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Into the Bad Girl: Jack Fans


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#1326
BobbyTheI

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Mondo47 wrote...

Seraphael wrote...
Wow. Refreshing attitude for a Tali(ban)ist. ;)


They're not a bad lot if you ask me... I've only ever had the fumbling, semi-tragic attempts at being schooled electronically (rendered doubly-hilarious by the fact I'm probably almost old enough to be their mommy... got to get an I'm-not-that-old disclaimer in there ;)) from Miridians.

I once made the foul and heinous suggestion in their fan-thread that her and Jacob had been in a relationship once and they went all...

Posted Image

...on me. Once I'd stopped laughing and dried my eyes I figured I'd best not go back there... might have been too much for their poor wittle selves :D


Wow.  Now I, like pretty much everyone who has ever drawn breath on this planet, have never played Mass Effect Galaxy, but from what I could glean from the Mass Effect Wiki page... wasn't that pretty much CANON that the two of them had something going on before?  Women generally don't visit men's rooms with a bottle of champagne just so they can have a friendly chat.

#1327
Mondo47

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I think what upset them the most was I thought it would have been nice (insofar as an aspect of the game) to watch someone else have a little romance to brighten their march into the jaws of doom, and to me at least if not the foaming-at-the-mouth hordes, reconciling Jacob and Miranda would have been kinda sweet. Not so to some, it seems...

Though it might also have had something to do with me saying I couldn't ever side with Miranda in the big Miranda/Jack chairthrowing spectacular :whistle: Well, for a woman so bloody smart she still falls back on schoolyard rules when another alpha female gets in her face. Might explain Jack's headshaving... means a distinct lack of hair-pulling ;) Cue the RAWRG RAWRG RAWRG IT WASNT CERBERUS BECOS SERMANTICS IZ EVERITHIN AN MIRANDA IZ NEVAR RONG chorus... Talimancers seem quite accepting of other people's ideas in comparison. I think Jackolytes are hallmarked by their not-giving-a-****-ness - we even stay fairly civil with trolls :D

You might have a point there, Royce, in regards to the sexual morality thing... some folk are a bit funny about things like that. Never had any clue why myself, but morality is a very personal thing I guess.

#1328
procki

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Mondo47 wrote...

I think what upset them the most was I thought it would have been nice (insofar as an aspect of the game) to watch someone else have a little romance to brighten their march into the jaws of doom, and to me at least if not the foaming-at-the-mouth hordes, reconciling Jacob and Miranda would have been kinda sweet. Not so to some, it seems...

Though it might also have had something to do with me saying I couldn't ever side with Miranda in the big Miranda/Jack chairthrowing spectacular :whistle: Well, for a woman so bloody smart she still falls back on schoolyard rules when another alpha female gets in her face. Might explain Jack's headshaving... means a distinct lack of hair-pulling ;) Cue the RAWRG RAWRG RAWRG IT WASNT CERBERUS BECOS SERMANTICS IZ EVERITHIN AN MIRANDA IZ NEVAR RONG chorus... Talimancers seem quite accepting of other people's ideas in comparison. I think Jackolytes are hallmarked by their not-giving-a-****-ness - we even stay fairly civil with trolls :D

You might have a point there, Royce, in regards to the sexual morality thing... some folk are a bit funny about things like that. Never had any clue why myself, but morality is a very personal thing I guess.


I somehow hate this loyality conflict Jack and Miranda have there. To me it just feels wrong that Jack would somehow go up there and try to get Mirandas approval for her feelings about what was done to her.
This is why I like some of the thereories that suspect some sort of yet unrevealed background between them. Because otherwise this just feels like a cheap plot to get more of these loyality conflicts into the game.

#1329
Jackal904

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Mondo47 wrote...

Seraphael wrote...
Wow. Refreshing attitude for a Tali(ban)ist. ;)


They're not a bad lot if you ask me... I've only ever had the fumbling, semi-tragic attempts at being schooled electronically (rendered doubly-hilarious by the fact I'm probably almost old enough to be their mommy... got to get an I'm-not-that-old disclaimer in there ;)) from Miridians.

I once made the foul and heinous suggestion in their fan-thread that her and Jacob had been in a relationship once and they went all...

(crazy)

...on me. Once I'd stopped laughing and dried my eyes I figured I'd best not go back there... might have been too much for their poor wittle selves :D


They were problem just frightened at the thought of having a meaningful and actually relevant conversation about the character that the freaking thread is based on. "We don't take kindly to you ontopic intelligent conversation starter types. Unless you can say something irrelevant in under 20 words then you best git outta here before things get unpleasant for yuh."

But seriously. Isn't it obvious that something happened romantically between Miranda and Jacob in the past? They make it pretty clear in the game. Maybe they just don't want to believe that Miranda was with anyone else besides their Shepard. I wouldn't be surprised if they really have convinced themselves of that.

Mondo47 wrote...
I think Jackolytes are hallmarked by their not-giving-a-****-ness - we even stay fairly civil with trolls Posted Image


Lmao that is a great way of putting it.

royceclemens wrote...

Of course that's just my opinion. But does anyone else here think that this might be a cause of some of the venom we've seen towards Jack? Could this all be just simple Puritanism?


Yes. You can totally tell when a person hates Jack because they are not some innocent pure woman who needs their Shepard to show them the ways of love. Jack will be giving Shepard pointers if anything. And people are intimidated by her because she's tough and independent and she doesn't need Shepard to protect her. They hate her because they want every chick to think of their Shepard as this knight in shining armour, but Jack tells you to **** off at first. And they're like "How dare you not worship me!" The people that think this way are generally the crazy Tali fans, because Tali satisfies their desire to appear as this knight in shining armour.

procki wrote...

I somehow hate this loyality conflict Jack and Miranda have there. To me it just feels wrong that Jack would somehow go up there and try to get Mirandas approval for her feelings about what was done to her.
This is why I like some of the thereories that suspect some sort of yet unrevealed background between them. Because otherwise this just feels like a cheap plot to get more of these loyality conflicts into the game.


Maybe Jack went to her office to question her about it (in a not so nice kind of way). Like "How could you let this happen?" or something like that. But Miranda just denied that it was Cerberus in the first place, and that pissed Jack off, and then you walk in.

Modifié par Jackal904, 10 mars 2010 - 01:47 .


#1330
royceclemens

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I just perused through three pages of the Miranda thread, just out of sheer curiosity... Hoo boy... It's a miracle I can remember math. Even when nothing is going on, someone will post saying "nothing's going on." It's a neverending feedback loop of wasted free time. Free time that could have been spent building up levies, tutoring inner city school children or crafting a meaningful sentence about a character they like.



And what in God's name is the point of posting Miranda pictures when she's seemingly lit the same way in every shot? They all look the same! At least with Jack, she's lit in a variety of ways and there might be an objective.



/endrant



But going back to the loyalty fight, Jack's words were that Miranda wouldn't admit that what Cerberus did to her was wrong. She wasn't even necessarily asking for an apology, just an acknowledgement of her suffering. If Miranda could only muster a simple "that sucks," then she wouldn't have died at the end of my next playthrough.

#1331
Mondo47

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royceclemens wrote...

But going back to the loyalty fight, Jack's words were that Miranda wouldn't admit that what Cerberus did to her was wrong. She wasn't even necessarily asking for an apology, just an acknowledgement of her suffering. If Miranda could only muster a simple "that sucks," then she wouldn't have died at the end of my next playthrough.


I dunno... I'll play devil's advocate again, and say it's not beyond the realms of possibility that Jack went up there to pick a fight. She's just come back from incinerating the place that has dogged her for her entire (remembered) life, and come to understand that it wasn't just her that had a rough time of it, but a whole bunch of other kids too. Jack might talk big about dropping space stations on moons, but she's not so stony that she can't feel guilt, or even sadness for others. And regardless of how it ended, the program was started by Cerberus. It's something to focus the anger on; with no target, you're just left with blind rage that nibbles away at you day and night, and she's already got enough of that **** to deal with without taking more on... think about it from her point of view: Shepard's helped her, been honest with her so far, and the rest of the Normandy's crew are faceless, just following orders or keeping out of her way, knocking them about is no more satisfying than shanking a prison guard when it's the warden you want to off. You need someone high-up to take it out on, someone who means something within Cerberus... that only can take you to the Cheerleader's room. It's not right to attack her - she had nothing to do with what was done personally - but it'll make you feel better for five minutes at least, before you're back alone with your thoughts again...

On the other side of the coin, Miranda can't appreciate how someone can be so angry with Cerberus. She refuses to accept the mistrust of the Quarians; that was just business. Jack is one scrawny little ****up who doesn't respect authority or fill a valuable role in society. She's human waste, plain and simple. Her only redeeming defect is her biotic ability, and that's been rendered unusable because it was crammed inside a screwed-up convict as opposed to someone that could appreciate the gift they'd been given. Miranda truly believes that humanity's advancement is a worthy goal, so why wouldn't it be acceptable to allow a few to suffer so the whole can improve? Besides, Cerberus shut down the program, so the blame for what happened can't possibly be laid at her door - the fact they started it in the first place is meaningless; the ends would have justified the means, and when it was obvious that the project wasn't working, they pulled the plug. Not a Cerberus problem anymore. Someone ripped the A section out of Miranda's dictionary, because she doesn't know the meaning of accountability.

I don't read either of them as particularly innocent in that exchange; Jack's anger is understandable but misplaced, and Miranda's attitude is shortsighted and ignorant of reality. People cannot rationalise a hurt that big; it changes people in awful ways, irrational ways. Just because you got a nice bottle of shampoo out of the years of research dosn't make the test bunny's retinas burn any less. Any chance of a normal life Jack may or may not have had was taken away by the experiments and has led to a life of excess, crime and further abuse. Those two women are an accident waiting to happen. I can see both sides, but only one person is an actual victim, and thus requiring sympathetic handling. The other is just being pigheaded and blinkered.

1-0 to Jack :P

#1332
royceclemens

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I'll be damned, Corey Haim died.



But back to the topic, It's not so much that Miranda isn't sorry that raises my ire whenever I think about it, Mondo. It's that she won't lie for the sake of the team. She doesn't have to be sorry, as Miranda didn't do anything wrong, as Miranda would have been a teenager at the time Jack escaped. But would it have killed her to fib a little just to defuse the situation?



Jack is in no way guiltless, as her outburst is akin to picking a fight with David Tennant because Sylvester McCoy was a crappy Doctor. But Miranda had the high ground and she should have used it. I'd rather her be dishonest and spiteful than honest and dumb.

#1333
procki

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Mondo47 wrote...

I dunno... I'll play devil's advocate again, and say it's not beyond the realms of possibility that Jack went up there to pick a fight. She's just come back from incinerating the place that has dogged her for her entire (remembered) life, and come to understand that it wasn't just her that had a rough time of it, but a whole bunch of other kids too. Jack might talk big about dropping space stations on moons, but she's not so stony that she can't feel guilt, or even sadness for others. And regardless of how it ended, the program was started by Cerberus. It's something to focus the anger on; with no target, you're just left with blind rage that nibbles away at you day and night, and she's already got enough of that **** to deal with without taking more on... think about it from her point of view: Shepard's helped her, been honest with her so far, and the rest of the Normandy's crew are faceless, just following orders or keeping out of her way, knocking them about is no more satisfying than shanking a prison guard when it's the warden you want to off. You need someone high-up to take it out on, someone who means something within Cerberus... that only can take you to the Cheerleader's room. It's not right to attack her - she had nothing to do with what was done personally - but it'll make you feel better for five minutes at least, before you're back alone with your thoughts again...

On the other side of the coin, Miranda can't appreciate how someone can be so angry with Cerberus. She refuses to accept the mistrust of the Quarians; that was just business. Jack is one scrawny little ****up who doesn't respect authority or fill a valuable role in society. She's human waste, plain and simple. Her only redeeming defect is her biotic ability, and that's been rendered unusable because it was crammed inside a screwed-up convict as opposed to someone that could appreciate the gift they'd been given. Miranda truly believes that humanity's advancement is a worthy goal, so why wouldn't it be acceptable to allow a few to suffer so the whole can improve? Besides, Cerberus shut down the program, so the blame for what happened can't possibly be laid at her door - the fact they started it in the first place is meaningless; the ends would have justified the means, and when it was obvious that the project wasn't working, they pulled the plug. Not a Cerberus problem anymore. Someone ripped the A section out of Miranda's dictionary, because she doesn't know the meaning of accountability.

I don't read either of them as particularly innocent in that exchange; Jack's anger is understandable but misplaced, and Miranda's attitude is shortsighted and ignorant of reality. People cannot rationalise a hurt that big; it changes people in awful ways, irrational ways. Just because you got a nice bottle of shampoo out of the years of research dosn't make the test bunny's retinas burn any less. Any chance of a normal life Jack may or may not have had was taken away by the experiments and has led to a life of excess, crime and further abuse. Those two women are an accident waiting to happen. I can see both sides, but only one person is an actual victim, and thus requiring sympathetic handling. The other is just being pigheaded and blinkered.

1-0 to Jack :P


Hmm, yes I can accept that. Especially if you consider the experiences during the Pragia mission. I never really thought about this as I always do Mirandas loyality mission last.
Even outside of her romance dialogue Jack shows sort of an attachment to people she can relate to. Like for instance the outlaw colony she used to live in. After the attack on that colony she destroyed the space station as a form of vengeance. So even if her sense of justice is "an eye for an eye" it shows she has some sort of moral compass and she isn't just out for herself.
Even though she originally showed great contempt for the other children in the Teltin facility, she may now see things differently. She may still think she had it worse there ( which hinges on whether you think it'S worse to be an expandable test subject, which could always die or to be a very valuable test subject which is mostly isolated) and  the other children may still have hated and attacked her during her escape. After seeing that she misinterpreted some of her memories and after seeing what has become of Aresh she may now see that these other children weren't weak and like her never had a choice because of what Cerberus did to them.
This may make her feel connected with the other victims of Teltin in way not unlike the way she felt about the people in the Outlaw Colony. Her normal way action would be to blow up something Cerberus related, but as she somehow still owes Shepard, this i not a possibility.
So this might lead her to go up to Miranda, who seems to be the very embodiment of Cerberus on the Normany and try to pick a fight.

#1334
Mondo47

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royceclemens wrote...

Jack is in no way guiltless, as her outburst is akin to picking a fight with David Tennant because Sylvester McCoy was a crappy Doctor.


WHAAAATT?!?!?!?

McCoy a crappy doctor??!?!? I cite Battlefield in defense! He stops a bunch of extradimensional knights and a UNIT detachment from killing one another by just raising his voice! At least he didn't spend 60% of his TARDIS-time telling people how 'very sorry' he was ;) ... he was the 30% added Emo Doctor! :devil:

And all Tennant's companions were irritating. And all his monsters sucked (save the old favorites). And he couldn't stand Captain Jack got more action than him. And he brought us teh worst Master evar... I miss Anthony Ainley... John Simm - ur doin it rong :(

I grew up with all the other ones... and Tom Baker owned the lot of 'em. Case dismissed :D

The Jack Thread - now with 40% added Talithreadness!

#1335
royceclemens

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Well, Mondo, it was just a for instance (light Scottish brogues FTW). Would you have been happier if I said Paul McGann? That's all I have to say about that... Except how DARE you defame Martha Jones! Freema Agyeman is going to be the future ex-Mrs. Clemens!



But going back to the topic at hand, good catch on Jack's moral compass, procki, about how she still has a set of morals, warped by surroundings and circumstance though they may be. It shows how Jack never stopped attempting to bring some semblence of decency in her life in the only way she knew how. Poor girl, it just dawned on me how hard she tried.

#1336
Mondo47

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royceclemens wrote...

Well, Mondo, it was just a for instance (light Scottish brogues FTW). Would you have been happier if I said Paul McGann? That's all I have to say about that... Except how DARE you defame Martha Jones! Freema Agyeman is going to be the future ex-Mrs. Clemens!

But going back to the topic at hand, good catch on Jack's moral compass, procki, about how she still has a set of morals, warped by surroundings and circumstance though they may be. It shows how Jack never stopped attempting to bring some semblence of decency in her life in the only way she knew how. Poor girl, it just dawned on me how hard she tried.


Ok, McGann is a given there... I tend to leap to McCoy's defense because I suspect I had a bit of a crush on him... I always wanted to be Ace *sigh* :kissing:

Also, yeah, Procki has a point there... she might be riding the delinquency line, but right up until she senses being used, you certainly get the feeling Jack is trying to do right by people in the only ways she knows how.

#1337
gneissguy2003

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Mondo47 wrote...

royceclemens wrote...

Well, Mondo, it was just a for instance (light Scottish brogues FTW). Would you have been happier if I said Paul McGann? That's all I have to say about that... Except how DARE you defame Martha Jones! Freema Agyeman is going to be the future ex-Mrs. Clemens!

But going back to the topic at hand, good catch on Jack's moral compass, procki, about how she still has a set of morals, warped by surroundings and circumstance though they may be. It shows how Jack never stopped attempting to bring some semblence of decency in her life in the only way she knew how. Poor girl, it just dawned on me how hard she tried.


Ok, McGann is a given there... I tend to leap to McCoy's defense because I suspect I had a bit of a crush on him... I always wanted to be Ace *sigh* :kissing:

Also, yeah, Procki has a point there... she might be riding the delinquency line, but right up until she senses being used, you certainly get the feeling Jack is trying to do right by people in the only ways she knows how.


Which would potentially help us understand exactly why some people who play the game don't like Jack that much. Jack is in a situation that she's never been in before. Most of the people that she's grouped with or teamed with in the past (the outlaw colony, Murtock, Manara and her boyfriend) have something that she perceives to be common between them and her. She's typically had a choice in who she "runs" with. This time, though, she doesn't have a choice; she either goes with Shepard on the Normandy or dies on Purgatory, and because she lives by instinct she won't accept death as an option. So here she is, forcefully recruited and surrounded by an entire shipload of people who she automatically blames for all the pain she's experienced in her life.

Until Jack has a reason to feel like she has something in common with the people on the Normandy, then she will never open up, she will never be close to them, and she will never make herself vulnerable. She's living in enemy territory, and she'll always keep at least one bullet in the chamber. Cue Shepard.

#1338
Noilly Prat

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I agree that a lot of people who dislike Jack probably prefer women who don't tell them to **** off and would rather romance a different (possibly needier or more virginal or more accepting of conventional gender roles) type of woman. But part of the reason I liked the Jack romance is seeing how Shepard behaves toward her... nice break from the knight in shining armor stuff.



I liked the fact that all of the different romances, in a way, show slightly different sides of Shepard's personality. Obviously, we still only get so much to work with on this front, but I feel like Shepard does show more hints of depth in the romances than in most other aspects of the game, and that the way he/she behaves generally seems pretty appropriate to the situation, in the romance dialogues if not every other scene in the game.



I enjoyed the Tali romance for her charming awkwardness and the references to the first game, and I thought that Shepard's softer approach fit well enough, but Jack's was the romance that made me like Shepard most. Of course, it doesn't hurt that Jack herself is just so cool, but I really enjoyed watching Shepard press her-- patient and sympathetic, but also having a bit of fun making her squirm. I felt like a bit less of a sap while pursuing Jack.

#1339
BobbyTheI

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I think you hit on one of the main strengths of Jack's romance: it requires an effort on Shepard's part.

Tali's romance is fun, yeah, but it's also the easiest.  She's already gaga over you, and you just have the artificial lengthening with her body chemistry to keep it from being consummated right away.  They give Miranda one token dialogue at the start going, "Oh, I don't like you, Shepard," before she immediately starts worshiping at your feet, like, "Oh, I may be genetically perfect, but I'll never be as good as you, Commander."

Jack, as we've said before, is doing everything she can to push you away.  She probably is the only female LI who isn't attracted to you right away, and it's only as she starts realizing she is that, instead of allowing it to happen, she pushes you away.  She doesn't need the pain of losing another loved one, and you have to convince her that it's worth the risk.

All in all, one of the reasons I'm writing complex arguments over here instead of posting one-line cooing over a character on another thread. :D

#1340
royceclemens

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What makes it work really well for me is the quality of the dialogue. You don't play a video game and expect top-tier quality dialogue like you'd see in, say a heist flick. In most forms of media, dialogue just moves the plot along. Characters say things simply to get us to the next scene quicker. But the Jack LI dialogue is defiantly, gloriously about itself.



I've used the term chess match before, but I honestly think it's apt. Diversions are mounted, risks are taken, defenses are fortified. I have nothing to compare it to except David Mamet, only with less colloquialisms, ellipses and F-bombs.



I have no idea who on the writing staff did the dialogue (and I would like an answer if any of the humps at BioWare read this thread), but, well... I'd say he or she should write for the movies, but then he or she wouldn't be writing for BioWare anymore, and we'd all miss out.

#1341
Mondo47

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Tha actually makes me wonder... how many different writers were at work on the story as a whole? I say 'story' in the broadest sense, since the script would have to be written in a pretty unusual manner considering it has no a-to-b-to-c to string it together; scenes having to make sense when played out at any point, dialogue remaining almost self-referential in its tightness and capsular nature, etc.

I've never been a great fan of collaborative writing as the people involve have to gel completely, and their individual ideas have to fit around one another equally to keep everything tight - the slightest misfit and the gaps are blindingly obvious. It seems like ME2 was a group effort (forgive me not for going and checking my facts right now - bit busy :) ), and some of the writers had tighter chops than others... Jack being a real highlight to me (and Mordin a close second). It seems almost a shame that some people will not have given her more than a cursory look-over because she's a selfish, whining, emo, bat**** crazy, evil ****... apparently.

Kinda feels like we've got a little bit of treasure all to ourselves, don't it? You climb the mountain, you get to enjoy the view.

Modifié par Mondo47, 10 mars 2010 - 10:02 .


#1342
royceclemens

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I think different writers are assigned to different characters while the head writer does the story.



And we get stragglers every day. It must be intimidating joining this thread as it's a perpetual conversation and not a fanart battle/twitter replacement.

#1343
Jackal904

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royceclemens wrote...

But back to the topic, It's not so much that Miranda isn't sorry that raises my ire whenever I think about it, Mondo. It's that she won't lie for the sake of the team. She doesn't have to be sorry, as Miranda didn't do anything wrong, as Miranda would have been a teenager at the time Jack escaped. But would it have killed her to fib a little just to defuse the situation?


She didn't have to lie, she just had to be a little sympathetic. If she had said something like "I'm sorry for what you went through, but I had nothing to do with it." Instead she just makes things worse by calling Jack a mistake and saying Cerberus had nothing to do with it which is bull**** whether or not the facility went rogue. That facility was their responsibility.

And I just realized that Miranda is quite the cold hearted ****. I forgot she acts like it's no big deal that Cerberus attacked the migrant fleet. Plus if you listen to some of the video logs in the lazurus station, Wilson talks about how Miranda acts so ungrateful for everything he has done and he even refers to her as an ice queen. So she doesn't care that Cerberus attacked the migrant fleet, she can't act a little sympathetic towards this girl that was physically and mentally tortured her entire childhood by the organization that she works for, and she won't even give Wilson a pat on the back for all the work he has done. I know he ends up betraying everyone but maybe if she tossed a little "good job" his way every now-and-then he wouldn't have tried to kill everyone Posted Image. Plus it's really annoying when she acts like she's above Shepard. Sometimes I just want to tell her to go sit in a corner.

#1344
Azint

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I've yet to "renegade scrog" Jack.Posted Image

#1345
Firmijn

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Azint wrote...

I've yet to "renegade scrog" Jack.Posted Image


Pretty please, to protect mine, and your own IQ, ban that word from this thread:unsure:

#1346
Mondo47

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Ahhhhhh! The 'S' word!

#1347
gneissguy2003

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royceclemens wrote...



I think different writers are assigned to different characters while the head writer does the story.



And we get stragglers every day. It must be intimidating joining this thread as it's a perpetual conversation and not a fanart battle/twitter replacement.




An interesting point. I don't think I'd ever have thought of this thread, or the people commenting in it, as being intimidating, but I can see why that might be the case. It seems so easy for me, personally, to comment in here with the rest of you. It's probably got something to do with what someone else said earlier about us Jackolytes having a certain "I-don't-give-a-****-ness" attributed to us.



Nonetheless, I've honestly enjoyed seeing some of the "new blood" that's cropped up in here in the last few pages. I was beginning to think that we were going to run out of discussion points because it was just the same couple of people commenting.



Oh, and Royce... I gotta say I love how you've been consistently comparing Jack and ME to other subject matter in literature. I'm not an amazingly well-read person myself, so having a viewpoint such as yours is refreshing and thought provoking. Thank you.

#1348
Jackal904

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Firmijn wrote...

Azint wrote...

I've yet to "renegade scrog" Jack.Posted Image


Pretty please, to protect mine, and your own IQ, ban that word from this thread:unsure:


I 100% agree. That word needs to be bleeped out like swear words, seriously...

#1349
Chaos-fusion

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gneissguy2003 wrote...

An interesting point. I don't think I'd ever have thought of this thread, or the people commenting in it, as being intimidating, but I can see why that might be the case. It seems so easy for me, personally, to comment in here with the rest of you. It's probably got something to do with what someone else said earlier about us Jackolytes having a certain "I-don't-give-a-****-ness" attributed to us.

I read alot of it. I don't mention anything myself though incase you guys already covered it, and I don't like taking the stick to the dead horse. .. I could just read through the thread, yes, but my attention span is abysmal when it comes down to reading. :unsure:

#1350
Azint

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Jackal904 wrote...

Firmijn wrote...

Azint wrote...

I've yet to "renegade scrog" Jack.Posted Image


Pretty please, to protect mine, and your own IQ, ban that word from this thread:unsure:


I 100% agree. That word needs to be bleeped out like swear words, seriously...

Now I know what peeves you.

I find your talks interesting, I've read alot of them. I don't comment because I feel like I'm intruding.