954 réponses à ce sujet

[Impresario]

Stanley Woo wrote...

It's kinda funny that this topic keeps coming up over and over again. People who claim to be old enough and mature enough to handle sex and nudity in a game seem to believe that any lack of sex and nudity in the game is a sign of self-censorship. They generally don't believe that a game can be called "mature" without explicit sex and/or nudity.

Let me tell you, folks, that as a developer full of mature individuals, we are also free to not have explicit sex and/or nudity in our games, no matter what you, Fox News, the government, or Bunky the Wonder Clown has to say about it. We have never considered it a "problem," it is simply a choice we have made and we have every right to make that choice.

Sure it's an artistic choice, but the palette available to game developers (at least looking in from the outside) seems narrow compared to film.  There's still an implicit taboo about nudity in video games, while in R rated films it's permissible.  Developers should be allowed to freely express their ideas in mature ways, including graphic sensual portrayals, but we're not there yet. The evidence in support is that games rarely (if ever) venture into that territory. That pausity, speaks for itself.  Only you ladies and gents on the inside know how much pressure you encounter when trying to push the envelope.  

[Ellestor]

BramAlam12345 wrote...

Mature does not equal nudity.

Of course not. Yet nor does nudity equal immature, mind you.

The fact that they obviously backpedalled because of Fox News (the only ones who pretended to be 'offended') is much more upsetting than the backpedalling itself, because everyone sane knows that Fox's 'coverage' was utterly disengenuous.

Mass Effect's scenes were tasteful and beautiful, like any so-called 'sex scene' in a good film, not to mention tender and moving. A very emotional vignette (which, in cinema, would occupy the space between PG-13 and R that is labelled R to be safe) that solidified the romantic interest's importance in a very human way. Anything of this nature is a remarkable achievement for a video game.

If the scenes had been nonexistent in ME1, no one (but a few nutters) would have complained, 'Hey! Why aren't there sex scenes!' Yet since we now know that BioWare is capable of handling these moments so well, to see them back down under the mad barking of a rabies kennel like Fox News is sad and a little incensing.

Modifié par Ellestor, 05 février 2010 - 06:41 .

[SethSteiner]

Multiplayer /= Nudity. Completly different topics. I think the criticism is made very mature, so why should you stop? BioWare want to show us a believable universe and so people give there feedback. Multiplayer has nothing to do with storytelling, atmosphere and setting at all.

[AGogley]

crackseed wrote...

I actually prefer ME2's romances. I mean yeah the ME1 was very tasteful, but it's not required to enjoy the romantic interactions with your LI of choice. ME2 built it up better as you spend more time talking to them and the climax ties in to how the character is. No issues with Bioware's choice.

You must be joking.  I thought the romances were done much better in ME1.  In ME2, suddenly you are in love with each other with very little interaction of build up before then.

[AGogley]

crackseed wrote...

I actually prefer ME2's romances. I mean yeah the ME1 was very tasteful, but it's not required to enjoy the romantic interactions with your LI of choice. ME2 built it up better as you spend more time talking to them and the climax ties in to how the character is. No issues with Bioware's choice.

You must be kidding.  I thought there was less romantic buildup before the sexual encounters in ME2 than in ME1.

[Rillanor]

Stanley Woo wrote...

I can understand how it must seem to players who really, really, really want to see HBO- and Showtime-like sex and nudity in our stories, but that's not what makes our games great, and ironically, insisting on sex and nudity tends to make people look immature. Just because you'd like to see somehing--anything--doesn't mean that we will do it or agree with your reasons to include/not include it.

and to both sides of the argument, let's please keep the insults out of the discussion. Thank you.

*SPOILER ALERT*

Stanley: My biggest complaint was why when the game is meant to be seen from SHEPERD's pov (the players avatar) that the DEV's decided not to show my love interests face!!! I was so looking forward to that!

Can you please asks them?

But the cut scene was still enjoyable I just wish I'd seen her face!

Modifié par Rillanor, 05 février 2010 - 06:45 .

[crackshot91]

Prioris wrote...

I'm not sure nudity or the lack thereof is really the complaint, it's that ME2 regressed from ME1 in its portrayal of the romance options. After a very tastefully rendered scene in ME1, we got a few kisses and a Sexy Discretion Shot in ME2. I think a lot of players at least wanted the same level of detail paid to the romances from game to game.

That said, I'm quite glad I stayed faithful to my ME1 love interest in my first playthrough. I think I, too, would have felt rather cheated, from an emotional perspective if nothing else. It's like the game is acknowledging that your replacement paramour is just that, a replacement, and a second-best option at that.

TALI IS NOT SECOND BEST!!!!!

>:

[LandonMurphy]

I don't think games should have nudity, don't get me wrong, the "romance" in ME1 adds a lot to the game (same with ME2 im sure) and i wouldn't want them to take it out, but that doesn't mean there has to be nudity.

[Rillanor]

crackshot91 wrote...

Prioris wrote...

I'm not sure nudity or the lack thereof is really the complaint, it's that ME2 regressed from ME1 in its portrayal of the romance options. After a very tastefully rendered scene in ME1, we got a few kisses and a Sexy Discretion Shot in ME2. I think a lot of players at least wanted the same level of detail paid to the romances from game to game.

That said, I'm quite glad I stayed faithful to my ME1 love interest in my first playthrough. I think I, too, would have felt rather cheated, from an emotional perspective if nothing else. It's like the game is acknowledging that your replacement paramour is just that, a replacement, and a second-best option at that.

TALI IS NOT SECOND BEST!!!!!

>:

Agreed! Pity she wasn't included as a love interest in ME1 - Tali is wonderful

[tiberius_adamantine]

I don't think there was anything wrong w/ the scenes in the first game. Honestly, Fox can go to hell. This is an M rated game anyway so something like that shouldn't be a problem. The scene was meant to add a sense of romantic passion but wasn't pornographic because it omitted the details. Movies have shown the same and been rated for less. I think they should bring it back, it only adds to the depth of the story.

[Kwonnern]

ME1 and DA:O did these things quite well.

[SethSteiner]

Well, the brothel in DA:O was a joke but at least the romance options were... yes I would say perfectly implemented. Leliana is a real favorite of mine and the F/F scene was, even with the ugly clothes, not made to bad.

[Traumacrazy]

Ryuuichi009 wrote...

Kwonnern wrote...

ME1 and DA:O did these things this quite well.

fix'd

lol i still can't get ove the dwarf sex scene with the elf assassin:pinched:

[Sheos]

As a German this get's funny from time to time. We have serious issues with violence in videogames, and near to no problem with sex scenes. It's like:

US: "Oh my god, a piece of skin! Let's get hide a sue someone!"

Germany: "Oh my god, a drop of blood! Let's get hide an forbid something!"

Rest of the world: "Oh my god the Krauts' and the Cowboy's a dealing with videogames again! Let's get hide and play Mass Effect!". ^^

[SethSteiner]

@Sheos
Okay but the German issue lies in a few politicians, Dr. Pfeifer and a stupid authority with the USK. I think our issues are minor compared to the americans and easier to solve. Okay to be honest I think the americans and germans have no real issue, the only thing the industry should do is just do it. Who could be in their way? Wal Mart and Fox are nothing against the gaming industry. Movies did it, magazines did it, literature did it long, long, long ago.

Modifié par SethSteiner, 05 février 2010 - 07:16 .

[Master Smurf]

Once again it seems BW gives us something but at the expense of something else. The ME scene was great - The options and conversations leading up to the scenes in ME2 are awesome - but with little payoff.



* SLIGHT SPOILER *

Take my situation - Backfrom the dead I run into one nearly LI who hates my guts because I work for Cerberus, I turn down my personal assistant because I want to be professional and my 2nd in command for ideological differences and also because I am trying to stay loyal.

However my LI turns into a cold-hearted **** and I fall in love with another Asari - An elegant, confident older "woman" who turns me down.

Couple this with the fact that a female who I think of as a kid sister falls head over heels for me after I save her from exile - I let her down gently but just need some release....

Pop downstairs and get it on with the psychotic rebel who is fine with something casual.

Great - back to saving the galaxy!!! - lol



* End Spoiler *

Great relationships but a little bit missing - Still, the bar has been raised!!! we are spoiled for complaining about the things we are on this site.

[soren145]

I think that a few scenes were done perfectly (Miranda, Tali) but others lacked (Garrus) this is nothing to get bent out of shape over, after all being a huge fan since day one of Mass Effect I wasn't playing these games for the sex scene, it's to get inside the characters head and really care about them which Bioware pulled of spectacularly. Please Bioware if you want to cut it out completely I don't care just make the third game the best it can be story and character wise.

[JabberJaww]

I will be completely honest.. i wanted to see Miranda nekkid, and im not ashamed to admit it





dat ass

[Ellestor]

SethSteiner wrote...

@Sheos
Okay but the German issue lies in a few politicians, Dr. Pfeifer and a stupid authority with the USK. I think our issues are minor compared to the americans and easier to solve. Okay to be honest I think the americans and germans have no real issue, the only thing the industry should do is just do it. Who could be in their way? Wal Mart and Fox are nothing against the gaming industry. Movies did it, magazines did it, literature did it long, long, long ago.

Bravo.

[Kniri]

Maybe my english is not good enough to understand all that's being said between the lines, but I think these scenes are really good in ME 1 and 2.



I ask myself, "what do these people want to see?" Where is your imagination? Do you really *must* see the latest detail? Do you want to make sure, they're really doing it?

And when is the point, that you would shut out some audience, when you are making love to your boy- or girlfriend? Don't you think, your Shepard has a right for privacy?

[deusofnull]

Menalaos1971 wrote...

I know I'm not the only one disappointed in Bioware over the last year. In Mass Effect 1 they gave as fairly tame scene with a team mate if we went through the trouble of spending time with them. The scene would have been acceptable on broadcast television, but it was a step in the right direction for Rated M games.

But somehow Bioware only heard FoxNews and not the enormous backlash from people that actually played and loved the game. This is obvious since in their next two games where having a relationship with your team mates was a part of the game they took a giant step backwards. Dragon Age had sex in bra and panties, and now Mass Effect didn't even have the sex. You and your partner start to make out and start to slip out of their clothes and the game cuts away.

Now I'm not asking for what FoxNews said was in Mass Effect 1. I don't want a game where I control my character in a graphic sex scene. Besides the whole creepy factor none of the console manufacturers would license the game since that's an obvious AO rating that no retailer would sell. But there was nothing wrong with what was in Mass Effect 1, and at least two other games have gone further than Bioware did then. In Grand Theft Auto 4 there was actual full frontal nudity (male) and fairly graphic sex acts (strippers and prostitutes), while in The Saboteur the (now bankrupt) developer released a Nude Mod on day 1 that took off the pasties from the women in the brothels.

The point is that some limited nudity and sexuality in a Rated M game designed for adult gamers is not unacceptable. So why take it out?

As for the why, I think I know the answer. Mass Effect 2 is Rated M for Mature gamers, but just for violence and alcohol. But most absentee parents don't seem to care if little Billy plays those games and will buy them without thinking twice. But through in some nudity and a portion of those parents might just say no. Sales fall and EA isn't happy. Or was it just EA lawyers???

Lets just hope for a diry sweaty sexy DLC that adds those scenes you want.  Doubtful as it may be.

[Master Smurf]

I think the industry as a whole and gamer activist need to lobby and promote their agenda like the rest of business - We all want games to be scene as literature / entertainment with varying genres for different audiences.

Mainstream just see it as kids stuff (the end) - That is from the US side, cant speak for Europe as I dont know their political landscape.