20813 réponses à ce sujet

[Pacifien]

Jack: find purpose beyond killing

Grunt: find purpose in killing

[Jackal904]

drunken pyromaniac wrote...

Now, if she's not romanced, who knows where she'll end up.

Well Shepard has still done a lot for her (assuming you gained her loyalty), more than any one else has done for her before. So she'd have a better outlook on the galaxy than before, just not as much as if you romanced her.

[drunken pyromaniac]

Jackal904 wrote...

Well Shepard has still done a lot for her (assuming you gained her loyalty), more than any one else has done for her before. So she'd have a better outlook on the galaxy than before, just not as much as if you romanced her.

True, and bringing into account that it's a video game they're probably won't be any backsliding into her old ways. That's one of the problems of ME2 though, none of the LIs talk to you much if you don't romance them. ME2 could've done with friendship paths with the various LIs, I like that someone romancing them gets more but it feels kind of silly that they stop talking entirely if you aren't romancing them. Hopefully they'll fix that in ME3.

[aamy]

I hope she comes back in some capacity, as a person who embraces her inner demons, because that's what makes her who she is. Shepard didn't exactly set her free, perhaps a fight for custody from the Illusive Man is in the future

[drunken pyromaniac]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

Assuming she is in ME3, I just wonder how much of this different outlook on the galaxy will actually be seen in ME3, if at all.  Will her positive or negative growth be seen depending on how she was romanced in ME2?  If she was not romanced then what? Negative?  If so, the same negative as a the Renegade fling outlook?   

Urgh, I hope it's not dependant on Shepard's romancing her or not. That bears...unfortunate implications. I could see her getting worse if you have the renegade fling though, that just confirms in her mind everything bad about people. I would hope she gets at least a little better even if you don't romance her, or again, unfortunate implications abound.

[Collider]

Jackal904 wrote...

yorkj86 wrote...

She dead, Jackal, she dead. If you didn't get her in Lothering before it was attacked, she dead.

Well damn. That's kind lame that you have to go there right away or she dies. That's pretty easy to miss her.

I missed Leliana the first time through. There's some dude outside of the inn who tells the player specifically not to go in, Why Bioware had this random NPC there to tell me that I donm't know.

I didn't get Sten either. I knew how to get him, but my warden wasn't about to let family murderer go free. YMMV though...

Let's see, why do I like Jack...I like her individualistic spirit. You can tell that she'll make an effort to get back at people who she thinks she has been wronged by. In context of her background, that it's a rather sympathetic motive, although it's not always the right idea.

To some degree, I like her cynicism. It's true that a lot of times people have some ulterior motive or desire when they interact with people - although not always. I also like the vulgarity at times, I admit. It's refreshing. Of course, swearing can be overdone in games and elsewhere, but AFAIK there's a happy balance with Jack. Jack has a youthful and rebellious spirit. I can appreciate that.

There's little doubt in my mind I'd have gone for Jack in my very first
playthrough (which had no ME1, thank you Virmire) if Tali had not been
an option. I will probably make a playthrough romancing Jack anyway,
when I have the time and drive to do so.I expect quite the great romance.

This one is quite superficial, but I also like the tattooes. They're quite beautiful and I wonder what each tattoo stands for and why she got it. I wouldn't get tattooes myself but they can look great on people and can symbolize part of who they are. In some cases you can take one look and speculate this person may have had a unique and interesting life, or at the very least has some colorful ideas. I wouldn't judge people for their tattooes though - either in a good or bad light. Each tattoo can be very personal and I cannot assume their significance or meaning when I've never taken in a walk in their skin.

[aamy]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

aamy wrote...
I hope she comes back in some capacity, as a person who embraces her inner demons, because that's what makes her who she is. Shepard didn't exactly set her free, perhaps a fight for custody from the Illusive Man is in the future

She has a long road ahead of her.

Indeed, she does Johnny Dollar, her and Samara are my two favorite characters. I don't think any two seemingly polar opposite characters from one setting have inspired me this much

[Collider]

Difficult question as to whether an unromanced Jack would return, character wise. So for as metagame or game mechanics go, I would wager that they'll have her return, sans any potential for romance of course. Character wise, I really don't know.
--
What do you all think? Character wise, would Jack stick with or rejoin a Shepard that didn't romance her (and didn't do the renegade route)? Will her loyalty (resolved fight/sided with Jack/did loyalty mission) or disloyalty (sided with Miranda/did not do Jack's loyalty mission)  play a direct factor?

Modifié par Collider, 10 juin 2010 - 05:31 .

[Jackal904]

drunken pyromaniac wrote...

Pacifien wrote...

If she stuck around Shepard long enough, on a ship full of people who aren't out to use and abuse her, I think given enough time she'll develop some trust for those around her, but she won't realize she's developing that way. And it's not the same level of trust as she could have if she romanced Shepard. With a romance, she is very consciously aware that someone is making her question who she is, what she's becoming, and what she can be in the future.
I take the difference as I would with my own friendships and romances. I can trust my friends, fight for my friends, but that kind of trust is somehow altered by romantic involvement. I'm not sure how to explain it.

Very true, I haven't thought about it that way, I've been hanging around too many people saying how there's no character development if Shepard doesn't romance her, I guess.

I thought that too for a long time. It wasn't until recently that I realized that even if Shepard hasn't romanced her he has still shown her that there are good people in the galaxy, and that he does care for her after he helped her deal with her past, just not in a romantic way.

[aamy]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

aamy wrote...

JohnnyDollar wrote...

aamy wrote...
I hope she comes back in some capacity, as a person who embraces her inner demons, because that's what makes her who she is. Shepard didn't exactly set her free, perhaps a fight for custody from the Illusive Man is in the future

She has a long road ahead of her.

Indeed, she does Johnny Dollar, her and Samara are my two favorite characters. I don't think any two seemingly polar opposite characters from one setting have inspired me this much

They are my favorite two characters as well.  To me, they are the two deepest characters in ME2, but I am sure others disagree.

Each character has depth to a certain degree, it is only the tangents they extend towards where we choose to align ourselves. Jack channels my inner angst, and protected sensitivities, how about you?

[NICKjnp]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

Jackal904 wrote...

drunken pyromaniac wrote...
Now, if she's not romanced, who knows where she'll end up.

Well Shepard has still done a lot for her (assuming you gained her loyalty), more than any one else has done for her before. So she'd have a better outlook on the galaxy than before, just not as much as if you romanced her.

Assuming she is in ME3, I just wonder how much of this different outlook on the galaxy will actually be seen in ME3, if at all.  Will her positive or negative growth be seen depending on how she was romanced in ME2?  If she was not romanced then what? Negative?  If so, the same negative as a the Renegade fling outlook?   

I think anyone who survived ME1 & 2 and were a possible LI in either game are going to be squamates in the final game.  Sucks for us Samara fans... but that is the best way to ensure that romances continue and that there is familiarity for Shepard.

[drunken pyromaniac]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

It seems to be important to her character growth though.  If she is romanced the paragon route, she begins to trust another, and shows emotion.  She shows signs of coming out of her shell and starting a new life so to speak. 

If she is renegaded, her state basically remains unchanged.  If she is not romanced at all, her state basically remains unchanged.  With the exception of the destruction of Teltin, and how this may rid herself of some personal demons.

Perhaps the only difference that would be seen in ME3 is during romantic dialog.  If Shepard romanced her the paragon route in ME2.

I meant that hopefully, even if you don't romance her there should be some posiive character growth, I don't think she needs a man to save her, I just think that having someone love her speeds the breaking down of barriers. Maybe not to the same extent as when she's been romanced but I could see her being more open just from the crew's companionship.

If you do the renegade fling I expect her to be the same or more likely, worse.

I only really see Bioware going throught the trouble of showing change if you romanced her though.

[Collider]

What exactly do you mean by saving her, pyro?

[drunken pyromaniac]

Collider wrote...

What exactly do you mean by saving her, pyro?

I mean that romancing her isn't necessary for her to come to trust others, it just speeds it in my mind.

[Collider]

drunken pyromaniac wrote...

Collider wrote...

What exactly do you mean by saving her, pyro?

I mean that romancing her isn't necessary for her to come to trust others, it just speeds it in my mind.

I hope you're right.

[drunken pyromaniac]

[quote]Jackal904 wrote... It w


[/quote]

I thought that too for a long time. It wasn't until recently that I realized that even if Shepard hasn't romanced her he has still shown her that there are good people in the galaxy, and that he does care for her after he helped her deal with her past, just not in a romantic way.

[/quote]
Yeah, that aspect bugged the hell out of me. Thankfully, I was wrong. It would be nice if they had a few more indicators of this even if you didn't romance her though.

[drunken pyromaniac]

Collider wrote...

drunken pyromaniac wrote...

Collider wrote...

What exactly do you mean by saving her, pyro?

I mean that romancing her isn't necessary for her to come to trust others, it just speeds it in my mind.

I hope you're right.

I'm not saying that's how it'll actually play out but I think that it should, it seems to be rather...I dunno, paternalistic for her to only get better from having Shepard romance her. I can give Bioware some slack since it's only one game but I hope they show her having some progress even if you don't romance her.  Just like anything else, in this, Bioware can either do a really goood job in making ME3 or they can screw it all up royally.

[aamy]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

aamy wrote...

JohnnyDollar wrote...

aamy wrote...

JohnnyDollar wrote...

aamy wrote...
I hope she comes back in some capacity, as a person who embraces her inner demons, because that's what makes her who she is. Shepard didn't exactly set her free, perhaps a fight for custody from the Illusive Man is in the future

She has a long road ahead of her.

Indeed, she does Johnny Dollar, her and Samara are my two favorite characters. I don't think any two seemingly polar opposite characters from one setting have inspired me this much

They are my favorite two characters as well.  To me, they are the two deepest characters in ME2, but I am sure others disagree.

Each character has depth to a certain degree, it is only the tangents they extend towards where we choose to align ourselves. Jack channels my inner angst, and protected sensitivities, how about you?

I have had my share of strife and anxiety in my life personally.  Jack is a character that has trudged through an overwhelming amount of trama and stress in her life.  I admire someone that is willing to not give up and keep fighting.  As the old saying goes "whatever doesn't kill you only helps you", I believe it.  Shepard is able to take part in facilitating Jack's fight to start a new life.  She will always be scarred from her past, but life is not fair, and it meets no one half way.

"Whatever doesn't kill you, only makes you stronger"

I'll concede that I have found that notion somewhat cheesy at times, but can't deny its suitability here.

[Jackal904]

Collider wrote...

What do you all think? Character wise, would Jack stick with or rejoin a Shepard that didn't romance her (and didn't do the renegade route)? Will her loyalty (resolved fight/sided with Jack/did loyalty mission) or disloyalty (sided with Miranda/did not do Jack's loyalty mission)  play a direct factor?

If she is loyal I think it would definitely fit her character that she would stay. Shepard has still done a lot for her even if he didn't romance her. And she's got a pretty good thing going with following Shepard. She's around people that won't abuse her and take advantage of her, a leader who cares about her (romantically or not), and a safe place to sleep. And if you get those food provisions, the meals are pretty good too^_^.

But if Jack is not loyal to you at the end of ME2, I do not think she will return in your ME3 playthrough.

Modifié par Jackal904, 10 juin 2010 - 06:04 .