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[Epantiras]

Regarding the Miranda hate on this forum, let me say again that she's one of the characters "I love to hate". I mean, my Shepards hate her but I do not, Mass Effect 2 would have been more shallow if Miranda was not there :-) even Jack gets a chance to shine thanks to her contrast with Miranda.



Morrigan, she's an arrogant b*tch but since I smother her with gold she happily proclaimed my Fem Warden as "honorary sister figure".



And yes, I've downloaded the "Slap Morrigan mod", I'll try it in my next playthrough

[Homebound]

Epantiras wrote...

Regarding the Miranda hate on this forum, let me say again that she's one of the characters "I love to hate". I mean, my Shepards hate her but I do not, Mass Effect 2 would have been more shallow if Miranda was not there :-) even Jack gets a chance to shine thanks to her contrast with Miranda.

Morrigan, she's an arrogant b*tch but since I smother her with gold she happily proclaimed my Fem Warden as "honorary sister figure".

And yes, I've downloaded the "Slap Morrigan mod", I'll try it in my next playthrough

I hate Miranda. If I dont have the Paragon, I ALWAYS side with Jack when Miranda and Jack go at it. Miranda always complains how everything about her is perfect and that it makes her feel less of a person, but because of this perception, she thinks shes better than everyone.

Jack on the otherhand will just kill you.

[Mondo47]

Oh, don't get me wrong, I think Miranda eventually begins to turn into a human being (though I really wish there was a dialogue option to dress her down for laying into Joker over the loss of the crew, because that's one of the biggest displays of douchebaggery in the game - you may or may not like Joker, but that tirade is on a par with yelling at someone in a wheelchair for not being able to get up stairs). I may never really use her in missions that often, because my playstyle rolls too well with Grunt and Jack for, well, everything, but I'd go as far as saying her presence on the mission is important. I'm glad she's there... and if she really was all that bad all the time, would a certain little girl have been named after her?

I just think that for someone that bemoans the high expectations set on her by others, she should listen to the way she talks to other people before she starts all the "woe is me, daddy made me in a test tube" crap... because the way she interacts with other crew members (and somtimes Shepard) just blows.

And in other, non-cranky news, liking the latest part Sunset. C*ckblocked = classic

[Gethforceone]

Epantiras wrote...

Regarding the Miranda hate on this forum, let me say again that she's one of the characters "I love to hate". I mean, my Shepards hate her but I do not, Mass Effect 2 would have been more shallow if Miranda was not there :-) even Jack gets a chance to shine thanks to her contrast with Miranda.

Morrigan, she's an arrogant b*tch but since I smother her with gold she happily proclaimed my Fem Warden as "honorary sister figure".

And yes, I've downloaded the "Slap Morrigan mod", I'll try it in my next playthrough

I absolutely HATE miri. but it's a "love-to-hate" thing, all other characters I don't want in the story (Namely Jacob and legion) are gone. But she is still there, because she's a good person to fight with. Besides, I want to see what happens when someone is no loyal in the next game.

[Goat_Shepard]

ME2 is working on my PC! All I had to do was update my drivers!  Ha! Problem is I got no icon for opening doors and safes unless I hit start lol

Pacifien wrote...
See, now we are talking about Legion instead of Jack. Pick another topic before I bring up the dyson sphere.

You're the one who sliced and diced all the Jack from my post to talk about Legion that's my rule: half on-topic, half on. Mostly.

And you're right, geth are never split on a decision, so it was all on Shepard. It wasn't a comfortable situation. Having Jack there to give me a definite answer was needed. I wonder if there are any squadmates who suggest to rewrite.

Anyway, I noticed the allignment issue on that mission as well. At one point, the paragon option is "Rewriting is unethical", and lo and behold, rewriting isn't just unethical, but also the right choice.

I've learned not to care about paragon/renegade unless a charm/intimidate option occurs. My little sister is so stressed about being a paragon, she's only hitting the upper right options. Won't even hit the lower left investigates

Shadow_broker wrote...
Was tottally coming to this thread to support jack....but now i won't
Jack support thread not miranda hate thread../../../images/forum/emoticons/crying.png

Wilson was a traitor who was trying to murder the reborn savior of the galaxy(not to mention the station faculty) that cost billions of credits and two years of time, She was right to shoot him

We don't know that Wilson was a traitor, and will never know because Miranda shot him. If he was a traitor, you keep him alive. Shepard even says we should have interrogated him, because with something as important as "murduring the reborn savior of the galaxy", you're not going to do it alone, at the END of the project when Shepard's 100% healthy.  "Too risky" she says? Wilson had a broken leg, and there were 2 people and Shepard surrounding him. Not using your brain, Miranda.

In the mission report, it says "security sweeps" were run over Cerberus' cells to make sure Wilson was the only mole. That is ineffective, and not how Cerberus does things (they like to interrogate people).

And like Mondo said, Miranda 2nd guesses you when she shouldn't. Her terms are "If you don't betray the Illusive Man, I'll follow your orders". TIM gives you all the freedom in the world to recruit these dossiers. Well, according to Miranda, giving Jack Cerberus data so that she joins you to finish Cerberus' mission is apparently not in your authority to do. Then she says Jack's endangering the mission, calls her unstable, childish, and a mistake. This is Shepard's 2nd-in-command belittling the 2nd most powerful person on the ship. Why does Miranda say all these things? Because Jack called her a b!tch, and threw a chair. Wow, for someone who talks endlessly about "focus on the mission", Miranda sure let's her personal feelings interfere with it.  Bad leadership.

Jacob is almost the same way, he has a problem with Thane, makes it clear in the debriefing room. The room where, you know, new crewmembers are welcomed aboard? I'm not saying you should trust every single person you see, but considering the Dossier's are from TIM, and for the sake of the mission, at least trying to make a good first impression is not only easy, but it's your job. That's where Miri and Jacob lose respect from me.

Having said that, I'm with Epantiras that I "love to hate" Miranda. Mass Effect would not be the same without each and every character. If you asked me if I would prefer a bland, forgettable character to an obnoxious one that drove me crazy with anger, I would say no. I'd trade 10 Liara's for 1 Miranda.

Now, back to Jack. Have things to do. Will return.

Modifié par Goat_Shepard, 22 août 2010 - 08:34 .

[Neccrid]

Great work Sundown Native! Like always, I loved it.

[Mondo47]

Goat_Shepard wrote...

We don't know that Wilson was a traitor, and will never know because Miranda shot him.

Well, my problem isn't with her just capping Wilson - the guy was acting suspiciously enough from me to suspect him of not being on the level, so no real loss. My problem is with her statement of how she's never wrong... doesn't really sell me on her the moment she shows up. Just makes me think "arrogant cow."

Exhibit A - Niket. Got that wrong, didn't ya?

Oooh, that was a low blow...

Actually going back to how trustworthy Jack is in comparison to Miranda, while I would have my doubts about both of them, Miranda would be much more likely to smile to your face while be plotting an accident for you. Jack would just come out and do the damn thing. Both women are dangerous, both are potential risks to your continued health, but at least Jack would stab you in the chest. Still not desirable, but honest at least.

I mean, in some respects, I do like Miranda; she's a good foil for Shepard, for one - any loose-cannon hero needs an authority figure telling them how they should be doing things they can ignore. And just as Shepard helps Jack to begin to restructure herself, Shep does the same for Miranda and aids her in becoming less hung up on success, ambition, invalid concepts of self-worth and the pressures others put on her... Shepard helps her loosen up (while the reverse is with Jack - Shep helps her tighten up). I do like the fact that the whole adventure transforms many of the crew for the better, and Miranda is as much a part of that as Jack.

[Shadow_broker]

Miranda is verly clear about her motives and thoughts, She gives you her outright opinion always i don't see how you can call her the back stabing type

No matter how many times you disagree with her suggestions she nevers goes against shepards orders even listens to him when shepard tells her to give jack all access to cerebrus files



She wants the mission to succeed despite her personal feelings, If you say you won't help her sister and let her get kidnapped by her dad then she says "I understand"

Miranda would be the last person to betray shepard while under his command as she says "on this ship we follow orders!"

[Epantiras]

Mondo47 wrote...

Actually going back to how trustworthy Jack is in comparison to Miranda, while I would have my doubts about both of them, [...]

Truth be told, in my very first, spoilerfree playthrough I chose Samara as biotic specialist instead of Jack because I was afraid she might betray Shepard - at the time, obviously, I didn't know the mechanics behind the suicide mission! I always expect a traitor among my party members (that's because of you, Yoshimo!).

[Mondo47]

I did the same, only not because I didn't trust her, I was afraid the strain might kill her (yes, I was expecting anyone to expire at any moment... thanks for the stress, BioWare)!

[Goat_Shepard]

Shadow_broker wrote...
Miranda is verly clear about her motives and thoughts, She gives you her outright opinion always i don't see how you can call her the back stabing type
No matter how many times you disagree with her suggestions she nevers goes against shepards orders even listens to him when shepard tells her to give jack all access to cerebrus files

She wants the mission to succeed despite her personal feelings, If you say you won't help her sister and let her
get kidnapped by her dad then she says "I understand"
Miranda would be the last person to betray shepard while under his command as she says "on this ship we follow orders!"

Miranda obviously doesn't follow all orders, since TIM gave her a direct one and she quit Cerberus.  She isn't trustworthy for several more reasons. The Lazarus Project ended in disaster, and the truth about Wilson, is that at any rate, Miranda either can't keep her team in line, or she slaughtered her whole team and lied to you about it.

She's an ice queen to you the whole time until after Freedom's Progress. She then suddenly has a personality shift when you enter her office, and is all smiles and cheerfulness, willing to tell you everything you wish to know. It's a complete 180 of her previous attitude and it comes off as terribly fake.

Then you have Miranda's genetic tailoring. All her successes are invalidated because she's perfect. I might feel bad for her, but then you see Miranda's attitude towards Jack. Jack was tortured, raped, and used, multiple times, BY CERBERUS. And Miranda feels no sympathy for her, calls her a mistake. Miranda complains about her own problems, and then harrasses Jack for her own problems. Jack has had it 10x as bad as Miranda, and Jack complains less! Miranda is either a liar, or a hypocrite.

Miranda wants the mission to succeed? Don't volunteer yourself for the biotic barrier.

Mondo47 wrote...
I mean, in some respects, I do like Miranda; she's a good foil for Shepard, for one - any loose-cannon hero needs an authority figure telling them how they should be doing things they can ignore.

Agreed. That's why I like Ashley and Morrigan. Usually skeptical and not wanting to get into anyone's business

And just as Shepard helps Jack to begin to restructure herself, Shep does the same for Miranda and aids her in becoming less hung up on success, ambition, invalid concepts of self-worth and the pressures others put on her... Shepard helps her loosen up (while the reverse is with Jack - Shep helps her tighten up). I do like the fact that the whole adventure transforms many of the crew for the better, and Miranda is as much a part of that as Jack.

Indeed. Although as proven by Exhibit A, sometimes Shepard has nothing to do with it.

Modifié par Goat_Shepard, 22 août 2010 - 10:06 .

[axl99]

Somewhat unrelated. Found Cee-lo's cover of Band of Horses' "No one's gonna love you" and kinda thought of Jack and Murtock. Careful. NSFW.

Modifié par axl99, 23 août 2010 - 12:24 .

[adriano_c]

Well, that was certainly the worst song I've heard in a while.

[axl99]

yorkj86 wrote...

axl99 wrote...

Somewhat unrelated. Found Cee-lo's cover of Band of Horses' "No one's gonna love you" and kinda thought of Jack and Murtock. Careful. NSFW.

You think she was growing tired of Murtock?   Or do you think that the woman in the video getting tired of the guy is representative of the excuses Jack throws out to cover up the hurt she feels when remembering Murtock?

I think it might've been both. Way back when I speculated a little about Murtock being a bit of a coward and unable to express his feelings properly. Jack was hurt because he couldn't pull through for her and her crying over him actually gave his sacrifice meaning - for someone who wasn't supposed to care.

[axl99]

Could be any number of things before the weapons frigate incident. I was referring to Murtock not being able to survive the batarians' counterattack while Jack escaped to the shuttle.

[NovenseiWarden]

Good to see the Jack thread is still alive here!

[axl99]

yorkj86 wrote...

So you don't think he was actually significant to her? You make it seem as if she's forcing herself to care about him.

Even while Jack mentions her time with Murtock was "fun" she straight up concedes that he "used" her just like everyone else. His last message and his self-sacrifice unnerved her because she never expected THAT out of him. If she didn't care about Murtock, she wouldn't have been half-cried about it in front of Shepard when she's telling him to back off on a relationship.

[Gethforceone]

Mondo47 wrote...

Goat_Shepard wrote...

We don't know that Wilson was a traitor, and will never know because Miranda shot him.

Well, my problem isn't with her just capping Wilson - the guy was acting suspiciously enough from me to suspect him of not being on the level, so no real loss. My problem is with her statement of how she's never wrong... doesn't really sell me on her the moment she shows up. Just makes me think "arrogant cow."

Exhibit A - Niket. Got that wrong, didn't ya?

Oooh, that was a low blow...

Actually going back to how trustworthy Jack is in comparison to Miranda, while I would have my doubts about both of them, Miranda would be much more likely to smile to your face while be plotting an accident for you. Jack would just come out and do the damn thing. Both women are dangerous, both are potential risks to your continued health, but at least Jack would stab you in the chest. Still not desirable, but honest at least.

I mean, in some respects, I do like Miranda; she's a good foil for Shepard, for one - any loose-cannon hero needs an authority figure telling them how they should be doing things they can ignore. And just as Shepard helps Jack to begin to restructure herself, Shep does the same for Miranda and aids her in becoming less hung up on success, ambition, invalid concepts of self-worth and the pressures others put on her... Shepard helps her loosen up (while the reverse is with Jack - Shep helps her tighten up). I do like the fact that the whole adventure transforms many of the crew for the better, and Miranda is as much a part of that as Jack.

Couldn't have said it better my self.