10369 réponses à ce sujet

[DreGregoire]

mousestalker wrote...

Does anyone know Wynne's last name?

In the toolset Wynne has no last name. I don't think that is unusual for mages though because they are suppose to leave all outside ties behind Often they have little or no memory of their time before the circle

Modifié par DreGregoire, 29 décembre 2010 - 07:43 .

[LupusYondergirl]

mousestalker: she was an orphan, she might not have one (or one she knows). She says she never knew her parents.

[mousestalker]

Thanks guys. I was afraid of that. It may be lampshading time.

[DreGregoire]

oh my you know your living in the fantasy world when you talk like you have first hand knowledge of the world hahaha

[Sarah1281]

I've always found the 'I'm giving up my last name because I'm cutting all prior ties' thing a bit odd. Cut whatever ties you wish but you're getting rid of your surname as well? Just...bizarre.

[LupusYondergirl]

I just figured it meant there was more importance to last names as a symbol of familial identity in the DA world, since the codex says Duncan gave up his last name for that reason. (when he had a good relationship with his own family)

[Sialater]

Surana and Amell both have a last name. But Jowan doesn't, either.

[Sarah1281]

Sialater wrote...

Surana and Amell both have a last name. But Jowan doesn't, either.

I thought it was WoG that Tabris, Brosca, Amell, Surana, and (possibly, depending on if that's the clan name) Mahariel weren't actually the Warden's surnames and only nobles had them. It explains why unlike, say, in Mass Effect when you're called 'Shepard' all the time no one ever addresses you by them unless you're a noble even though it would feel a lot less forced than all the 'your friend' 'your prized student' and all the rest of the ways you are referred to.

[Mahkara]

Sarah1281 wrote...

I thought it was WoG that Tabris, Brosca, Amell, Surana, and (possibly, depending on if that's the clan name) Mahariel weren't actually the Warden's surnames and only nobles had them. It explains why unlike, say, in Mass Effect when you're called 'Shepard' all the time no one ever addresses you by them unless you're a noble even though it would feel a lot less forced than all the 'your friend' 'your prized student' and all the rest of the ways you are referred to.

Beginning of rant:

I always found the surname thing kind of odd. It strikes me as being totally a plot bunny.  Some of the nobles are referred to by their first name, some by their last, half the characters don't even half a last name, etc.

If we went by historical British Isles stuff, only those in clans/nobility would even have a last name, and even they would be referred to primarily by first names (i.e. it would not be Arl Bryland, it would be Arl Leonas, which is consistent with Arl Eamon, Bann Teagan, Arl Vaughan, Teyrn Loghain, King Cailan, etc.  But doesn't make sense for Arl Wulff, Arl Bryland, Arl Howe, Teyrn Cousland, etc.)  Everyone else would either use a patronym (i.e. Fitz-name, Mac-Name, or Ni-Name) or just an identifier "i.e. Alistair the bastard, Morrigan the Swamp Witch, Irving the First Enchanter").  And patronyms typically differed by gender (i.e. Ericsson vs. Ericsdottir, or MacArthur vs. NiArthur, which is the feminine version.) as well as changed every generation (because you'd be Mac-your father's name, not Mac-some ancestor's name)  I am driven absolutely crazy by that Loghain is Loghain MacTir, not Loghain MacGareth, and that Anora is also MacTir, rather than either dumping it for the clan name (Theirin) or becoming NiLoghain.

And let's not even go into how some women keep their maiden names (Anora) and some don't (Eleanor).

It all makes me very sad.  As I am crazy.  And this kind of thing bugs me far more than it should.

End of rant...

[Creature 1]

Any link for Gaider saying the surnames were not surnames? If so, I think I'd definitely make my Surana nameless.

[Sialater]

They have to be surnames because there are default first names. Neria Surana, for instance.

[Sarah1281]

The Wiki claims that the Dragon Age Players Handbook says that most people in Ferelden only have one name but might also identify themselves by their trade or place of origin.

Edit: The position is not that Surana would be their first or middle name. The position is that Surana would not actually be a part of their name.

Modifié par Sarah1281, 30 décembre 2010 - 01:39 .

[LupusYondergirl]

I've got the players handbook, it does. (yes, I tabletop game. shut up, don't judge me!)
From the PDF:

Avvarian Names
The hillsmen are divided into clans, each is which is centered on a settlement called a hold. The settlement and the clan are so intertwined that they share the same name, so the seat of Clan Craghold is Craghold. Avvar names have three parts: first name, byname, and clan name. The clans are matrilineal (as they say, one’s mother is obvious to all), so the byname indicates an Avvar’s mother by use of “An” (daughter of) or “Ar” (son of) in front of the mother’s name. This is followed by “O” and then the clan name. Here’s a complete example of an Avvar name: Arcill Ar Dubne O Wyrmhold. So Arcill is the son of Dunbe and they belong to the Clan Wyrmhold.

Dwarven Names
Dwarven society is made up of houses, each of which comprises a group of families. A dwarf has a given name and a house name. The house name is sometimes used as a last name and sometimes as part of a title. A  dwarf might call himself Bhelen Aeducan or Bhelen of House Aeducan, for example, depending on the situation.

Elven Names
City elves follow the Fereldan standard and have but one name. Dalish elves generally only identify themselves by first name as well, but they also have a clan name that is used in formal situations. Dalish clan names generally correspond to the noble houses of the Dales that they descend from.

Fereldan Names
Most people in Ferelden have only one name. They may identify themselves by trade (Jannelle the Baker) or by their place of origins (Darrahn of Highever) if needed. True last names are reserved for the nobility.

Modifié par LupusYondergirl, 30 décembre 2010 - 01:44 .

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Interesting...I wonder if you could attempt to rationalise the existence of City Elf and Mage Elf surnames by suggesting they have Dalish roots, however far back. They *would*, really...all you'd need is a reason for why the family/your character kept the name.

Edit: As for the inconsistant use of surnames amongst human nobility, yeah. Oversight by writers? Or maybe some of them just prefer to be addressed by sur/first name. The biggest fluff (to me) is Vaughan and Urien of Denerim. Hard to tell whether Urien is the family name. At the start, Vaughan is identified as Vaughan Urien, and later in the game it's said the Urien family is dead. If you find him behind bars, Vaughan calls himself Vaughan Kendells, I think, and since he claims to be the Arl of Denerim it's unlikely he'd lie about his family name.

Modifié par Shadow of Light Dragon, 30 décembre 2010 - 01:58 .

[inquartata02]

LupusYondergirl wrote...
 (yes, I tabletop game. shut up, don't judge me!)

Nothing wrong at all with tabletop gaming!

I'm in the middle of DMing a game where a rogue currently has a portable hole hidden in his nether regions to keep his goods away from guards. This is after the rogue and his buddy paladin (that he totally ditched) set an entire forest on fire. Natives are pretty pissed. As a DM, though, I am highly amused at this outcome, and it's definitely something that really couldn't have been accomplished in a video game RPG. 

Ah, tabletop. Good times.

Modifié par inquartata02, 30 décembre 2010 - 02:08 .

[jackkel dragon]

inquartata02 wrote...

LupusYondergirl wrote...
 (yes, I tabletop game. shut up, don't judge me!)

Nothing wrong at all with tabletop gaming!

I'm in the middle of DMing a game where a rogue currently has a portable hole hidden in his nether regions to keep his goods away from guards. This is after the rogue and his buddy paladin (that he totally ditched) set an entire forest on fire. Natives are pretty pissed. As a DM, though, I am highly amused at this outcome, and it's definitely something that really couldn't have been accomplished in a video game RPG. 

Ah, tabletop. Good times.

I sadly have never actually been able to play tabletop or a forum-based version of such a thing, but my room looks like I'm a regular.

I have the Star Wars Saga Edition books, Dragon Age books, and countless D+D materials. (D+D has some wierd pictures...) I call it "story material" and use it for my game modding...

Nah, I'm not wierd.

[Mahkara]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

 Hard to tell whether Urien is the family name. At the start, Vaughan is identified as Vaughan Urien, and later in the game it's said the Urien family is dead. If you find him behind bars, Vaughan calls himself Vaughan Kendells, I think, and since he claims to be the Arl of Denerim it's unlikely he'd lie about his family name.

Yes, it is very aggravating.  I would like them to stick to the British-isles nomenclature.  It would be far less confusing/irritating.

Then again, I am irrationally anal about naming conventions, and recognize this.  

[Creature 1]

LupusYondergirl wrote...

I've got the players handbook, it does. (yes, I tabletop game. shut up, don't judge me!)
From the PDF:

Avvarian Names
The hillsmen are divided into clans, each is which is centered on a settlement called a hold. The settlement and the clan are so intertwined that they share the same name, so the seat of Clan Craghold is Craghold. Avvar names have three parts: first name, byname, and clan name. The clans are matrilineal (as they say, one’s mother is obvious to all), so the byname indicates an Avvar’s mother by use of “An” (daughter of) or “Ar” (son of) in front of the mother’s name. This is followed by “O” and then the clan name. Here’s a complete example of an Avvar name: Arcill Ar Dubne O Wyrmhold. So Arcill is the son of Dunbe and they belong to the Clan Wyrmhold.

Dwarven Names
Dwarven society is made up of houses, each of which comprises a group of families. A dwarf has a given name and a house name. The house name is sometimes used as a last name and sometimes as part of a title. A  dwarf might call himself Bhelen Aeducan or Bhelen of House Aeducan, for example, depending on the situation.

Elven Names
City elves follow the Fereldan standard and have but one name. Dalish elves generally only identify themselves by first name as well, but they also have a clan name that is used in formal situations. Dalish clan names generally correspond to the noble houses of the Dales that they descend from.

Fereldan Names
Most people in Ferelden have only one name. They may identify themselves by trade (Jannelle the Baker) or by their place of origins (Darrahn of Highever) if needed. True last names are reserved for the nobility.

Thanks.  I think I will vanish my mage's surname.  More useful for his occasional "who am I and where am I from?" angst anyway.  

[jackkel dragon]

Mahkara wrote...

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

 Hard to tell whether Urien is the family name. At the start, Vaughan is identified as Vaughan Urien, and later in the game it's said the Urien family is dead. If you find him behind bars, Vaughan calls himself Vaughan Kendells, I think, and since he claims to be the Arl of Denerim it's unlikely he'd lie about his family name.

Yes, it is very aggravating.  I would like them to stick to the British-isles nomenclature.  It would be far less confusing/irritating.

Then again, I am irrationally anal about naming conventions, and recognize this.  

You're not the only one angry over the Mac Tir thing. At least keep it all in one word! ("MacTir") I had just finished reading an Irish legend with many many Macs used for ancestry of one person, only to find it misused in DAO.

[jillyfae]

LupusYondergirl wrote...

I've got the players handbook, it does. (yes, I tabletop game. shut up, don't judge me!)
 

So, I generally just lurk this thread, but this I had to respond to.

Not only do I have a DA gaming group, but I am currently distracted from any of my actual chapter-fiction projects (with readers and collaborators poking me periodically to do something with them) by my character's epilogue for said group.  

What, I haven't updated ff.net in months?    But Naessa's so cute, and I swear I'm almost done really... hopefully?

And yes, the naming 'conventions' in DAO are whacked and inconsistent.  And I mostly just try to ignore them.  It doesn't work, but hey, I try.

[WeRtheBrox]

inquartata02 wrote...

 a rogue currently has a portable hole hidden in his nether regions

O.  M.  G.

*dies laughing*

[DreGregoire]

well my guess is the whole giving a last name to all pc's is more of a game structure thing than a 'this person does or does not have a last name. I could see you playing it either way. Either totally ignore the fact that in game you pc has a last name or come up with some reason as to why they do

Hmmm I want Fergus to show up half way through origins or sooner in one of my male human noble fanfictions I am writing. What do you all see as problems I would have to address if I did so? Like what the impact would be?

Concerns, ideas, advice, etc welcome

Modifié par DreGregoire, 30 décembre 2010 - 06:17 .

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Well, how Fergus found the HN when Loghain isn't doing a good job of it. If Fergus already tried going to Highever (he says he sent word in the epilogue), and how that panned out, eg. if Howe soldiers are hunting him. Is he with other people or surviving on his own somehow? Cousland sympathisers? Is he still recovering from whatever sickness he came down with? Are any of the Chasind looking for him after he escaped them? How strong are his feelings that he and the HN should confront Howe right away?



A few things, anyway.

[DreGregoire]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

Well, how Fergus found the HN when Loghain isn't doing a good job of it. If Fergus already tried going to Highever (he says he sent word in the epilogue), and how that panned out, eg. if Howe soldiers are hunting him. Is he with other people or surviving on his own somehow? Cousland sympathisers? Is he still recovering from whatever sickness he came down with? Are any of the Chasind looking for him after he escaped them? How strong are his feelings that he and the HN should confront Howe right away?

A few things, anyway.

ha that get's me to thinking about how Loghain could possibly miss my pc and party trooping all over Ferelden. I really don't think Loghain has as much backing as we are lead to believe. I tend to think that the fact that the pc is constantly on the move would make it harder for Loghain sympathizers to find the pc. There is all that fighting between Loghain's troops and some or most of the bannorn. I just got to rewatch the cut scene with Loghain when Bann Teagan confronts him and I was thinking to myself that Loghain's high handedness probably didn't set well with many, but with the Darkspawn threat looming many would not create a stir. Then part of me keeps thinking about that huge army Loghain quit the Ostagar field with. The bannorn is supposedly huge and all of Ferelden is fairy large so I'm guessing it wouldn't be too hard to lose yourself.

This all just makes your point of concern on how Fergus would find the pc any easier than loghain more valid. Aside from sheer blind luck I would suppose if he connected with any of the factions that the pc involved himself with would make it possible for Fergus to figure out where his brother will be next.

I could make Fergus still a bit wounded to make it possible to not go after Howe right away, because you are right he probably would want to go for Howe. Another part of me feels that he is a very honor bound man so perhaps he would put those needs aside to help his brother gain the aid to defeat the blight.

I definately need to rego over what he says when he is found. Weren't the chasind just helping him? Oooooo research!

Modifié par DreGregoire, 30 décembre 2010 - 07:25 .

[DreGregoire]

Do you think Howe left more than a few soldier's behind in Highever? Most of his people seem to have gone to the capital. I always got the impression that the castle was empty of all people. I always pictured the halls bare with cobwebs starting to form. Heh.