Into the Bad Girl: Jack Fans
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Average Gatsby
, févr. 05 2010 03:24
#18651
Guest_Midey_*
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 05:51
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I was thinking about romancing Jack... Interesting idea, don't you think?
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#18652
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 05:54
LordHelfort
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yorkj86 wrote...
LordHelfort wrote...
I dont think Jack is considered a (or as much as!) a STD ridden *ahem* as Isabela. I mean Isabela takes the cake on that one (I havent checked, but does she have ANY fans?).
Any woman who isn't virginal is an STD-ridden *ahem*. So says the internet.
Well, the internet is known for trolling, so its likely theyre trying to bait you bro.
I think (this is in response to the second poster below mine, my Forum skillz suck so I cant quote you at the same time) we might be reading a bit too much politics into the Isabela debate. Jack has had what, 3 (confirmed?) sexual partners, whereas Isabelas would probably need a computer screen to fill. I think given the brutal disparity in numbers between Jack and Isabela (alot like comparing a pond in your town to the Atlantic ocean) I think there will probably be a similar difference in the number of **** etc. accusations between the two.
Notably (this is a bad sample for a poll obv) Whenever I bicker with my friend about Jack or Isabela, he hasnt one mentioned Jack's ****tiness, but its centrality to her character is probably why this emerges as a major problem for many.
And in response to the accusation of men having a "vagina is mine mentality, you can chalk that one up to evolution.
#18653
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Posté 15 avril 2011 - 05:59
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Trolling? No, I'm not getting trolled. I was being sarcastic. As for the internet, some people actually believe this. People have believed this, for a very, very long time.
Modifié par yorkj86, 15 avril 2011 - 06:00 .
#18654
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 06:00
LordHelfort
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yorkj86 wrote...
Trolling? No, I'm not getting trolled. Some people actually believe this, and people have believed this, for a very, very long time.
Well, I perhaps mistakenly assumed we unspokenly agreed that this was aside from those very *special people*, but trolling is just as likely.
#18655
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 06:18
Mondo47
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I think the line Jack uses is "I've been with lots of people, but if you mean a boyfriend or a girlfriend, no." That at the least alludes to her having a pretty casual approach to intimacy. There's plenty of other dialogue that says the same kinds of things. It's enough for the morons to wheel out the skank label.
Actually, if it was down to evolution and not social conditioning, we'd see more of you fighting one another to the death over breeding rights. I'd break out the popcorn for that
And women have evolved too, you know... if I don't say it's yours and yours alone and you want to disagree, me and Ms.45 here are willing to school you fellas on Darwin. And ballistics.
Now that's a lesson Jack would approve of
LordHelfort wrote...
And in response to the accusation of men having a "vagina is mine mentality, you can chalk that one up to evolution.
Actually, if it was down to evolution and not social conditioning, we'd see more of you fighting one another to the death over breeding rights. I'd break out the popcorn for that
And women have evolved too, you know... if I don't say it's yours and yours alone and you want to disagree, me and Ms.45 here are willing to school you fellas on Darwin. And ballistics.
Now that's a lesson Jack would approve of
Modifié par Mondo47, 15 avril 2011 - 06:19 .
#18656
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 06:24
axl99
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Last I checked, the one time we saw Isabela getting sick over her promiscuity was when she was using it to keep certain people in authoritative positions from butting in her homeless friend's business.
But this is the Jack thread, and granted I like Jack for more or less the same reasons as Isabela, I shall make up for the lack of Jack with this:
Yes. I'm still working on it... When I'm not busy throwing tables across the room because someone just gave me more work to do.
But this is the Jack thread, and granted I like Jack for more or less the same reasons as Isabela, I shall make up for the lack of Jack with this:
Yes. I'm still working on it... When I'm not busy throwing tables across the room because someone just gave me more work to do.
#18657
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 06:27
Mondo47
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Looking good, Axl, as always. I somehow see GLaDOS not approving of the use of biotics though... so unscientific!
#18658
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 06:37
LordHelfort
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Mondo47 wrote...
I think the line Jack uses is "I've been with lots of people, but if you mean a boyfriend or a girlfriend, no." That at the least alludes to her having a pretty casual approach to intimacy. There's plenty of other dialogue that says the same kinds of things. It's enough for the morons to wheel out the skank label.LordHelfort wrote...
And in response to the accusation of men having a "vagina is mine mentality, you can chalk that one up to evolution.
Actually, if it was down to evolution and not social conditioning, we'd see more of you fighting one another to the death over breeding rights. I'd break out the popcorn for that
And women have evolved too, you know... if I don't say it's yours and yours alone and you want to disagree, me and Ms.45 here are willing to school you fellas on Darwin. And ballistics.
Now that's a lesson Jack would approve of
Geuss I overlooked that part (thanks Mondo, Ill wonder if I did that unconciously or not for the rest of the day). On the note of breeding rights, most competition takes the non-violent form, since of course simply being the biggest brute doesnt necessarily mean youd be the best father and I suspect most competition for breeding rights would A) Be group-style combat, similar to the Roman myth of how they got enough women to keep going (something about Sabines) and
Reduce Women's status to something akind to how it was about 1200 years ago (Assuredly something neither of us will be behind)But we are WAY off topic oh dear
I think Jack would make a better MC for Portal 2, if only because Puzzles suck and explosions are fun. I wonder what everyone else thinks of Bioware also producing an escape hatch for the promiscuity thing, because in both Jacks and Isabela's case you can 'overlook'/excuse the promiscuity based on...well just plain horror or conjugal violence.
#18659
Guest_Sundown Native_*
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 07:28
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Y'know, Jack's parents might end up dead, come ME3. If they weren't, already.
I know we're pretty much past the Murtock thing, so now I want to ask about something that pretty much sums up all of the speculation about who or what's going to show up in Jack's life in the third game.
What's wrong with a little background? I see most people saying that they don't want the game to turn into a soap opera. It's not like I'm saying have an entire mission based on catching up with your mother, or something entirely dialogue ridden. It's not like any of that is going to happen, anyway, with the Reapers invading, and putting something like that into the game when the entire galaxy's about to get wiped out would make it seem out of place.
But anything that could flesh out a particular character while keeping the main focus of the story would be appreciated. For example, if Jack was going to meet with family? She would be going to SAVE them first, most likely. They wouldn't talk -- at least, not much -- until the Reapers were defeated.
Second example. Murtock was never in any real danger. That whole scuffle with the batarians was staged. Maybe they -- and by 'they', I mean Cerberus -- wanted her to think he was dead, just to see if it'd do anything to her biotics. They might just send his ass to her, in an attempt to get under her skin, and betray Shepard.
That'd serve as a good reason to include him, and it could be used however the developers wished.
Not every "What if" is going to have Shepard sitting at a coffee table, having tea over which gift would be best to grant Jack, or having her meet her family, and warming up to them, all in the same month. Including these people from her past has got to have a sufficient enough reason for me, and the setting of the final game does a lot to exclude those exact same ideas that would give you the impression that it was turning into a soap opera.
I know we're pretty much past the Murtock thing, so now I want to ask about something that pretty much sums up all of the speculation about who or what's going to show up in Jack's life in the third game.
What's wrong with a little background? I see most people saying that they don't want the game to turn into a soap opera. It's not like I'm saying have an entire mission based on catching up with your mother, or something entirely dialogue ridden. It's not like any of that is going to happen, anyway, with the Reapers invading, and putting something like that into the game when the entire galaxy's about to get wiped out would make it seem out of place.
But anything that could flesh out a particular character while keeping the main focus of the story would be appreciated. For example, if Jack was going to meet with family? She would be going to SAVE them first, most likely. They wouldn't talk -- at least, not much -- until the Reapers were defeated.
Second example. Murtock was never in any real danger. That whole scuffle with the batarians was staged. Maybe they -- and by 'they', I mean Cerberus -- wanted her to think he was dead, just to see if it'd do anything to her biotics. They might just send his ass to her, in an attempt to get under her skin, and betray Shepard.
That'd serve as a good reason to include him, and it could be used however the developers wished.
Not every "What if" is going to have Shepard sitting at a coffee table, having tea over which gift would be best to grant Jack, or having her meet her family, and warming up to them, all in the same month. Including these people from her past has got to have a sufficient enough reason for me, and the setting of the final game does a lot to exclude those exact same ideas that would give you the impression that it was turning into a soap opera.
#18660
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 08:02
zewuok
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That, if done properly, could be great and really add to the story. For example, you need Kvorian fleet to defeat the Reapers so in one mission you have to convince the Admiralty, in the meantime learning more about their different views on the geth war, the positive and negative effects of Tali's father experiments etc. The same could go with Salarians or Krogans and genophage/rachni wars and so on. Just don't limit it to LIs background only.
I'll be happy and pissed off at the same time if BW makes us choose between brand new and powerful biotic implants (which had been tested on kids like Jack, but which will give us a real power boost to defeat the Reapers, or implants blocking the indoctrination) and typical implants that are almost useless 'cause the metal space squids can just mess with everyone's minds.
PS. Speaking about gifts, I didn't like DAO gift system- "I don't like you, Warden - nice shiny gift- I will die for you, Warden.
I'll be happy and pissed off at the same time if BW makes us choose between brand new and powerful biotic implants (which had been tested on kids like Jack, but which will give us a real power boost to defeat the Reapers, or implants blocking the indoctrination) and typical implants that are almost useless 'cause the metal space squids can just mess with everyone's minds.
PS. Speaking about gifts, I didn't like DAO gift system- "I don't like you, Warden - nice shiny gift- I will die for you, Warden.
#18661
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 08:58
Mondo47
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Sundown Native wrote...
Second example. Murtock was never in any real danger. That whole scuffle with the batarians was staged. Maybe they -- and by 'they', I mean Cerberus -- wanted her to think he was dead, just to see if it'd do anything to her biotics. They might just send his ass to her, in an attempt to get under her skin, and betray Shepard.
Oh dear. Jack's reaction if she found out that Murtock was some Cerberus stooge...
I think it might go a little something like this:
#18662
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Posté 15 avril 2011 - 09:42
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It also can allude to Jack fearing an intimate relationship. I think it's safe to say that Jack hasn't exactly had a healthy love life. You've discussed in the past, Mondo, of how you think that Jack exaggerates and displays a facade about herself and her history when exchanging dialog with Shepard. This can make one question her self-esteem, if this is the case.Mondo47 wrote...
I think the line Jack uses is "I've been with lots of people, but if you mean a boyfriend or a girlfriend, no." That at the least alludes to her having a pretty casual approach to intimacy. There's plenty of other dialogue that says the same kinds of things. It's enough for the morons to wheel out the skank label.
Intimacy may not be any different. Romantic relationships, or any relationships, could be quite awkward for her. It actually makes sense given her history. So when she is asked about her past relationships, she casually tells Shepard "I've been with lots of people, but if you mean a boyfriend or a girlfriend, no.", she could be intentionally marginalizing "intimacy", playing it down, as if has very little concern to her, but this could be part of the facade. She may be starving for an intimate relationship, and could simply be scared.
#18663
Posté 15 avril 2011 - 10:10
Mondo47
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True, it could, but I just get this gut feeling from it all... it's something about how she says it, that how she just launches into sex like a missile (if your Shep's an idiot, that is). Perhaps me using the word "intimacy" has loaded it somewhat, but I do believe that Jack draws a line between sex and genuine intimacy (as in sharing emotional attachment as opposed to just body fluids). Considering some of the things she's been through, I think detachment from sex would be not unbelieveable, but I think it's more like Jack has had it enforced throughout her development as an adult that sex is something people want. You don't have to put yourself into it, going through the motions is often enough, and it gives you an idea about their motivations. So Jack detaches herself from it all; sure, she might physically enjoy it, but she's not really all there. I'm sure considering all the sex, drugs and going to a better place she had with the cult, and the numerous unsavoury characters she's formed temporary alliance with, she's used sex as either a yardstick to measure a person's character, or as a bargaining chip to get to something she actually wants... mercenary, certainly, but logical for where she's been, what she's done and how she's survived.
I think your use of "love life" there is a very nice way to bundle it up into one whole (at least the way I see it) - Jack has probably had a lot of sexual partners over the years, but very, very little of it could have ever have been called a love life. It's been another part of her arsenal of survival tools, one that can come out as casually as a blade from a Swiss Army knife, but love has barely been part of that. It would explain the frustration and anger at the loss of Murtock before she understood what he was really about, and the abject fear of going there again and losing it.
I think your use of "love life" there is a very nice way to bundle it up into one whole (at least the way I see it) - Jack has probably had a lot of sexual partners over the years, but very, very little of it could have ever have been called a love life. It's been another part of her arsenal of survival tools, one that can come out as casually as a blade from a Swiss Army knife, but love has barely been part of that. It would explain the frustration and anger at the loss of Murtock before she understood what he was really about, and the abject fear of going there again and losing it.
#18664
Guest_Sundown Native_*
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 12:02
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Mondo47 wrote...
So Jack detaches herself from it all; sure, she might physically enjoy it, but she's not really all there.
I'm sorry, I know what you were talking about was important, but that sentence put necrophilia into my head. Which kind of reinforces my idea of not having sex with her just for the hell of it.
I'd rather they'd both be there than just one person. Just doesn't seem right, otherwise.
#18665
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 12:27
HK-90210
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Just a thought I'm sending in here for discussion on Jack's role in ME3:
The GI article says that Cerberus is after Shepard now. Jack hates Cerberus. If romanced, Jack loves Shepard. What will Jack's natural reaction be?
I think Jack's role is going to be that of the Anti-Cerberus squadmate(possibly temporary, but I don't think so). You might recruit while she is wiping out an entire Cerberus base on her own, or maybe she saves you from a Cerberus surprise attack. I don't know, but that's the only direction I can see her character taking in the next game. Otherwise, what else is our crazy biotic @#!$% going to do?
The GI article says that Cerberus is after Shepard now. Jack hates Cerberus. If romanced, Jack loves Shepard. What will Jack's natural reaction be?
I think Jack's role is going to be that of the Anti-Cerberus squadmate(possibly temporary, but I don't think so). You might recruit while she is wiping out an entire Cerberus base on her own, or maybe she saves you from a Cerberus surprise attack. I don't know, but that's the only direction I can see her character taking in the next game. Otherwise, what else is our crazy biotic @#!$% going to do?
#18666
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 01:27
android654
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LordHelfort wrote...
I dont think Jack is considered a (or as much as!) a STD ridden *ahem* as Isabela. I mean Isabela takes the cake on that one (I havent checked, but does she have ANY fans?).
I loves me some Izzie
#18667
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 02:49
Jedi Master of Orion
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I think the idea behind Isabella's character is that she's more promiscuous than Jack, even how much she talks about it. She certainly seems to be more overtly interested in sex than Jack given how much she flirts with everyone. Plus it's kind of a joke that Isabella has STDs in the game itself.
For me after having played Dragon age 2, I found I got along with her a lot like Zevran. In my first run our relationship ended very poorly. Second time around I learned how to do it better.
For me after having played Dragon age 2, I found I got along with her a lot like Zevran. In my first run our relationship ended very poorly. Second time around I learned how to do it better.
#18668
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Posté 16 avril 2011 - 03:51
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Whatever it is, I hope we don't have to go rescue her again. No point in defining her as independent and all-powerful if what we actually see is that she can't take care of herself.CastonFolarus wrote...
Just a thought I'm sending in here for discussion on Jack's role in ME3:
The GI article says that Cerberus is after Shepard now. Jack hates Cerberus. If romanced, Jack loves Shepard. What will Jack's natural reaction be?
I think Jack's role is going to be that of the Anti-Cerberus squadmate(possibly temporary, but I don't think so). You might recruit while she is wiping out an entire Cerberus base on her own, or maybe she saves you from a Cerberus surprise attack. I don't know, but that's the only direction I can see her character taking in the next game. Otherwise, what else is our crazy biotic @#!$% going to do?
I believe Jack has overcome her issues with Cerberus, that's what we went to Pragia for. I mean she still hates them but that's not what moves her anymore. What I don't know is how many time has passed between ME2 and ME3. If it's not too much time, why would Jack abandon the normandy at all (especially if she romanced Shepard)?
#18669
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Posté 16 avril 2011 - 05:15
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axl99 wrote...
Last I checked, the one time we saw Isabela getting sick over her promiscuity was when she was using it to keep certain people in authoritative positions from butting in her homeless friend's business.
But this is the Jack thread, and granted I like Jack for more or less the same reasons as Isabela, I shall make up for the lack of Jack with this:
Yes. I'm still working on it... When I'm not busy throwing tables across the room because someone just gave me more work to do.
:wub:I love it! Can't wait to see the finished product.
Also can't wait for Portal 2 on Tuesday (unless Valve gives us another of their famous but well excusable delays)!
#18670
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 05:56
SlottsMachine
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Mondo47 wrote...
So Jack detaches herself from it all; sure, she might physically enjoy it, but she's not really all there. I'm sure considering all the sex, drugs and going to a better place she had with the cult, and the numerous unsavoury characters she's formed temporary alliance with, she's used sex as either a yardstick to measure a person's character, or as a bargaining chip to get to something she actually wants... mercenary, certainly, but logical for where she's been, what she's done and how she's survived.
I agree with this Mondo, I'm thinking Murtock probably failed the "test", that would explain why she thought he was using her for sex like all the rest. I can picture Jack replaying all there memories together over again in her mind after hearing his message trying to figure out if there were any signs that he felt that way about her, because this "love" business must have seemed like it came out of left field to her.
#18671
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 09:12
Epantiras
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axl99 wrote...
[awesome art]
Yes. I'm still working on it... When I'm not busy throwing tables across the room because someone just gave me more work to do.
looks great so far!!! Can't wait to see the finished version (unless someone gives you more work to do, that is).Also, I'm enjoying the current discussion, but I just don't have anything to add yet. Proceed
#18672
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 12:41
Mondo47
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Sundown Native wrote...
Mondo47 wrote...
So Jack detaches herself from it all; sure, she might physically enjoy it, but she's not really all there.
I'm sorry, I know what you were talking about was important, but that sentence put necrophilia into my head. Which kind of reinforces my idea of not having sex with her just for the hell of it.
I'd rather they'd both be there than just one person. Just doesn't seem right, otherwise.
It's nto really supposed to sound right to anyone, but people do do that; particularly people that have survived rape or sexual abuse, even people that have been through psychologically-abusive relationships let alone physical ones sometimes take this kind of mental-retreat from the act itself.
Perhaps it's because it's so not-right is why so many people don't construe the culmination of the paragon romance as sex (hence Jack loves cuddles
). Well, I'm expecting that's why at least.
#18673
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 04:34
spirosz
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Hey guys, I wrote another song for Jack. This one based on the romance scene/future cuddles hahah. She's such a well written character, can't get enough. Anyway, I hope you guys like it
www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPu1XYvrrOg
www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPu1XYvrrOg
Modifié par spiros9110, 16 avril 2011 - 04:35 .
#18674
Guest_Sundown Native_*
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 08:07
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Slow day, huh?
#18675
Posté 16 avril 2011 - 08:32
Mak999
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Modifié par Mak999, 16 avril 2011 - 08:38 .
