889 réponses à ce sujet

[JamesMoriarty123]

For the last hour I've only been in it for the ****s and giggles. I really dont care either way. Bioware fire and foremost approach everything with a sense of taste, unlike these crazy ******'s with their deluded fantasies.

Anyways, I'm off. Got a day of NONGAY Mass Effect ahead of me tomorrow, gonna be wacthing some sweet Hetero drama play out with Ash and Tali

Bai Bai, Peace Red, I'm with ye all teh way!

[Clova]

illerianna wrote...

GrimmjawJin wrote...

LOL @ the guys fighting over gay stuff.... no offence. Ultimately what it boils down to is, we can only give suggestions on these forums. Its up to the developers/writers to decide if shepard will be gay or he won't. Fighting over this issue like idiots won't change this fact. So peace out, keep your fingers crossed and we'll see who gets lucky.

Just saw this before I tabbed back in to DA...

Mean offense. Really. I love laughing at myself. I'm a complete retard, and I sure know it. I'm well aware this is pointless, but it's still mildly entertaining.

This thread is like crack. I'm addicted to the stupidity.

Agreed. Reading this thread, even the stuff i posted when i was bored, gave me the giggles. Its certainly more productive to giggle at this then trying to argue.

[MassFrost]

Riot Ring wrote...

Quit turning this forum into your anti-gay soapbox. You dont want gay shepard, dont make one. Just because he might have the chance to be gay, doesnt mean you have to get 1912 on the idea and not play the game. Quit being a homophobic moron and play the game. Make whoever you want Shepard to be.

Why the hell did you quote yourself in your own sig? That has to be the most retarded thing I've ever seen.

[PyroFreak301]

illerianna wrote...

GrimmjawJin wrote...

LOL @ the guys fighting over gay stuff.... no offence. Ultimately what it boils down to is, we can only give suggestions on these forums. Its up to the developers/writers to decide if shepard will be gay or he won't. Fighting over this issue like idiots won't change this fact. So peace out, keep your fingers crossed and we'll see who gets lucky.

Just saw this before I tabbed back in to DA...

Mean offense. Really. I love laughing at myself. I'm a complete retard, and I sure know it. I'm well aware this is pointless, but it's still mildly entertaining.

This thread is like crack. I'm addicted to the stupidity.

I'm bookmarking this page.

It's just got so much potential.

[pedal2metal]

I personally have no interest in a homosexual shepard (although doesn't that mean lesbianism is out too in the strictest of denotations of homosexuality?). I bet a lot of guys won't like that! However, so long as Bioware keeps ME true to the franchise & the sexuality implementation form where that the player must initiate sexual remarks, innuendo, & advances, I don't really care.  However, demographically speaking, I wouldn't expect much change over the next 3 years so I'd expect similar approach for ME3.  They are running a business, not a political campaign.

If they shift over to a DAO style where sexuality is forced on you by your silly teammate remarks made out of the blue with no prompting by the player, I'm going to be pissed. I hate that kind of crap, hetero or ******. I'm the player, I'll say when we start flirting, not the damn NPC (i.e.: game developer). That's one thing that turned me off in DAO. No subtlety at all. Just sophomoric sexuality at it's worst. That's fine if you're 16 but at 41, 2 marriages, & 3 kids later, it's just boring now.

I guess that's why I liked Samara the best in my crew. Unfortunately, I couldn't romance her. She has an elegance & depth I find alluring more so than raw physical attraction alone although she was attractive IMO also. Miranda is definitely a cold fish. Good for a roll in the sack but not much else IMO. All body & brains but no soul. Yuch!

best regards,
Pedal2Metal

Modifié par pedal2metal, 07 février 2010 - 03:58 .

[Ziggeh]

Creid-X wrote...

ziggehunderslash wrote...
Would it be okay if you had avoided all romantic envolvement up to that point, and "suddenly" took an interest in guys? Or had always been into guys, but the pressure of living in a morally backwards society made him overcompensate with a series of brief and meaningless female sexual relationships, but having met a man he deeply cares for is finally forced to face his sexually identity?

Because I bet neither of those ever happen.

The problem is that no one just turns homosexual suddenly, and there are absolutely no indication  whatsoever not even one sentence that suggest flirt between males, if you get a male LI which is a new character, Shepard will only stick to him? people will want to romance Jacob/Kaidan/Garrus/Thane and will start a new outrage, and the sole notion of Shepard suddenly turning flirty with those characters is a total violation of the established canon, stories just don't work like that

The notion of an established canon in a dialogue tree is erroneous, but many people have mentioned this previously, so I'll leave be.

Neither of the above involve a sudden change in stance, all they imply is that the character that the person is playing hasn't been interested in those specific guys to one extent or another. Frankly given the options I don't find that a huge stretch of the imagination. Indeed, an overcompensator would purposefully avoid, even be angry and agressive at the implication they might be considered gay, so fits perfectly into any dialogue path you might have taken.

[JamesMoriarty123]

pedal2metal wrote...

I personally have no interest in a homosexual shepard (although doesn't that mean lesbianism is out too in the strictest of denotations of homosexuality?). I bet a lot of guys won't like that! However, so long as Bioware keeps ME true to the franchise & the sexuality implementation form where that the player must initiate sexual remarks, innuendo, & advances, I don't really care.

If they shift over to a DAO style where sexuality is forced on your by your silly teammate remarks made out of the blue with no prompting by the player, I'm going to be pissed. I hate that kind of crap, hetero or ******. I'm the player, I'll say when we start flirting, not the damn NPC (i.e.: game developer). That's one thing that turned me off in DAO. No subtlety at all. Just sophomoric sexuality at it's worst. That's fine if you're 16 but at 41, 2 marriages, & 3 kids later, it's just boring now.

I guess that's why I liked Samara the best in my crew. Unfortunately, I couldn't romance her. She has an elegance & depth I find alluring more so than raw physical attraction alone although she was attractive IMO also. Miranda is definitely a cold fish. Good for a roll in the sack but not much else IMO. All body & brains but no soul. Yuch!

best regards,
Pedal2Metal

Liara got me with naive and innocent hook. From a married man's standpoint I see what you mean about soul though. Once you've been through the wringer a few times it just takes that little bit more.

[Kreid]

ziggehunderslash wrote...
The notion of an established canon in a dialogue tree is erroneous, but many people have mentioned this previously, so I'll leave be.

Neither of the above involve a sudden change in stance, all they imply is that the character that the person is playing hasn't been interested in those specific guys to one extent or another. Frankly given the options I don't find that a huge stretch of the imagination. Indeed, an overcompensator would purposefully avoid, even be angry and agressive at the implication they might be considered gay, so fits perfectly into any dialogue path you might have taken.

I'm not talking about canon in the sense of a canon Shepard or canon "neutral" dialogue, Shepard's appearance, sex, decisions, that's all subjective, but Saren being a bad guy, Tali being a Quarian, TIM being the lead of Cerberus are examples of canonicity that cannot  be refuted by the player's choice, and neither is the fact of male Shepard being only able to have sex/relationships with women, those are proven facts.
People turning down romances and hoping for a future M/M romance or roleplaying as if their Shepards are homosexual are simply speculation/rationalization of their own preferences, sure, you are not FORCED to engage with women and in your own role playing world it is ok for you to think your Shepard is gay, but the developers giving you the chance to only romance females as male and giving bisexual options for females is most saying, I say, everyone can think whatever they want but whoever doesn't see the reality is because they do not want to.

[Nizzemancer]

Creid-X wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
True, but what of it? The fact that the developers didn't put in any potential gay male partners doesn't say anything at all about the version of Shepard that I'm playing. All it says is that he hasn't met anyone yet.

If it was impossible to play a Shepard that wasn't interested in women, you'd have a point -- which I guess is why you tried to claim that upthread. Is it? I'll have to take another look at that Samara convo.

What I am saying is that the fact that homosexual romance was scrapped is an indication of where the mind of the developers is in, they wanted to keep male Shepard only able to romance women, yet they have no problem having female Shepard being bisexual, for a moment  try stop rationalizing why you couldn't have a M/M romance in ME1 or ME2 and look at the facts from an outside perspective, it is clear Bioware wants male Shepard heterosexual, maybe for marketing, maybe for story reasons but it is pretty much undeniable at this point, they did F/F with femShep in ME1 and ME2 if male was ever meant to have a same sex relationship it was forgotten long time ago and now is not a good time to try implement it again.

That proves that they felt the need to make Kaidan straight rather than bi. Given the way certain immature fans have reacted to some Bio characters in the past, it's understandable.

Bio developers have always been quite clear in the past that they have nothing against players making their characters gay, but that they don't necessarily feel required to make any gay NPCs for them to be with. I take the devs at their word... but it is conceivable that Shepard is an exception.

I am just trying to be neutral here but, cut me some slack Shepard can or cannot be gay ok? since there is not any kind of external monologue for us to choose or know, but he has teh possibility of sleep with lots of women and there are no signs of M/M romance in 2 out of three games of the trilogy, I'm just adhering to the most LOGICAL conclusion.

You mean the one where we can't arbitrarily reject a claim because there is no evidence to support the rejection of said idea?

Absence of proof is not proof, basic science, it's called elementary school or higher, kids. Might want to look it up.

[ReDSH1FT]

Riot Ring wrote...

Quit turning this forum into your anti-gay soapbox. You dont want gay shepard, dont make one. Just because he might have the chance to be gay, doesnt mean you have to get 1912 on the idea and not play the game. Quit being a homophobic moron and play the game. Make whoever you want Shepard to be.

More anti antihomo protesting.  God forbid someone have a point of view that doesn't align with your majestic one.

You make no argument to counter mine, just waltz in here with some asinine comment about homophobia.  

Your stance is weak, your status is weak.

[JamesMoriarty123]

Well, I'm off, spent too much time here. Fact is, They had the option to implement it 3 years ago. They didn't. No reason to start now, not with the franchise 2/3's complete. Unlucky gay's, yay straights

[Kreid]

Nizzemancer wrote...You mean the one where we can't arbitrarily reject a claim because there is no evidence to support the rejection of said idea?

Absence of proof is not proof, basic science, it's called elementary school or higher, kids. Might want to look it up.

I'll just quote myself.

People turning down romances and hoping for a future M/M romance or roleplaying as if their Shepards are homosexual are simply speculation/rationalization of their own preferences, sure, you are not FORCED to engage with women and in your own role playing world it is ok for you to think your Shepard is gay, but the developers giving you the chance to only romance females as male and giving bisexual options for females is most saying, I say, everyone can think whatever they want but whoever doesn't see the reality is because they do not want to.

You wanna hang you thread of hope on "lack of proof?" good for you but I think you should start accepting what Bioware has in mind.

[ReDSH1FT]

JamesMoriarty123 wrote...

For the last hour I've only been in it for the ****s and giggles. I really dont care either way. Bioware fire and foremost approach everything with a sense of taste, unlike these crazy ******'s with their deluded fantasies.
Anyways, I'm off. Got a day of NONGAY Mass Effect ahead of me tomorrow, gonna be wacthing some sweet Hetero drama play out with Ash and Tali
Bai Bai, Peace Red, I'm with ye all teh way!

I hear that, Be eZ.  Stop by this forum occasionally to let these people know whassup.

[ReDSH1FT]

MassFrost wrote...

Riot Ring wrote...

Quit turning this forum into your anti-gay soapbox. You dont want gay shepard, dont make one. Just because he might have the chance to be gay, doesnt mean you have to get 1912 on the idea and not play the game. Quit being a homophobic moron and play the game. Make whoever you want Shepard to be.

Why the hell did you quote yourself in your own sig? That has to be the most retarded thing I've ever seen.

Oh my god.  Just noticed that.  He's done.  Anything he has to say now is invalid.  That's just hilarious.

I'm telling you, their arrogance knows no end.

Quoting himself, LOL.  He's done.

Modifié par ReDSH1FT, 07 février 2010 - 04:13 .

[Red_warning]

I dunno, it would be pretty awkward if Shepard just suddenly turned gay in the last game.

Modifié par Red_warning, 07 février 2010 - 04:28 .

[ReDSH1FT]

Red_warning wrote...

I dunno, it would be pretty awkward is Shepard just suddenly turned gay in the last game.

Yeap.  Like wtf happened to you between ME2 and ME3?  Cuz I KNOW you were straight for the first two.

[PyroFreak301]

Creid-X wrote...

ziggehunderslash wrote...
The notion of an established canon in a dialogue tree is erroneous, but many people have mentioned this previously, so I'll leave be.

Neither of the above involve a sudden change in stance, all they imply is that the character that the person is playing hasn't been interested in those specific guys to one extent or another. Frankly given the options I don't find that a huge stretch of the imagination. Indeed, an overcompensator would purposefully avoid, even be angry and agressive at the implication they might be considered gay, so fits perfectly into any dialogue path you might have taken.

I'm not talking about canon in the sense of a canon Shepard or canon "neutral" dialogue, Shepard's appearance, sex, decisions, that's all subjective, but Saren being a bad guy, Tali being a Quarian, TIM being the lead of Cerberus are examples of canonicity that cannot  be refuted by the player's choice, and neither is the fact of male Shepard being only able to have sex/relationships with women, those are proven facts.
People turning down romances and hoping for a future M/M romance or roleplaying as if their Shepards are homosexual are simply speculation/rationalization of their own preferences, sure, you are not FORCED to engage with women and in your own role playing world it is ok for you to think your Shepard is gay, but the developers giving you the chance to only romance females as male and giving bisexual options for females is most saying, I say, everyone can think whatever they want but whoever doesn't see the reality is because they do not want to.

You make the distinction yourself. There are plot lines, or canonicity as you call it, in which the player has virtually no control over how events unfold.

Hetero relationships do not fall under this catregory as you can go through the entire game without a female love interest, so these would have to fall under a non-cannon category, which i'll call role-playing. Would it be plausible to claim a role-played Shepard could be considered asexual? If the player has avoided any romance options in dialogue then the answer would be yes. By extension, you could also claim Shepard to be bisexual even if he has encounters only female love interests so far.

General personality and sexuality choices will always fall under a role-playing category, as they have no effect on the story and thus cannot be considered canon. So you can't really say Shepard cant be gay or bisexual according to canon without pressing your own role-played Shepard onto other people.

[Bass of Spades]

Traumacrazy wrote...

Gorn Kregore wrote...

awwwhahaha

thats so funny

"Indeed" /nods like Teal'c

I agree with keeping the option out of ME3 as it makes no sense when you understand that Shepard has some details about him/her that regardless of what the person playing wants, will never change, but not enough that'd it'd anger me if it was included.

back to eating mah popcorn.

[Jackal904]

I agree with the OP. Male Shepard is a rugged tough guy, not a fruit cake.

[lyravega]

Gorn Kregore wrote...

[pedal2metal]

Why does being against homosexuality make one "******-phobic"? Taking such a position does not necessarily imply one is afraid of homosexuals. I've never understood the logic of that implication as it just doesn't seem to follow. I'm not sure why people can't honestly disagree w/o necessarily being afraid of one another. Seems silly to me. I disagree w/my wife all the time but I'm not afraid of her & vice-versa. Oh well, whatever, I'll probably never understand...



best regards,

Pedal2Metal

[Ziggeh]

Creid-X wrote...
 the developers giving you the chance to only romance females as male and giving bisexual options for females is most saying, I say, everyone can think whatever they want but whoever doesn't see the reality is because they do not want to.

I imagine it's more a statement about the realities of budget and time constraints, what with gay folk being a small portion of the market and all.

A lack of an option doesn't preclude a thing, the existance of sub machine guns and heat clips for example. This isn't an argument for, it's just that "it wasn't there before so it shouldn't be there in the future" isn't really an argument against. It's pretty much avoiding one.

[ReDSH1FT]

PyroFreak301 wrote...

Creid-X wrote...

ziggehunderslash wrote...
The notion of an established canon in a dialogue tree is erroneous, but many people have mentioned this previously, so I'll leave be.

Neither of the above involve a sudden change in stance, all they imply is that the character that the person is playing hasn't been interested in those specific guys to one extent or another. Frankly given the options I don't find that a huge stretch of the imagination. Indeed, an overcompensator would purposefully avoid, even be angry and agressive at the implication they might be considered gay, so fits perfectly into any dialogue path you might have taken.

I'm not talking about canon in the sense of a canon Shepard or canon "neutral" dialogue, Shepard's appearance, sex, decisions, that's all subjective, but Saren being a bad guy, Tali being a Quarian, TIM being the lead of Cerberus are examples of canonicity that cannot  be refuted by the player's choice, and neither is the fact of male Shepard being only able to have sex/relationships with women, those are proven facts.
People turning down romances and hoping for a future M/M romance or roleplaying as if their Shepards are homosexual are simply speculation/rationalization of their own preferences, sure, you are not FORCED to engage with women and in your own role playing world it is ok for you to think your Shepard is gay, but the developers giving you the chance to only romance females as male and giving bisexual options for females is most saying, I say, everyone can think whatever they want but whoever doesn't see the reality is because they do not want to.

You make the distinction yourself. There are plot lines, or canonicity as you call it, in which the player has virtually no control over how events unfold.

Hetero relationships do not fall under this catregory as you can go through the entire game without a female love interest, so these would have to fall under a non-cannon category, which i'll call role-playing. Would it be plausible to claim a role-played Shepard could be considered asexual? If the player has avoided any romance options in dialogue then the answer would be yes. By extension, you could also claim Shepard to be bisexual even if he has encounters only female love interests so far.

General personality and sexuality choices will always fall under a role-playing category, as they have no effect on the story and thus cannot be considered canon. So you can't really say Shepard cant be gay or bisexual according to canon without pressing your own role-played Shepard onto other people.

Wrong, Shepard's dialogue shows what he's capable of.  It's basically what's going on in his head at the moment.  Should I destroy this really awesome data because it's too dangerous, or keep it for a rainy day?

What about the Rachni, what should I do here?

When he speaks to Kelly, he has the thought in his head to say you're prettier and I'd embrace you.  With Miranda, he has the thought in his head to lean in and steal a kiss.  

No such things for any of the males on the crew.

If you really want to equip your paper bag on your head for this one, I dunno what to say.

[Kreid]

PyroFreak301 wrote...
You make the distinction yourself. There are plot lines, or canonicity as you call it, in which the player has virtually no control over how events unfold.

Hetero relationships do not fall under this catregory as you can go through the entire game without a female love interest, so these would have to fall under a non-cannon category, which i'll call role-playing. Would it be plausible to claim a role-played Shepard could be considered asexual? If the player has avoided any romance options in dialogue then the answer would be yes. By extension, you could also claim Shepard to be bisexual even if he has encounters only female love interests so far.

General personality and sexuality choices will always fall under a role-playing category, as they have no effect on the story and thus cannot be considered canon. So you can't really say Shepard cant be gay or bisexual according to canon without pressing your own role-played Shepard onto other people.

You just ignored the most important part of my post xD
My point is just that, while you are free to romance freely, this very freedom concept is a lie for male Shepard, it's just like creating the illusion of freedom of choice while the ending is fixed, female Shepards can choose to have hetero or homosexual relationships (whether they cannot romance other female characters is, ofter a matter of no-concern if you actually pay attention, because what players value is the capacity of choosing) but in the case of male Shepard is an illusion, you are given the impression that your Shepard could be hetero/homosexual/asexual but the truth is that you can only be hetero and that's the way the developers want to push male Shepard in.

[PyroFreak301]

Wrong, Shepard's dialogue shows what he's capable of.  It's basically what's going on in his head at the moment.  Should I destroy this really awesome data because it's too dangerous, or keep it for a rainy day?

What about the Rachni, what should I do here?

When he speaks to Kelly, he has the thought in his head to say you're prettier and I'd embrace you.  With Miranda, he has the thought in his head to lean in and steal a kiss.  

No such things for any of the males on the crew.

If you really want to equip your paper bag on your head for this one, I dunno what to say.

With all of these, theres an option to not act upon it at all (apart from story decisions, where decisions are obviously mandatory). For the player that selects an option, Shepard only thinks what he is told to think. When I'm playing my paragon, I dont stare angrily at the intimidate options asking why my Shepard even considered that, he's a good guy, he shouldn't even consider punching reporters in the face! Same with karma interupts, I can act on them, or I can ignore them. If i want to ignore it, I'm quite content believing my Shepard didn't even consider dropping 2 krogan before they finished talking.

That probably wasn't very clear, it's getting late. My point is that if every option that appeared on the dialogue wheel was an actual thought process of Shepards, we'd have a Saint Shepard with homicidal tendancies due to his extremely severe schizophrenia.

If they add it or not, it doesn't affect me, I wouldnt go down that path anyway. The only reason I argue for is because the more choices for character personalisation in a game like this the better, no matter the nature or mortality of the choice.