305 réponses à ce sujet

[Paeyvn]

CrazyShuba wrote...

Basically, if you want to look at it like this, the other races need the Council because they need to bounce stuff against each other to come to a clear answer that isn't too biased any way.
Humans do that on their own.

Very excellent points.

To quote Samara:
"Yours is a very interesting species. For example, if there are three humans in a room, there will be six opinions."

[Default137]

Solitas777 wrote...

How is it that humanity became as strong as the council races in like three decades? Stolen prothean tech? Also, even if the council was killed in the last game how is it possible they didnt send replacements? Are you telling me the Asari, Turian, and Salarians entire military was at the citadel?

Because I don't know if you've noticed yet, but humans tend to expand and grow remarkably fast.

Look at our own history, in less then a hundred years, we've gone from single shot rifles, extremely basic communication, planes made out of paper and sticks that could barely hold one person and a gun, and honestly not even knowing that there was more then five planets in our Solar System to talking about the fact there may be a Multiverse of sorts, having planes that can carry 300-500 people at a time, the internet, really I could go on here.

Its not really that hard to think that Humanity could grow so fast in the ME universe with everything they have gained, they have the ability to study Prothean Tech, and even if that gets used up, we now have decent to good ties with the Galactic Community, which would allow us to advance our sciences by several hundred years if not more, and with this wealth of new knowledge, its not hard to think of humanity growing so quickly at all.

[Kerberus88]

Read any fantasy novel and you will begin to learn that humans are the most vital race. We aren't set in our ways and we aren't united fully as a race. With this diversity comes adaptation. Being able to adapt to any situation is what makes humans a determining factor in the universe.

[WarmachineX0]

Solitas777 wrote...

How is it that humanity became as strong as the council races in like three decades? Stolen prothean tech? Also, even if the council was killed in the last game how is it possible they didnt send replacements? Are you telling me the Asari, Turian, and Salarians entire military was at the citadel?

Three decades, it was over night. humans not being a council race didn't have their fleet in in orbit around the Citidel.  During the reaper/geth attack the council races' fleets where destroyed. Shep opened the mass relay in time, and the human fleet jumped over just in time to save the day. Humans are the only ones really left with a fleet.

Now, if your talking about tech, all teck is bassed off of two things, Prothean tech and the mass effect relay tech. We all have the same knowlage of this tech, as all races, not just humans scavanged this tech.

[Doug84]

vashts1985 wrote...

pay attention to mordin's take on the human race.

we are versatile.

This. In Mass Effect, humans have achieved interstellar travel after only a short period of global transport links, hence a larger range of variance than the typical interstellar races. Primarily because of the Prothean ruins giving us a leg up. 

Also, humanity was unafraid of AI / VI research - hence how they managed to beat the more experienced Turian fleet - battlefield VI's used to improve tactical responses and so forth. At least, thats how its explained in the books.

Also, the Council races have been stuck in a frankly stale environment for too long - they've gotten use to the way things are done. They are increasingly unable to flexiblity react to problems - a problem that afficts alot of older governments on Earth, to be honest.

[mcvxiii]

It is a fairly common science fiction fantasy convention. Aliens have a tendency to get into space then build a huge galatic civilization. After that they sit back, put their feet up and wait for human beings to show up. When humans beings do show up with our "ability to innovate", hope and a prayer, and a whole bunch of gumption we save the universe while the other species sit around, thumbs up arses. The aliens also have one or two human characteristics -- their only one or two -- and generally they are from the our negatives colum. Mass Effect is not as bad as some and they do attempt to explain this inequity between us and them -- some are more convincing than others.

The main thing is that these tales are made for the enjoyment of human beings who are looking for a heroic aventure tale. I would imagine that in any alien sience fiction that featured us in it, we would be weak and essentially useless waiting for them to come along and save the universe.

Modifié par mcvxiii, 06 février 2010 - 09:32 .

[Doug84]

Kerberus88 wrote...

Read any fantasy novel and you will begin to learn that humans are the most vital race. We aren't set in our ways and we aren't united fully as a race. With this diversity comes adaptation. Being able to adapt to any situation is what makes humans a determining factor in the universe.

Yeah. Sadly, unlikely to be true if we ever meet another sapient race, but its good for sci-fi.

[Schneidend]

Nautica773 wrote...

Also, humans bicker constantly. "You'll have three people in a room and six different opinions."

Where you hear "bicker," I hear "generate new and different ideas with fewer individuals."

[Himmelstor]

TeaCokeProphet wrote...

Turians established as council space protectors. Militaristic, autocratic. Yet humans have "larger galactic presence"? Possible that genotypic traits determine personality making humans more tenacious. Seems likely that Bioware intentionally makes humans better than others.

"Larger galactic presence." Not larger than every other fleet. Just stronger than normal.
You refer to the treaty of Farixen. But the treaty only limits Dreadnoughts. Humans compensate with more, smaller ships and carriers.

[Gerudan]

I think, you can see the number of Dreadnoughts of each council race in the Codex and there humans are by far the weakest.



So they are strong for an upstart race, but still weak compared to the other council races.

[fusilero1]

Because we had a large fleet before we even met another Aliens, from the cache on mars we developed our own awesome stuff. Anyway, the Human Fleet is so much smaller than the Turian Fleet. Only reason we saved the day on the Citadel is because we weren't surprise attacked.

[elmephd1]

Solitas777 wrote...

How is it that humanity became as strong as the council races in like three decades? Stolen prothean tech? Also, even if the council was killed in the last game how is it possible they didnt send replacements? Are you telling me the Asari, Turian, and Salarians entire military was at the citadel?

From what the codex says, due to the war with the Turians we aren't allowed to have a fleet above a certain size (for every five dreadnoughts the Turians can build, humans can build one). So military wise, we're rather weak.

The main reason humans became members of the council was because of rescuing/sacrificing the existing council members. Also we don't have much competition when you think of the other non-council citadel races (like the Elcor, Hanar and Volus). We have a moderate life expectancy, breed like crazy and like some character said we're always changing things.

[ShoepZA]

Probably because we promote (and demand) inter-species romances

[RickmanUK]

Because Humans in ME are willing too go to great lengths too do what we consider too be right, We also have people who will push the Boundaries of what is possible/Right.



I could compare the Alliance with the Human "Clan" from David Brin's Uplift Saga.... We're Willing too Reserch into things that the other races don't see as an issue, Because they can get something that fits the job about right. Humans will Make Tools too be able to Refine tools too do greater deeds. That and Even if we deem stuff Unethical/Immoral it doesn't stop us from Benefiting from it in the long run.



Individuals are weak, but as a Whole they are strong.

[Nautica773]

Schneidend wrote...

Nautica773 wrote...

Also, humans bicker constantly. "You'll have three people in a room and six different opinions."

Where you hear "bicker," I hear "generate new and different ideas with fewer individuals."

So I'm pragmatic and you're idealistic? 

[GnusmasTHX]

Why is this even a question?

Because we're awesome, obviously.

That and the Protheans either had an idea about us and deliberately left arguably the largest cache of advanced technology that jump started our development probably tens of thousands of years.

Or it was by accident.

Modifié par GnusmasTHX, 06 février 2010 - 09:54 .

[NuclearBuddha]

Where is this "humans are strong" thing coming from? The codex in the game says that the Turians have like 5 times as many dreadnoughts.

[Draconis6666]

Genetic Diversity is a much larger strength than is really played upon in game. It allows adapatbility that races with low diversity do not have, this allows humans adapt to things that other races cannot. Races with low genetic diversity will look the same, and in many ways think the same. Samara hits on this a little when she mentions that if there are three humans in the room there will be six opinions.



Humans are able to "think outside the box" something many other races are not capable of doing you can cleary see this in game by the fact that most of the aliens of the other races act very much the same. A perfect example are the Volus almost every volus you see in game shares the same mindset and same personality.

[Nautica773]

You know, for all the talk of genetic diversity, Vorcha have us beat hands down. You don't see them heading the new Council though.

[GnusmasTHX]

Nautica773 wrote...

You know, for all the talk of genetic diversity, Vorcha have us beat hands down. You don't see them heading the new Council though.

They live 20 years and have developed only primitive levels of technology. The only reason you see them carrying guns is because krogans practically give it to them.

Also their brain development doesn't seem to compensate for their short life span, most of the ones you meet are nearly illiterate, but that might be more indicative of their upbringing and culture.

More so, regenerative cells aren't genetic diversity. It's just a trait they have. Likewise you could argue a flatworm should be on the Council, as they are equally moronic and of low technological standards.

Modifié par GnusmasTHX, 06 février 2010 - 10:02 .

[Dark_Caduceus]

Ambitious, aggressive socially and physically and stubborn, large degree of genetic diversity=different goals, viewpoints, ways of getting things done. The Turians might have a much larger fleet, but humanity's aggressive expansion has probably led to a very powerful industrial infrastructure that when coupled with the fact that the human military is a sleeping giant could potentially make them a huge force to be reckoned with.

[Jigero]

maybe in Citadel Space, but humans are second class in the Terminus systems.

[Doug84]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Nautica773 wrote...

You know, for all the talk of genetic diversity, Vorcha have us beat hands down. You don't see them heading the new Council though.

They live 20 years and have developed only primitive levels of technology. The only reason you see them carrying guns is because krogans practically give it to them.

Also their brain development doesn't seem to compensate for their short life span, most of the ones you meet are nearly illiterate, but that might be more indicative of their upbringing and culture.

More so, regenerative cells aren't genetic diversity. It's just a trait they have. Likewise you could argue a flatworm should be on the Council, as they are equally moronic and of low technological standards.

Indeed - the Vorcha aren't exactly thinkers. Though the short life span isn't necessarily a problem - the Salarians only live to about 40.

Modifié par Doug84, 06 février 2010 - 10:05 .

[Nautica773]

GnusmasTHX wrote...
More so, regenerative cells aren't genetic diversity. It's just a trait they have. Likewise you could argue a flatworm should be on the Council, as they are equally moronic and of low technological standards.

Well, flatworms don't have nearly the adaptability as the Vorcha. A flatworm, if thrown into a fire, won't become flame retardant.

I agree that it's highly unlikely for the Vorcha to ever be little more than vermin, they just make a good example that "genetic diversity" isn't the key to humanity's success.

(Personally, I always felt the genetic diversity argument to be just a simple way to explain why humans have so many different ethnicities but the aliens all look the same. It's an easy out, if you will.)

[Himmelstor]

Himmelstor wrote...

TeaCokeProphet wrote...

Turians established as council space protectors. Militaristic, autocratic. Yet humans have "larger galactic presence"? Possible that genotypic traits determine personality making humans more tenacious. Seems likely that Bioware intentionally makes humans better than others.

"Larger galactic presence." Not larger than every other fleet. Just stronger than normal.
You refer to the treaty of Farixen. But the treaty only limits Dreadnoughts. Humans compensate with more, smaller ships and carriers.

Because apparantly not read.
Also, Treaty of Farixen goes: Turians 5, COUNCIL RACES: 3, Others:1.
Now humans on Council, can build more dreadnoughts.