22 réponses à ce sujet

[Tragic_Arsenic]

I'm planning on building an AW/SH hybrid, but I currently don't have any room in my plan for Miasma so I'm wondering if maybe I could instead rely on Song of Courage and Rally to make up for that fact? Thoughts and opinions?

Also, is Glyph of Neutralization really worth it? I've never really had too much trouble with mages before, but I'm planning on building this character in Nightmare, so I'm wondering if I'll be needing it this time around.

[x-president]

You really do not need either of those spells to do good in nightmare.

Glyph of Neutralizations is ok.  I find enemy mages just walk away from it as soon as you cast it.  Mana Clash is a better choice imo and you can kill multiple mages at once.


I've never used miasma and never get it.  So I really can't comment on it.

Modifié par x-president, 06 février 2010 - 05:55 .

[mosspit]

It will be quite funny if your AW steps on the Glyph of Neut.
Either you take the miasma line or you leave it alone. I find the slow is only good for kiting or chasing down archers. The slow can be resisted tho. IMO rally's more than sufficient.

Modifié par mosspit, 06 février 2010 - 05:59 .

[kasanza]

Miasma reduces enemy def and att by 10, so it really isn't all that vital. Definitely get Mana Clash over Neutralization. Also, Spell Might in that line is awesome. It only drains 4 mana per tick, so if you get good mana regen items and Improved Combat Training, your golden. I was running Spell might and Shimmering Shield when I would don my casting gear on my AW/BM mage and was fine for all but Elite Boss battles.

[soteria]

Miasma is superior to rally as a defensive buff, because although increasing your defense doesn't help when you're stunned or knocked down, decreasing the enemy's attack is always beneficial.

[mosspit]

soteria wrote...

Miasma is superior to rally as a defensive buff, because although increasing your defense doesn't help when you're stunned or knocked down, decreasing the enemy's attack is always beneficial.

What do you mean? Does a char def drop to 0 or a fixed base number when disabled? My char still manages to avoid hits when disabled during stuns and webbed.

Edit: Additional point. If a char def do indeed drop to a predetermined value, will the atk penalty still matter in this case?

Modifié par mosspit, 06 février 2010 - 08:15 .

[soteria]

That's how I understand it. The attack penalty still matters because the chance to hit is determined by the difference between your defense and their attack. So they can still miss you even while disabled, but I'm sure you've noticed that you are much more likely to be hit.  It's possible I'm misunderstanding something since I've never really gotten into studying all the math.

Modifié par soteria, 06 février 2010 - 08:36 .

[mosspit]

I think it requires some code digging to be sure. I tend to zoom to fpp mode in combat mode and so am pretty sure I dodged hits while disabled. However, I am wearing items that gave 30% dodge tho so those may matter. But a char definitely can still dodge melee hits while disabled.

[soteria]

Well, like I said, chance to hit is determined by the difference between attack and defense (modified, 1-100), so being able to dodge attacks while disabled doesn't prove anything either way, even before you consider abilities like evasion or bonuses to dodge on gear. I know for a fact--from experience--that disabling a target makes them easier to hit, and I've heard it reduces defense to zero. It passes the common sense test: your ability to defend shouldn't matter if you're paralyzed, only your enemy's ability to attack.

As far as I know the toolset wiki doesn't say anything about the effects of stuns on defense/attack, and I have no inclination to go through the source.

Modifié par soteria, 06 février 2010 - 09:03 .

[mosspit]

I agree that it is not worthwhile to find this out. For me I wont know for sure, but I really dun think that the def penalty if applicable will "eat" into the def buff that rally provides. If it does, the atk penalty will be beneficial. If it doesnt, there wun be a difference between def buff of rally and atk penalty of miasma.

[Jono564]

My AW/SH doesn't have Miasma. It is not needed to succeed on nightmare.

[hexaligned]

You don't really NEED anything in particular for Nightmare. It isn't a huge difficulty jump or anything.

[Lord Phoebus]

I think the defense penalty for being stunned is around 30 points of defense or so, open your character sheet the next time you're stunned and check the value, it does show up there.



I find Miasma and Mass Paralysis quite useful on my AW, he's often surrounded by enemies so having a long duration mass stun is quite nice to have. Paralyze is also quite useful it's cheap and lasts a fair amount of time even on nightmare. If it weren't for glyph explosion this spell line would be ranked much higher by players. It takes a while to cast Mass Paralysis, but there's no friendly fire and there's nothing stopping you from using Glyph Explosion and Mass Paralysis. E.g. Battle starts: Glyph Explosion, cast a few spells, then Mass Paralysis, cast a few more spells, then Blood Wound, and melee anything that's still alive.



I like Miasma because even if I'm dragging a party along with me I often like to solo certain fights, and the +10 to defense and attack on a sustained ability (as opposed to heroic offense or heroic defence which you often can't cast with your sustains on) is quite significant in some cases. You can however make do with Song of Courage and Rally, though Song of Courage+Rally+Miasma is even better.

[mosspit]

^ Thanks for the info.

[mosspit]

Hmm I did the test. Turns out the def while stunned do turn up in the Char Profile.... However the number is kinda weird. I got scattershot and my def dropped from 97 to 84.... which is a 13def drop. Its quite an unusual number I must say.

[Mr_Raider]

Miasma is good, but not game changing. If getting the spell falls within your plan (i.e. you want paralysis, or all the entropy spells), go for it. Other wise look to boost your attack and defence by other means. Just equipping an offhand dagger like the edge or thron of the gods will give a massive bonus to attack, providing you have the dex to do.

[beancounter501]

According to the effect script for stun you lose your entire dex bonus to defense when stunned. But you keep all other forms of defense.

[Tragic_Arsenic]

Thanks for the info everyone. I appreciate it. ^__^ Guess I'll be sticking with Tempest instead of Miasma so I can team up with Morrigan for Storm of the Century.

[mosspit]

beancounter501 wrote...

According to the effect script for stun you lose your entire dex bonus to defense when stunned. But you keep all other forms of defense.

This is completely accurate!. My AW has 23 dex which translate exactly to 13def.
I know the topic is kinda close but I need to give beancounter the credit
Thanks

[beancounter501]

glad to help. I will have to check what knockdown/paralysis does to defense.

[grimtoothy]

Does Miasma create threat?

[mosspit]

yes.

[grimtoothy]

Could someone who has access to the toolset state how much treat is generated by looking at the scripts? I'd do it, but sadly I bought the xbox version and there's no way for me to get the information myself.