825 réponses à ce sujet

[jlb524]

Naltair wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Matrons are still sexually active.  Samara turns you down b/c of her Code.

It think it has less to do with the code and more to do with, I am almost a 1000 years old and sex for fun just does not do it or me anymore.  If I am going to have sexual relations I want it to be real and I am just not looking for that right now.

I don't think the code says anything about sex, well forbidding her from having sex.

What about a romance then?  Why couldn't Samara and Shepard developed that?   She could have been a romance option, that's all I'm saying.

[Naltair]

NKato wrote...
Spoiler or not, I was not happy with seeing female-with-female relationships being marginalized in ME2. I'm not interested in supporting a product that is not willing to step onto hardball territory when it comes to social issues.

I can understand that but when did that become Bioware's responsibility to shoulder that burden?  There are better ways to promote that lifestyle than in a video game.  A video game where many men will only go female/female because they like playing a girl but don't want to romance a guy.

These men are not exactly furthering your cause, which I presume is the promotion of gay rights.

[ERJAK2]

tmp7704 wrote...

Nautica773 wrote...

DeathCultArm wrote...

Female parts=/=Female....

Please, please, please tell me you're being sarcastic.

It can get tricky with the Asari. Our idea of gender is based on what reproductive role the person can perform, and any Asari can work in either role.

Technically the idea of gender is considered to be more psychological than physical, sex is stated as being physical differences. (stupid college psych classes.)

[Mystranna Kelteel]

Naltair wrote...


It think it has less to do with the code and more to do with, I am almost a 1000 years old and sex for fun just does not do it or me anymore.  If I am going to have sexual relations I want it to be real and I am just not looking for that right now.

I don't think the code says anything about sex, well forbidding her from having sex.

That's only true if you ask Samara for casual sex. If you press Sam for an actual relationship she specifically says that she does believe she could find an actual meaningful relationship with you. But then she leaves the room because of her code.

[shinobi602]

jlb524 wrote...

Matrons are still sexually active.  Samara turns you down b/c of her Code.

Not because of her code. Shep specifically asks her is there anything against romantic relationships in your code, and she says "There is not."

[Naltair]

jlb524 wrote...

Naltair wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Matrons are still sexually active.  Samara turns you down b/c of her Code.

It think it has less to do with the code and more to do with, I am almost a 1000 years old and sex for fun just does not do it or me anymore.  If I am going to have sexual relations I want it to be real and I am just not looking for that right now.

I don't think the code says anything about sex, well forbidding her from having sex.

What about a romance then?  Why couldn't Samara and Shepard developed that?   She could have been a romance option, that's all I'm saying.

Because she did not want to be?  I mean why can't a person just say no?  She does not want to do it, she has her reasons and I admire her for sticking to them.

[Naltair]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

Naltair wrote...


It think it has less to do with the code and more to do with, I am almost a 1000 years old and sex for fun just does not do it or me anymore.  If I am going to have sexual relations I want it to be real and I am just not looking for that right now.

I don't think the code says anything about sex, well forbidding her from having sex.

That's only true if you ask Samara for casual sex. If you press Sam for an actual relationship she specifically says that she does believe she could find an actual meaningful relationship with you. But then she leaves the room because of her code.

So ultimately her answer is no, I am not sure why her saying no is a bad thing.  Can people not turn down Shepard?

[-Area51-Silent]

did we miss the whole, shes been hunting down and killing her daughters convo? maybe its because her offspring tend to have that flaw that makes them kill people they um...hook up with?

[DeathCultArm]

If they made Samara a LI everyone would revert to the asari=sex bots complaint, so I was almost glad she wasn't a LI.

[Naltair]

ERJAK2 wrote...

Technically the idea of gender is considered to be more psychological than physical, sex is stated as being physical differences. (stupid college psych classes.)

Semantics, the terms in most conversations are interchangeable.

[ERJAK2]

wako58 wrote...

ERJAK2 wrote...

wako58 wrote...

I appreciate that bioware believes in diversity in their characters and those characters' relationships..doesn't happen in a lot of rpgs other than the assorted elves, dwarfs, trolls, etc. Given the estimated number of gay/lesbian people in the general population today...according to wikipedia at least..how is the number in mass effect somehow deficient? Sounds like more of a complaint that some people didn't get to romance the character they wanted. That is an entirely different issue and nothing to do with the fair representation of gay/lesbian characters.

Because the most populous species in the galaxy is universally female in physical appearance, is universally bi, and is not a romance option.

Yes...and the asari Samara was a unrequited romance option for males and females because as a matron she has passed the point in her life....so your point was???

Unrequited means she doesn't want to romance, which puts her in the same territory as legion/mordin/grunt in that respect. Morinth Kills you instantly. Non of them give the Paramour achievement. None of them count. Also, it's implied that she's late matron early matriarch and every child she has will be ardat-yakshi.

[Naltair]

DeathCultArm wrote...

If they made Samara a LI everyone would revert to the asari=sex bots complaint, so I was almost glad she wasn't a LI.

That too.

[ERJAK2]

-Area51-Silent wrote...

did we miss the whole, shes been hunting down and killing her daughters convo? maybe its because her offspring tend to have that flaw that makes them kill people they um...hook up with?

Just the one, the other two live in isolation.

[jlb524]

Naltair wrote...

Because she did not want to be?  I mean why can't a person just say no?  She does not want to do it, she has her reasons and I admire her for sticking to them.

First off, she does tell you that she does want to romance you, but is restricted by her code.  She's very confilicted in the scene were she turns you down.  Have you seen it?

Second, Bioware didn't write her as a romance and they could have.  On the flip side, they could have easily given Tali a crap reason not to want to romance Sheaprd.  Would you be satisfied with that?

[ERJAK2]

Naltair wrote...

DeathCultArm wrote...

If they made Samara a LI everyone would revert to the asari=sex bots complaint, so I was almost glad she wasn't a LI.

That too.

I honestly didn't want to see Samara as an LI either...now? I'll take what I can get.

[Mystranna Kelteel]

Naltair wrote...

So ultimately her answer is no, I am not sure why her saying no is a bad thing.  Can people not turn down Shepard?

Of course she can turn Shepard down. But it is kind of a slap in the face.

Samara specifically says she's attracted to you, that she could find a meaningful relationship with you, but then she turns and leaves right before you kiss.

It's especially frustrating if you want an actual lesbian romance. Both Samara and Morinth are like BioWare is trolling us.

Jack is bisexual, but she won't romance a female Shepard.
Samara is bisexual, but she simply won't romance anyone even after saying she wants to.
Morinth is bisexual and all about sex, but if you try anything you die.

[wako58]

Nautica773 wrote...

Naltair wrote...
It think it has less to do with the code and more to do with, I am almost a 1000 years old and sex for fun just does not do it or me anymore.  If I am going to have sexual relations I want it to be real and I am just not looking for that right now.

I don't think the code says anything about sex, well forbidding her from having sex.

I thought she didn't want to risk producing another space vampire and had no interest in pursuing a romantic relationship at that time.

Sorry, I may be mistaken here because I only tried to romance her once with a paragon shep and my recollection was that she was a matron and past that stage of her life.  I don't recall any mention of the possibility of an Ardat-Yakshi.  You were just going to sleep with her..there wasn't any indication she planned to have your children.

[Nautica773]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...
Jack is bisexual, but she won't romance a female Shepard.
Samara is bisexual, but she simply won't romance anyone even after saying she wants to.
Morinth is bisexual and all about sex, but if you try anything you die.

Guess it undermines the trope that the main character is universally loved, adored and will have everyone they meet throwing themselves at you. 
On the bright side, there will most likely be another lesbian romance in 3 with, at the very least, the return of Liara.

wako58 wrote...
Sorry, I may be mistaken here because I only tried to romance her once with a paragon shep and my recollection was that she was a matron and past that stage of her life.  I don't recall any mention of the possibility of an Ardat-Yakshi.  You were just going to sleep with her..there wasn't any indication she planned to have your children.

That was just my take on the situation. She didn't actually say anything specifically about it, but I thought it might be a reasonable concern for. Especially since she'd basically just finished saying that every one of her children was an Ardat-Yakshi. I imagine it wasn't the only reason she turns down Shepard though. 

Modifié par Nautica773, 06 février 2010 - 05:40 .

[Mystranna Kelteel]

wako58 wrote...

Sorry, I may be mistaken here because I only tried to romance her once with a paragon shep and my recollection was that she was a matron and past that stage of her life.  I don't recall any mention of the possibility of an Ardat-Yakshi.  You were just going to sleep with her..there wasn't any indication she planned to have your children.

The matron stage is when an asari has lots of children and raises her family.

Samara would be in the Matriarch stage if those years were "past her".

[Naltair]

jlb524 wrote...

Naltair wrote...

Because she did not want to be?  I mean why can't a person just say no?  She does not want to do it, she has her reasons and I admire her for sticking to them.

First off, she does tell you that she does want to romance you, but is restricted by her code.  She's very confilicted in the scene were she turns you down.  Have you seen it?

Second, Bioware didn't write her as a romance and they could have.  On the flip side, they could have easily given Tali a crap reason not to want to romance Sheaprd.  Would you be satisfied with that?

I have not scene in full but I had no idea this was a hot button, I was actually pleased though that they made her not a romance.  

I would be fine with tali denying my Shepard, because I don't take the romances that seriously.  It's just part of the story, it was not meant to be and my Shepard would have had to move on.  There is more to this game for me than the LIs, they just add a bonus.

[ERJAK2]

Link to samara video.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sdkm9QnGSLQ

[Naltair]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

Naltair wrote...

So ultimately her answer is no, I am not sure why her saying no is a bad thing.  Can people not turn down Shepard?

Of course she can turn Shepard down. But it is kind of a slap in the face.

Samara specifically says she's attracted to you, that she could find a meaningful relationship with you, but then she turns and leaves right before you kiss.

It's especially frustrating if you want an actual lesbian romance. Both Samara and Morinth are like BioWare is trolling us.

Jack is bisexual, but she won't romance a female Shepard.
Samara is bisexual, but she simply won't romance anyone even after saying she wants to.
Morinth is bisexual and all about sex, but if you try anything you die.

I understand but I don't see it as a slap in the face I see it as just another page in the story.  Not every story has a happy ending, some just end.  But that isn't the end of that Shepard's journey, there are other stories to pursue.  I guess I am just not that hung up on this idea.

Modifié par Naltair, 06 février 2010 - 05:41 .

[ERJAK2]

Nautica773 wrote...

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...
Jack is bisexual, but she won't romance a female Shepard.
Samara is bisexual, but she simply won't romance anyone even after saying she wants to.
Morinth is bisexual and all about sex, but if you try anything you die.

Guess it undermines the trope that the main character is universally loved, adored and will have everyone they meet throwing themselves at you. 
On the bright side, there will most likely be another lesbian romance in 3 with, at the very least, the return of Liara.

This is the only reason I'm still talking about this. We stayed quiet between ME1 and ME2 and got nothing while both Tali and Garrus are LI, I figure if I make enough noise the same thing will happen for me as did for the Tali/garrus fans. 

I don't like it, but I'm not the one who set the precedent.

[Guaritor]

NKato wrote...

Naltair wrote...

NKato wrote...

I actually had an answer from Bioware's "Evil Chris" during the NFC game broadcast on uStream...but it wasn't the answer we all were looking for. When I asked about a female love interest for Tali'zorah, he replied, "Tali love interest? She loves cupcakes" (Or cookies, can't remember which)

Quite frankly, I was getting an immense urge to strangle him through the camera. When I ask a honest question, I expect a honest answer. Not BS like what Chris gave me.

Edit: I'm the sort of person who expects a respectful answer when I ask a question. That means avoiding tasteless, pointless jokes. Plus, the incident really hurt Bioware's professional reputation in my opinion, because when I ask a question that I consider to be serious and related to "equality", you damn well better answer it honestly, or get the hell out.

That would have been a spoiler they were not going to say spoilers live during that broadcast.

Spoiler or not, I was not happy with seeing female-with-female relationships being marginalized in ME2. I'm not interested in supporting a product that is not willing to step onto hardball territory when it comes to social issues.

Why is this a political or social issue? Why is it so hard to believe that BW just didn't write Jack, Tali, or Miranda as bisexual? If its not in their character why should you be able to romance them?

Your criticizing them for not purposly getting involved with an issue for no reason?

[Naltair]

ERJAK2 wrote...
This is the only reason I'm still talking about this. We stayed quiet between ME1 and ME2 and got nothing while both Tali and Garrus are LI, I figure if I make enough noise the same thing will happen for me as did for the Tali/garrus fans. 

I don't like it, but I'm not the one who set the precedent.

What is it that you are looking for?  I am sorry I must have missed this.