82 réponses à ce sujet

[Vaeliorin]

Your groups are lacking. I liked (didn't love) ME1, and like (don't love) ME2. I wish they'd gone more towards RPG than TPS. What I'd really like is a turn-based game for ME3 (I know that won't happen...maybe a spin-off?) ala Fallout 1/2 (but with a cover system and powers still...and squadmates who don't shoot you in the back or stand in your line of fire.)

[AtreiyaN7]

Why I'm #1, and I think the "choice" and loot in ME1 were overrated. I'm OCD about locked containers, but let me tell you that omni-gelling 10+ Snowblind X ammo rounds in a row just to make space (for stuff I didn't really even need when I started my NG+ runs) was not my idea of entertainment or fun.

[Sean]

I am like the 2nd

[BrunoBolderfist]

2nd, but I'm liking the new inventory system now that I'm used to it.

[Grand_Commander13]

Cygnus Atratus wrote...

You are not a number. You are a free man!

*laughs evilly*

*cough*

Ahem.  Liked ME1, loved ME2.

[pfcpartsz]

2 but can commisserate with the 3s...

Was expecting alot from ME2 after DAO and how pleasantly surprised I was
at how good that game was.

Loved the first ME (behind original KOTOR as my favorite bioware game)
but I'd have to agree that ME2 feels lacking and is going in a weird
direction for a bioware game...  Seems like they took a step back almost.
I didn't care for the new chars as much as I did for the old crew.

Main gripes were the story was kinda off and loyalty missions were
all similar (aside from thane and samara), shoot this and get there, 
though Tali and Garrus' arcs were great.


Cons

Not much in replayability...

-planet grinding...  a few exploration missions or a mix of both would have been fine
-ammo "heatsinks", hybrid would have been nice
-you can't earn all weapon proficiencies, only choose from select ones
and are shackled with it, yet can change abilitites with ezo
-skill trees regressed... 
-ammo access or lack of it... 
-paragon/renegade points don't stack after playthroughs leading to early
missed convo options unless you are continuing from a ME1 save
-you can't get more powerful versions of weapons after the first choice 
-squadmates don't interact on missions
-cover system... how about click the stick to get into cover and if you hold down run, you'd leap it?
-no random encounters (would have expected zaeed to leave and pull a calo nord after the
paragon on his mission, definiately not loyalty lol)
-inserting disc one and two back and forth on the xbx, wasn't installing it supposed to end that lol?
-limited choice of weapons
-no spectre class weapons lol



Pros

-interesting locals
-funny npc talks
-some npcs were terrific and more interesting then squadmates (Bailey, Kelly, Conrad, reporter,
engineers, matriarch bartender, etc)
-nice influx of variety of chars, if somewhat plain
-Joker part (wasn't expecting it)
-combat, though nerfing some powers turned it into more of a tps



Overall it was somewhat of a disappointment as I'm not sure I like
the way the series is headed, but a decent game as is.  Bigger and
prettier game but definitely not as good or as charming as the first. 

-----

Be interesting to see what happens next when whole team dies though lol.

Also, how come intergalactic strip joints only feature asaris?  Shouldn't there
be at the least taurian, quarian, elcor, hanhar, human, krogan, and batarain
strippers to cater to the rest of the galaxy as well? 

[Veex]

etherhonky wrote...

heres the deal, i think theres 3 types of posters involved in this discussion mainly...

1- person who loved ME1 and loves ME2.
2- person who loved ME1 and likes ME2 (but wishes it were more like ME1)
3- person who loved ME1 and now hates ME2.

Not everyone loved Mass Effect. I thought it was a good start for something billed as a hybrid RPG/Shooter, I think that Mass Effect 2 is more near to that goal.

[KPnuts123]

I am not a number but a person. However if you want to pigeonhole me put me in with group number 1. I loved ME1 and Love ME2 although I can see that it doe's have flaws.



Also group 3 at times tends to look at ME1 with Rose Tinted Glasses. Sure it's a greta game but it really does have it's flaws as well.

[Mezinger]

Group 2 here.

[DKnightPortela]

im a 5th group i loved ME1 for its inovative world and feel but hate bioware for selling out ME2, the group armor control and weapons assignment but i do understand the grip with the ammo changing and modules grinding but i took that as part of the game. In the second it totally lack any reward for that and the stores feel empty, story wise i also am disapointed with it it lacks the epicness of the 1st one, It feels empty, the music the enviroments and even the roleplay were taken off to extreme limits to enforce action and not storytelling, taking out in mission chatter from party members and making all enviroments look like a shooter designed level with a end flag and menu breaking the imersion tottaly.

If i didnt bought the digital version i would return it and buy AVP from Rebellion instead.

Modifié par DKnightPortela, 06 février 2010 - 04:41 .

[Moogliepie]

I'm not in any of your three types. Maybe you are missing that many of us thought ME1 was simply an inferior game with a great storyline. The whole time I was playing ME1, I thought, "I would love to see this as a movie, or high-budget miniseries, but the gameplay is awful, boring, with idiotically easy, yet clunky-feeling combat and it really felt like they rushed this to the shelves more than any other game I have owned. Really Bioware, I am disappointed you released this choose-your-own adventure movie and dared to call it a game."



Then Mass Effect 2 came out. The only reason I didn't pre-order was because I was so skeptical that the same problems plaguing the first would be in this one. After I read some reviews and got some confirmation that almost all of those issues had been addressed, I went out and bought it. After playing through it, I think this is easily on my top ten games of all time. Yeah a few things could have been better, but no game is perfect, especially when they were building off the horrible game design of the first one.

[Sirsmirkalot]

I'm a group 2 person.

ME1 

Superior locations
While the locations in both games offer a variety of differant worlds, the places in mass effect 1 have a lot more immersion. Part of is due to their superior individual stories along with their place in the main storyline (more on this below).

A better story
I've said it before and I'll say it again : Mass Effect 1 felt like you were dragged into an epic battle against Saren and the Reapers, while Mass Effect 2 felt like a trek arround the galaxy to collect 10 crewmen. The main antagonists were pushed too far to the background, since during the majority of the game you're doing nothing that relates to them even the slightest (it's like someone pressed the pause button on the main story). It really didn't feel like you were saving the galaxy from the reapers or anyone else anymore. PI Shepard anyone?

ME1 : Story about fending off a galactic threat where you pick up your crew along the way.
ME2 : Story about picking up 10 differant crew members to kill the "badguys".

Better weapon customization
Mass effect 1 allowed me to adapt my weapons, and those of my teammates, a lot more to the current situation. While trying to maintain an oversight of the inventory was nigh impossible, the results of the little bit of tinkering were awesome.

An ending that made the hairs in your neck stand up straight
I've finished Mass Effect 1 about 6 times in total now, and it still has one of the best endings in the entire gaming history if you ask me. The whole setup of the ending was so much more greater and epic. Saving the galaxy guns blazing with an armada of ships is just that more epic than finishing off a beehive that for the most of the game, was no concern to you.

Better immersion
The hand designed intermezzo's during missions on the makko really shined and gave the game a bigger scope.
Also, seeing your crewmembers run arround in vacuum with nothing but breather masks is beyond awkward and steers away from the semi-realistic impression that I got from ME1.

And then there were also no "mission end" screens. I can forgive you a lot Bioware, but those Mission End screens are beyond ridiculous. Complete and utter immersion and gameflow destroyers. After playing all your games for nearly a decade, I find these "Missions end" screens to be your worst decision ever.

ME2

Superior combat
Saying that I love the combat on my infiltrator, Soldier or Vanguard doesn't cut it. I'm really, really blown away by your combat mechanics in this game. I've never liked shooting as much in a third person shooter as I do in this game, and I've played a lot of them. This is also the main reason why I'm gearing up for a 4th playthrough.

Better armor customization
Another thing that I like a lot more. It feels similar to tweaking my armor in ME1, but than with a bigger impact concerning my choises. Along with that, the option to color my armor to my liking = win.
Note : this only applies to the PC, not the partymembers.

Better companions
The partymembers that you can recruit feel more diverse and more human as you talk to them. Also, their backgrounds are more compelling to me. I just wish that the manner on which you recruit them had something to do with the main story!

Thank you for your time.

And Bioware, despite the flaws don't let anyone tell you you can't be proud of this product. 
I myself am already looking forward to your next one.

I hope my english wasn't too bad!

Modifié par Sirsmirkalot, 06 février 2010 - 05:17 .

[Phaedra Sanguine]

vutha_ixen wrote...

Ok, I must admit that I fall into the second category. I don't hate ME2 but I think that it is missing some things that the first one did quite well. Here is a quick good bad about ME2 (personal opinion of course).

First off the skill system is to simple. Each character has 4 skill set s that have four ranks. On the flip side of this I do like having two options for the final rank.

Secondly, there is a disappointingly small amount of loot. In an MMO I can see loot as not being as important, but a single player game need something to collect to extend the lifespan of the game. Also being stuck with pretty much the same gear for half the game is kinda boring. Even FPSs have a variety of new guns that they hold out to give you until the game has progressed to a certain point in the plot. The flip side of this one is I like being able to customize the color scheme of the armor that I'm wearing. That was a nice touch,

Lastly, the ability to only use three abilities at a time (one per character in party) was very tactically limiting. Yes I know Bioware wanted to emphasize the FPS aspect by increasing our reliance on using bullets, but I miss my well planned strategies where I would have a string of four keys for my powers and throw in ally powers for special circumstances. On top of that some powers felt like they were made for a combo attack, but with only three at a time, and reliance on having standing team mates they were unreliable. If you really want to make the FPS more important then make us aim our powers instead of limiting the number of powers we can use. There is no real flip side to this! This was just a bad mistake.

I have complaints about loyalty, inventory (or lack there is of), and a too predictable story line on top of what I've alread said. However, there are a few posts above mine such as Djehutynakht's post that cover those for me. That was my two cents anyway, and I hope that the developers are reading these so they can polish the thrid game into a perfect fusion of the first and second ME.

I stopped reading at the point where you mentioned wanting something to collect. You want to collect? Collect stamps, the flakes of your skin from the floor as you sit typing inane forum replies. Someone needs to find all these players who believe that Diablo is the true rpg style, they need to find these people and bash them in the face with natural selection bat -- bolded in big black lettering on the side.

Stop living in the past and join us in the awesomeness. Until then, enjoy your overflowing inventory and meaningless collection of items in... hrm, diablo and world of warcraft.

[beermilk]

Here we go again, some moron complaining about the lack of customization and flailing this fact around as some sort of proof that ME2 isnt a RPG.

[DKnightPortela]

Sirsmirkalot wrote...

ME1 

Superior locations
While the locations in both games offer a variety of differant worlds, the places in mass effect 1 have a lot more immersion. Part of is due to their superior individual stories along with their place in the main storyline (more on this below).

A better story
I've said it before and I'll say it again : Mass Effect 1 felt like you were dragged into an epic battle against Saren and the Reapers, while Mass Effect 2 felt like a trek arround the galaxy to collect 10 crewmen. The main antagonists were pushed too far to the background, since during the majority of the game you're doing nothing that relates to them even the slightest (it's like someone pressed the pause button on the main story). It really didn't feel like you were saving the galaxy from the reapers or anyone else anymore. PI Shepard anyone?

ME1 : Story about fending off a galactic threat where you pick up your crew along the way.
ME2 : Story about picking up 10 differant crew members to kill the "badguys".

Better weapon customization
Mass effect 1 allowed me to adapt my weapons, and those of my teammates, a lot more to the current situation. While trying to maintain an oversight of the inventory was nigh impossible, the results of the little bit of tinkering were awesome.

An ending that made the hairs in your neck stand up straight
I've finished Mass Effect 1 about 6 times in total now, and it still has one of the best endings in the entire gaming history if you ask me. The whole setup of the ending was so much more greater and epic. Saving the galaxy guns blazing with an armada of ships is just that more epic than finishing off a beehive that for the most of the game, was no concern to you.

Better immersion
The hand designed intermezzo's during missions on the makko really shined and gave the game a bigger scope. That and there were no "mission end" screens. I can forgive you a lot Bioware, but those Mission End screens are beyond ridiculous. Complete and utter immersion and gameflow destroyers.

Also, seeing your crewmembers run arround in vacuum with nothing but breather masks is beyond awkward and steers away from the semi-realistic impression that I got from ME1.

ME2
Superior combat,
Saying that I love the combat on my infiltrator, Soldier or Vanguard doesn't cut it. I'm really, really blown away by your combat mechanics in this game. I've never liked shooting as much in a third person shooter as I do in this game, and I've played a lot of them. This is also the main reason why I'm gearing up for a 4th playthrough.

Better armor customization
Another thing that I like a lot more. It feels similar to tweaking my armor in ME1, but than with a bigger impact concerning my choises. Along with that, the option to color my armor to my liking = win.
Note : this only applies to the PC, not the partymembers.

Better companions
The partymembers that you can recruit feel more diverse and more human as you talk to them. Also, their backgrounds are more compelling to me. I just wish that the manner on which you recruit them had something to do with the main story!

This. Awesome explanation with all my problems with ME2 told in a concise manner.

[MassEffect762]

# 2 but just barely. Otherwise # 3



I won't accept this if ME3 is a carbon copy of ME2.

[DoNotResistHate]

I am a #2. I think they definitely need to find the middle ground.

[Aratar Amero]

Ive said it before in other posts and I'm saying it again as it annoys the crap out of me reading this. as Beermilk said, Customization and inventory screens are NOT what make an rpg, they are tools implemented in games for equipping weapons and such, if you think its anything more than that please return to your WoW and stop playing/talking about real rpgs. If you have a problem with the equipment menus and style of loot, thats fine, complain about it as a problem with equipment selections, but do not complain that it ruins the rpg experience of the game just because items aren't pissing out of every corpse or because you dont have your magical bag of holding that lets you carry 150 items anymore, because that is total bs and these people need to learn the true meaning of an rpg.



On a side note id consider myself somewhere between #1 and #2, I love both games but at the same time i can see why people are saying certain things and somewhat agree.

[MassEffect762]

Aratar Amero wrote...

Ive said it before in other posts and I'm saying it again as it annoys the crap out of me reading this. as Beermilk said, Customization and inventory screens are NOT what make an rpg, they are tools implemented in games for equipping weapons and such, if you think its anything more than that please return to your WoW and stop playing/talking about real rpgs. If you have a problem with the equipment menus and style of loot, thats fine, complain about it as a problem with equipment selections, but do not complain that it ruins the rpg experience of the game just because items aren't pissing out of every corpse or because you dont have your magical bag of holding that lets you carry 150 items anymore, because that is total bs and these people need to learn the true meaning of an rpg.

On a side note id consider myself somewhere between #1 and #2, I love both games but at the same time i can see why people are saying certain things and somewhat agree.

NVM, I take it back.

Modifié par MassEffect762, 06 février 2010 - 06:57 .

[Sirsmirkalot]

Let's try to keep this thread ontopic, shall we?

[I Pyrrhus I]

Frotality wrote...

i find it very disconcerting that people cant accept ME2 has some flaws....

im certainly #2, and i think #1 is lying to themselves in some way about what they really wanted in the game, and that #3 while often justified is way to extreme.

how so many can claim to love ME1 yet berate every RPG feature it had as better off gone is quite odd. most seem to just take Bioware's reasoning for it and make it their own, often inconsistent with their thoughts on the first game, a phenomena known as fanboyism. on the other end is fandumb, who take any change to the original formula as blasphemy.

i am very disappointed in the fanbase more than Bioware at this point, for being so incapable of either enjoying the game at all or acknowledging its lack of classic, tried and true, and beloved RPG features as not what they, the rpg fans, would have rather had improved and not removed.

story and characters do not make an rpg, they make nothing but a foundation for any and all media outlets. by the outlandish new definition floating around here, the godfather was roleplaying game of the year, and Of Mice and Men carries new york times bestselling rpg award. what makes an rpg is player immersion, and a very very very big part of that is character customization and choice in multiple facets. ME2 had dialouge (though all the important choices here still depend on your naughty/nice points instead of basic reasoning skills), very limited choice of armor, and to an unnecessarily restricted degree no more than 4 levels of no more than 6 skills. ME2 is a great action game with a limited, if well told story and some light rpg elements, that is less an opinion and more or less its definition as a genre.

bioware sought to redefine RPG when nobody wanted it redefined, especially if it is redefined as an action game, but alot of folks think Bioware and webster are one in the same and accept the definition because they said so. ME1 was the first action/rpg to be more rpg than action and that is what made it great; ME2 followed the same tired formula of action/rpg as every other one out there, but being bioware they made it good, if not severely less than what it couldve been by virtue of its new direction.

ME2 is great on its own, but as a sequel it barely resmebles the first and feels more like a spin-off.

So I can't like ME2 and ME1 without lying to myself? Oh the misery of living under the shadow of my own deception!

Sure you can dismiss any opinion or preference that varies from your own as fanboyism; and sure you can dress it up all nice in neat into your little thesis and try to sell it as fact. But at the end of the day its you who can't reconcile your own disappointment with the notion that there are others who do not share it.

There is no measurement of prefrence that you can compile into some sort of fantasy statisical data that exposes your little "fanboy" concpiracy theory. The simple truth: there will be people that like changes due to preference, and there will be others who do not, why? Because thats what they like (or don't like) not because Bioware told them to.

I for one, am glad to see a reduction in dress-up, spreadsheet managing, carrot chasing nonsense. ME1 was good so I liked it in spite of these things, if ME2 was bad I wouldn't have liked it regardless of the changes it made. However, ME2 was good (to me) and "I" liked it independently of what Bioware has to say on the issue.

[Orogenic]

Group 2 reporting in.

[ME2Shephard]

Aratar Amero wrote...

Ive said it before in other posts and I'm saying it again as it annoys the crap out of me reading this. as Beermilk said, Customization and inventory screens are NOT what make an rpg, they are tools implemented in games for equipping weapons and such, if you think its anything more than that please return to your WoW and stop playing/talking about real rpgs. If you have a problem with the equipment menus and style of loot, thats fine, complain about it as a problem with equipment selections, but do not complain that it ruins the rpg experience of the game just because items aren't pissing out of every corpse or because you dont have your magical bag of holding that lets you carry 150 items anymore, because that is total bs and these people need to learn the true meaning of an rpg.

On a side note id consider myself somewhere between #1 and #2, I love both games but at the same time i can see why people are saying certain things and somewhat agree.

Well I'm glad that you let your ignorance shine in this community. Clearly no one stated that having an inventory was genre defining. So you are assuming that most RPG fans are WoW players. WOW. Ignorance sure is bliss. As stated in many posts on this thread was that there was a lack of character immersion. Look you entitled to believe that Mass Effect 2 is the best thing since the invention of the condom but don't assume that RPG fans do certain things when you don't know who they are. I love RPG's yet hate WoW. I think playing that game is worst for you than smoking crystal meth. Try to be more mature than how you came off in your previous post.

Now that I have said my piece on that topic. I'm definitely a #2 mainly because I got more of the Mass Effect story. I also loved the interrupts and all the characters introduced. Other than that I was disappointed in the game. I hated how linear the game was and how the exploration aspect was taken out of the game. Scanning/Probing was so tedius and not enjoyable. I would have had a better time jabbing an ice pick through my leg. I would take the MAKO anyday over that aweful system. Many #3's complain about how the MAKO was aweful... Fine you guys are entitled to hate it all you want but in no way is the scanning/probing aspect of ME2 better.

The assignments were worthless and weren't worth spending your time on aside from getting credits. The side missions in this game weren't fun and seemed and were extremely short... I mean even some of the planets you went to for those missions... You didn't fight anyone. Atleast in the first game when I went to a system, I knew I would be able to explore a planet and get to fight some stuff.

And don't think that ME2 has its problems when it comes to getting stuck in the terrain. This just happened to me on my last playthrough when I was fighting the Thresher Maw. That has been a common glitch amongst many players that Bioware still hadn't addressed from the first game. Again I am a #2... Through loved the first game. I enjoyed the second but was a little disappointed by it.

[TuringPoint]

Scylene wrote...

I guess I'm not on that list. I thought ME1 was just okay (maybe would give it an 8). Good idea and premise but lacked execution. Great start to a franchise in terms of foundation but it had some glaringly obvious flaws. I mostly made myself play through it because I knew Bioware would take all the criticism and make a better sequel. They did. I love ME2.

This is me.

As fond as I am of the quirkiness of ME 1, it was not as well polished.  They compromised some of the features of ME1 in ME2, but what do you expect?  Will they just come out with a game every 4 years? 

ME 2 is a seriously awesome game if you don't come into it with preconceptions that it should be like ME 1 in any way.

And actually, there are ways the scanning/probing system is better.  The probe mini game is a nice enough diversion, and not as frustrating as holding down the joystick for twenty minutes at a time and occasionally shooting something or dodging a rocket like you have been forced to 80,000 times before in just the main plot.  Seriously, the first time I saw MAKO gameplay I was like, "Is that supposed to be fun??" and I wasn't surprised when it turned out to not be that much fun.

 The most convoluted batch of mindless repetition, was the MAKO.  More convoluted but stupid does not equal more complex.  At least the probe mini game doesn't have pretensions which aren't delivered.  The probing is not an amazing feat, it just does what it's supposed to, and it's fine if you don't try to spend hours hunting down every single piece of platinum in the game, which you DON'T HAVE TO DO.  ME 1 had these collection quests which forced you to explore every inch of blank, stale ground on planet after planet.  That is not better, that is not even good.

I do think an improved version of the MAKO would've been the best solution, but that would've taken a lot of time for them to implement, so I can understand that they didn't.  I was under the impression they were going to release a complete game, and they didn't, and that's my only complaint.  For me, the probe mini game is just fine.  It's entertaining for what it is, like solitaire.

Modifié par Alocormin, 06 février 2010 - 06:54 .

[Hatmonster]

I'd have to put myself squarely in group #1, I'm thoroughly enjoying ME2.