290 réponses à ce sujet

[JaegerBane]

Frotality wrote...

they apparently went with that so we could draw a connection to it; it looking human and all. couldve had you know, the slightest hint of subtlety though. reaper/human combo isnt a bad idea on its own, but it is so blatantly radical a design, it loses alot of credibilty; something that actually looked reaper/human and not just giant terminator wouldve really made that bit of the game better; a synthesized terror... instead, we get something that makes us cringe at the thought of it flying thru space upon completion.

Why us the idea of a flying giant squid okay, but a huge flying human not?

I personally thought it was rather disturbing. It really made the Reapers come across as totally alien - like no other type of artificial life I've heard of in sci-fi. The idea that the Reapers aren't even truely artificial - that they're basically frankestein-like AIs built out of melted down members of other species, to the extent they treat us like seeds.... i thought it was well done.

No wonder the things think they're so superior. To them, we must be like biological cells.

[Sapienti]

JaegerBane wrote...

Frotality wrote...

they apparently went with that so we could draw a connection to it; it looking human and all. couldve had you know, the slightest hint of subtlety though. reaper/human combo isnt a bad idea on its own, but it is so blatantly radical a design, it loses alot of credibilty; something that actually looked reaper/human and not just giant terminator wouldve really made that bit of the game better; a synthesized terror... instead, we get something that makes us cringe at the thought of it flying thru space upon completion.

Why us the idea of a flying giant squid okay, but a huge flying human not?

I personally thought it was rather disturbing. It really made the Reapers come across as totally alien - like no other type of artificial life I've heard of in sci-fi. The idea that the Reapers aren't even truely artificial - that they're basically frankestein-like AIs built out of melted down members of other species, to the extent they treat us like seeds.... i thought it was well done.

No wonder the things think they're so superior. To them, we must be like biological cells.

And that right there is exactly what they were trying to convey in this game. But people were too busy ignoring conversations and not understanding the plot to see it.

[Mudzr]

Well I thought the flying squids looked a bit prothean, I mean it would have been cool if that was true and it's like "That's what will happen to us if we don't defeat them"

[Tokalla]

JaegerBane wrote...

No wonder the things think they're so superior. To them, we must be like biological cells.

To them, the galaxy is but a petri dish.  Unfortunately for them, it seems a few really dangerous cultures may have grown this time.

[Sapienti]

Tokalla wrote...

JaegerBane wrote...

No wonder the things think they're so superior. To them, we must be like biological cells.

To them, the galaxy is but a petri dish.  Unfortunately for them, it seems a few really dangerous cultures may have grown this time.

Meet commander Shepard. The Reaper Immune Virus.

[eldav]

So in the endgame we found out that there is a human reaper being buildt, witch seem kind of odd thing ingame.

First of, why do it look like a human skeleton, i meen why are the reapers building themself in the image of Man ?

Evolution wise the Insects are a perfect creation, as we see how Sovering and Harbringer look like.

So i think that the human lookalike reaper is there just to hint to us that Shepard IS a human Reaper.



No she/he is not build by a Reaper but by the Illusive Man, as we seen in the beginning of the game.

No one know who TIM is, maybe he is a Prothean, and maybe he has knowledge to build a Reaper lite.



Think of it, many things make seense now, like Geths intress in Shepard, how he looks like in full Renegade,

and why there is a human like Reaper being build in the image of Man.



Think about it..........

[Sapienti]

eldav wrote...

So in the endgame we found out that there is a human reaper being buildt, witch seem kind of odd thing ingame.
First of, why do it look like a human skeleton, i meen why are the reapers building themself in the image of Man ?
Evolution wise the Insects are a perfect creation, as we see how Sovering and Harbringer look like.
So i think that the human lookalike reaper is there just to hint to us that Shepard IS a human Reaper.

No she/he is not build by a Reaper but by the Illusive Man, as we seen in the beginning of the game.
No one know who TIM is, maybe he is a Prothean, and maybe he has knowledge to build a Reaper lite.

Think of it, many things make seense now, like Geths intress in Shepard, how he looks like in full Renegade,
and why there is a human like Reaper being build in the image of Man.

Think about it..........

The Reapers create Reaper larva based off of the race harvested to build that reaper. This one happens to be human. The Prothean one likely looked like a Prothean and the (insert million year old species) looked like that species. The Reapers are all part organic. Also if you hadn't noticed the human Reaper larva was very small compared to the likes of Sovereign. It was not complete likely still needed to be fitted with a shell and what not. Otherwise Shepard could have defeated Sovereign by shooting him in his exposed core.

[Arrtis]

shepard killed and stopped them...i do not think that has happened before.

So maybe they copy and take the strong so they can use it against them.

thats what i think at the end....although kind of sad that the fight was super easy. ..

Then again you saw how fast that thing moved think if it were finished how ships would be having problems.You just know they are gonna give a giant human a giant gun.

[Zhijn]

When we took that platform to ending i was like "ooh what could be there!" and then this giant human robot pops into view.. My gawd i couldnt stop laughing.

Even if the reapers do this sort, i just didnt feel it belonged. To funny to be serious!.

Modifié par Zhijn, 07 février 2010 - 02:49 .

[That Confused 1]

We do not know what the internal super structure of the other reapers are. The external design of the reapers could easily encase and conceal the "skeletal" form of each reaper of which could vastly vary in shape and form due to the species used to create a "Reaper." For all we know, Soverign could have been built using a sapient ape like species close to human form, but the external armor/weapons encasing denies the ablity to see the "bones" of the monster.  All we got to see in ME1 and ME2 of a fully designed and built Reaper was it's internal "organs".

Modifié par That Confused 1, 07 février 2010 - 03:33 .

[CDClock]

JaegerBane wrote...

Frotality wrote...

they apparently went with that so we could draw a connection to it; it looking human and all. couldve had you know, the slightest hint of subtlety though. reaper/human combo isnt a bad idea on its own, but it is so blatantly radical a design, it loses alot of credibilty; something that actually looked reaper/human and not just giant terminator wouldve really made that bit of the game better; a synthesized terror... instead, we get something that makes us cringe at the thought of it flying thru space upon completion.

Why us the idea of a flying giant squid okay, but a huge flying human not?

I personally thought it was rather disturbing. It really made the Reapers come across as totally alien - like no other type of artificial life I've heard of in sci-fi. The idea that the Reapers aren't even truely artificial - that they're basically frankestein-like AIs built out of melted down members of other species, to the extent they treat us like seeds.... i thought it was well done.

No wonder the things think they're so superior. To them, we must be like biological cells.

Exactly. This is a cool concept. They could have done this wonderfully without making the human reaper look like a gigantic metal skeleton that shoots lasers out of its mouth.

[Jarcander]

At least it didn't shoot lasers out of its eyes.



I'm not sure why it is unclear to some that you don't destroy mass relays. They are after all the only way to travel around the galaxy and more importantly, no citadel space race knows how to make a new one. Also, what is (was) behind omega relay was a mystery and it could've just as easily had links to new mass relays and untold new worlds and resources.

[BattleVisor]

Revan312 wrote...

Besides the crucified mutant hybrid skeleton reaper manimal being a retarded concept, why would they do this in the first place. If they can somehow indoctrinate organic beings to follow them without question, wouldn't it be more logical to simply use the hundreds of thousands of abducted humans to fight the council races? I mean it would have had more impact and would illicit far less laughs and knee slaps if that would have been the case.

Plus didn't Sovereign tell Shep in ME1 that they sort of hate living organisms, yet here they are making reapers out of said organics? Seems hypocritical and a waste of resources. I mean if the reapers are already "legion" than why would they need this huge elaborate plan to abduct millions of humans just to liquefy them and create this ridiculous reaper/human hybrid monster? Looking at the last shot of the game, I think they have enough reapers...
..

You clearly dont understand and pay attention to the story at all.

Firstly they only abducted ten thousand humans. Secondly the reaper only indoctrinate when you'r physically inside the ship. And if you know about the Racnis, the reapers did indoctrinate them to fight with the council races.

And Sovereign NEVER said he hated living organisms, He is indfiferent, it is the purpose of the reapers.

And thirdly, it doesnt matter if there are thousands of reapers, none of them can use the citadle relay to get inside the milky way, can they?

And lastly your complete misunderstanding of everything irks me a little.

Modifié par BattleVisor, 08 février 2010 - 12:58 .

[BattleVisor]

Guys you have to also realise, this human reaper larva had no legs, just a long spinal cord.



So it leaves room for a lot of development into a more dreadnought space faring conventional reaper ship

[CDClock]

Mass Effect 1's Ending:






Epic.




Mass Effect 2's Ending:


Wtf.

[SuperVaderMan]

I think it would've been pretty cool if we were able to see the "collected" species that was used as the base of the Derelict Reaper. At least then we'd have some sort of insight into reaper construction and could more easily envision how the terminator reaper would've looked like.

And it's not like its purpose would've been revealed on the derelict reaper. The squad could've found this interior structure that looked completely different from the rest of the ship, and it wouldn't be until the final confrontation with Super T-800 that you'd suddenly realize that the interior structure of that reaper was modeled after an alien donor race.

This final reveal and the clues leading up to it could've been done better, but unfortunately they weren't. And now we're stuck being annoyed at this (from most peoples' perspectives) mediocre final boss... bah

Modifié par SuperVaderMan, 08 février 2010 - 03:13 .

[Besetment]

JaegerBane wrote...
Why us the idea of a flying giant squid okay, but a huge flying human not?

The way I understood the design and concept of the Reapers is that they were based upon the Inhibitors from Revelation Space and the unknown terror from Lovecraftian horror (more particularly Cthulhu who is described as looking vaguely squidlike).

The design of the Reapers kind of exploit those two elements or what exists of them in popular culture. Firstly because Sovereign/Nazara is a Cthlulhu like being, vast and terrible like an ancient vengeful god. Secondly because this being is just the herald of an ancient race of dark gods that lurk outside the boundaries of known space which plays into that idea of unknowable and ever present danger. They are a terror which exist beyond our comprehension.

They are literaly based upon the Inhibitors which share so many similarities that you can use them to guess what the Reapers may turn out to be in ME3 (if the writer's ever decide on a kind of big reveal). The inhibitors were a post intelligent organic race that gradually converted itself to machine and are the last surviving remnants of intelligent life after a cataclysmic, galaxy wide conflict in the distant past. They predicted the milky way/andromeda collision and attempt to  limit the damage that it would cause. One of the things they did was embark on a controlled extermination of all species above a certain technological threshold which could threaten the success of the project.

The development of sovereign as a kind of space faring vessel also had a sound concept in the sense that Reapers attempted to control the technological development of all intelligent species via mass relay technology and the citadel and so their design is such that they are meant to be 'used' and controlled by intelligent life with the very great irony being that same intelligent life is really being used by the Reapers.

The Terminator Reaper, I'm not sure I get the concept behind. Is it a vessel? How does it fit in with what is known of the Reapers and what they do? I dunno, I just don't get it.

Modifié par Besetment, 08 février 2010 - 04:07 .

[genghis rob]

Break out the Silver Surfer, the Reapers were buidling Galactis

[Revan312]

BattleVisor wrote...

Revan312 wrote...
*snip*

You clearly dont understand and pay attention to the story at all.

Lmao, I did pay attention, it makes no sense.

Firstly they only abducted ten thousand humans. Secondly the reaper only indoctrinate when you'r physically inside the ship. And if you know about the Racnis, the reapers did indoctrinate them to fight with the council races.

Why would they abduct thousands of humans (by the way, it was hinted
they were going to need millions) just to liquefy them and build a
reaper out of said human juice... Why?

If the reapers are so past our
level of understanding then why do they need actual humans to make the
new reaper. Their level of technology is so far past our own that the entire plot revolving around the reapers is looking more and more ridiculous.  Their large, intricate and complex plans seem moot because 1.) their technology is so advanced one would assume they would be past needing actual organics for reproduction and 2.) there are so many of them. Why they haven't figured out a way to simply clone beings and create reapers out of said clones really doesn't make any sense at all.

Also it's hinted at that the collectors themselves were indoctrinated (they were protheans after all), I can't imagine why they couldn't do the same to the human colonists they abduct. Or, why not make them all husks, the collectors create better than average husks, husk monstrosities, exploding husks.. All of which seem to do a pretty good job of killing, so to assume that creating an army out of the humans, an army that is obviously a better investment of resources, is worse than a 50 foot tall skeleton with laser breath is just defending Bioware's story for the sake of it.

Also, to anyone saying that it's in an early stage of development and will most likely be encassed with a much larger shell, why make the thing have weapons at this point then? Last time I checked I didn't have a mouth that could shoot plasma so obviously that's not part of the "human" genes used...

And Sovereign NEVER said he hated living organisms, He is indfiferent, it is the purpose of the reapers.

Sovereign said, and I quote "Organic life is nothing but a genetic mutation, an accident." Also, "Before us, you are nothing.  Your extinction is inevitable." He goes on further about destruction and end times, and annihilation etc, seems he's not too keen on organic life... 

Plus he only really allows the geth to fight for him and makes sure that even his biggest fan, Saren, is almost completely turned into a synthetic himself.  I don't care what you say, Sovereign hates organics as he continually killed them en mass, brain washed them, implanted them to the point of them pretty much being robots and talked about organics as if he were a genocidal tyrant, he hates living beings...

And thirdly, it doesnt matter if there are thousands of reapers, none of them can use the citadle relay to get inside the milky way, can they?

Heres where reading comprehension comes in, read my post, I said why don't they just use the collector army along with the thousands of potentialy indoctrinated humans/potential husks (look above for the explanation as I'm wondering if you don't simply skim) to attack the citadel, overwrite the keepers and send in the fleet of reapers...  Seems to me the collector's cruiser is pretty powerful, far more so than the geth ships so I can't see why they couldn't pull it off reasonably well.  At least it would be a better plan than liquefying thousands of potential soldiers just to try and make a retarded T-3000...

And lastly your complete misunderstanding of everything irks me a little.

My misunderstanding irks you? Thats a good one...

Bottom line is your trying really hard to defend a ridiculously contrived plot that was put in place solely to have a larger than life boss fight at the end, one that most think was lame. There was a million ways to go about that ending that would have been both more meaningful and logical. Bioware dropped the ball big time on that ending and as such I felt it ruined any immersive experience I had up to that point. 

Games are typically allowed a lot of leniency in regards to story but when the game is touting the plot as the main point of playing the game it deserves just as much scrutiny as a movie or book.  The forced feeling concerning the last 10 minutes of the game was on par with BSG's ending. 

The last fight is a perfect example of a plot device called a one off, this human reaper appeared for all of 5 minutes and will never be seen again only to drive home in a ham fisted way the explanation of reaper reproduction. If you want to fool yourself into believeing it was appropriate and fit the universe then whatever, but it doesn't change the fact it was a contrived device, period.

[Schneidend]

CDClock wrote...

I mean, come on. Who in God's name thought that would be a good idea? 

1) According to EDI, the facility can't control what the Reaper looks like. It is based on the race that provides the organic component.

2) The damn thing wasn't finished.

[Lumiya03]

I have a step by step guide to answering this question.

Step 1) Go find a friend with the collectors edition of the game/open your collectors ED.

step 2)Politely ask that friend if you can look at the art book included/Open your art Book

Step 3)Turn the art book to page 16

Step 4) look on the left hand side of the page'

Step 5)take a deep breath and be glad Bioware knows what they are doing



This freaking problem people have with this is stupid. Seriously follow those steps and you will understand that this was not some half baked plan by bioware. It also shows why all the reapers look basically the same.

[Captain Crash]

ME1 ending: Epic, I think I shed a tear at just how awesome it was. So much so I been hooked ever since!



ME2 ending. Confused-ish? Was that just a giant Terminator?!

[Zentrasi]

Though it would be a total rip off of 2001, a better idea might have been to just have a normal looking human baby as the final reveal. It's still a reaper but it's a child that hasn't woken up yet to learn what it is.



What would you do about it?

[Internet Kraken]

Revan312 wrote...

-snip-

I think you're just looking at this in a different way. You think that the Reapers are trying to make another Reaper for military purposes. I disagree. I think they are not trying to make just a Human Reaper for cultural reasons.

Many people ahve wondered why the Reapers constantly allow civilizations to build itself up, only to swiftly destroy it. There are many theories as to why. You could think that the Reapers are just using oprganics as a food source, but arguably there are easier ways to cultivate and substain organic food than allowing civilizations to contstantly evolve and then fall. Rather I think they do it becuase the Reaper's culture involves preserving the most avdanced and valuable species for eternity as Reapers. Reapers are not one single species, but rather a combination of all species ascended into a higher form of life. The best the galaxy has ever produced, all united under one banner.

The Reapers were not just trying to build any odrinary Reaper. They wanted to build a Human Reaper. Not to lead a massive attack against the Citadel, but rather becuase this is the Reaper's culture. They believe Humans are the species with the greatest potential. If they were just trying to build a generic Reaper, they could have used any species. Arguably it would be a lot easier to target soemthing other than human colonies. But they specificaly wanted to turn humans into the Reapers. Think about Harbinger's dialogue. He refers to the process of turning humans into genetic paste to fuel the larva's growth as "ascension". Why use that word in particular? Why not call it "assimilation"? Or "consumption"? "Ascension" implies that they are raising humans to be what they consider to be a higher form of life. They see value in humans.

But what about Sovereign? He didn't seem to like organics at all. Why turn them into Reapers. Well I believe that the Reapers may have considered the current organic "crop" to be a failure, not worthy of being turned into Reapers. This could be for a number of reasons. I think it's because the galaxy had a very diverse catagory of sentient lifeforms, with no one species apppearing to be dominant. The Protheans appeared to be the undiupted rulers of the galaxy at the time of their downfall. This is the Reapers idea of the perfect organic race to harvest. One species that follows their predetermined line of technological advancement, rather than a handful of species that all do so at the same time. So the Reapers were all set to just wipe every race out and start from scratch. What changed this? Well humans killed a Reaper. The game often alludes to the idea that by killing a Reaper, we grabbed their attention. To delay the extinction cycle and kill a powerful Reaper in the process would probably interest them. So Harbinger now thinks that humans are worthy of ascension into the ultimate life form.

If you're wondering why they didn't do this to the Protheans, it's becuase the Prothean Reaper failed. Instead they turned them into the Collectors, so that they would still serve a purpose.

In short; Reapers wanted to create a Human Reaper for cultural reasons, not military strength.

Modifié par Internet Kraken, 08 février 2010 - 10:54 .