825 réponses à ce sujet

[Naltair]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

Naltair wrote...

Why would I complain, I fully admit things can change in sequels and say as much

See, now I have no idea what your stance even is. You say you don't like them changing parts of the story or characters to suit people's taste, but you have no problem with them making Tali romanceable specifically to sate the fan outcry and Tali obsessions.

My stance in many threads is against making the change in some DLC or patch, like it was a bug to be fixed.  In this case if it is just looking to the future I am all for it and I was not trying to be antagonistic, I will admit I came in the middle and I have not really crapped on anyone's parade just conversing with anyone that wants to converse on the subject.

[jlb524]

Naltair wrote...

To be honest the men playing men who want women have a more valid argument than the men playing women who want other women.  One is a more common and culturally accepted lifestyle choice and the other is often for the sexiness and because I am a dude I am not gay but I like to see two chicks doing it.  Not trying to belittle them but lets be serious here.  I am not trying to say one is more valid than the other, but just come out and say it instead of hiding behind "promoting" female  + female relationships when you really are not.

I use you in the general sense.

So, you want to assume that all men who enjoy lesbian romances in video games only do so for the sleaze factor, while all men who enjoy straight romances in video games do not enjoy it for the sleaze, but enjoy it on some deeper lever?

These romances are hardly pornographic.  I think if a straight guy really wanted to get his f/f kicks on, he'd rent a porn and would not play through a f/f Mass effect romance that's like 10 minutes of boring 'get to know you' dialog and maybe 1 minute of a very soft core 'love scene'.

[HAGA NAGA]

There is no question. we got hosed. thank you OP. and to the opposition, how dare you be so selfish? pathetic.

[Mystranna Kelteel]

Naltair wrote...

It's not an implausible change nor one they didn't account for before it happened, they just thought she was too alien to be one, but when people were positive to her and Garrus they did it.  I never got the feeling either was repulsed by Shepard in fact they both seem to have some kind of awe of him/her.  It's a no brainer to make something happened you were thinking about doing anyway.

She was considered at one time before ME1 launched, is what I mean.

if you don't know my stance you obviously don't read my posts.

I'm building a case here, bub.

See, now you've said what I wanted you to say and I can follow up.

You admit that they changed Garrus and Tali to suit the positive reaction of the fanbase. You say sequels can change things and you're fine with that.

So how is that any differeny from we (the fanbase) giving feedback now about wanting to see certain characters romanceable in the future who aren't romanceable now? It's the exact same scenario, but you're okay with one and not okay with the other.

Modifié par Mystranna Kelteel, 06 février 2010 - 06:58 .

[tmp7704]

Naltair wrote...

I always gave her the data, I play Paragon and I always liked her character, they made her and LI it worked if not I would not be complaining on the intarwebs because it isn't a big deal to me personally. 

My Shepard didn't give her the data because she pretty much shared Ashley's views on aliens in ME1, then in ME2 i gave Veetor to Cerberus and Tali still said she'd link suits with her. I was rather surprised actually.

[jlb524]

Naltair wrote...

My stance in many threads is against making the change in some DLC or patch, like it was a bug to be fixed.  In this case if it is just looking to the future I am all for it and I was not trying to be antagonistic, I will admit I came in the middle and I have not really crapped on anyone's parade just conversing with anyone that wants to converse on the subject.

What about all the threads asking BW to fix Liara's crap cameo through DLC?  What about all the threads complaining to fix Tali's romance with a DLC b/c we didn't get to see her face?

[Kolaris8472]

Naltair wrote...
I always gave her the data, I play Paragon and I always liked her character, they made her and LI it worked if not I would not be complaining on the intarwebs because it isn't a big deal to me personally.  The only reason I am voicing my opinion is to try and keep the conversation honest and not just a pity party, but maybe find valid solutions which I try and offer.

Wait wait wait, so you're ruling out the fact that a Renegade ass who was mean to her in ME1 can romance her in ME2, but won't stop to consider how that feels for the Paragon Female Shephards who were nice to her but get dropped for no apparent reason? 

[Naltair]

jlb524 wrote...

Naltair wrote...

To be honest the men playing men who want women have a more valid argument than the men playing women who want other women.  One is a more common and culturally accepted lifestyle choice and the other is often for the sexiness and because I am a dude I am not gay but I like to see two chicks doing it.  Not trying to belittle them but lets be serious here.  I am not trying to say one is more valid than the other, but just come out and say it instead of hiding behind "promoting" female  + female relationships when you really are not.

I use you in the general sense.

So, you want to assume that all men who enjoy lesbian romances in video games only do so for the sleaze factor, while all men who enjoy straight romances in video games do not enjoy it for the sleaze, but enjoy it on some deeper lever?

These romances are hardly pornographic.  I think if a straight guy really wanted to get his f/f kicks on, he'd rent a porn and would not play through a f/f Mass effect romance that's like 10 minutes of boring 'get to know you' dialog and maybe 1 minute of a very soft core 'love scene'.

I am not saying all men, and yes there are pornos but let's be serious here there is a connection and I think for some it may seem odd to make that connection with a man, while playing as a woman.  I did not mean to imply that all men are sleazy it just seems odd to me that men would really fight this hard for it, but if that is your wish so be it.

Again I don;t think there is anything really wrong with it, just odd to me,  I mean if I played a female Shepard and there was no real option I liked I would just go without and move on.  I rarely complain about my own personal experience and I really don't pine for the other side of the fence, maybe I am weird like that but I just don't see it as a huge deal.

The fact that others do intrigues me even if I don;t always agree with their ideas.

[Nautica773]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...
I'm not saying I agree with whatever trolling or whatever has been going on to make this thread 10 pages long, but maybe so many people belittle the disappointment in threads like these because so many people in -this- group like to belittle other people's preferences to make their point. Why not just make it a pure, 'F/F relationships for ME3' thread instead of 'Garrus/Thane/Jacob suck and are stupid' thread? By making it the message 'all FemShep players are screwed because their options suck' you're asking for hate from FemShep players that like their options, ManShep players that like their options, and ManShep players that wish they had the FemShep options. You shouldn't have to put one group down to make your own seem better.

This.
Though, since the thread was started by someone no longer participating in the debate, I can forgive the turn it took. I agree that there are some relationships that are missing, not everyone can be happy and the romances could be better. I just don't think that one side has it better than the other. I'm not a fan of the male options present, personally. 
Neither am I against a character, say Tali, have a female-female relationship in the sequel either since there's no definitive indication what she likes. 

[HAGA NAGA]

Naltair wrote...

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

Naltair wrote...

Why would I complain, I fully admit things can change in sequels and say as much

See, now I have no idea what your stance even is. You say you don't like them changing parts of the story or characters to suit people's taste, but you have no problem with them making Tali romanceable specifically to sate the fan outcry and Tali obsessions.

My stance in many threads is against making the change in some DLC or patch, like it was a bug to be fixed.  In this case if it is just looking to the future I am all for it and I was not trying to be antagonistic, I will admit I came in the middle and I have not really crapped on anyone's parade just conversing with anyone that wants to converse on the subject.

yeah, your "stance" is always very supportive of Femsheps *sarcasm*

You some how always show up when Femsheps want something and you pose as this independant person who doesn't care about the issue, but you obviously do. what is your problem? i don't get it at all. the only thing i know is that you're disturbed.

[tmp7704]

Kolaris8472 wrote...

but get dropped for no apparent reason? 

Sexual orientation or lack of sexual attraction isn't "no apparent reason"... at least that's what i'd guess is the reason behind it. Given she has no problem taking it further with other kind of Shepard.

[DeathCultArm]

This appears kind of one sided. As it seems all these threads turn out to be. Guys getting it from all angles...jeez..

[Naltair]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...
So how is that any differeny from we (the fanbase) giving feedback now about wanting to see certain characters romanceable in the future who aren't romanceable now? It's the exact same scenario, but you're okay with one and not okay with the other.

Thanks for stating what I already said, see people are so antagonistic that they don;t read my words.  I have said and usually that if they wanted to change that in ME3 then go for it.  I just think some hotfix or patch, or crappy DLC to add the option to ME2 is asinine.

But thanks for thinking you pulled the wool over my eyes.

[Naltair]

Disturbed? I am not against anyone, there is too much us against them, if you actually read my words then maybe you would be better off.

[Naltair]

Kolaris8472 wrote...

Naltair wrote...
I always gave her the data, I play Paragon and I always liked her character, they made her and LI it worked if not I would not be complaining on the intarwebs because it isn't a big deal to me personally.  The only reason I am voicing my opinion is to try and keep the conversation honest and not just a pity party, but maybe find valid solutions which I try and offer.

Wait wait wait, so you're ruling out the fact that a Renegade ass who was mean to her in ME1 can romance her in ME2, but won't stop to consider how that feels for the Paragon Female Shephards who were nice to her but get dropped for no apparent reason? 

I have stated many times the game cannot account for that and never does why does that even matter?

[wako58]

Juancor wrote...

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

This is all we are asking for...the ability to voice our complaint in hopes of changing things in ME3, without people trolling the threads or trying to belittle our disappointment.

I'm not saying I agree with whatever trolling or whatever has been going on to make this thread 10 pages long, but maybe so many people belittle the disappointment in threads like these because so many people in -this- group like to belittle other people's preferences to make their point. Why not just make it a pure, 'F/F relationships for ME3' thread instead of 'Garrus/Thane/Jacob suck and are stupid' thread? By making it the message 'all FemShep players are screwed because their options suck' you're asking for hate from FemShep players that like their options, ManShep players that like their options, and ManShep players that wish they had the FemShep options. You shouldn't have to put one group down to make your own seem better.

Pretty much sums up what I think too.

QFT

[Naltair]

Nautica773 wrote...

Aris Ravenstar wrote...
I'm not saying I agree with whatever trolling or whatever has been going on to make this thread 10 pages long, but maybe so many people belittle the disappointment in threads like these because so many people in -this- group like to belittle other people's preferences to make their point. Why not just make it a pure, 'F/F relationships for ME3' thread instead of 'Garrus/Thane/Jacob suck and are stupid' thread? By making it the message 'all FemShep players are screwed because their options suck' you're asking for hate from FemShep players that like their options, ManShep players that like their options, and ManShep players that wish they had the FemShep options. You shouldn't have to put one group down to make your own seem better.

This.
Though, since the thread was started by someone no longer participating in the debate, I can forgive the turn it took. I agree that there are some relationships that are missing, not everyone can be happy and the romances could be better. I just don't think that one side has it better than the other. I'm not a fan of the male options present, personally. 
Neither am I against a character, say Tali, have a female-female relationship in the sequel either since there's no definitive indication what she likes. 

Same here, I don't think they can please everyone.

[Mystranna Kelteel]

Naltair wrote...

Thanks for stating what I already said, see people are so antagonistic that they don;t read my words.  I have said and usually that if they wanted to change that in ME3 then go for it.  I just think some hotfix or patch, or crappy DLC to add the option to ME2 is asinine.

But thanks for thinking you pulled the wool over my eyes.

How is "DLC" any different from a sequel, bub? It's the devs changing or adding something to the game after the game was released.

[Naltair]

HAGA NAGA wrote...
yeah, your "stance" is always very supportive of Femsheps *sarcasm*

You some how always show up when Femsheps want something and you pose as this independant person who doesn't care about the issue, but you obviously do. what is your problem? i don't get it at all. the only thing i know is that you're disturbed.

I am not sure if that was your idea about the DLC to add bisexual romance options to the core game with nothing new, but I just found the idea terribly short sighted.

[Kolaris8472]

tmp7704 wrote...

Kolaris8472 wrote...

but get dropped for no apparent reason? 

Sexual orientation or lack of sexual attraction isn't "no apparent reason"... at least that's what i'd guess is the reason behind it. Given she has no problem taking it further with other kind of Shepard.

The "getting dropped for no apparent reason" is because in some alternate universe game designers don't record non-romantic dialog for romance interests, and because somewhere in yet another alternate universe there is a Shephard that isn't female. In my playthrough universe, Shephard and Tali are very close and then it starts looping for arbitrary reasons.

If we wanted to argue it in more objective terms, one set of characters got a fanservice and others didn't. I'm here to petition for a lesser-evil resolvement in ME3, as unlikely as it is. 

[AngryTigerP]

God forbid, you should hit on someone of the same gender and find out that they don't return your feelings.

Rather than accept that, you think that either A.) God [Bioware] messed them up, or B.) Continuing to pester them will make them change their orientation [wait between ME2 and ME3].

Is it REALLY that hard to roleplay a lesbian Shepard who happened to fall in love with a straight woman?

If you can change anything in this universe to fit what you want, I'd like Thane's illness to go away, Samara to be sexable, and Legion to fix that hole in his chest. Unfortunately, I've accepted that the ME universe is only in my hands insofar as I can react to it, and occasionally have an effect on a person's outlook on life (Garrus, kinda, in ME1 [even though he doesn't carry it over into ME2], Conrad Verner, etc.) This universe is about YOUR story, yes, but sometimes you have to accept that things are beyond your control.

(For individuals who haven't before seen my posts: I would not take issue with changing orientations in ME3, provided a believable story be given. The fact that Tali and Garrus had a history is a believable story, so don't start going OMG FAN DEMAND AAAAAAH. For everyone else, continue to ignore everything I said because it isn't what you want to hear.)

[jlb524]

Naltair wrote...

Again I don;t think there is anything really wrong with it, just odd to me,  I mean if I played a female Shepard and there was no real option I liked I would just go without and move on.  I rarely complain about my own personal experience and I really don't pine for the other side of the fence, maybe I am weird like that but I just don't see it as a huge deal.

No, you just complain about complainers.

I'm happy your satisfied with the way ME is going so far and your desires for the game have been pretty much met.  This isn't the case for everyone out there.

It seems like you don't like the complainers b/c you're afraid things that you like and are satisfied with will be changed at their expense.

[DeathCultArm]

Wow this poster is getting hammered, it must be easy to make a point when it's like 8 vs 1.

[Naltair]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

Naltair wrote...

Thanks for stating what I already said, see people are so antagonistic that they don;t read my words.  I have said and usually that if they wanted to change that in ME3 then go for it.  I just think some hotfix or patch, or crappy DLC to add the option to ME2 is asinine.

But thanks for thinking you pulled the wool over my eyes.

How is "DLC" any different from a sequel, bub? It's the devs changing or adding something to the game after the game was released.

If they want to add a new DLC with a new character or characters who happen to go both ways and I would like two to cover both genders plus new recruiting missions and loyalty mission then you have the most amount of win for the most amount of players.

Changing what we already have is a cheap cop out.

If you disagree with this then I am not sure what else to say.