793 réponses à ce sujet

[The Questioning Motive]

Mr. Woo, I'm glad to see that the developers are taking their time out of their schedule to respond to the forum and fanbase.

The sex scene was just skin in Mass Effect 1 and there was hardly any connection in the first game. But in terms of emotional connection. I believe the character depth (Love interest or not) in Mass Effect 2 rival those in the greatest of science fiction characters.

I however find it very ironic that the Mass Effect series would have gotten so much possibly negative feedback in terms of the sexual content of the Love interest subplot while other games like Dante's Inferno is only getting controversy over the title of an achievement, "Bad Nanny."

But there's my two cents on the controversy. But you can't please everyone. Some people are fine with the lack of "boobs and ass". Others, they'll scream and complain about it. Can't help everyone, I for one think it's the best game I've played since I was a kid.

Modifié par The Questioning Motive, 08 février 2010 - 12:10 .

[Lmaoboat]

I can picture it now: A ME3 banner add with a scantly clad Asari with the text "Play now, my lord!" and "You can play discreetly forever!" "Mature" demographic, indeed.

Modifié par Lmaoboat, 08 février 2010 - 12:13 .

[Mev186]

Mr. Woo,



I thank you for your time in responding to the issues raised in this thread. However, I think many of us here would appreciate an explaination or clarification about the "dictatorship" remark made in another thread. While I firmly believe as artist and developers you have every right to make these games as you see them. This company has had a well established relationship with it's fans. We trust you. I, myself have bought nearly every game Bioware has published since KOTOR. (My PC can't handle Dragon Age). Mass Effect and it's sequel could not have been made possible without the support of the fans. By saying that it is a "dictatorship" even if taken out of context, you risk tarnishing the relationship with your fanbase. As for the romance in ME2, I myself thought it was done well, it was intimate and meaningful.



I did not buy this game for any romance option. I bought it because I trusted Bioware to make a game that was superior to the last one. You succeeded by leaps and bounds IMO. But that success was possible partly because you listened to your fan's concerns and ideas from the first game. While I'm sure not every idea from the community was added into the final product, I am sure some of them did. I, for one was very dissapointed by Bioware's response. I was always under the impression that Bioware understood that the opinion of it's fans mattered. While they are not the final say so, their opinion still mattered. I still believe that. I'm just concerned that Bioware might be heading toward a path that will alienate the consumers that support it .



And for my fellow posters: This thread is bigger than sex in ME2. Please lets stay on topic. It's no use getting worked up over five minutes of sensuality in a 20+ hour game.



Thank you for your time.

[Toastysoul]

Why are there so many people in here that are espousing on their lack of interest in a more detailed sex scene? If you really in fact don't care, then why use that as an argument against having more detail in the love scenes? If you don't care it shouldn't matter to you that those of us that -- do care -- want more. Stop the charade. You either do care and don't want to openly argue against nudity, or you don't care and this discussion shouldn't matter to you.

I have read the majority of posts in the thread, and there seem to only be people that want nudity and people that just "don't care". There are a few that from what I can read seem to actually be happy with it the way it is as compared to ME1, but you thankfully seem to be in the minority. Post after post, seems to be "Why no boob?" w/ a few replies asking "Why do you need boob?".

I saw a thread a little while ago that had nothing to do with this issue, but in it contained the solution: Helmet toggle. Fits in nicely with my helmet analogy I used earlier, don't you think? I'm not suggesting something as obvious as a "shirt/bra toggle" awesome as that might be. Rather add the content in, and add a parental control option to take it out. Those that "don't care" (fakers) can then pretend having that option doesn't matter to them, and those that do care get the detail they want.

Mr. Woo I have to admit I was a little surprised you took the time to respond to forum posters. What part of QA did you work with? QA's spell checker = fail. I'm not perfect myself, but I don't have a budget to pay someone to check my work either. Maybe that wasn't you, but there were several spelling and grammatical errors. Several primary entries in the codex had very clear differences between voice acting and writing. How does that even happen? Write the entry, have the actor read the entry, have a staff memeber listen to the entry and read it to verify they say the same thing sometime before launch. This happens with at least two entries new to ME2, and it's sloppy. The studio recording the voice actor for the new primary entries really should have tried harder to match the included ME1 entries. It's the same actor, but it sounds different.

There are many inconsistancies between planet descriptions and artwork, though that is much more forgivable than the codex errors.

All that said, I'd rather have a sloppy codex and partial nudity than sloppy love scenes and a partially correct codex.

[Vlainstrike]

Satanicfirewraith wrote...
I've missed nothing...
but I wasnt going to bring it up... but the point is nonrelavent.
The ONLY way you can claim that they self cencored is if you can show us a single clip of any of their LI climax scenes that actually had nudity in them to start with and was changed.

Just because ME 1 had a love scene with some boob in it (ok 2 scenes) and ME 2 dont doesn't mean it was cencored. Watch the movie 40 Days and 40 Nights there is a love scene in it where they dont even get undressed.
Again just because they dont strip and show male or female private parts, dont mean its cencored or some stupid **** like that. and honestly the ONLY way to prove it is, is if you have some sort of clip from ME 2's development that actually shows them that way compared to what we got now. So basicly unless your a BW employee I doubt your going to have this kind of clip, and if you are and show it, I doubt you'll be employed to much longer..

No I will say it was a bit of a let down for me, and it felt a bit odd when the zoom out was happening and they were both still almost fully clothed and liked like they were going at it.... but hey, its a minor scene that really effects nothing to be honest, and with all the flaws and steps backwards BW made in ME 2, this is something that just makes me say so ****ing what.

Again, people aren't just talking about nudity with regard to how the sex scenes played out... duuno how else to explain it to you.

Also, if you know anything about rhetoric, then you'd know proof isn't needed to make strong deductive/inferrential arguments about a topic (which is why circumstantial evidence is valid in a court room).  Meaning, a reasonable person can arrive at likely conclusions based on the available evidence. 

And there is plenty of inferential evidence available to back up those arguments, derived from the changes in how romance was handled between the 2 games, the type of media feedback that ocurred between releases, Bioware's responses to said feedback, and the obvious clash between how sex is handled vs. other mature topics.  Add to that a simple knowledge... a cipher, if you will (to borrow a ME concept), as to how business/marketing work, and how American culture has reacted to nudity in video games up till now, and you have all the ammo necessary to formulate a reasonable argument.  Heck, even Mr. Woo with his 'I can neither confirm nor deny' responses (see quote below), has at least admitted that all design choices are influenced, at least somewhat, by business interests - it would be completely naive to think otherwise.

The clash between the handling of sex vs. other mature topics becomes readily apparent when you look at some of the specifics.  For instance it's ok to show prison guards beating up a defensless prisoner, and dealing with that encounter with paragon/renegade choices, versus Jack's love scene where they abruptly cut away to black before shepard & jack actually do anything naughty, next you see shepard stranded by a staircase without any followup dialogue to the encounter.

Then there's places like Afterlife - supposedly one of the seediest night clubs on one of the most infamously dangerous space stations in the galaxy, and yet the strippers don't even go topless?  Such ommisions stretch believability, and compromise immersion.  It's not just about 'omg i get to see boobies', rather it's about what details are appropriate to the setting.  I expected a place like Chora's Den to have topless dancers at the very least, while nudity in Flux would seem out of place since it's a classier joint.

The disparity between how sex is treated vs. any other mature subject matter in ME2 couldn't be any more blatant.

Stanley Woo wrote...

Aquilas wrote...
You're asserting that omitting intimate content in ME2 and DA:O was a purely artistic and aesthetic choice.  That is, there were no business considerations in these decisions.  Despite including such content in ME1.

I don't believe I have ever said that there was only one reason for the choices made, or what that choice was. I was not involved in those decisions, nor do I have the authority to make those decisions. I can, however, tell you likely reasons why developers make the choices they do, and I can respond to arguments made here on the forums.

Believing that there are "no business considerations in these decisions" is silly. Every decision made has something to do wtih business, because the game has to be sold. And because we'd like to be proud of the game we've created, decisions also have to be made for artistic and aesthetic reasons. Neither can really be ignored, and that's not including decisions made for purely practical reasons such as time and resources available. Can anyone on the forums nail down precisely why these decisions were made? No, absolutely not, but they can make logical guesses that may or may not be true. I'm certainly not going to say for certain which is true and and which isn't. I can but make counter-arguments based on my experience as a member of the QA team who has shipped numerous titles, and as an individual who has worked on projects which require such decisions.

So here's my bottom line: did the developers and/or any other decision makers at BioWare or EA consider marketability and profitability in deciding whether or not to include nudity or partial nudity in ME2 (or DA:O)?  Did those business considerations affect content?

It's not really a fair question, since as I mentioned above, all decisions made during development have something to do with the final product which is intended to be sold and appeal to as many people as possible.

Mr. Woo, if you respond with an unqualified "No, BioWare and EA didn't consider marketability and profitability at all in toning down  intimate content in ME2" (or words to that effect), I'll take you at your word.  Even considering the "shooter changes" in the game to broaden ME2's appeal, hence broaden its market, hence profitability, gameplay changes do not equal artistic changes.  Thanks again for listening and talking to us.

I'm sorry, but I can neither confirm nor deny the conclusion you've reached. Sorry.

Modifié par Vlainstrike, 08 février 2010 - 02:40 .

[Vlainstrike]

Toastysoul wrote...

Why are there so many people in here that are espousing on their lack of interest in a more detailed sex scene? If you really in fact don't care, then why use that as an argument against having more detail in the love scenes? If you don't care it shouldn't matter to you that those of us that -- do care -- want more. Stop the charade. You either do care and don't want to openly argue against nudity, or you don't care and this discussion shouldn't matter to you.

I have read the majority of posts in the thread, and there seem to only be people that want nudity and people that just "don't care". There are a few that from what I can read seem to actually be happy with it the way it is as compared to ME1, but you thankfully seem to be in the minority. Post after post, seems to be "Why no boob?" w/ a few replies asking "Why do you need boob?".

I saw a thread a little while ago that had nothing to do with this issue, but in it contained the solution: Helmet toggle. Fits in nicely with my helmet analogy I used earlier, don't you think? I'm not suggesting something as obvious as a "shirt/bra toggle" awesome as that might be. Rather add the content in, and add a parental control option to take it out. Those that "don't care" (fakers) can then pretend having that option doesn't matter to them, and those that do care get the detail they want.
[...]
All that said, I'd rather have a sloppy codex and partial nudity than sloppy love scenes and a partially correct codex.

I agree, a coded parental control is a great solution.  Allow developers to include whatever content is appropriate to the game's setting and interactions, and put the power in the parents hands to censor the nuaghty bits if they want to.

Modifié par Vlainstrike, 08 février 2010 - 02:02 .

[Legbiter]

Heh, Bioware will have to release a Fornax x-pack for some of that teenage Needs-More-Alien Sideboobage demographic.

[Satanicfirewraith]

Vlainstrike wrote...

Again, people aren't just talking about nudity with regard to how the sex scenes played out... duuno how else to explain it to you.

Also, if you know anything about rhetoric, then you'd know proof isn't needed to make strong deductive/inferrential arguments about a topic (which is why circumstantial evidence is valid in a court room).  Meaning, a reasonable person can arrive at likely conclusions based on the available evidence. 

And there is plenty of inferential evidence available to back up those arguments, derived from the changes in how romance was handled between the 2 games, the type of media feedback that ocurred between releases, Bioware's responses to said feedback, and the obvious clash between how sex is handled vs. other mature topics.  Add to that a simple knowledge... a cipher, if you will (to borrow a ME concept), as to how business/marketing work, and how American culture has reacted to nudity in video games up till now, and you have all the ammo necessary to formulate a reasonable argument.  Heck, even Mr. Woo with his 'I can neither confirm nor deny' responses (see quote below), has at least admitted that all design choices are influenced, at least somewhat, by business interests - it would be completely naive to think otherwise.

The clash between the handling of sex vs. other mature topics becomes readily apparent when you look at some of the specifics.  For instance it's ok to show prison guards beating up a defensless prisoner, and dealing with that encounter with paragon/renegade choices, versus Jack's love scene where they abruptly cut away to black before shepard & jack actually do anything naughty, next you see shepard stranded by a staircase without any followup dialogue to the encounter.

Then there's places like Afterlife - supposedly one of the seediest night clubs on one of the most infamously dangerous space stations in the galaxy, and yet the strippers don't even go topless?  Such ommisions stretch believability, and compromise immersion.  It's not just about 'omg i get to see boobies', rather it's about what details are appropriate to the setting.  I expected a place like Chora's Den to have topless dancers at the very least, while nudity in Flux would seem out of place since it's a classier joint.

The disparity between how sex is treated vs. any other mature subject matter in ME2 couldn't be any more blatant.

But again... people are claiming its self cencored... But yet unless any of you can prove that there was supposta be nudity, and then it was removed, you cant claim it was self cencored.... because see, you cant use ME 1 as a base to compare it because the games are too different.
The only similarity is the character names and the overall universe setting.
other then that really everything else has been changed so comparing the love scene from ME 1 to ME 2 is like comparing the combat in the 2 games and asking why they are different.

[Vlainstrike]

Satanicfirewraith wrote...
But again... people are claiming its self cencored... But yet unless any of you can prove that there was supposta be nudity, and then it was removed, you cant claim it was self cencored.... because see, you cant use ME 1 as a base to compare it because the games are too different.
The only similarity is the character names and the overall universe setting.
other then that really everything else has been changed so comparing the love scene from ME 1 to ME 2 is like comparing the combat in the 2 games and asking why they are different.

People do compare the combat between ME1 & ME2 - often. And much of the improvements (granted, some will argue they like the old combat better) between the two games is a testament to Bioware's responsiveness to reviews and community feedback on the last game, which is another reason the handling of sex in ME2 is so baffling - you may not feel the same, but to many of the posters here, most game elements were greatly improved between ME1 & ME2, while the treatment of both romantic dialogue and sex feels like a huge step back.

Only similarity is names and setting? lolz... not even gonna bother with that one.

Will be interesting to see how they handle ME3 though.

Modifié par Vlainstrike, 08 février 2010 - 04:04 .

[Stanley Woo]

Mev186 wrote...

Mr. Woo,

I thank you for your time in responding to the issues raised in this thread. However, I think many of us here would appreciate an explaination or clarification about the "dictatorship" remark made in another thread. While I firmly believe as artist and developers you have every right to make these games as you see them. This company has had a well established relationship with it's fans. We trust you. I, myself have bought nearly every game Bioware has published since KOTOR. (My PC can't handle Dragon Age). Mass Effect and it's sequel could not have been made possible without the support of the fans. By saying that it is a "dictatorship" even if taken out of context, you risk tarnishing the relationship with your fanbase. As for the romance in ME2, I myself thought it was done well, it was intimate and meaningful.

Then take it in the context in which the statement was meant. I have already explained the "dictatorship" statement in this very thread. Whether you accept that explanation or wish to continue to be offended by it is no longer my concern. I have neither the time nor the patience to ensure that each and every person is satisfied with my explanations. On the anonymous internets, that's just an exercise in futility. But I hope at least some people got where I was coming from, and what I meant by it.

[Gemini1179]

Mr. Woo. I've read a few of your responses and see that you are doing the best with what you have. I have no quarrel with you or wish to get into this discussion. Decisions were made, for reasons that they were made and that is it. No amount of foot stomping on my part is going to get any more "alien sideboob" if I were to wish it, so that's ok with me.



That said, I'd love for someone official to respond to my query as to why the promo armors/weps are not being made available for purchase via XBOX marketplace/ BioPoints/ PS3... marketplace?? whatever it may be.



It leaves a sour taste in my mouth to know that I paid $85 CAD to purchase the ME2 CE from EA.com and I don't have the option to get either the Terminus or Inferno armors. I am willing to pay for them. I'm sure there are those in the same boat regarding the Collector armor.



Can we please have something official on why this cannot be? It seems fair to me, those who pre-ordered get the perscribed items for free, anyone else who wants them should pay for them. How is that not good business sense?



Thank you for your time.

[Gwydeon79]

My whole problem with this nudity in ME1 (sorta) and lack of nudity in ME2 is that the reason the public and community keeps reciving is (sumation): We have our reasons, they are, but not purely asthetic, buisness was likely involved but not the sole factor.  We have not actualy recived any of the reasons.  Any responder whom has had word on the subject has pointed at higher ups,  business or asthetic concerns of those above them or in other deparments.

This is one of the reasons that the subject has not been droped.  Our response to our concern(s) has been a statment of "doing it our way" or finger pointing to other deparments without expression of the cause of the changes.  Many fans have likewise pointed at the media, conservative groups or EA's PR deparments (or related) as their belived sources instead.

The source, no matter what it was, is not what these many threads and posts are interested in.   The interest lies in a truthful decimation of the reasons that the series appears to  have risked less in the areas of nudity or sexuality.  The community has similar concerns about lacking (as compared to ME1) party interactions between non-shepard characters and such omisions as the land vehical.

Please Mr Woo or any Bioware representatives.  Can we recive some information on the cause of these changes? Instead of statments (or acusations) from either side on the source.

Modifié par Gwydeon79, 08 février 2010 - 05:07 .

[Fexelea]

Welcome to PR.

Everything you say can and will be used against you.

We hope you learn this quickly, as checking your humanism at the door before engaging in any responses is best practice; you should have no emotions and never engage with anything but a prepared statement that will conform to all audiences by saying nothing at all.

[TopUSGun]

I don't get it, I found the excessive ****** in ME2 and Dragon Age very immature, therefor Mr. Woo's comment is void.

[Khavos]

Guys.



Woo's a hero for wading through this crap and addressing as much of it as he could. On Super Bowl Sunday, no less.



If Bioware made the decision to yank racier stuff from ME2 or not design it in the first place due to the conservative media outcry against ME1 - and remember, the game got called a "virtual rape simulator" by certain idiots - then they're never, ever going to admit it. Trying to get them to is pretty pointless.

[Lucy Glitter]

SL22 wrote...

Do people honestly feel strongly about not seeing about two seconds of skin?

It's because it was in ME1, that people expected it to be in the second game.

[TopUSGun]

Lucy_Glitter wrote...

SL22 wrote...

Do people honestly feel strongly about not seeing about two seconds of skin?

It's because it was in ME1, that people expected it to be in the second game.

Exactly.

[TigerTongPo]

It still is unclear why people seem to be of the opinion that something which is absent in ME 2 that was present in ME 1 results in a case of self-censorship. What about Mass Effect 2 truly indicates an inclination by Bioware to censor themselves? Is it the brain splatter animation from a sniper's headshot? Is it the increased swearing? Perhaps the concepts of child abuse, filicide, slavery, murder, etc indicate a weakening of Bioware's resolve to earn that Mature rating... no?



If the line between tasteful and honest presentations of romantic love falls between boob and no boob, and if a developer is not allowed to do things differently from one game to the next without vigorous charges of self-censorship, then perhaps the problem isn't the developer, but rather the consumer. Maybe the public doesn't really understand why it's angry, because it cannot reasonably or logically explain why change frightens them so and why they fervently believe change must be the result of some sinister kowtowing to "the man."



Regardless, Mr. Woo gave his answers. Whether or not opponents of Bioware choose to believe his words is irrelevant. There was no nudity in ME 2, yet they still executed the romances in a tasteful and realistic manner. The absence of nudity did not prevent the developer from achieving a desirable conclusion to the side plot. If a person feels like nudity, rather than emotional satisfaction, is meant to be the reward for pursuing the side plot then they won't be swayed by words to the contrary. But that same person cannot reasonably claim that the lack of nudity artistically ruined the scene. Nor can they demonstrate that the scene as originally conceived involved nudity until some additional considerations caused Bioware to tone them down. Therefore accusations of self censorship come across as inevitably baseless and, indeed, like the ranting of a mad conspiracy theorist.

[SuSuSudio]

I have to say I sided with the developers on this one until just a couple minutes ago. But I am going through my renegade playthrough and got to the Jack sex scene - this is the one place where anything they say about not needing nudity just becomes an excuse.
The Jack scene is pretty damn aggressive! So aggressive that it makes NO sense when you watch it because they're both still fully clothed but acting like they're tearing each other apart. If there was nudity in the scene it would look like a sex scene, but since my Shephard is still wearing his Back To The Future life vest casual wear, it just looks ridiculous and strange.
If sex isn't going to be a part of the game then THERE SHOULDN'T BE SEX SCENES! If sex IS part of the game, then the post-pubescent demographic is going to take umbrage when both participants still have their pants on!
BioWare tried to compromise between conservative/sexy and wound up falling between the two stools. Either one would have worked. Trying to do both only ends up disappointing both sides.

Modifié par SuSuSudio, 08 février 2010 - 05:44 .

[Mev186]

Stanley Woo wrote...


Then take it in the context in which the statement was meant. I have already explained the "dictatorship" statement in this very thread. Whether you accept that explanation or wish to continue to be offended by it is no longer my concern. I have neither the time nor the patience to ensure that each and every person is satisfied with my explanations. On the anonymous internets, that's just an exercise in futility. But I hope at least some people got where I was coming from, and what I meant by it.

And so you did!.. I didn't see your earlier post. ( It's been a hectic day)  Thank you for clarrifying. I apologize for the misunderstanding.

[ITSSEXYTIME]

Lucy_Glitter wrote...

SL22 wrote...

Do people honestly feel strongly about not seeing about two seconds of skin?

It's because it was in ME1, that people expected it to be in the second game.

Apparently people do that a lot.

They expected an inventory system, they expected the same character development system they expected armour for your party members.  It seems that the community does a whole lot of "expecting" and then a whole lot of "****ing" when their expectations turn out to be invalid.

Would the ME2 sex scenes really be improved with Turian genitalia and the removal of Jack's nipple-covering shoulder straps?  I doubt it.  It seems to me that people want nudity for two main reasons and neither of which actually benefit the game.

1. Controversy. People want Bioware to be "progressive" and include elements like homosexual relationships and nudity in their games.

2. Immature desire to see boobs.  It's why we see all these nudity mods for games like Oblivion, Dragon Age and Fallout 3.  In fact, they're usually the first mods we see crop up.  It's not about immersion or about "maturity" at all.

[Toastysoul]

TopUSGun wrote...

I don't get it, I found the excessive ****** in ME2 and Dragon Age very immature, therefor Mr. Woo's comment is void.

That is another contradiction. The first time I noticed the fit of Miranda's uniform was from the launch trailer. I never actually expected it to be there entire game. The eye candy is paraded around the whole time. My wife had commented that she might as well be wearing body paint (which is fine by us in any case). Even Ashley found a backyard in the 2 years between games. (Awesome, awesome work on Miranda's body BTW. If I ever meet that guy/team that built her, I will so buy you all a beer.)

It again makes the love scene all the more disappointing because the expectation was so high. You raise the bar in the first game, then deliberately fall under it on the second. If the phsyical sexual aspect is so unimportant to the game, and indeed the love scene, then they should have just liscensed Rosie O'Donnell likeness for Miranda's character. That'd move some copies off the shelves. /sarcasm At least you wouldn't have had so many complaints about the lack of nudity.

Khavos wrote...

Guys.

Woo's a hero for wading through this crap and addressing as much of it as he could. On Super Bowl Sunday, no less. 

A hero? That's drinking the kool-aid a little much don't you think? A good employee perhaps, but I wouldn't extend that too far given the context in which he became directly named and involved in this discussion (i.e. so quoted "Dictoatorship" and "Immature fan" comments). Not everyone cares about superbowl Sunday either. I spent my time playing ME2.

Modifié par Toastysoul, 08 février 2010 - 06:22 .

[Ry3 Sjursen]

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...

Lucy_Glitter wrote...

SL22 wrote...

Do people honestly feel strongly about not seeing about two seconds of skin?

It's because it was in ME1, that people expected it to be in the second game.

Apparently people do that a lot.

They expected an inventory system, they expected the same character development system they expected armour for your party members.  It seems that the community does a whole lot of "expecting" and then a whole lot of "****ing" when their expectations turn out to be invalid.

Would the ME2 sex scenes really be improved with Turian genitalia and the removal of Jack's nipple-covering shoulder straps?  I doubt it.  It seems to me that people want nudity for two main reasons and neither of which actually benefit the game.

1. Controversy. People want Bioware to be "progressive" and include elements like homosexual relationships and nudity in their games.

2. Immature desire to see boobs.  It's why we see all these nudity mods for games like Oblivion, Dragon Age and Fallout 3.  In fact, they're usually the first mods we see crop up.  It's not about immersion or about "maturity" at all.

I agree.  Not seeing a couple seconds of shoulder, or side boob and people are in a huff.  Just look at Jack, she has two nip cups and that is it.  Isn't that what you guys wanted?

Personally I would rather have a more expansive armor system allowing me to modify the NPC's over a "nude" scene.  Besides, if you want one, buy the game on the PC and wait a while, as said above, people are probably working on it as we argue this point.  

[AutumnGhost]

jpetrey123 wrote...

i dont think you realize just how many of those threads there has been. if you people want nudity look at porn or watch HBO. i mean seriously they are pixels!!!

Porn on monitors or TV may as well be just as real to anyone as pixels are.  The falsehood here is that you assume people are getting excited when they see naked pixels.  The sex-scene in mass effect 1/2 is not porn, nor should it be treated as such.  
The argument that it is such because they are pixels is quite frankly, retarded.  Why play games, why play violent video games, why drudge through hours of conversation and be caught up in the stories of these characters?  It's nothing but pixels.  Movies are fantasy, porn is fantasy, by your reasoning, nobody should feel anything about these mediums.

But again, the sex-scenes in this game aren't to 'get off'.  But to portray a sex scene with practically full on clothes is silly.  I'd rather have a fade to black than what we got in this game, or there are other ways to tastefully do this...without being lame.