20813 réponses à ce sujet

[Booglarize]

Mondo47 wrote...


Not wanting to tread this ground again, but as much as I thought Alistair was an annoying simp, I was not going to inflict her deal on him... it'd be like allowing someone to abuse a child because you find the kid irritating. 

Eh, I think Alistair would've gotten over it. I mean sure, him being a virgin and all would maybe make it a bit more awkward but I doubt whether he'd be traumatized for life or anything.

Getting back to the broader point, though - my issue with DA:O wasn't that the ending wasn't happy. It just felt... pretty lame, almost, and kind of fell flat for me. Neither the "bad" nor the (relatively) "good" outcomes felt particularly satisfying, and the plot justifications for why certain things had to happen the way they did (especially towards the end) weren't particularly strong. I think it's partially due to the fact that Origins wasn't really meant to be the absolute end of things, so maybe they didn't really attach too much importance to the ending of that particular game - unfortunately, they chose to follow it up with Awakening, which (from a story perspective) was even more lame and left things even worse off.

I'm cautiously optimistic of a better outcome in ME3, if only because Mass Effect crew know exactly where they want this game to stand - that is, the final part of a trilogy. Seems to be a lot less uncertainty with regards to their ultimate vision for the series. 

[royceclemens]

Booglarize wrote...
I'm cautiously optimistic of a better outcome in ME3, if only because Mass Effect crew know exactly where they want this game to stand - that is, the final part of a trilogy. Seems to be a lot less uncertainty with regards to their ultimate vision for the series. 

In a way, I'm happy that DA keeps spectacularly screwing itself.  That's the one they experiment on.  If it fails, then they don't carry any of the failed lessons over to MASS EFFECT, which is the money franchise. 

Jack's getting more and more popular, as she's gonna make it another day out of ME SURVIVOR, most popular among women, outlasted three of the other four female LIs in the deathmatch, etc.

Do you think it's more that people are taking a shine to our girl, or is it that they're just getting used to her.  I do have to say that the latter might be an option, for as of late I've gotten used to... Miranda... God that felt dirty to type.

[adriano_c]

Booglarize wrote...

Getting back to the broader point, though - my issue with DA:O wasn't that the ending wasn't happy. It just felt... pretty lame, almost, and kind of fell flat for me. Neither the "bad" nor the (relatively) "good" outcomes felt particularly satisfying, and the plot justifications for why certain things had to happen the way they did (especially towards the end) weren't particularly strong. I think it's partially due to the fact that Origins wasn't really meant to be the absolute end of things, so maybe they didn't really attach too much importance to the ending of that particular game - unfortunately, they chose to follow it up with Awakening, which (from a story perspective) was even more lame and left things even worse off.

I can't say I was overly impressed with anything story-related in Dragon Age at all. It felt so recycled and dull. The world itself was hardly anything original and felt especially sterile to me (it honestly seemed like some product of a "generate your own medieval fantasy world now!" type of machine, very much by the numbers).

It's saving grace, however, was the party. I don't think I really disliked any of them (perhaps Oghren, if any).

[Mondo47]

Booglarize wrote...

Mondo47 wrote...


Not wanting to tread this ground again, but as much as I thought Alistair was an annoying simp, I was not going to inflict her deal on him... it'd be like allowing someone to abuse a child because you find the kid irritating. 

Eh, I think Alistair would've gotten over it. I mean sure, him being a virgin and all would maybe make it a bit more awkward but I doubt whether he'd be traumatized for life or anything.

Getting back to the broader point, though - my issue with DA:O wasn't that the ending wasn't happy. It just felt... pretty lame, almost, and kind of fell flat for me. Neither the "bad" nor the (relatively) "good" outcomes felt particularly satisfying, and the plot justifications for why certain things had to happen the way they did (especially towards the end) weren't particularly strong. I think it's partially due to the fact that Origins wasn't really meant to be the absolute end of things, so maybe they didn't really attach too much importance to the ending of that particular game - unfortunately, they chose to follow it up with Awakening, which (from a story perspective) was even more lame and left things even worse off.

I'm cautiously optimistic of a better outcome in ME3, if only because Mass Effect crew know exactly where they want this game to stand - that is, the final part of a trilogy. Seems to be a lot less uncertainty with regards to their ultimate vision for the series. 

I don't the act would have traumatised him... I meant more that I didn't want him to have to live with the fact that Baby Cthulhu was his child, especially when it goes on the telegraphed-twenty-years-in-advance Godzilla-style rampage (which I suppose is conceivably an interesting plot element for a male character who forms a relationship with Morrigan, a'la the old king in Beowulf, but I was locked out of that because of playing a woman... one who turned out to be gay because I couldn't romance Sten, I didn't fully trust Zev and as for knocking boots with Alistair... we've tread that ground already). And damn, I could have handled a bad ending where people died and the kingdom went to ****, what annoyed me was the idea that this was going to be an ongoing series and I ended up dead. I was expecting something a little more epic-fantasy storyline, with part two following part one maybe a year or two later. Same character, ongoing adventure. Not something that smacked of me having to make a new character every damn time and each story experience being seperate. If I wanted that, I'd play a Final Fantasy game.

[Booglarize]

adriano_c wrote...

I can't say I was overly impressed with anything story-related in Dragon Age at all. It felt so recycled and dull. The world itself was hardly anything original and felt especially sterile to me (it honestly seemed like some product of a "generate your own medieval fantasy world now!" type of machine, very much by the numbers).

It's saving grace, however, was the party. I don't think I really disliked any of them (perhaps Oghren, if any).

Exactly. I agree completely - the game's single biggest strength was its characters. I can't even recall the sheer number of times I tried making this point over at the DA forums, trying to get people to see just how much they were losing with BioWare casually discarding all of the game's best characters because they wanted to push this expansion through. Unfortunately, most of my exhortations fell on deaf ears, and I eventually left the DA forums for good and settled down in ME territory - which is where I came across the Jack thread, so I guess it all worked out in the end. 

I don't think ME will make the same mistake. They already seem to be mindful of this - the Ash/Kaiden and Liara brouhaha aside, they did a much at ensuring that characters from ME1 would get at least a bit of decent screen time in ME2. I see no reason why they won't do that for the third game as well. 


@ Mondo47 

Yeah, I guess I kinda see what you mean. I guess I just generally have a "Suck it up, man!" approach when it comes to utilitarian calculations weighing personal unease against real-world consequences. As for DA's future, all of us may well be in the same boat as you, Ultimate Sacrifice or no - when I was last at the forums the majority opinion seemed to be that Awakening was the end of the road and that the next proper sequel would entail starting over with a completely new character. Of course I hope that's not the case, but regardless, that's what I'm bracing for. 

Modifié par Booglarize, 17 avril 2010 - 11:52 .

[Booglarize]

yfhfrg wrote...

That...sucks. I
haven't followed anything about the game in a while, but wasn't there
going to be a replacement warden to play as if you imported a dead
character? Guess they cut him out so they could rush it.<_<

The Orlesian warden is still there. Unfortunately, if you play as a warden from Orlais, you get stuck with a default storyline that doesn't take into account things that your Ultimate Sacrifice warden may have done. I won't say which things, because that may be spoiling it a little (though some of them should be obvious). The only other option is the bring-your-dead-character-back-to-life retcon approach. 

Personally, I think Awakening should've just gone full-Lazarus project rather than beating about the bush the way they did. 

Modifié par Booglarize, 18 avril 2010 - 12:09 .

[Dominus5412]

I have to jump in here and give a huge +1 to everything Mondo is saying.

[Mondo47]

Booglarize wrote...

yfhfrg wrote...

That...sucks. I
haven't followed anything about the game in a while, but wasn't there
going to be a replacement warden to play as if you imported a dead
character? Guess they cut him out so they could rush it.<_<

The Orlesian warden is still there. Unfortunately, if you play as a warden from Orlais, you get stuck with a default storyline that doesn't take into account things that your Ultimate Sacrifice warden may have done. I won't say which things, because that may be spoiling it a little (though some of them should be obvious). The only other option is the bring-your-dead-character-back-to-life retcon approach. 

Personally, I think Awakening should've just gone full-Lazarus project rather than beating about the bush the way they did. 

I'd have accepted coming back from the dead in that storyline much better. It makes sense there. I could have come back from the dead because the Gods decided it wasn't my time (because the swines from under the ground were still on the prowl and all that), and then I could have gone on to save the world, et cetera et cetera.

And the idea of a world being saved by a lesbian couple just tickles me so much (or a couple of gay guys - either would just rock because, well, it breaks the norm)

That great goes-on-forever epilogue at the end too just seemed to dump on everything that had happened and lock all the threads off for good... kind of shafted them for putting expansions in because we knew that this was going to happen to that character and so on. Should have just ended with my funeral and everyone being all happy-clappy because the world was put to rights (or was it - cue the dramatic chord).

[Jackal904]

I hope in ME3 they make it much more difficult to get the perfect ending. You have to suck a bit at video games if you lose a squadmate on the final mission. If you lost someone's loyalty in an arguement, then that's understandable. But if everyone is loyal, and someone still dies, you might want to stick with Wii Sports.

And they need to make the "best" dialogue choices less obvious. Right now the dialogue wheel might as well just have three options labaled, "Best", "Meh", "Worst", because it's so obvious what the best option is.

I can picture there being an ending where everyone lives, an ending where you have to sacrifice yourself because you ****ed up a bit, and an ending where you doomed the galaxy because of a bunch of stupid decisions. That would be ideal.
And to make this remotely on topic, I bring pictures!













None of these are from my own games. Some I printscreened from this youtube vid and the others I found on google images. I like the one about **** slapping Miranda .

Modifié par Jackal904, 18 avril 2010 - 03:17 .

[Chaos-fusion]

Nice pics there. Google does throw up some nice stuff sometimes. (Now if only I could unsee the Garrus/Tali art it threw up for me the other day.. ) I've seen that slap Miranda one before, and it made me smile. :happy: I like her (I know, I know.. I'm annoyed at myself for liking the obvious fanservice) but I really wish that option had been in the game. That's probably the one point where I wanted to dig my claws into a party member for their nonsense. .. Grr!

Modifié par Chaos-fusion, 18 avril 2010 - 01:55 .

[Booglarize]

Jackal904 wrote...

I hope in ME3 they make it much more difficult to get the perfect ending. You have to suck a bit at video games if you lose a squadmate on the final mission. If you lost someone's loyalty in an arguement, then that's understandable. But if everyone is loyal, and someone still dies, you might want to stick with Wii Sports.

The only time I ever lost a squadmate was on my very first playthrough. Miranda was the one who didn't make it, because I didn't take her side in the argument (paragon score wasn't high enough to avoid it), and thus lost her loyalty and wasn't able to get enough paragon points to win it back. 

Which itself is kind of interesting, in retrospect. This was my very first go, before I had really discovered Jack - my character was romancing Tali then - and yet, when the confrontation happened, I knew I had to take Jack's side. I think that was the beginning of my realization that there was more to her than the advertised "psychopath" persona.  

Of course, that decision of mine also ended up costing Miranda her life, which was... unfortunate. 

[MHRazer]

Jackal904 wrote...

And they need to make the "best" dialogue choices less obvious. Right now the dialogue wheel might as well just have three options labaled, "Best", "Meh", "Worst", because it's so obvious what the best option is.

If they do that, they need to give a bit more information on what you're actually choosing in the dialog wheel. There are plenty of times throughout the game where I pick a wheel choice that I think will result in Shep saying one thing, but it comes out totally different. I'd hate to have them jumble up the good/neutral/bad options only to end up with my Shepard saying something ridiculous that I never would have chosen, had I known the actual dialog. 

[Booglarize]

MHRazer wrote...

Jackal904 wrote...

And they need to make the "best" dialogue choices less obvious. Right now the dialogue wheel might as well just have three options labaled, "Best", "Meh", "Worst", because it's so obvious what the best option is.

If they do that, they need to give a bit more information on what you're actually choosing in the dialog wheel. There are plenty of times throughout the game where I pick a wheel choice that I think will result in Shep saying one thing, but it comes out totally different. I'd hate to have them jumble up the good/neutral/bad options only to end up with my Shepard saying something ridiculous that I never would have chosen, had I known the actual dialog. 

I agree with this. I think one way around might be to keep the same layout for paragon/renegade/neutral options while making outcomes a bit less straightforward - perhaps having more situations where paragon options leave you obviously worse off, for example.

[Jackal904]

Booglarize wrote...

MHRazer wrote...

Jackal904 wrote...

And they need to make the "best" dialogue choices less obvious. Right now the dialogue wheel might as well just have three options labaled, "Best", "Meh", "Worst", because it's so obvious what the best option is.

If they do that, they need to give a bit more information on what you're actually choosing in the dialog wheel. There are plenty of times throughout the game where I pick a wheel choice that I think will result in Shep saying one thing, but it comes out totally different. I'd hate to have them jumble up the good/neutral/bad options only to end up with my Shepard saying something ridiculous that I never would have chosen, had I known the actual dialog. 

I agree with this. I think one way around might be to keep the same layout for paragon/renegade/neutral options while making outcomes a bit less straightforward - perhaps having more situations where paragon options leave you obviously worse off, for example.

Yeah good point, I agree.

[Quaay]

[Torrential]

Jackal904 wrote...

I hope in ME3 they make it much more difficult to get the perfect ending. You have to suck a bit at video games if you lose a squadmate on the final mission. If you lost someone's loyalty in an arguement, then that's understandable. But if everyone is loyal, and someone still dies, you might want to stick with Wii Sports.

I agree in part, but it isn't all as clear cut as you make out.

Following the Renegade Cerberus playthrough, I kept the Krogan and Geth on ice for their study.

Now I am not sure if having more squadmates covering him would mean Thane would have survived the first specialist assignment, he comments he is comfortable in the heat, and used to sneaking around vents, so he seemed a reasonble choice at first.

Thanes death meant 3 squadmates inactive, do numbers again impact the success of the final fireteams mission? Mordin died here for me, but it might well of been related to the fact I kept the Krogan on ice, their plots(fates) might well be interlinked in ME3 concerning the survival of the Krogan species.

Like I say a few variables are not all that clear, I need a few more playthroughs to get solid answers. Picking Tali for the vents is the first obvious change, to see if her speed changes both results.

Modifié par Torrential, 18 avril 2010 - 08:31 .

[HighMoon]

So what do you guys think Jack's age is? It's never stated anywhere in the game as far as I can tell and the "Universe" section of the main page doesn't say either. I'd assume she's one of the younger characters in the game however. Probably somewhere in her 20's.

[adriano_c]

I believe, considering what can be gathered from some ME novel and in-game, that she's anywhere from 20 to 30-years-old.



She strikes me as being 22-25ish.

[Mondo47]

Ah, so we are about to lose Jack in this Mass Effect: Survivor thing... she suddenly got about 50+ votes overnight that stormed her past Miranda... hmmm...

Who shall we blame? Bitter Talimancers? The whole thing being a gip because someone brought ringers in? Or is it merely an epeen duel that has only one conclusion - Wrex winning - and thus a futile waste of time...

Well, I'd not put money on anyone but the big guy winning. And if he doesn't now, well, I would be very suspicious.

[Chaos-fusion]

I think her age is one of the many things we'll never know about her. She likely doesn't know herself. But I'd agree with adriano_c's estimate. That seems about right to me.

As for the survivor thing, someone mentioned that since biotics need to eat more, it'd be logical to off them first. And, I have to agree. I am still annoyed she's going to be out so soon though. Being a character that's made to try and be unlikable probably isn't helping her in this.

JohnnyDollar wrote...

Why annoyed?

I'm a straight women, so my corner of the market wasn't in mind ith her, so I suppose it's the feminist in me. Causes a knee-jerk reaction sometimes. It's silly really. I should direct my ire at whoever set up those not-so-subtle camera angles. ... Maybe I'm just bitter because I didn't like any of the options for Femsheps? No arse shots of Jacob leaning over the table, hmph..

Modifié par Chaos-fusion, 18 avril 2010 - 12:26 .

[Cypher0020]

hmmmm Jack's age? I'd put her around 25 or so.... I think