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#10201
Corker

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Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

I suspect it might have been a DA2 change (Kirkwall being the City of Chains), although I don't recall anything in DA2 specifying Andoral as 'of Chains' or 'of Slaves'. I recall it being 'Chains' on the wiki though.


*facepalm* 

Aren't the chains in the harbor new?

And if they aren't, wouldn't it be cheap, easy atmosphere to say that the Tevinter city and slave-trading center *did* consider Andoral as its patron?  Like St. James for Compostella or St. Denis for Paris.

Then one of those weirdo idols could have been for Andoral or something, potentially foreshadowing [redacted]?

Shoulda left it, IMO...

#10202
Shadow of Light Dragon

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I just checked DA:O, and in the 'The Old Gods' codex entry Andoral is referred to as the the God of Slaves, not Chains. So either there is a Chains reference elsewhere, or the wiki was just wrong? Or was DA:O sneakily updated? o_O

@Corker, not sure how new the chains are, but according to the Kirkwall codex they've been around for at least a few of the city's past rulers. Codex seems to imply they were installed to put a stranglehold on trade, so entirely possible and probably likely they were not there during Tevinter rule, before the city was named Kirkwall.

Edit: The wiki still shows Andoral as the Dragon of Chains under the archdemon image...

Modifié par Shadow of Light Dragon, 27 septembre 2011 - 01:38 .


#10203
Shadow of Light Dragon

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Most of you guys probably know this already, but for the others...

Image IPB

#10204
UnsungHero

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 Hello fellow writers!

I've been sort of lurking in the thread for a while after joining and thought I'd give up lurking. I have to say I've read some stories and I'm quite jealous of the talent you people have. :pinched:

So I think I'll go back to lurking now. :whistle:

#10205
Raonar

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Why not write something yourself too?:P. No time?

Also, no need to go back to lurking. Some fresh blood would do this threat good, i think.

Modifié par Raonar, 02 octobre 2011 - 04:42 .


#10206
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An artist talks about talent vs skill.

Howard Tayler of the sci-fi space opera Schlock Mercenary speaks on the same topic:
Part 1 Part 2 Part 3 Part 4

Also ties into the quote SoLD posted above...

Modifié par Corker, 02 octobre 2011 - 06:23 .


#10207
Merilsell

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Whohoo, I have justly received my 400th review for OEaH. :D

On the other hand, it is insane, really, :blink:  (I'd have expected to get 100 in the end, at best)

#10208
Maria13

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Congrats Meri!!

#10209
Klidi

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Hm... If I hear someone play violin really great, I also say, 'wow, you're so talented' - but that doesn't mean I'm not aware it takes long years of playing to get great (in fact, having a neighbour who tries to learn playing violin for fifteen years now, I have very good idea).

Now, even if I decided 'I want to play like this' and my Wish-O-Matic Genie would made me play violin for hours every day, and study everything there is about the playing violin, it still wouldn't help. 8, 18 or 118 years of practice - the result would be the same - an accoustic weapon. Because the sad truth is, I don't have the ear for harmony and I don't feel musical rhythm.

So no, hard work is not enough. You need talent.

I wished someone finally explained it to my neighbour. :pinched:

In writing, talent is the ability to bring something new, fresh - be it idea, style, different take on some matter, language - or in other words, the ability to perceive the world differently and to mediate it to the readers. And that is something that can't be learnt. One can improve his skills, you can study all there is about how to create plot and write strong dialouges and avoid adjectives, but without talent, it's still nothing. Yes, he can even get published.

And then people will buy a cheap paperback, read it in a plane, then toss it in the nearest bin together with paper coca-cola cup, and forget it within two days. It will collect dust in libraries, once in ten years read by someone with too much free time, or a fanatic trying to discover an overlooked talent. :?

It's sad and unfair and depressing, but it's reality.

That doen't mean that people should stop writing and trying to improve, only that they should be realistic in their expectation and the know the truth about their writing and why they write. Because if they write for fun, or if they write because they have some ambitions to become known as writers - published, sold and read -  those are two very different things.

In fact, fanfiction could be perfect for it - because it's more necessary to find out something 'new' and not just parrot what is in the original work already.

And this rant doesn't mean I think of myself as the greatest author of all, no, I don't. Actually I suffer of severe minority complex, and am one of those who is very hard critic of their own work, as my beta and other victims of my endless whining and doubts could confirm.

I'm told I show some talent in my original fiction, but I know it will require years of hard work to be really good. And I do work hard. But only because I see some point in doing so. I don't try to learn to play violine, because I know it would be just a waste of time.
Fanfiction is another thing, it's for fun and to improve writing in English, and because Zevran in my head just doesn't want to shut up. :P

#10210
Corker

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Klidi wrote...
Now, even if I decided 'I want to play like this' and my Wish-O-Matic Genie would made me play violin for hours every day, and study everything there is about the playing violin, it still wouldn't help. 8, 18 or 118 years of practice - the result would be the same - an accoustic weapon. Because the sad truth is, I don't have the ear for harmony and I don't feel musical rhythm.


Usually, folks think of talent as a positive tendency towards an endeavor, rather than the lack of a negative tendency.

I don't have any learning disabilities that keep me from doing math, but I don't think I have any talent for it.  I'm very *good* at it, after many years of study and practice, but I don't like it and it doesn't come easily for me. 

Or, capability and talent aren't the same, at least where I'm from.

#10211
Merilsell

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Vent :D *cheeky monkey high five*

I write for fun and to get the nagging Dalish out of my brain, because I know she would sing "In Utherna" (sp?) there all my life, otherwise. And Lenya is a horrible, HORRIBLE singer xD

So no, I have no ambition others than to make my own story as good and enjoyable for me and my readers as possible. That should be enough, no? ;)

#10212
Klidi

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Corker wrote...

Usually, folks think of talent as a positive tendency towards an endeavor, rather than the lack of a negative tendency.

I don't have any learning disabilities that keep me from doing math, but I don't think I have any talent for it.  I'm very *good* at it, after many years of study and practice, but I don't like it and it doesn't come easily for me. 

Or, capability and talent aren't the same, at least where I'm from.


Math. *shivers in terror* Don't mention that to me. I think even my singing is better than that. :o

But I think that's not lack of talent, but lack of interest. I was always good at biology and I still remember the fury of my biology professor, back in the grammar school, when she found out I decided not to take my graduation exam in biology and took philosophy instead. I was good at it, but to learnt about plants bored me to death. I only like genetics.

(As it turned out, graduation exam in philosophy was the quickest way to kill my interest in that subject as well. Especially Kant. I hate that man passionately!)


Yay, Merilsell, fellow Monkey! I haven't been there for days, mostly because I feel guilty for not reading anything. :whistle:No time! But I hope to have more time this week and I will catch up.

#10213
Merilsell

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Haha, yeah I know what you mean. I write on my monster- seized story which gives me not that much time to read other stuff and partly I avoid it too, to prevent an idea-meshing. Nevertheless, I put your story in my faves and thus on my "Must read someday-" list. And this where I don't read slash, otherwise, but your Warden is too adorable to pass :D

#10214
Klidi

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He, Zevran is becoming more and more frustrated. 13 chapters, and not even a kiss on a cheek! ^^ Though that might change soon, but it will take a lot more chapters till he gets a real one. Even then, there will never be more than kisses in FTF - their first time is after the Blight, so it's in separate oneshot (and yes, it means Zev is chaste for more than a year xD) and even that is a fail. Oh so love to torture that assassin. >:)
So I think it's pretty safe to read.

I reached chapter SNAFU two weeks ago, but I didn't have time to continue yet. But I can already say that I think that critic had read some other story. :)

#10215
Lakhi

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Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

Most of you guys probably know this already, but for the others...

Image IPB


Shadow, that's probably the most inspirational thing I've read in a while (no joke). Life's been on a negative downswing for me lately with schoolwork and relationships and all that fun evil crap. 

Goals, gotta love them, and I think thats what I need to set once more :)

#10216
Merilsell

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Klidi wrote...

He, Zevran is becoming more and more frustrated. 13 chapters, and not even a kiss on a cheek! ^^ Though that might change soon, but it will take a lot more chapters till he gets a real one. Even then, there will never be more than kisses in FTF - their first time is after the Blight, so it's in separate oneshot (and yes, it means Zev is chaste for more than a year xD) and even that is a fail. Oh so love to torture that assassin. >:)
So I think it's pretty safe to read.


Good to know. :)

Not that I'm opposed to M!Warden/Zevran stuff, because it is game canon (unlike the Alistair/M!Warden stories ) it normally just don't catches my interest/ is not my cup of tea. *shrug*

As for Zevran....wow. That is... UST alert x1000000 xD I wonder how he is surviving that.  I mean, it takes over 60 chapter for me to get to the first Lenya/Alistair kiss (hah, see what I did there, spoiler xD) , but to let Alistair never have some action beyond that in my main story would be cruel. So he eventually...cough....gets it xD
Then again from what I have read of Airam so far, it is fitting to his character. ^_^

I reached chapter SNAFU two weeks ago, but I didn't have time to continue yet. But I can already say that I think that critic had read some other story. :)

Aww, thanks. I have an inkling who you mean, lol. :whistle: And don't sweat it, my story is veeeeeery long, after all. I'm always amazed when there are still people starting to read it. Wow.

Modifié par Merilsell, 02 octobre 2011 - 11:06 .


#10217
mousestalker

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Does anybody really like Kant? There's a Kant expert who claims that no one has ever read all of Kant, not even Kant. Reading Kant as a philosophy major is like eating beets as a six year old, your elders insist upon it because it is supposed to be good for you, builds character or something.

Congrats Merilsell!

Modifié par mousestalker, 03 octobre 2011 - 12:12 .


#10218
UnsungHero

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Raonar wrote...

Why not write something yourself too?:P. No time?

Also, no need to go back to lurking. Some fresh blood would do this threat good, i think.


I actually have plenty of time to write and have been writing a story for DA:O, unfortunately I'm often struck down with writer's block. I know how I want my story to progress, I just can't seem to put it in words.

#10219
Merilsell

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Haha, thanks Mouse and Maria <3 It is not that I have won the pulitzer price (sp?) but it still damn awesome that people still reading my long winded drivel, even after over 1 1/2 years. Wow.

#10220
Sushifer

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Hello, Unsunghero! No need to lurk- it’s much more fun interacting and sharing and discussing. And I hope you do get to write something. I generally find the best way to get out of a block is to just force yourself to write, no matter how bad or difficult it is, until it starts getting good again. In my experience, if you only write when you really want to, you don’t write very much.

Congrats, Meri! That's really awesome and I'm guessing rather motivating, too. It's always nice to know people enjoy what you do :)

I may have to throw my penny into the ring on the topic of talent vs. skill, because it's something I have ~views~ on. But, I'll probably go on a bit, so, er, give me some time to compose it. Long story short, I beleive that even with talent, you won't get good at anything without a lot of hard work.

Modifié par Sushifer, 05 octobre 2011 - 05:58 .


#10221
Maria13

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@Sushi. I agree one upon a time I was a language teacher and (as well as deciding I didn't like teaching... But that's another story...) I came to the conclusion that foreign language was one of the fairest subjects in the curriculum. Why? because EFFORT PAYS OFF... Sure, there are many people born naturally gifted in one aspect or another of learning a language, people with great social skills, people with a good ear for accent and entonation, people with an instinctive grasp of grammar, but, overall, a language is such a complex entity if you don't put in the graft, it won't pay off and the more graft you put in, the better your results.

Writing I think is much the same.

Joe Lonsdale, "writing=ass+chair" :P

Modifié par Maria13, 05 octobre 2011 - 08:20 .


#10222
Corker

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Maria13 wrote...

...overall, a language is such a complex entity if you don't put in the graft, it won't pay off and the more graft you put in, the better your results.

Writing I think is much the same.

Joe Lonsdale, "writing=ass+chair" :P


Very much agreed, with the caveat that just writing more does not guarantee improvement.  You can't escape the need to practice writing by writing, but if you're not working on your problem areas, you're going to make only very small improvements.

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that I've put down a few hundred thousand words of Dragon Age fanfic, and my abiltiy to set a physical scene is no better than when I started, because I haven't been working on it.  I'm naturally inclined to dialogue, and if I don't make the effort, the other elements of a story fade out around that.  Can I learn to do lush, evocative descriptions of settings?  Sure I can.  I just haven't yet, and I won't til I start working on it.

#10223
Shadow of Light Dragon

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Oh definitely...the volume of writing isn't everything, there has to be some attempt to extend one's skills beyond what one's already doing.

I could draw a hundred circles, squares and triangles, but that wouldn't make me any better at drawing a dragon. Practising shading would not help me improve linework.

Modifié par Shadow of Light Dragon, 07 octobre 2011 - 07:52 .


#10224
Tryynity

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Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

Most of you guys probably know this already, but for the others...

Image IPB



WOW !  That is just so awesome.

I really needed that - thank you - only stopped in here for a browse :D

#10225
Sialater

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Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

Most of you guys probably know this already, but for the others...

Image IPB



Image IPB

Thank you.  I keep trying so very hard to articulate this and I've not yet been able to.

Oh, and Klidi?  I hope you can see this:  www.youtube.com/watch

Modifié par Sialater, 07 octobre 2011 - 06:36 .