. I'm all in favour of time and events changing the characters, but this new Liara bears no resemblance at all to the one I met in ME1. I played ME2 right after finishing ME1, without having read any spoilers or even seen any trailers, and this one part of the game was just a total let down and uncharacteristically sloppy on BioWare's part IMO. To top it all off, the last thing she says to Shepard is that she's still years away from finding the Shadow Broker and she intends to persue him for as long as it takes. Not exactly a statement that inspires hope, or even desire, for a future relationship.

Given that love interests were one of the things that made Mass Effect a bit different from other games I find it just plain bizarre that BioWare have dumped all the ME1 love interests like this - with the bare minimum of fuss and hardly any dialogue at all.

The only bright side I can see is that this gives me an opportunity to replay ME2 with my imported ME1 paragon Shepard and have him turn renegade part way through ME2 after Liara breaks his heart. But on a more serious note, given the evident lack of resources that BioWare put into the continuation of ME1 love interests, I'm fully expecting (against my hopes) to see an all new set of love interests in ME3 and any love interests started in ME2 to be dumped in the same unceremonious manner as we've seen here. I think BioWare see Shepard as a sort of Captain Kirk from the original Star Trek i.e. a new woman every episode. That seems to me to be where they're heading with this series, and I'm not at all happy about it.

[pf17456]

I think having kept the dialog vague adds an air of mystery and also suggests a deeper emotional bond between Liara and Shephard. The distant gaze on Liara's face after their kiss seemed one of question and doubt as well as fear and guilt since as we find later that Liara was responsible for bringing Shephard back. So when she greets Shephard knowing what has occurred she's got to be thinking is this real ? or was she kissing an AI robot. as the conversation continues we find Liara feared reprisal from Shephard for giving his/her body to cereberus. I think Liara is basically protecting herself and has adopted a facade with Shephard for that purpose and Shephard doesn't quite understand but if her picture remains in Shephard's room then I believe thier bond will reunite them either in dlc or me3. I was disappointed though that for all the interest Liara showed for the Prothians Shephard never let her know that the Prothians became the Collectors. I think that would have been an interesting dialogue. At any rate I think Liara is a significant character in the story and will return hopefully as a squad member with a shadow broker quest with an additional role as the mother of Shephards daughter.

[Nightwriter]

If you romanced Liara, it warranted a discussion with her about the two of you when she saw you again. Period. After you reunited it should've been talked about. It should've probably been the first thing you talked about.

Any excuses or explanations or inferences about why she acted the way she did or what was really going on there are totally speculative, as nothing was explained and nothing was addressed. It was left a total blank. Some people may fill in the blanks with good things, some people may fill in the blanks with bad things. What matters is that there are freaking blanks to begin with when there shouldn't have been.

Modifié par Nightwriter, 26 mars 2010 - 05:28 .

[Xaijin]

And DLC won't fix that unless they literally rewrite the entire section... which isn't going to happen.

[Ulicus]

yorkj86 wrote...

Reading the Redemption comics, there's nothing specifically Liara-esque about her actions.  If I were to read over the dialogue of the comics with all of the names removed, I could guess that any of Liara's dialogue could have been said by any of Shepard's team-mates.  There's absolutely nothing that makes me think, "Oh, that's definitely Liara doing all of this."

What's even more perplexing is that, at the beginning of the comics, she acts nothing like the Liara in ME1, as if she's already been changed and hardened by the events that haven't even happened yet.  It's poor writing, all around.

Define "Liaraesque"? When she's not stumbling over her words because of her attraction to Shepard and awkwardness with people, she's actually pretty gung-ho and badass in ME1.

"This is where the fun begins!" and the like being amongst her "entering battle cries".

Don't get me wrong, the transition from game to comics hasn't been perfect... but it's not as bad as you're making out. At first I thought her using contractions was a problem... then I replayed ME1 and realised that she used plenty of contractions outside the romance dialogs with Shepard. Which was... weird. Hell, once of her first lines was: "I'm trapped, I need help."

[onelifecrisis]

Ulicus wrote...

yorkj86 wrote...

Reading the Redemption comics, there's nothing specifically Liara-esque about her actions.  If I were to read over the dialogue of the comics with all of the names removed, I could guess that any of Liara's dialogue could have been said by any of Shepard's team-mates.  There's absolutely nothing that makes me think, "Oh, that's definitely Liara doing all of this."

What's even more perplexing is that, at the beginning of the comics, she acts nothing like the Liara in ME1, as if she's already been changed and hardened by the events that haven't even happened yet.  It's poor writing, all around.

Define "Liaraesque"? When she's not stumbling over her words because of her attraction to Shepard and awkwardness with people, she's actually pretty gung-ho and badass in ME1.

"This is where the fun begins!" and the like being amongst her "entering battle cries".

Don't get me wrong, the transition from game to comics hasn't been perfect... but it's not as bad as you're making out. At first I thought her using contractions was a problem... then I replayed ME1 and realised that she used plenty of contractions outside the romance dialogs with Shepard. Which was... weird. Hell, once of her first lines was: "I'm trapped, I need help."

What? Where did you get that idea? In ME1 Liara was the peace-loving tree-hugging sheltered-upbringing virgin of the group. She urges Shepard to do his part to show the galaxy that humans are not just obsessed with power and violence. In one mission, when Shepard drives over a space monkey in the Mako, Liara comments "that's the sort of thing that gives humans a bad rep" or something like that. Of course her personality doesn't make any sense on the battlefield (even if she didn't make comments like "now the fun begins" I'd still be bemused by her willingness to do battle) but that's pretty common in superhero stories. It's her out-of-battle personality that's been betrayed/ignored/slaughtered by the post-ME1 storyline and dialogue (and lack thereof).

[lastpawn]

onelifecrisis wrote...
What? Where did you get that idea? In ME1 Liara was the peace-loving tree-hugging sheltered-upbringing virgin of the group. She urges Shepard to do his part to show the galaxy that humans are not just obsessed with power and violence. In one mission, when Shepard drives over a space monkey in the Mako, Liara comments "that's the sort of thing that gives humans a bad rep" or something like that. Of course her personality doesn't make any sense on the battlefield (even if she didn't make comments like "now the fun begins" I'd still be bemused by her willingness to do battle) but that's pretty common in superhero stories. It's her out-of-battle personality that's been betrayed/ignored/slaughtered by the post-ME1 storyline and dialogue (and lack thereof).

This is also an incomplete and one-sided interpretation of Liara's character. Her academic social awkwardness doesn't make her any of the things you suggest. It makes her an awkward academic. The rest is your speculation - i.e., that's nice but not germane here. Keep in mind she's killed before Shepard recruits her and mentions this casually.

[Hyper Cutter]

The most annoying part is that a romanced Liara acts almost exactly the same as she does if you didn't.



Also that the last conversation is glitched and it's possible to miss the conversation about her giving your body to Cerberus entirely if you choose the other dialog option first...

[Larask]

Hyper Cutter wrote...

The most annoying part is that a romanced Liara acts almost exactly the same as she does if you didn't.

Also that the last conversation is glitched and it's possible to miss the conversation about her giving your body to Cerberus entirely if you choose the other dialog option first...

Yes, I don't even know how the devs didn't catch that. The glitch leads to the most meaninful part of Liara's dialog, and A LOT of people missed it in their first playtrough. 
I really wish that there was more for the people who romanced Liara. The fact that she acts the same for every Shepard (aside from the weird kiss) is really dissapointing. If there is a DLC with her, I hope that BW won't make the same mistake again.

[jlb524]

Wow, this thread got resurrected just like Shepard.

Larask wrote...

I really wish that there was more for the people who romanced Liara. The fact that she acts the same for every Shepard (aside from the weird kiss) is really dissapointing. If there is a DLC with her, I hope that BW won't make the same mistake again.

Liara gives a romanced Shepard 500 more credits for completing her missions!

I agree though, there needs to be more Liara romance content somewhere.  The comics can't go there so DLC better.

[JamieCOTC]

jlb524 wrote...

Wow, this thread got resurrected just like Shepard.

Larask wrote...

I really wish that there was more for the people who romanced Liara. The fact that she acts the same for every Shepard (aside from the weird kiss) is really dissapointing. If there is a DLC with her, I hope that BW won't make the same mistake again.

Liara gives a romanced Shepard 500 more credits for completing her missions!

I agree though, there needs to be more Liara romance content somewhere.  The comics can't go there so DLC better.

That's why God created fanfic. 

[Unit-Alpha]

It's alive!



Seriously, they needed to fix that; instead they probably spent the time developing the rain/suit interaction system for Jack's loyalty mission.

[scmadsen]

That 500 extra credits is so Shepard can go and get really drunk after seeing Liara again.

The comics failed to give any new information about Liara and her quest to hunt down the Shadow Broker. If anything it spit at the fans and hinted at a Liara and Feron romance. What moron thought that was a good idea. It's so out of character for Liara to start with.

The comic also failed to deliver on the promise that we would learn something important from it. It doesn't explain why Liara won't go with Shepard anymore then she does in game. You want to kill someone, you ask Commander Shepard for help, duh.

We can guess as to what is going thru Liara's mind in game, and we can deal with her as she is now. But what none of us understand is why Shepard is not allowed to help, comfort, or talk to Liara about their relationship. BioWare failed big, and gives no reason other then, you just can't because we don't want you to.

And while I'm ranting, what happened to Liara wanting to go back to Ilos? What happened to a Shepard and Liara love child. They spend their romance talking about mating, they mate, and then...nothing. Really BioWare?

Ashley and Kaidan fans get to talk about their romance, they even get to talk to both Joker and Kelly about it. They even get an email.

What does Liara get, nothing. Well, we get half a kiss, ok. But really? Then they release Kasumi and they toss us a bone...but what a bone...same time as the comic comes out, with it hinting that Liara only cares about Feron now...and we get Kasumi telling us, Shepard and Liara were an item...not are an item.

At this point, we might get a DLC with Liara in it, but I don't expect a Liara DLC...more like a Shadow Broker DLC.

BioWare really did drop the ball with Liara.

Modifié par scmadsen, 11 avril 2010 - 01:00 .

[JaylaClark]

I'm not as angry as some of my fellow Liarasexuals are, but I really have to say, I may be the kindest person in the Fan Club to Mac Walters, and yet there's my sig with "Mac Walters doesn't care about blue people" in it right there. 

I tend to characterize the reunion scene as "unfinished".  It throws a lot of subtle hints for us to pick up on, but nothing concrete.  And plenty of stuff for someone who's glass-half-empty like scmadsen to pick up on, too.  I can understand it in the comics -- though I will again say that there's more hinting to a Tali-Kal romance than a Liara-Feron romance, and the former is in the game -- because it has to attempt to satisfy people who aren't Liaramancers and nothing can be very definite.  But in the actual game, they dropped the ball.  That headshake is very vaguely explained, I think, by Liara's worries that Shepard isn't her Shepard, but it's not how I would've gone about it at all.

Plus Kai and Ash get a forced-priority Kelly dialogue and Liara doesn't even get one at all.  I personally took the Kasumi line to be a step toward rectifying it, but I'd have rather it come in one of her mission interactions where I could have answered back "WERE an item?"  Then she could expound on it and I'd say "Once this is over, I'm docking the Normandy at Illium and sleeping outside her office, and that's only until she invites me to her place ..." or the like.  Still, I'm confident, strangely enough, that they know they borked the scenes, just because of that line.  But they need to give us more, and I'd prefer they tell us about it soon.

[TMA LIVE]

JaylaClark wrote...
Plus Kai and Ash get a forced-priority Kelly dialogue and Liara doesn't even get one at all.  I personally took the Kasumi line to be a step toward rectifying it, but I'd have rather it come in one of her mission interactions where I could have answered back "WERE an item?"

Well, it's not like Shepard and Liara are off the bat a couple again, just because he's back from the dead. And the game is designed around you going to see other people if you no longer love your love interest. I see it more as them covering their asses on both end. After all, even if you're still committed to Liara and will not move on, the current statues in the relationship between you two is unknown. Nothing is official.

[JaylaClark]

TMA LIVE wrote...

JaylaClark wrote...
Plus Kai and Ash get a forced-priority Kelly dialogue and Liara doesn't even get one at all.  I personally took the Kasumi line to be a step toward rectifying it, but I'd have rather it come in one of her mission interactions where I could have answered back "WERE an item?"

Well, it's not like Shepard and Liara are off the bat a couple again, just because he's back from the dead. And the game is designed around you going to see other people if you no longer love your love interest. I see it more as them covering their asses on both end. After all, even if you're still committed to Liara and will not move on, the current statues in the relationship between you two is unknown. Nothing is official.

I italicized the sentence I'll start off with.  Thing is, to a Liaramancing Shepard, she or he sent Liara scurrying to the escape pods, probably, less than a month ago if that.  So to that end, it hasn't been that long.  Plus my friend is very paranoid that they went and had Liara properly move on -- though her actions, to my thought, say otherwise.  At least, that one dialogue option suggests it pretty clearly.  (I've gone on about how Liara's last comment in the comics actually doesn't contradict 'because I couldn't let you go at length in the Liara thread.  It's some variation on how she doesn't want Shepard to Come Back Wrong, as TvTropes puts it.)  Still, anyone of us who heard about 'rewards for staying faithful' from Casey would be pretty insulted if they forced a break up between Shepard and Liara, Kaidan and Ashley.

The second sentence is true, but actively insulting to some people.  They do seem to be actively pushing us out of the arms of our ME1 romances -- they even seem to be trying to make Liara less attractive, tell you the truth, given the lighting in her office only shows her at her original skin color when she's standing at the window.  (One of the fan club members hacked a Shepard to have Samara's skin, and noticed that the color's washed out everywhere for blues on Illium, tell you the truth.)  But I do think that they're going for choose your own cliche with the ME1 LIs, either 'heartbroken lover finds comfort in the arms of another', or 'lovers torn apart by distance remain faithful nonetheless'.  (The e-mails from Ash and Kai are my evidence of the latter, and I think the 'couldn't let you go' line is evidence to the former ... except that everyone can get it.  This is the broken nature of the Liara interactions in full force.)

I totally agree with you on one thing, though, I don't think there's any way anyone outside the relationship can know specifically if Shepard and Liara are still considering themselves an item.  We'd ... just like more of an indicator that the devs remember that we were or are one.  (Just one hug at the end of it all would've worked best -- I think it's totally necessary work that Liara is doing, I acknowledge she needs to keep on doing it, and I even acknowledge that she might need to finish it on her own for her own sake, but lemme say I understand and I'll be here if you need anything, at least.  And yeah, I kind of owned Shepard's feelings just a bit there.  A lot of us do on the forums, I've noticed.)

[pf17456]

Love gained, love in question, love regained. That's how I see it playing out if Liara was your LI and you were true to her in me2. I think Liara will play a significant role in me3 and once the Shadow Broker thing is dealt with I expect to see Liara staying in Shephards quarters with a lot of options and dialogue. Out of all the love interests Shephard can have I believe the story presents Liara's as the deepest and most meaningful.

[Ray Joel Oh]

Sigilius wrote...

I've found acknowledgement of your relationship with Liara in this game. When you complete the Observer quest, you get 4,500 credits from Liara...

If you romanced her, you get 5,000.

Go buy yourself something pretty, Shepard. ;-*

[TMA LIVE]

Ray Joel Oh wrote...

Sigilius wrote...

I've found acknowledgement of your relationship with Liara in this game. When you complete the Observer quest, you get 4,500 credits from Liara...

If you romanced her, you get 5,000.

Go buy yourself something pretty, Shepard. ;-*

So you're saying if you were just friends with her, she rips you off by 500 credits???

[ryu niiyama]

lastpawn wrote...

This is also an incomplete and one-sided interpretation of Liara's character. Her academic social awkwardness doesn't make her any of the things you suggest. It makes her an awkward academic. The rest is your speculation - i.e., that's nice but not germane here. Keep in mind she's killed before Shepard recruits her and mentions this casually.

Seconded. I never got why some people have the notion that Liara is some little waif because she doesn't have a collection of severed heads or something. As for her general adversion for fighting; it is not her profession (and she is not a psychopath) so she doesn't take pleasure in it... doesn't mean she is not capable of it. There are many people that may not like violence but are highly skilled in bringing it about if needed. A Paragon Shep is willing to talk... but she has usually blown through regiment of guards first and and is likely to take an enemy down if they are unwilling to meet her halfway.

Sorry if that was a derail, but I was surpised to find someone that finds Liara capable and it not think she is just because ME is a video game.

[lordnyx1]

Only read to page 40ish but so far I agree with the vast majority of the opinions. Liara/LI weren't really handled that well compared to Conrad and other npcs...

Modifié par lordnyx1, 14 avril 2010 - 09:55 .

[wickedwizzard01]

Hope they won't screw things up in DA:O2 Like they have done in ME2 with Liara

it's a shame there isn't anything hinting to the romance from ME1 apart from that one kiss

and that Liara said she could not let go so thats why she gave Shepard to ceberus...