20813 réponses à ce sujet

[Booglarize]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

^I am aware of it, and have read a little about it. From what I remember reading, the game is about 20hrs long. That seems a little short to me. Other than that, it sounds pretty cool.

That's not necessarily too short - I think it took me roughly that much time to beat ME2 as well (on my first playthrough).

[Mondo47]

adriano_c wrote...

Artificial depth, sure.

"I have a lot of profound thoughts, I'm just not going to share them. Think of me as a "deep" person, though."

-edit. Funny thing is, you could maybe get away with this sort of stupidity in real life, but not in a story.

Pick up the damn gun already, Mr Chekhov, eh?

For better or worse, when someone designs a character as visually-detailed as Jack, the artists involved may well come up with facets of a backstory as they go along; ephemoral little things that mean something to them as they go... I just thought of about six off the top of my head: neat designs that could be worked into the whole, and would have a meaning if the character ever voiced it. Sure, it's no use to us locked up there in the artist's head, but it's there if it's ever needed.

I think Jack sitting down and explaining what they all mean would also be a complete anti-climax. I don't think we'd want to know everything, anyways; having little bits teased out over time would be much better. I keep meaning to write this scene I have in my head where Shepard is giving Jack a backrub and he asks what some of them mean; I'd come up with a few ideas of my own for meanings, a couple would be fairly basic, one would be a little more symbolic and philosophical (just to give Jack a hint of some deeper feelings and thoughts at earlier points in her life)... they'd all be little stories in their own right, and Shep would be getting the capsule lover's-version. In my mind at least, it's the only satisfying way for something like that to spool out in the story... it'd have to have some kind of spontaneity, some intimacy, or it'd be more soulless than reading aloud from a textbook. And the really unfortunate thing is that a scene like that would likely have no place in a game like Mass Effect; it'd be long, a bit too much of a cooldown in a very action-oriented game, and while it'd help draw characters into much more three-dimensional beings it would seem more at home in a movie (think how short the dialogue scenes on board the Normandy actually are in the majority of cases) than a game.

Here's hoping that they man up and give us at least a few of their tablescraps one day, but in this particular case, they'd damn well better do it right.

[Mondo47]

Jackal904 wrote...

JohnnyDollar wrote...

yorkj86 wrote...

@JD,

I wonder about that scar a lot.  Did someone attempt to cut her throat?    Is it from some kind of neck-restraint (collar)?

Good question, that was one of the reasons I uploaded it.  It's hard to tell with that angle.  The scar doesn't seem to go all the way around her neck, but I can't tell for sure.  So that gives me the impression that it was a cut/gash of some sorts.  With that said though, the scarring that we can see, also looks like something similar to what a collar could do.

Well if you look at the entire back of her neck it's clear that it was from surgery. Most likely an implant on her neck or the base of her skull done during her time at Teltin.

I'm not so sure the neck one is a Teltin leftover; compare it to all the other large scars, which have a very uniform colouration, are very straight and precise, and are (presumably) stretched by Jack's growth over the years. The one on her neck seems not to have a single contiguous line to it - it has fits and starts, almost as though something has sawn into her flesh manually (while the large scars have so much precision that a machine could have carved them). It has healed differently also; it's still like a canyon in her skin compared to every other scar which has become hypertrophic (suggesting no loss of tissue beneath the injury). The atrophic nature of the neck wound suggests something came out instead of went in...

Maybe one of her prisons lowjacked inmates in the neck and a tracker needed digging out? Or a malfunctioning or damaged implant needed removing? Maybe someone dug one of her implants out forcibly? Or some villain just held her down and did an ugly hatchet job of trying to saw her head off?

For all we know it might be from Teltin, but because of it's difference from the others I'm not entirely convinced. I just know that's the one that makes me wince the most.

[KendallX23]

has anyone seen black lagoon the anime...i think Jack is similar to the main character there(wich is a woman)...both badass women

[adriano_c]

@Mondo



Well, clearly Jack putting forth a treatise on her tattoos or conducting a powerpoint presentation wouldn't work, but something further needs to be uncovered about their "deeper meaning"; otherwise all that resplendent design becomes a waste, aside from looking cool. That is, if part of their intention was adding "depth of character". You're right, though, about any suitable exposition on the matter being out of place in ME (as it stands currently). However, I could see something in that vein happening in Dragon Age...one of the few good things that game has going for it, lol...



Also, I don't get the italicized reference.

[Mondo47]

adriano_c wrote...

@Mondo

Well, clearly Jack putting forth a treatise on her tattoos or conducting a powerpoint presentation wouldn't work, but something further needs to be uncovered about their "deeper meaning"; otherwise all that resplendent design becomes a waste, aside from looking cool. That is, if part of their intention was adding "depth of character". You're right, though, about any suitable exposition on the matter being out of place in ME (as it stands currently). However, I could see something in that vein happening in Dragon Age...one of the few good things that game has going for it, lol...

Also, I don't get the italicized reference.

Chekhov's Gun - in essence, if you put a gun on a table in a story, make sure some bugger uses it before the curtain comes down. If you go to the effort of putting something potentially significant in a story, don't squander it in other words :happy:

And yeah, I agree about Dragon Age there... loved the character development in it right up until the game screwed me (oh yes, I'm still sore)!

Modifié par Mondo47, 23 mai 2010 - 12:24 .

[LiquidGrape]

I think I made a mistake in revisiting Blade Runner so soon after Mass Effect 2.

- Now everything seems moronic. With one obvious exception.

[adriano_c]

Mondo47 wrote...

Chekhov's Gun - in essence, if you put a gun on a table in a story, make sure some bugger uses it before the curtain comes down. If you go to the effort of putting something potentially significant in a story, don't squander it in other words :happy:

And yeah, I agree about Dragon Age there... loved the character development in it right up until the game screwed me (oh yes, I'm still sore)!

Had to look it up just now. Perfectly sums up what I meant.

Other than that, cut Morrigan some slack.

[Mondo47]

adriano_c wrote...

Other than that, cut Morrigan some slack.

Nothing to do with her, she might have been a pain in the ass, but she wasn't why I ended up hating the game... I'm more sore the game made me, after deciding to be a lesbian because the male love interests were singularly vapid or irritating (or both in Alistair's case), put me in a position where I had to sacrifice myself for the good of the world (and my other options were either allow the birth of a monster that might one day destroy the world, or let a venomous coward retain his honour in death and deny the realm the king it needs... punishment for being moral, whatever next...). I stopped enjoying the game roughly five minutes after carving Loghain's worthless head off in front of his daughter and giving it to Shale to squish.

Some "choices", Bioware. I'm going home and I'm taking my ball with me, don't wanna play with you no more

[Pacifien]

I know they liked to stress how each of Jack's tattoos had a story behind it, but I think that kinda goes without saying. For everyone I know with tattoos, there's always a story behind it. Some of them aren't necessarily Chaucer, but they're stories of their life nonetheless.

My own opinion of tattoos follow the Church line of reasoning from Red Vs. Blue. "Take your current age. Now subtract ten years from it. Were you smart back then? Of course, you weren't! You were a goddamn idiot! Fact of the matter is, you're just as big of an idiot today, it's just going to take you ten more years to realize it."

But, you know, it works on Jack and she probably won't make it ten years to realize the folly of her youth.

[Pacifien]

I once asked a British friend what he thought of the American accent. He said it made men sound like douches, but women sounded quite sexy. He then said all Australians sounded.... I can't remember the exact phrase but it was something akin to awful.

ETA: I'm also amused that the British cling to their regional accents as well as they do given the homogenization of voices you find on tv.

Modifié par Pacifien, 23 mai 2010 - 03:21 .

[Pacifien]

I was going to say we could always do with more Flapper Jack, but then I figured that had to be a term with some wrong connotations somewhere on the internet.



Still, another fine drawing, Epantiras! Wonder what they're listening to.

[Booglarize]

adriano_c wrote...

Other than that, cut Morrigan some slack.

Yeah. For me, Morrigan was possibly BioWare's best-developed romance since Viconia - the only really low points had to do with the bizarre endgame plot "twists"... and those ended up ruining more than just Morrigan, to be honest.

[NICKjnp]

I saw this in the motivationals thread and thought Jack fans might laugh at it a little...

[Mondo47]

Booglarize wrote...

adriano_c wrote...

Other than that, cut Morrigan some slack.

Yeah. For me, Morrigan was possibly BioWare's best-developed romance since Viconia - the only really low points had to do with the bizarre endgame plot "twists"... and those ended up ruining more than just Morrigan, to be honest.

Twist schmists. A little part of my heart died when I discovered I would never be able to turn around to Leliana and say "C'mon babe, I'm taking you to Orlaise to buy you shoes. And dresses. And lacy nothings. Zev can come too in case we need a little... variety. SO LONG, SUCKERS!"

And my dog pined away and died. Bioware, you're a bag of bastards.

[Auzden]

well i figured before i go to my sisters graduation id check on the jack thread see whats happenin

[Booglarize]

Mondo47 wrote...

And my dog pined away and died. Bioware, you're a bag of bastards.

Yeah, that was pretty lame. I mean sure, Dog was no Dogmeat, but in the end he was still a pretty cool dog. Oh well, at least Mass Effect doesn't really have any pets that we're likely to get too attached to - though I have to admit, Space Hamster has kind of grown on me.

yfhfrg wrote...

Lol, dog dies in the ultimate sacrifice ending?[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/crying.png[/smilie] I guess I forgot that bit.

I don't think the ending really matters. Dog doesn't make it to the expansion regardless of what happens, so it was widely assumed that he died (though I'm not sure if it was ever officially confirmed).

Modifié par Booglarize, 23 mai 2010 - 06:02 .

[Gethforceone]

What's one Jack scene you wanted to see in ME2 they didn't add? For me, it is Jack heading to Shep's room after entering the omega 4 relay.

[Epantiras]

Mondo47 wrote...

Nothing to do with her, she might have been a pain in the ass, but she wasn't why I ended up hating the game... I'm more sore the game made me, after deciding to be a lesbian because the male love interests were singularly vapid or irritating (or both in Alistair's case), put me in a position where I had to sacrifice myself for the good of the world (and my other options were either allow the birth of a monster that might one day destroy the world, or let a venomous coward retain his honour in death and deny the realm the king it needs... punishment for being moral, whatever next...). I stopped enjoying the game roughly five minutes after carving Loghain's worthless head off in front of his daughter and giving it to Shale to squish.

Some "choices", Bioware. I'm going home and I'm taking my ball with me, don't wanna play with you no more

I romanced Zevran instead, I could not bear Alistair's whining and Leliana's religious BS. The ending was, uhm, weird, with no "right choice". I let Morrigan do the ritual because, from my character's point of view, Morrigan was her best friend forever and she didn't care about Alistair anyway. Probably letting Alistair doing the sacrifice would have been a "better choice", but I didn't want to screw him like that. And who cares, someday Morrigan will send a postcard with a photo of her little cute demon baby with fiery eyes of doom.

I would like to see a game mixing the best qualities of both Dragon Age and Mass Effect. As someone said, that masterpiece would be knonw as "Dragon Effect" - or "Mass-age" which sounds way better.

Ah... I remember at first I believed Jack to be Morrigan in space... I was SO WRONG! ;-)

[Gethforceone]

I'm just gonna ignore that shot about religions.

[Mondo47]

Epantiras wrote...

I romanced Zevran instead, I could not bear Alistair's whining and Leliana's religious BS. The ending was, uhm, weird, with no "right choice". I let Morrigan do the ritual because, from my character's point of view, Morrigan was her best friend forever and she didn't care about Alistair anyway. Probably letting Alistair doing the sacrifice would have been a "better choice", but I didn't want to screw him like that. And who cares, someday Morrigan will send a postcard with a photo of her little cute demon baby with fiery eyes of doom.

I would like to see a game mixing the best qualities of both Dragon Age and Mass Effect. As someone said, that masterpiece would be knonw as "Dragon Effect" - or "Mass-age" which sounds way better.

Ah... I remember at first I believed Jack to be Morrigan in space... I was SO WRONG! ;-)

Warning - there be Spoilers ahead! If you ain't played Dragon Age, quit readin' now!

That was the thing... I found Morrigan to at first be an insufferable cow. You help people, she whines, you do nothing, she derides you for being wishy-washy, you give her presents, she's happy. I took her for selfish, childish and arrogant and for a good ten hours or so didn't want her around at all. Then I realised she really was a child; some poor thing kept cloistered away by a scholarly tyrant that was priming her her entire natural life to be some spoke in a great ritualistic wheel. I wanted to help Morrigan then, break the cycle, set her free. Instead I find after doing that (well, it seemed a good idea at the time) all I'd done is throw a pebble in the path of the wheel - only little bump, and it was over it. Morrigan's ritual just sounded like a nightmare waiting to happen, and there was no way, despite having grown to like her, I was going to let her endanger the world for what could potentially have been her mother's grand scheme all along.

Alistair... gods and monsters, he was almost as insufferable as Morrigan to begin with. He whined like a schoolboy shoved over in the mud by big lads, his attempts at flirting were not cute but painfully embarassing (I kept expecting him to start waving roses at me and spouting doggerel at me like some other Bioware love interest of days gone by I could mention) and his abject inability to see what needed to be done made me want to shove him out of a window. Frankly, no man that childish and simpering is getting in me; you must be THIS much of a real man to enjoy this ride... and Sten wasn't interested. Thankfully, the game won me back over by allowing me to bed the female bard, the male assassin, and then have them both AND a bonus harlot in The Pearl (sometimes my brain does live below my waist - sue me). Alistair needed to grow up. For better or worse, the land needed him, and it needed him to be the king the last moron failed to be. So, when it came to the final reel, I realised that he needed tough love for the sake of the land; that slap I'd been dying to give him and a royal bawling out preferably in public to get him to sort it out.

Letting Loghain survive wasn't an option for me; the man was a spineless coward with eyes on the throne; a 'hero' only so long as the foe was one he knew how to master easily, so I was going to dig what bones he had in his general back area out and feed them to him before he expired for the sake of all the men that died at the farce of a battle in the first act. If there's one thing I hate, it's weakness; the kind of petty weaknesses that make people inflict horrors on others because they think they're right, or history will see them as right one day, or that whatever it is they do it's beacuse it's what they want and anyone else is just there to be ran roughshod over. He had to go - if only it could have been slower. And by the same turn, no matter how much I disliked Alistair I couldn't inflict Morrigan's bargain on him; the knowledge of what he had done would have turned him into Arthur when Excalibur was lost. The big picture was saving the realm, nothing else mattered... alas, that meant I was locked on the rails with no breaks roaring into the buffers at top speed. Boom.

So, lacking a magic sword of my own to knock Morrigan up (not that I would have anyway) I spent the last reel happy in the knowledge that all those hours spent with my merry band were for no big payoff whatsoever. I read George RR Martin for Chrissakes, I'm no stranger to endless puppy-kicking or loveable characters taking it in the rear from the writer, but to find myself doomed in the first part of an epic adventure? Hold on a f**king second, Bioware! I'm not happy about this so-called state of affairs! This isn't how these games work! Ok, maybe I'll survive somehow, or I'll come back from the dead, or...

Wishful thinking. The Epilogue was the final straw. The land had its king, everyone went their seperate ways, my girlfriend had a broken heart and my dog died! You certainly know how to stick it in and break it off, Bioware! Normally I turn off the game and sit back, happy it was all over and I played it well enough to finish it. This game though just left me feeling like someone filled my bikini with sand while I was asleep... irritated didn't seem strong enough a term. I tried to replay it once, but knowing what I knew... my heart wasn't in it (plus sleeping with Morrigan made me feel dirty). Hence, all my interest in the series has gone. No buying extra content for me. I'll maybe go back if I magically return from the dead in DA2, maybe. But it's been the first game in years I've played where I was tempted to turn the disk into a coaster. The best RPG I've ever played, until it suddenly started playing the banjo in the final reel and gave me the Deliverance treatment.

I'll call it a day on Dragon Age now... I'll lock the door on it after this little rant. At least I will never have to hear that "licking lamposts" crap ever again. Ugh... pass the chastity belt.

Sermon over. Peace(nik) out.

Gethforceone wrote...

I'm just gonna ignore that shot about religions.

I don't think Epi meant it that way, Geth. I think it wasn't so much about religions as Leliana. Now I'm not a religious person, and I wouldn't mock or judge someone for being religious - it's their call, more power to them. But Leliana's faith did seem to be one of convenience; in my eyes at least it did seem like she joined the church to help people and to perhaps a little less altruistically escape her past... in my book, that's not why you embrace a religion. Maybe I was reading it wrong, but it smacked of hypocracy a little. Am I right there, Epants?

Modifié par Mondo47, 23 mai 2010 - 08:38 .