20813 réponses à ce sujet

[Firmijn]

gneissguy2003 wrote...

[Stuff]


Sorry for the rant.

I agree with you on most things, she gave me the same feeling:o
But when it comes to the council, I think that at that point a squadmember just has to say' screw the council'. Its the same at the rachni queen. One says yes, the other no. If you took Liara and sweet kaiden I suppose it would have been kaiden who said screw the council/rachi, and then people would have the same "what de hell did you just say expericence":?

In short, I think that that particulair sentence doesnt truly have to be like how tali sees it.

[gneissguy2003]

Firmijn wrote...

gneissguy2003 wrote...

[Stuff]


Sorry for the rant.

I agree with you on most things, she gave me the same feeling:o
But when it comes to the council, I think that at that point a squadmember just has to say' screw the council'. Its the same at the rachni queen. One says yes, the other no. If you took Liara and sweet kaiden I suppose it would have been kaiden who said screw the council/rachi, and then people would have the same "what de hell did you just say expericence":?

In short, I think that that particulair sentence doesnt truly have to be like how tali sees it.

I guess that's possible. I'm playing through ME1 again and I'll have to test that out.

[Mkrgross]

Mondo47 wrote...

royceclemens wrote...

I am heartened by the fact that while Talimancers apparently have NO SENSE OF HUMOR WHATSOEVER, Miranda and Jack being hot for each other has become our running gag.

I hate comparing threads and all, but... Clearly our code is superior. We talk of serious business while not letting it become "seriuz bizniss."

One of the cool things is that we can analyze and discuss the component parts of Jack's scenes instead od the whole, which I will attempt to do, if you'll indulge me. Check out 0:28-1:00 of the video gneissguy put up a couple of weeks back.



It isn't the conversation in and of itself, but the way it's shot. With the exception of the one cut to focus on her face at 0:51, they pulled off a sweet-as-all-hell 360 degree camera pan around Jack as she told her story. A lesser person, a cretinous person, would have turned this into three or four shots.

To me this really lends to how cornered Jack feels in this situation. This is her Break-Glass-In-Case-Of-Emergency story to ward off anyone she might think will get too close. How many people you think she told that story to? Parting with it means letting Shepard in, and she might as well let the whole world in. The way the camera almost invasively moves around her in a full circle underlines that this is the one thing she can't run from.

It's the little things like that which add up to the bigger picture. Well, I'm a film guy, so I thought it was interesting at least.

Circles like a shark, don't it? Poor little Jack's heart, bobbing in the water while Shepard bides his time waiting to roll his eyes back and take a bite...

Way back I did two years of film at college, and my chops are so ingrained and rusted-solid I never even noticed the camera tracking around her until you pointed it out. Seriously, I hate the way that I was only taught to notice pretentious bull**** like seven minute crane shots or seven minute continuous static camera or contrazooms, or my pet hate (it's like shearing teeth in half with a dremel tool to me) - screen-wipes... people that use them in the 21st century without irony need to be fed to the varren, that means you, George ****ing Lucas!

I digress. My point being, I never even noticed how nice the camerawork is in general in Jack's basement - thanks Uncle Royce. There's limited space, the walls, ceiling and floor intrude constantly, the lighting is not exactly friendly (being dull red or a single-point bare-lightbulb glare)... would have been nice to see some long shadows getting in on the act. It makes all the other 'relationship' locations (and the scenes within them) seem really restrained creatively-speaking.

Thinking about it, Miranda and Shepard's scenes go back and forth like a tennis match; the shots matching up (framing wise) a lot of the time. Tali's seem to have a lot of closeups (as does Thane's, but his has some inward tracking too, framing him and a Femme-Shep a couple of times.) and makes a lot of Shep and her being close (there's more touching in their scenes too, even prior to the big 'confession' scene that precedes the Omega 4 Hot Action Commander sequence. There's a tiny bit of touching in Miranda's one (I kept shrieking "Stop pawing me!") and none in Jack's... all very interesting, how these visual relationships are built up by interaction and camera work, and how much they suit the 'lovestyles' of the characters who are hot for Shepard.

And I feel even more stupid now, learning that my 'denial' quote is actually a Mark Twain, and I've been using it for years without knowing it!



Sorry Bobby, but it is Twain after all!

I could make these things all day...

There is an unwritten rule, that if you use a quote more than 3 times the quote becomes yours, or so I was told. (Or at least you do not have to referance where it came from anymore).

Modifié par Mkrgross, 31 mars 2010 - 07:55 .

[Neccrid]

Jackal904 wrote...

royceclemens wrote...

It isn't the conversation in and of itself, but the way it's shot. With the exception of the one cut to focus on her face at 0:51, they pulled off a sweet-as-all-hell 360 degree camera pan around Jack as she told her story. A lesser person, a cretinous person, would have turned this into three or four shots.

To me this really lends to how cornered Jack feels in this situation. This is her Break-Glass-In-Case-Of-Emergency story to ward off anyone she might think will get too close. How many people you think she told that story to? Parting with it means letting Shepard in, and she might as well let the whole world in. The way the camera almost invasively moves around her in a full circle underlines that this is the one thing she can't run from.

It's the little things like that which add up to the bigger picture. Well, I'm a film guy, so I thought it was interesting at least.

Yeah I thought the camera work on that scene was exceptional. The rotating camera at that part adds an additional sense of drama and significance to what Jack is saying. I really like how they rotate in when Jack was talking about Murtock's message, and how they zoom in perfectly right after that. The camera work during the entire scene is simply amazing. This scene with Jack is a great example of how BioWare goes above and beyond to make an incredible deep game.

I have a save that is right before the conversation that initiates this scene with Jack, so I've seen it alot :happy:

And I must say it's one of the best screen work / angle work and whatever else that can be seen in a game.  There's just something about this scene (as with the romance scene at the end) that give you a certain connection with Jack.  I just never felt to engaged with the other characters as I do with Jack so I don't bother with them, it's always to Jack.

[royceclemens]

Yeah, it is kind of weird calling it "camerawork," as this is a video game and no actual cameras were used.

[Mondo47]

royceclemens wrote...

Yeah, it is kind of weird calling it "camerawork," as this is a video game and no actual cameras were used.

That's something I can never get around - it always just is camerawork to me, camera or no camera. I think it's the only thing in my limited vocabulary of English and Bad English that really communicates it to me.

To me at least, it's alien to see it as anything else.

[Mondo47]

Mkrgross wrote...

There is an unwritten rule, that if you use a quote more than 3 times the quote becomes yours, or so I was told. (Or at least you do not have to referance where it came from anymore).

It's Twain, man! You have to give the man props - he was a legend! Some people, like Mark Twain, Groucho Marx, Bill Shatner, Warren Ellis and Henry Rollins must always be given credit for being the marvelous wordsmiths they are. Forgive me Father, for I am a worm... heh heh heh heh...

Whoa... and now I'm drifting into the Highlander script unconciously. Sign I need a drink if there ever was one

[Mkrgross]

Mondo47 wrote...

Mkrgross wrote...

There is an unwritten rule, that if you use a quote more than 3 times the quote becomes yours, or so I was told. (Or at least you do not have to referance where it came from anymore).

It's Twain, man! You have to give the man props - he was a legend! Some people, like Mark Twain, Groucho Marx, Bill Shatner, Warren Ellis and Henry Rollins must always be given credit for being the marvelous wordsmiths they are. Forgive me Father, for I am a worm... heh heh heh heh...

Whoa... and now I'm drifting into the Highlander script unconciously. Sign I need a drink if there ever was one

Ha! I totally agree. There are certain people you give credit where credit is due. I personally read a lot and quote many authors and people, but if I had to give credit to everyone, the conversations would be a bit annoying.

I am also a HUGE Henry Rollins fan, and the 'Original' Highlander was an excellent movie.

Modifié par Mkrgross, 31 mars 2010 - 09:26 .

[Jackal904]

adriano_c wrote...

Interestingly, I've also noticed that fans of that particular character are by far the most belligerent and intolerant on these boards. Just watching them hijack and derail threads they perceive as besmirching the "honour" of their favourite is embarrassing.

You know I've noticed this too. I know three people well who have played Mass Effect 2, two of them are incredibly immature, like text book definition of immature. And the other is pretty mature. The two who are extremely immature  and hate Jack and think she is a "tatoo'd freak", they both went for Miranda. The mature one went for Miranda first and he doesn't hate Jack and he wants to romance her in his second playthrough. Now I'm not saying that all people who romance Miranda and hate Jack are immature, but I think it's obvious that there is a trend between a person's maturity level and who their LI of choice is. It's quite interesting really.

gneissguy2003 wrote...

If by chance there are any other scenes, with or without Jack, that people are interested in possibly having recorded and posted up on the "Tube" for checking out, let me know. I'm more than happy to fire up Fraps and make some recordings.

I'm curious to see the scene where Jack dies when you choose her as the fire team leader, when you have romanced her. She says something about knowing she would die because she was too happy with you. Watching it will be very heartbreaking but I'm so curious to see it. And I will never do it in one of my playthroughs even though I could just reload a save.

Booglarize wrote...

 

Mondo47 wrote...

That's a line there just to slam the door on further conversation. A little more nuance would be nice.

I agree; I think a slightly less erratic response would've been more appropriate - showing some obvious disappointment on her part, sure, but not the complete 180 she does in that clip.

You can tell her that you want to end your relationship with her because you are concerned for her health. So the option is their. I guess they just needed a renegade option to give you the option to crush Tali deuchily (yes I just made that word up).

gneissguy2003 wrote...

Firmijn wrote...

In short, I think that that particulair sentence doesnt truly have to be like how tali sees it.

I guess that's possible. I'm playing through ME1 again and I'll have to test that out.

No need. www.youtube.com/watch

Neccrid wrote...
I have a save that is right before the conversation that initiates this scene with Jack, so I've seen it alot

And I must say it's one of the best screen work / angle work and whatever else that can be seen in a game.  There's just something about this scene (as with the romance scene at the end) that give you a certain connection with Jack.  I just never felt to engaged with the other characters as I do with Jack so I don't bother with them, it's always to Jack.

Same here. Jack killed my interest in all other characters, not just other female characters. Tali was my favorite Mass Effect character until I ran into Jack. I went into ME2 with my intentions dead set on romancing Tali. Now I couldn't care less about Tali. I was a huge Garrus fan in ME2, I brought him with me every where and he was my main bud. Now, while I still like him, I don't care about him nearly as much as I used to.

[Chaos-fusion]

Firmijn wrote...

gneissguy2003 wrote...

[Stuff]


Sorry for the rant.

*snip*

In short, I think that that particulair sentence doesnt truly have to be like how tali sees it.

Yep. With the rachni, you can even have Ashley take the "we can't kill them!" stance. It's one reason I disliked characters in ME1 - almost everything off the ships was interchangable. It's like they were just sandwiched into certain roles, because the player might not realise what choices they have.Because of course, your entire audience are idiots! (Sorry, sorry, that's just one of the issues I have with ME1. I'm not bitter though, no. ) I'm really glad they didn't do this in ME2. I can just imagine at the end of the game:

TIM: Sheperd, give Cerberus the base! We can use it!

Other party member: No! It's too dangerous, we need to destroy this place!

Jack: The reapers are a threat [other partmy member]! Sheperd, we need to let Cerberus have this base.

It just wouldn't work, heh. (Apologies, I lack Mondo's flair for writing this stuff )

Jackal904 wrote...

Now I'm not saying that all people who
romance Miranda and hate Jack are immature, but I think it's obvious
that there is a trend between a person's maturity level and who their LI
of choice is. It's quite interesting really.

I don't know how
it reflects on maturity, but some people just like going for the obvious
fanservice choice. Both my brother, and a friend went for Miranda
because they thought she was the 'right' choice, just like playing a
male was 'right'. .. then again, they do lack maturity sometimes, so
this is moot.

No need. www.youtube.com/watch

Heh, I wonder if someone's got a video of that for all the
characters.

Modifié par Chaos-fusion, 31 mars 2010 - 10:27 .

[gneissguy2003]

Jackal904 wrote...

gneissguy2003 wrote...

If by chance there are any other scenes, with or without Jack, that people are interested in possibly having recorded and posted up on the "Tube" for checking out, let me know. I'm more than happy to fire up Fraps and make some recordings.

I'm curious to see the scene where Jack dies when you choose her as the fire team leader, when you have romanced her. She says something about knowing she would die because she was too happy with you. Watching it will be very heartbreaking but I'm so curious to see it. And I will never do it in one of my playthroughs even though I could just reload a save.

I've already got a recording of this back home. There are actually two different lines that Jack can say in that scenario, even if you did romance her. I've been able to get one of them to play, but I'll try to get the other one recorded and post it up tonight or tomorrow.

Jackal904 wrote...

gneissguy2003 wrote...

Firmijn wrote...

In short, I think that that particulair sentence doesnt truly have to be like how tali sees it.

I guess that's possible. I'm playing through ME1 again and I'll have to test that out.

No need. www.youtube.com/watch

Thanks for clearing that up. It doesn't necessarily do much for my opinion of Tali, though. Still, it's kind of nice to know now that it was more of an issue with how Bioware handled the game as opposed to an overall character flaw.

Modifié par gneissguy2003, 31 mars 2010 - 10:52 .

[Jackal904]

So I looked up what other roles Courtney Taylor has played. She does the voice of Serina, the A.I. chick from Halo Wars. She's like Halo War's version of Cortana from the other Halo games. I went back and listened to her and it sounds like Jack trying to talk with an accent lol. She played another A.I. in C&C 3 as the Scrin A.I.. She was in an episode of iCarly, and she played quite a few roles in Saints Row 2. She played Juhani in kotor, did some additional voices in DA:O, and plays some unknown voices in the new old republic game that hasn't been released yet.

Here's the full list of all the roles she has done. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1057696/

Modifié par Jackal904, 31 mars 2010 - 11:44 .

[Neccrid]

Jackal904 wrote...

adriano_c wrote...

Interestingly, I've also noticed that fans of that particular character are by far the most belligerent and intolerant on these boards. Just watching them hijack and derail threads they perceive as besmirching the "honour" of their favourite is embarrassing.

You know I've noticed this too. I know three people well who have played Mass Effect 2, two of them are incredibly immature, like text book definition of immature. And the other is pretty mature. The two who are extremely immature  and hate Jack and think she is a "tatoo'd freak", they both went for Miranda. The mature one went for Miranda first and he doesn't hate Jack and he wants to romance her in his second playthrough. Now I'm not saying that all people who romance Miranda and hate Jack are immature, but I think it's obvious that there is a trend between a person's maturity level and who their LI of choice is. It's quite interesting really.

gneissguy2003 wrote...

If by chance there are any other scenes, with or without Jack, that people are interested in possibly having recorded and posted up on the "Tube" for checking out, let me know. I'm more than happy to fire up Fraps and make some recordings.

I'm curious to see the scene where Jack dies when you choose her as the fire team leader, when you have romanced her. She says something about knowing she would die because she was too happy with you. Watching it will be very heartbreaking but I'm so curious to see it. And I will never do it in one of my playthroughs even though I could just reload a save.

Booglarize wrote...

 

Mondo47 wrote...

That's a line there just to slam the door on further conversation. A little more nuance would be nice.

I agree; I think a slightly less erratic response would've been more appropriate - showing some obvious disappointment on her part, sure, but not the complete 180 she does in that clip.

You can tell her that you want to end your relationship with her because you are concerned for her health. So the option is their. I guess they just needed a renegade option to give you the option to crush Tali deuchily (yes I just made that word up).

gneissguy2003 wrote...

Firmijn wrote...

In short, I think that that particulair sentence doesnt truly have to be like how tali sees it.

I guess that's possible. I'm playing through ME1 again and I'll have to test that out.

No need. www.youtube.com/watch

Neccrid wrote...
I have a save that is right before the conversation that initiates this scene with Jack, so I've seen it alot

And I must say it's one of the best screen work / angle work and whatever else that can be seen in a game.  There's just something about this scene (as with the romance scene at the end) that give you a certain connection with Jack.  I just never felt to engaged with the other characters as I do with Jack so I don't bother with them, it's always to Jack.

Same here. Jack killed my interest in all other characters, not just other female characters. Tali was my favorite Mass Effect character until I ran into Jack. I went into ME2 with my intentions dead set on romancing Tali. Now I couldn't care less about Tali. I was a huge Garrus fan in ME2, I brought him with me every where and he was my main bud. Now, while I still like him, I don't care about him nearly as much as I used to.

Just something clicks with me for Jack, it just feels right.  I like alot of the other ME charatcers, Wrex, Garrus, ect.. but Jack just outshines all of them for me.  Jack is that perfect character that a player would want to engage with.  With Jack, the player has the ability to really feel a sense of 'Wow, I just completely reshaped the way this girl will live her life".  You actually give Jack purpose, without Shepard she'd be doing her usual thing and probably wind up seriously demented or dead. 

I've played many games before but never before, I can honestly say, have I felt such a strong connection with any character as I do with Jack.. I still don't truly understand what drives this feeling but it's just there.

[Neccrid]

Jackal904 wrote...

So I looked up what other roles Courtney Taylor has played. She does the voice of Serina, the A.I. chick from Halo Wars. She's like Halo War's version of Cortana from the other Halo games. I went back and listened to her and it sounds like Jack trying to talk with an accent lol. She played another A.I. in C&C 3 as the Scrin A.I.. She was in an episode of iCarly, and she played quite a few roles in Saints Row 2. She played Juhani in kotor, did some additional voices in DA:O, and plays some unknown voices in the new old republic game that hasn't been released yet.

Here's the full list of all the roles she has done. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1057696/

Sweet! If she plays a similar type of role in The Old Republic (But with a star wars spin to it) it's gonna be Jack love for me all over again, lol. 

[Jackal904]

Neccrid wrote...

 With Jack, the player has the ability to really feel a sense of 'Wow, I just completely reshaped the way this girl will live her life".  You actually give Jack purpose, without Shepard she'd be doing her usual thing and probably wind up seriously demented or dead. 

I think this is what creates such a strong connection to her fans. I know I helped a bunch of people in ME1 and ME2 and I've saved the galaxy twice now, but with romancing Jack I actually feel like I've truely helped someone. I've also never felt this way before with a video game character. I know it's just a video game, but I guess it just shows how immersive the game is and how realistic the characters can feel. It's a huge compliment to BioWare that a video game character can make anyone feel that way.

[Neccrid]

Jackal904 wrote...

Neccrid wrote...

 With Jack, the player has the ability to really feel a sense of 'Wow, I just completely reshaped the way this girl will live her life".  You actually give Jack purpose, without Shepard she'd be doing her usual thing and probably wind up seriously demented or dead. 

I think this is what creates such a strong connection to her fans. I know I helped a bunch of people in ME1 and ME2 and I've saved the galaxy twice now, but with romancing Jack I actually feel like I've truely helped someone. I've also never felt this way before with a video game character. I know it's just a video game, but I guess it just shows how immersive the game is and how realistic the characters can feel. It's a huge compliment to BioWare that a video game character can make anyone feel that way.

Indeed, huge props to BioWare on creating such a great character.  My Mass Effect 2 experience truly wouldn't of been as great as it was without Jack. 

[BobbyTheI]

Jackal904 wrote...

So I looked up what other roles Courtney Taylor has played. She does the voice of Serina, the A.I. chick from Halo Wars. She's like Halo War's version of Cortana from the other Halo games. I went back and listened to her and it sounds like Jack trying to talk with an accent lol. She played another A.I. in C&C 3 as the Scrin A.I.. She was in an episode of iCarly, and she played quite a few roles in Saints Row 2. She played Juhani in kotor, did some additional voices in DA:O, and plays some unknown voices in the new old republic game that hasn't been released yet.

Here's the full list of all the roles she has done. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1057696/

I still can't get over the role she played in "Duck, Duck, Goose!"  I'd name it here, but I get the feeling the filters would probably defeat the purpose.

(Spent my free time today finding out how to extract the audio from ME1.  Yes, ME1-only squadmates, even you are not safe from my plans.  MWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!)

[Dominus5412]

Not even Michael Ironside could save Highlander 2.

[Jackal904]

BobbyTheI wrote...

Jackal904 wrote...

So I looked up what other roles Courtney Taylor has played. She does the voice of Serina, the A.I. chick from Halo Wars. She's like Halo War's version of Cortana from the other Halo games. I went back and listened to her and it sounds like Jack trying to talk with an accent lol. She played another A.I. in C&C 3 as the Scrin A.I.. She was in an episode of iCarly, and she played quite a few roles in Saints Row 2. She played Juhani in kotor, did some additional voices in DA:O, and plays some unknown voices in the new old republic game that hasn't been released yet.

Here's the full list of all the roles she has done. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1057696/

I still can't get over the role she played in "Duck, Duck, Goose!"  I'd name it here, but I get the feeling the filters would probably defeat the purpose.

Lmao "La Penis Woman"? Wtf?

[royceclemens]

In the same movie with the guy who played Legion, no less.



Does anyone here know who Taylor was in DAO? I checked the wiki and it said "Farinden," and I have no idea who the hell that character is.



I think I may have found her as the last gang leader you have to kill to complete that Chanter's Board quest in Denerim, but I'm not sure.



Fuirthermore, she did additional voices in ME2, as well. Anyone have an idea where else she might have popped up?

[Dominus5412]

I haven't the foggiest. Some voices are just easier to spot than others.

[BobbyTheI]

royceclemens wrote...

In the same movie with the guy who played Legion, no less.

Ha, didn't notice that one.

"This unit wishes to inquire how you were given the appellation 'La Penis Woman.'"

"Dammit, has Miranda been running her mouth again?"

[Sago_mulch]

Firmijn wrote...

Sago_mulch wrote...

wat..someome made a tali blow up doll?

haha

You sir/madam,

Just doomed mankind:?

I think I found the doll

[Jackal904]

Sago_mulch wrote...

Lmao that's great.

[Ilzairspar]

Sago_mulch wrote...

Firmijn wrote...

Sago_mulch wrote...

wat..someome made a tali blow up doll?

haha

You sir/madam,

Just doomed mankind:?

I think I found the doll

ARGH!!!! MY EYES!

:ahem: 

Anyway I've noticed that ever since playing ME 2 I'm having a bit of trouble getting into ME 1 again.  I was wondering if anyone else is haveing the same problem. 

Or is it just me.