54 réponses à ce sujet

[Monica21]

I've got a human female mage who knows she can't be queen, so how do I go about convincing Alistair to continue the relationship? Is it part of the dialogue after the Landsmeet?

[Sialater]

Did you talk to his sister yet?

[Monica21]

No, I haven't made it very far at all, but just want to know how things have to work. Does he have to be hardened?

[Addai]

You have to "harden" him (*ahem* it is a game term LOL). After talking to Goldanna, there is a particular response which will change Alistair's character to one who is more willing to look out for himself. It seems rather harsh at the time, but doesn't give you an approval drop or change his behavior much except in regards to the kingship and to being willing to choose less-than-noble options in regards to his romantic life.

The correct response is "Everyone is out for themselves, you need to learn that." Later he will talk to you about it in camp and any response other than "That's not what I meant, don't do that!" will "confirm" the hardening.

Modifié par Addai67, 05 février 2010 - 04:49 .

[melkathi]

Monica21 wrote...

No, I haven't made it very far at all, but just want to know how things have to work. Does he have to be hardened?

Yup. He has to be hardened. Otherwise Alistair would never cheat on his wife.

[Sandtigress]

You need to "harden" his personality first when you talk to Goldanna by choosing the "Everyone is out for themselves. You need to learn that." option when you leave her house. Afterwards, the next time you talk to him, choose anything but "No, I didn't mean that!" and you have successfully hardened him.



Then, you can either pre-arrange for Alistair to marry Anora to win her support, or not. This doesn't really affect being Alistair's mistress, but if you want him to marry her, you have to arrange it prior to Landsmeet.



At Landsmeet, support Alistair for king of some sort, either on his own, or with Anora as queen. Do NOT accept the secret character on your team at this point, or the relationship is off.



Post-Landsmeet, Alistair will try to break up with you. I've forgotten the exact dialogue choice you have to make, but its along the lines of no one tells the king what to do. He'll make a comment on that, and you tell him "Being king isn't a punishment." to which he will then assent and let the relationship continue!

[Sialater]

Or keep you as what the unhardened Alistair sees as a ****.



Also, you need to max your persuasion for after the Landsmeet. It's still a difficult persuade check. Tell him being a king isn't a punishment.

[Monica21]

Thanks for the quick replies. I thought he had to be hardended, but I wasn't sure. And I wasn't sure about when the conversation happened. My first playthrough I got broken up with an un-hardened Alistair and I don't think that dialogue option was available. And I'm pretty sure I couldn't marry him off to Anora.

[Sandtigress]

The dialog options are there with unhardened Alistair, he just won't go for it. If I get home at a decent hour tonight, I've got a save point just before Landsmeet with an unhardened Alistair, so I could tell you then what he says in reply.



As far as Alistair and Anora, its something you have to arrange pre-Landsmeet when you're all in Eamon's estate.

[Addai]

Poor Alistair, he's showing himself better than any noble in Thedas by not being willing to reduce his elf lover to the status of concubine. And he's reviled by female gamers everywhere for it. LOL

Modifié par Addai67, 05 février 2010 - 05:03 .

[Sialater]

Addai67 wrote...

Poor Alistair, he's showing himself better than any noble in Thedas by not being willing to reduce his elf lover to the status of concubine. And he's reviled by female gamers everywhere for it. LOL

I know!  Though the problem is his, not ours.  Unhardened, he sees it as being lesser, demeaning.  Hardened, he sees it as staying together no matter what in whatever way you can.

[ejoslin]

Sandtigress wrote...

The dialog options are there with unhardened Alistair, he just won't go for it. If I get home at a decent hour tonight, I've got a save point just before Landsmeet with an unhardened Alistair, so I could tell you then what he says in reply.

As far as Alistair and Anora, its something you have to arrange pre-Landsmeet when you're all in Eamon's estate.

Actually, I KNOW unhardened Alistair will marry Anora even if it's not arranged ahead of time.  In my "Alistair-hate" game, he would not agree to the engagement.  So when I suggested it afterwards, I was really surprised when Anora took it and ran with it and he just went along with it.

Edit: Alistair is really, in my eyes, a tragic character.  What he wants and what he is forced to do are often so different.  He tries to do what is right for everyone.  I really do like him as a character, even if not as a romance partner.

Modifié par ejoslin, 05 février 2010 - 05:11 .

[Sandtigress]

Actually, that's one of the things I love about him - even hardened its hard to get him to agree to it. I just adore his "Wouldn't that be terribly unfair to my wife? And to you?" line. Faithful men FTW!

[Sandtigress]

ejoslin wrote...

Sandtigress wrote...

The dialog options are there with unhardened Alistair, he just won't go for it. If I get home at a decent hour tonight, I've got a save point just before Landsmeet with an unhardened Alistair, so I could tell you then what he says in reply.

As far as Alistair and Anora, its something you have to arrange pre-Landsmeet when you're all in Eamon's estate.

Actually, I KNOW unhardened Alistair will marry Anora even if it's not arranged ahead of time.  In my "Alistair-hate" game, he would not agree to the engagement.  So when I suggested it afterwards, I was really surprised when Anora took it and ran with it and he just went along with it.

Huh, learn something new every day!

[Monica21]

Sandtigress wrote...

Actually, that's one of the things I love about him - even hardened its hard to get him to agree to it. I just adore his "Wouldn't that be terribly unfair to my wife? And to you?" line. Faithful men FTW!

Ugh, he says that? Uh oh, that will be hard.

[Addai]

Monica21 wrote...

Sandtigress wrote...

Actually, that's one of the things I love about him - even hardened its hard to get him to agree to it. I just adore his "Wouldn't that be terribly unfair to my wife? And to you?" line. Faithful men FTW!

Ugh, he says that? Uh oh, that will be hard.

Yeah, you have to "harden" your character a little bit, as well.  That's why my Dalish character could only do this by setting him up with Anora.  With her, you know she a) knows the drill about a political marriage, and wants power more than anything else.  So Dalish GW felt minimum guilt about giving Anora what she most wanted in exchange for keeping what she most wanted.  Everything was out on the table and Anora didn't have to take the deal if she was unwilling to be cheated on.  Of course, Anora being who she is, she has to give you a warning that she intends to turn Alistair's eye.  She pointedly tells you that her marriage to Cailan started out political, too, but changed later on.  Fair enough, you grasping harpy, let the female games begin!

Alistair is not happy about it all, to be sure, but seems to have gotten over it by the end of the game to the point that he cheerfully tells you he's going to get you alone later and Anora can go soak her head. 

Modifié par Addai67, 05 février 2010 - 05:20 .

[Mistersunshine]

Can't you just have him not marry Anora?

[Monica21]

Mistersunshine wrote...

Can't you just have him not marry Anora?

Yeah, but he doesn't want to marry her. I dunno, I haven't played very far with this character so I'll have to see how she ends up doing thing at that point.

[Sialater]

I ended up as Chancellor with Alistair unmarried on my elven mage. I couldn't force him to marry someone like her.

[Sandtigress]

Addai67 wrote...

[
Yeah, you have to "harden" your character a little bit, as well.  That's why my Dalish character could only do this by setting him up with Anora.  With her, you know she a) knows the drill about a political marriage, and wants power more than anything else.  So Dalish GW felt minimum guilt about giving Anora what she most wanted in exchange for keeping what she most wanted.  Everything was out on the table and Anora didn't have to take the deal if she was unwilling to be cheated on.  Of course, Anora being who she is, she has to give you a warning that she intends to turn Alistair's eye.  She pointedly tells you that her marriage to Cailan started out political, too, but changed later on.  Fair enough, you grasping harpy, let the female games begin!

Alistair is not happy about it all, to be sure, but seems to have gotten over it by the end of the game to the point that he cheerfully tells you he's going to get you alone later and Anora can go soak her head. 

Ha, weird.  Anora made no such comment to my City elf who told her that she wasn't going anywhere.  She simply asked that they not embarass her.  What dialog option did you pick to get that statement?

lol I love his "Let her get her own conquering hero, I've got mine right here" little bit.  Very cute.

[ejoslin]

If you want to really have power in the kingdom, Chancellor or not, you have to leave Alistair unmarried -- Alistair and Anora as a pair are extremely effective. If you want to be the ruler, keep Alistair unhardened and become chancellor. Good stuff there. I have no clue if being his mistress at the end changes any of that -- I can't bring myself to do another "in love at the end with Alistair" ending, though, I suppose, in one of my games I could turn on the romance just before the arch demon fight to see if there are any differences.

[Addai]

Sandtigress wrote...

Ha, weird.  Anora made no such comment to my City elf who told her that she wasn't going anywhere.  She simply asked that they not embarass her.  What dialog option did you pick to get that statement?

lol I love his "Let her get her own conquering hero, I've got mine right here" little bit.  Very cute.

Well, this is a bit of my interpretation from her response to the GW saying "You've never heard of a political marriage?"  She gives you that batting-eyelashes look as she tells you that that's how her marriage to Cailan started but that it developed into more later.

I don't hate Anora, really I don't.    My GW would not have arranged such a thing if she had.  But, you have to know going into something like that that you're dooming him and yourself to a lifetime of Anora-style gamesmanship.  I figure Dalish GW made her home base at Soldier's Peak.  Close enough for kingly booty calls, far enough away from court that she and Anora could have their separate spheres and be happy.  It's not like she wanted Anora miserable, after all- the whole point being that she and Alistair would be good co-rulers and produce an heir.  With the civil war and all, it still seemed like a better arrangement than having him find someone else later down the line.

Modifié par Addai67, 05 février 2010 - 05:43 .

[SurelyForth]

Being Alistair's mistress does not change the Chancellor card (but it isn't the awesome one you get when he's not hardened, although he does still defer to you most of the time and leaves you in charge when he's gone).

[ejoslin]

My latest disappointment is that the "princess-consort ruler and savior" card doesn't change if he's not hardened. And of course you don't get the Chancellor card, even if you are chancellor. So next try is see if he'll marry a neutral or hostile Cousland. I have a feeling he will with that as well, but probably will still have the same epilogue cards.

[errant_knight]

Sialater wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Poor Alistair, he's showing himself better than any noble in Thedas by not being willing to reduce his elf lover to the status of concubine. And he's reviled by female gamers everywhere for it. LOL

I know!  Though the problem is his, not ours.  Unhardened, he sees it as being lesser, demeaning.  Hardened, he sees it as staying together no matter what in whatever way you can.

Well, he's not wrong.... Nor is he wrong in resisting the ritual. One can find reasons to justify both actions, but his instincts are the more noble ones.