96 réponses à ce sujet

[pacer90]

2nd act.... 2nd act people...





Think two towers.

[Kuari999]

TheGreyGhost119 wrote...

People say the choices were simple, but I disagree.

Sure, the tech expert one maybe, but the fire team leaders were a little trickier. I honestly don't see why Garrus or Jacob would be good leaders. Garrus got his whole squad killed, and Jacob is just a hired (albeit, loyal) hired gun.

And everyone seemed to hate Miranda.

Garrus didn't get anyone killed.  He did well until he was drawn away by a traitor, so he couldn't be there to protect his team, before that though, he was amazing at guriella tactics.  The only concern I had when I chose him was I was slightly worried there might be a confidence issue.  Jacob is ex-military, and being military for any length of time they expect you to know teamwork and leadership.  Only Jack really hated Miranda enough to be a problem, the others showed no hate and certainly not enough to be a leadership issue.

[Series5Ranger]

Kuari999 wrote...

TheGreyGhost119 wrote...

People say the choices were simple, but I disagree.

Sure, the tech expert one maybe, but the fire team leaders were a little trickier. I honestly don't see why Garrus or Jacob would be good leaders. Garrus got his whole squad killed, and Jacob is just a hired (albeit, loyal) hired gun.

And everyone seemed to hate Miranda.

Garrus didn't get anyone killed.  He did well until he was drawn away by a traitor, so he couldn't be there to protect his team, before that though, he was amazing at guriella tactics.  The only concern I had when I chose him was I was slightly worried there might be a confidence issue.  Jacob is ex-military, and being military for any length of time they expect you to know teamwork and leadership.  Only Jack really hated Miranda enough to be a problem, the others showed no hate and certainly not enough to be a leadership issue.

Jacob's whole Loyalty mission is about what makes a good or Bad leader as well.

[mcramladu]

If you think about ME2 only being part of the storyline, you could argue that there are decisions that have much more potential impact than anything in ME1. I say potential because who knows exactly how much your decisions impact the storyline in ME3 (I mean, ME1 decisions meant little other than some conversational changes).

If they decide to make ME2 decisions impact ME3 in a big way, the decision to keep the collector ship could end up being the equivalent of Luke choosing to embrace the dark side in Empire Strikes Back

Modifié par mcramladu, 04 février 2010 - 10:00 .

[Gill Kaiser]

Kuari999 wrote...

TheGreyGhost119 wrote...

People say the choices were simple, but I disagree.

Sure, the tech expert one maybe, but the fire team leaders were a little trickier. I honestly don't see why Garrus or Jacob would be good leaders. Garrus got his whole squad killed, and Jacob is just a hired (albeit, loyal) hired gun.

And everyone seemed to hate Miranda.

Garrus didn't get anyone killed.  He did well until he was drawn away by a traitor, so he couldn't be there to protect his team, before that though, he was amazing at guriella tactics.  The only concern I had when I chose him was I was slightly worried there might be a confidence issue.  Jacob is ex-military, and being military for any length of time they expect you to know teamwork and leadership.  Only Jack really hated Miranda enough to be a problem, the others showed no hate and certainly not enough to be a leadership issue.

Remember that Garrus is ex-military too. All Turians are.

[AtreiyaN7]

And who said that that was the human Reaper's finished form? I tend to agree with the people theorizing that it would be housed inside the standard Reaper shell/superstructure. Taking races and turning them into Reapers is described as being the Reaper method of reproduction in the game. I'll repeat what I said in another thread as well: the Reaper interest in us is in part due to our genetic diversity (Mordin mentions this). As for the suicide mission, you had choices throughout the game to make people loyal or to let things be AND whether or not you wanted to get those upgrades or ignore them completely. If you chose the optimal path because you wanted your people to survive, then of course there was going to be a high likelihood that you would get a positive outcome. On the suicide mission itself, you could choose wrong and get people killed, or take too long and get people killed, etc. It was all more dependent on your abilities, common sense, and speed, rather than being a forced choice (a la Virmire). I'm not saying that Virmire wasn't dramatic, but it was forced. I liked the freedom and the responsibility for saving everyone (or losing people, depending) on the suicide mission, plus there was greater urgency due to the time restrictions. On Virmire, well, you could take all day getting to Ashley/Kaidan if you wanted without repercussion.

[WrexEffex]

- When Garrus was attacked by the Gunship (thought he died)
- Jacob's loyalty mission (epic ending, depending on what you chose to do with his dad)
- Tali's recruitment mission on Haestrom (I love quarians)
- First seeing Leigon and his bad**** pose, then turning him on on the Normandy was an awesome conversation (Shepard Commander. "Can you understand me?" "Yes")  
- Thane's recruitment mission (very dark and loved the music)
- The whole suicide mission, not knowing who's going to survive (epic)
- Doing to Horizon mission (seeing the collectors for the first time)

All those were truly amazing moments for me in the game. Both ME1 and ME2 have amazing moments in it, it's such an incredible story so far. Come on ME3!!

Modifié par WrexEffex, 04 février 2010 - 10:12 .

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

Kuari999 wrote....

Only Jack really hated Miranda enough to be a problem, the others showed no hate and certainly not enough to be a leadership issue.

Except that isn't totally true, I've seen a video where Jack had obviously died during the ship ride and in that moment when Miranda mentions being the leader, Garrus stepped up and stated that not many trust her. Which to some extent is understandable due to what he says to Shep when you recruit him.

But of course this is just personal opinions from them, professionally Miranda is a good leader.

[Gill Kaiser]

WrexEffex wrote...

- Jacob's loyalty mission (epic ending, depending on what you chose to do with his dad)

Why, what happens? In my first playthrough I had him arrested. Is the ending totally epic if you tell Jacob to shoot him or leave him on the planet?

[Myrmedus]

It's simple - noone every really replaced Sovereign nor was the conversation with him replaced (most important aspect missing).

The Collectors are meant to be the 'chilling' immediate antagonists of the game but even when it's revealed they're Protheans you never speak to one. You never directly speak to Harbinger either which was a big mistake IMO. Because of that you never have any 'direct' connection with the enemies you're fighting and thus it lacks the chill of the first.

As Mordin might say: Standard rule of protagonist-antagonist relationship - must create connection either through conversation or direct actions - must produce potential compromise or attempt at understanding - must produce some capacity to respect one another or otherwise succumb to intense negative feelings; plot without such cohesion produces stale composition and outcome!

Modifié par Myrmedus, 04 février 2010 - 10:18 .

[flatlander five]

Gill Kaiser wrote...

WrexEffex wrote...

- Jacob's loyalty mission (epic ending, depending on what you chose to do with his dad)

Why, what happens? In my first playthrough I had him arrested. Is the ending totally epic if you tell Jacob to shoot him or leave him on the planet?

Lol, thats why you have to play through the games with the goal of taking different paths, getting different endings, different save games - so you can import all of them into ME3... My next game, for example, is going to be a 100% disaster scenario... No loyalty missions, no upgrades, bad decisions... 

Or use the you-tubes.

But yeah - I got a pretty epic moment with Jacobs dad

[Missouri Tigers]

Unless you are one of those people that looked up everything on the internet before getting the game, you probably had some people die.  I had all crew upgrades and did all loyalty missions, but I lost 3 people: Mordin, Miranda, and Legion.


Miranda died because after gaining her loyalty, I didn't have enough points to choose the Charm or Intimidate option so I sided with Jack and lost loyalty.  

Mordin died randomly at the end because I left him with the other to defend me.  

Legion died because apparently Geth are bad at Tech, I chose him to be the Tech Specialist on the final mission.

[xMister Vx]

I literally said "Holy ****!" out loud when the Collectors were revealed to be Protheans. The casual nature of that reveal made it even more striking. Legion's geth. Yes, there wasn't as much epicness in the presentation of it all, but it made an impact nonetheless.

[Gill Kaiser]

Missouri Tigers wrote...

Legion died because apparently Geth are bad at Tech, I chose him to be the Tech Specialist on the final mission.

Legion is fine. You must have made a poor choice for fire team leader.

[Majpain007]

The Virmire moment is the fact your whole Crew can die thats a huge. The big reveal was that the Reapers basically modified the Protheans to serve them thus Collectors.

[Ewing5150]

I think BW changed this idea alot really. The 'Virmire' of ME2 was the Collector base. And whoever dies depends on how well you prepared for the mission. But I see where your coming from. You dont really choose who lives and who dies.

[Myrmedus]

What 'made' Virmire though wasn't the death of a character but more the conversation with Sovereign - we REALLY needed a dialogue with Harbinger in this game or at least maybe the Human-Reaper! Could've called it Messiah or something

Modifié par Myrmedus, 04 février 2010 - 10:43 .

[Gill Kaiser]

Myrmedus wrote...

What 'made' Virmire though wasn't the death of a character but more the conversation with Sovereign - we REALLY needed a dialogue with Harbinger in this game or at least maybe the Human-Reaper! Could've called it Messiah or something

I liked the revelation of Harbinger as a Reaper because it meant that a Reaper had been 'conversing' with me at numerous times during the plot, without me realising.

[RurouniSaiya-jin]

Gill Kaiser wrote...

Missouri Tigers wrote...

Legion died because apparently Geth are bad at Tech, I chose him to be the Tech Specialist on the final mission.

Legion is fine. You must have made a poor choice for fire team leader.

Yeah. I choose Legion for the Tech Specialist too and he got the door open in no time like a pro. Then Garrus got everyone lined up and covered our retreat while the door closed.

On topic, think this might have been said already but I'm going to say it anyway. Personally, I think the final mission on the Collector ship was even better than Virmire. It was just so rewarding and awesome to watch your whole team work so fluidly and efficiently to get the job done after all the hours you spent recruiting them, preparing them and getting their loyalty.

[Ewing5150]

Well, if your talking about a high point in the story line involving the Reapers or Harbinger, the ending pretty much did it. Well, at least IMO. A fleet of Reapers pretty much explains it all to me

[Myrmedus]

Gill Kaiser wrote...

Myrmedus wrote...

What 'made' Virmire though wasn't the death of a character but more the conversation with Sovereign - we REALLY needed a dialogue with Harbinger in this game or at least maybe the Human-Reaper! Could've called it Messiah or something

I liked the revelation of Harbinger as a Reaper because it meant that a Reaper had been 'conversing' with me at numerous times during the plot, without me realising.

So did I but the problem was that you only realised this AFTER the game was finished so DURING playing the game you didn't get the same sense - also you never really had a true conversation with it only uttering phrases during combat.

Besides, now that I've said it I'm actually really liking the name Messiah for the Human-Reaper! Which leads me to another interesting question anyway: the 'humanized' names of the Reapers (ie. Sovereign instead of Nazara, Harbinger etc.) always appear to relate to their 'function' or their mission from a Reaper perspective. Harbinger was obvious but 'Sovereign' - I wonder what that means he was doing? Or at least what the Reaper's viewed him doing. Sovereign is basically another word for a monarch or sorts....

Anyway, like I said as much as I know that the suicide mission was bigged up, if it had been possible to make it only 2/3 through the story the game's narrative would've been better for it. The biggest punch should generally come at about 2/3 or 3/4 through rather than at the very end UNLESS you can follow it up with an immediate sequel (again, think the Matrix Reloaded conclusion - it was followed by Revolutions in only 6 months).

Modifié par Myrmedus, 04 février 2010 - 10:49 .

[andy christo]

Um... You start the game off by watching Shepard die a miserable death. Shepard suffocates while floating helplessly through space, then gets pulled into a planet's atmosphere and burns up while falling to the planet's surface at X speed from X altitude. It was INSANE. I don't know about you people but I was rather attached to my Shepard. I thought I had made a mistake in the few dialog options you're given during the attack on the Normandy. Or that I'd made a bad decision in ME1 and it was finally catching up to me. I was ****ting bricks!!

It wasn't exactly a big REVEALING moment, but it was definitely a huge nail-biter.

Also knowing that you and your entire crew and your ship might die during the suicide mission...

Tali's trial... Finding out the Collectors are genetically altered PROTHEANS enslaved by the Reapers... Baby human Reaper... Your crew getting abducted and almost killed...

Missouri Tigers wrote...

Unless you are one of those
people that looked up everything on the internet before getting the
game, you probably had some people die.  I had all crew upgrades and
did all loyalty missions, but I lost 3 people: Mordin, Miranda, and
Legion.

I didn't look any of the answers up on the internet, I just used common sense and practical thinking.
When it asks for a tech specialist to hack the door I knew there were only two choices. Legion or Tali. I chose Legion because he's a geth, I considered him to be more expendable then Tali. (he survived by the way.)
When it asked for a leader for team 2, I always picked Garrus. He was in the Turian military for years and worked with C-sec. He succesfully led a small team of vigilantes on Omega and wrecked the mercs and gangs there. The only reason his team got killed on Omega was Sedonis betraying him.
When it asked me to choose someone to create a biotic shield to protect us from the swarms I knew you had to choose Jack or Samarra. I chose Samarra because she's a 1000-year-old Asari Justicar. Though I'm pretty sure Jack would have worked as well. Both deciding to have Garrus lead team 2 and choosing Samarra payed off for me.
When given the option to have someone guide the survivors back to the ship I chose Jack because I remembered the carnage she caused on Purgatory. She was single-handedly blasting through walls and laying battle mechs and gaurds out... Though I think you can choose any member and they will survive for this one.

My whole crew survived.

Modifié par andy christo, 04 février 2010 - 10:56 .

[spm1138]

I was pretty worried about every decision I made on the last mission.

[Ewing5150]

spm1138 wrote...

I was pretty worried about every decision I made on the last mission.

Same here. I was literally on the edge of my seat.