20813 réponses à ce sujet

[Errationatus]

Wall of text - read it anyway.  It's insightful, witty and at times, poignant and meaningful. There is also a free footrub to the first person to humor me and agree with the preceding statement.

Personally, I think Jack is the perfect partner for Shepard. 

There are a few things I think people get wrong - or, it may sound odd, not exactly right.  I've doubtless done it myself.

Those who think Jack needs !MIGHTY MAN MOJO! so miss the point it's not even worth arguing any longer.

In my opinion:

Jack doesn't need stability.  She doesn't need a family.  She doesn't need the cozy hearth holo deep in the comforting bowels (ewww, not a great metaphor!) of the Normandy to soothe her 'guilt' over whatever. 

Jack knows what she is.  And, I think, she knows what she isn't.  Jack wants answers.  She's said it herself - answers, not fixes. 

Fvck your fixes. 

She's not normal, nowhere close to normal and will never, ever, ever be anything even remotely resembling normal.  Doesn't need normal, doesn't want it, wouldn't know what to do with it if she had it.  It's like giv'n the cat the exercise bike.  All you get is the "what, you stupid or som'fin?" look and you'd deserve it.

I doubt she gives a crap about normality or stability or even certainty. 

She tells Shepard that she needs.  But needs what?  She never says what exactly she needs, and people guess and speculate, and think they know. 

Sometimes, just sometimes - needing is enough in itself.

One person. 

All Jack really needs is one person out of the uncountable trillions that she can actually and truly trust.  Love may or may not come, but that's not important.  The one thing Jack has never been able to do is trust anyone.  

Suicide mission?  Who cares?  You don't like Jack and waste her out of spite?  Joke's on you, douchebag - you did her a favour - you put her out of her misery.  If you did the human thing? Jack now has everything she wanted.  Death is trivial after that.  Loyalty is trust, plain and simple.  Everything else flows from that.  So Shepard leads a dangerous life?  So?  She's a consummate survivor.  I think you would never see her so happy and content as in the teeth of hell with Shepard there at her back and she at his, and they'd laugh to spite it all.

Did we romance Jack?  Really?  I don't think we actually did.  We just earned her trust, and saw the bare glimmers of something else.  But it's not love.  Not yet. 

You don't "change" Jack via waving the Magic Mojo Wand or do'n her up a treat;  if you change her at all, you humanize her.  You show this ravaged biotic beautiful monster that she is human, and it's not so bad. 

A last thing, probably not news:

In an odd way, Jack is a kind of litmus for gamers.    We perceptives, We Noughtians, we get it.  We know she's a new standard.  We're swimming in the deep end of the pool and staying out of the shallows.  We can dive and not break our necks like damn fools. 

Now...  who wants that footrub?

[Mondo47]

JakeMacDon wrote...

**snippety-snip**

Sure, I'd say you're right on the money with a lot of your points. Sure, we're all going to disagree on the fine details, because we all craft Jack into the Jack we'd like her to be to various degrees, but I'd say that's fairly even and accurate, Jake

[JohnnyBeGood2]

Can I just say that I prefer the various variations of the Jack avatars that are around as opposed to some of the user created Fem shep avatars that are around.

[Mondo47]

Well, she's probably getting as "better" as anyone could having gone through all she has.

I do wonder though how Shep deals with her 'bad days' - would he give her space, would he try and give her emotional support, etc.?

[Mondo47]

Yeah, that kinda takes us back to how certain Sheps - Earthborn, Sole Survivor, Colonist - would probably have enough insight to know how to handle Jack's moods, but when you're involved with someone intimately it can take away some of your common sense in a position like that; you're torn between your actual understanding and empathy and your sense of duty and affection to a person... it'd probably be a rough ride sometimes; rasied voices, flying furniture, tears, all that jazz.

[axl99]

And *cough*make-up sex*coughcough* lots of TLC.



I think she might be able to grow out of it. It's Jack we're talking about. She can think it out, she can adapt. That's how she always rolled - albeit on her own terms, but it's been done. It'd be a shame if she didn't having anything to show for ME3.

[Mondo47]

Yeah, I'm been too busy to do more than make my usual little posts here the past couple of weeks, as opposed to sitting down and spending an hour or two crafting something. I still need to finish 'Candy' - it has another part to the epilogue to go. After that, who knows? I do have some ideas for not-so-happy things... what can I say, I like writing about relationships from a real perspective - warts and all. Because hey, that's what relationships are like. They're not all kitties and bunnies.

Plus there's something else back here bubbling under, as you know, York. I think the people here are gonna love it!

[stewie1974]

As I said before.. Jack has told you why she dosn't trust people, last person she loved "DIED" and she hated them for that.

Jack may not give a **** about her own mortality, but if she falls in love with shep, isn't that "He's gonna die " ((given his choice of career and pretty much suicidal lifestyle)) gonna be at the back of her mind all the time..

So say shep gives her an order to hold a position or something, yet those crazy little thoughts like bugs crawling around inside her head, make her abandon her position to go and hold sheps back, wether he needs it or not.....
You are forgetting that jack is not "disciplined"... she choses "detachement" In order to prevent her succumbing to her emotional drives. Much easier not to make "Emotional" choices when you don't feel emotional about someone....

You may contend that Jack has the tools to deal with this kind of thing. She dosn't , She's compulsive and obbsessive and not at all able to control her emotions except when she "dosn't give a ****" about something.
You give her an order when she's indifferent about something, fine, she'll follow it... you give her an order when she's emotionally involved.... she don't have the tools to deal with it..... she'll either pitch a fit, sulk, or disobey.

Opening up a "love interest" with Jack pretty much means opening up the floodgates... Use her to cover your back on missions.... but ask her to hold a position away from shep where she can't "protect her interest", and she'll no doubt screw it up.

The abandonment issue is not something to be taken lightly.... people with such issues will either chose detachment.... or obssessive compulsive behaviour throwing all judgement out of the window.

Once you've broken down the detachment barrier , you have a more obbsessed and compulsive person who seeks to protect you regardless of orders... Jack aint the disciplined type to follow orders when theres a chance her love interest could die with out her there at their back....

Also potential "Jealousy" is also gonna raise its head once that "detachment" barrier is broken down.... Shep talked to Tali, or Mirianda, or even kelly.... you can imagine the temper tantrums Jack will throw.

As I said, courting jack is 24/7 job..... so is saving the galaxy... if you have the time, energy,and mental resources to keep on reassuring her that you aint seeing anyone else, you are fine with out her gaurding your back, then fine...

Solitude and detachment work well for her... romance and social conformity is something she is constantly going to battle with.... because she's not equipped to deal with it...

Shoot her, slap her, beat her.... fine she can deal with that crap, she's tough in that way... take her out of her element..... she's a weak little girl , with all the demands and wanting of child... she still is a child locked up inside a hard as nails pyscho biotic.

If you break through to the little girl, remember its not the sugar and spice one... It's the tantrum throwing, emotional, undisciplined ....Brat.

I don't mean this to be mean to Jack's character. It's her flaws that make me appriciate the characterisation that has gone with her..

I don't think sheps magic peen can solve all her problems.... I don't think he's the right choice for her partner. I don't think the problems are over once you start to romance, I say they are about to begin... No matter what you think, sheps magic genitles are not going to undo YEARS of issues...

It would take at least 6 other games with no other content other than the romance to actually get her happy and content.

Jack is always going to be that little girl they experimented on.... something she tries to hide with her physical apparence...   Shaved Head, Strapped down boobs, Boy clothes.. Masculine name .... She's trying to break away from what she she see's her self as inside...... a small helpless little girl.

Modifié par stewie1974, 22 septembre 2010 - 06:52 .

[Errationatus]

Mondo47 wrote...

JakeMacDon wrote...

**snippety-snip**

Sure, I'd say you're right on the money with a lot of your points. Sure, we're all going to disagree on the fine details, because we all craft Jack into the Jack we'd like her to be to various degrees, but I'd say that's fairly even and accurate, Jake

Thank you, Mondo.  High praise, indeed. 

*Rubbity-rub-rub*

Hmmm.... in light of the LotSB dossiers on our crew,  *Rubbity-rub-rub* I wonder if they shed any light on the other relationships that *Rubbity-rub-rub* can be had in the game?  For example, *Rubbity-rub-rub*, take Miranda, when she speaks of "hormones" and "time for love" *Rubbity-rub-rub*, does she mean it?  Or is she just desperate to have anybody?  Shepard just happens to be the best she's gonna get?  *Rubbity-rub-rub*  Or is it just "we could all die tomorrow, and he's the best I'm gonna get on this ship?"  *Rubbity-rub-rub*

Are they just insightful little adjuncts or do they radically alter the way we could regard the affairs?


*Rubbity-rub-rub*

[Therion942]

Anger can lead to a deeper understanding of both your partner and your relationship if used positively. Of course conventional logic dictates that throwing a couch at somebody generally means that you're beyond the "understanding why" phase. I'm sure a silver-tongued (and deft-footed; BOB AND WEAVE) Shepard could spin the situation positive.

[Big Blue Car]

yorkj86 wrote...

Considering the lines I posted above, I wonder if Bioware plans to write Jack as a little more mellow, for ME3. I doubt it, since not everyone romanced her. Shepard was probably just referring to the way Jack feels a little more at-home, aboard the Normandy. From the perspective of the romance, he's probably saying that Jack feels a little more comfortable with him.

If ME3 Jack isn't a pirate queen you visit to get the support of the galaxies underworld to battle the Reapers then Bioware have gone wrong.

[axl99]

I just wanna see Jack tear apart a reaper from the inside out.

[GodWood]

yorkj86 wrote...
Trying to write fanfiction where Shepard mulls over whether or not he should give the information about Jack's mother to Jack, I have no idea where to begin.  I tried to write how she would react to Shepard giving her the information, and the only thing I could come up with was "anger", which seems apt, but simply not sufficient

In my ideal universe Shepard and Jack would of read the dossiers together and would of had a good laugh.

Modifié par GodWood, 23 septembre 2010 - 08:37 .

[Epantiras]

Big Blue Car wrote...

If ME3 Jack isn't a pirate queen you visit to get the support of the galaxies underworld to battle the Reapers then Bioware have gone wrong.

That would be awesome!


And, in reply to the previous posts about the "coercion into romance" thing... well, Shepard does *not* force Jack into romance, but he's really obsessive! I felt like playing as a stalker. A good-hearted one, but still a stalker. Probably because of my female mentality... but when a girl says "no" and a boy keeps on bothering her, well, that's not nice. Ok, we all know that Jack is just putting on a wall to keep other people out of her life, but it still felt wrong.
As York said, if I remember correctly, that's mostly because of Shep's lines, some of which are really awful.