134 réponses à ce sujet

[Silvermistshadow]

Here, we are going to post codex entires for why Thermal Clips were discontinued in ME3. Make it as in-universe as possible and make it sound like a codex entry. Who knows, they may actually use the reasons given to remove them.

[Endurance_117]

no

[RighteousRage]

"After Shepard awoke from his weird dream he realized it was 2183 and weapons didn't require exchangeable clips, just as they didn't before, kinetic barriers didn't protect people against radiation and decompression, people don't actually heal completely from bullet wounds in a matter of seconds, and negotiation ability has nothing to do with past deeds."

They can have the Tick read it off, whatever his name is.

Modifié par RighteousRage, 07 février 2010 - 04:48 .

[DigitalLiquid I]

*Does deep voice guys' deep voice*



We got rid of thermal clips 'cos all the weenies demanded it...

[Jalem001]

Thermal clips add to the combat. No.

[MassEffect762]

Willem dafoe: There WAS A FIREFIGHT!!

[Silvermistshadow]

Not really. At least I would've enjoyed it if they'd let us let them cool off instead of forcing us to eject them. At this point, we were better off with the old system.

[finnithe]

One of the problems with ME1's guns were Frictionless Material. With that, you could fire indefinitely. A lot of you might call this "fun", but IT DOES NOT MAKE FOR A GOOD GAME. It is not challenging at all. This was compounded by the infinite ammo you had in that game. I remember playing my Infiltrator, and taking out Armatures, Primes and Colossi with my rifle. Mind you, these are tanks, they are not supposed to be killed by my sniper rifle. In short, ME1's system could be described as "fun", depending on your taste, but the game was filled with gamebreaking items, weapons, abilities and mechanics. The thermal clips fix this, forcing you to switch weapons, and keeping you from staying in cover for too long.

[Silvermistshadow]

And this makes it more fun for you? We just went from one extreme to the other, it doesn't make it 100% better.

[MassEffect762]

Silvermistshadow wrote...

Not really. At least I would've enjoyed it if they'd let us let them cool off instead of forcing us to eject them. At this point, we were better off with the old system.

That would have been cool, they self cool eventually but faster if you eject the thermal clip.

I don't think BW is going to do us any favors at this point, sounds like the shooters are in full force for the foreseeable future.

[Jalem001]

Silvermistshadow wrote...

Not really. At least I would've enjoyed it if they'd let us let them cool off instead of forcing us to eject them. At this point, we were better off with the old system.

It really doesn't make any sense to shoot your weapon until its about to explode. 

[DigitalLiquid I]

MassEffect762 wrote...

Silvermistshadow wrote...

Not really. At least I would've enjoyed it if they'd let us let them cool off instead of forcing us to eject them. At this point, we were better off with the old system.

That would have been cool, they self cool eventually but faster if you eject the thermal clip.

I don't think BW is going to do us any favors at this point, sounds like the shooters are in full force for the foreseeable future.

Good

[kab]

finnithe wrote...

One of the problems with ME1's guns were Frictionless Material. With that, you could fire indefinitely. A lot of you might call this "fun", but IT DOES NOT MAKE FOR A GOOD GAME. It is not challenging at all. This was compounded by the infinite ammo you had in that game. I remember playing my Infiltrator, and taking out Armatures, Primes and Colossi with my rifle. Mind you, these are tanks, they are not supposed to be killed by my sniper rifle. In short, ME1's system could be described as "fun", depending on your taste, but the game was filled with gamebreaking items, weapons, abilities and mechanics. The thermal clips fix this, forcing you to switch weapons, and keeping you from staying in cover for too long.

The ammo system doesn't actually achieve any of what you described.

So no.

[rmp]

I liked it a lot better before.

[finnithe]

kab wrote...

finnithe wrote...

One of the problems with ME1's guns were Frictionless Material. With that, you could fire indefinitely. A lot of you might call this "fun", but IT DOES NOT MAKE FOR A GOOD GAME. It is not challenging at all. This was compounded by the infinite ammo you had in that game. I remember playing my Infiltrator, and taking out Armatures, Primes and Colossi with my rifle. Mind you, these are tanks, they are not supposed to be killed by my sniper rifle. In short, ME1's system could be described as "fun", depending on your taste, but the game was filled with gamebreaking items, weapons, abilities and mechanics. The thermal clips fix this, forcing you to switch weapons, and keeping you from staying in cover for too long.

The ammo system doesn't actually achieve any of what you described.

So no.

It'd be easier to defend myself if you substantiated your opinion. Don't you conserve your Widow Ammo? It only has a dozen shots or so. Same thing with the shotguns, and the Canifex doesn't have that much ammo either. The only gun for which I never run out is the Tempest, and I don't like that.

[tetracycloide]

finnithe wrote...

The thermal clips fix this, forcing you to switch weapons, and keeping you from staying in cover for too long.

Negative.  New damage system does this.  If clip capacity infinite superior weapon choices remain.  Protection counters paramount.

Clip capacity forces power usage.  A moderate positive.  Forces ammo hunting.  A massive negative.

[RighteousRage]

I would have honestly preferred if the combat was just 100% like Gears of War, because at least then my teammates would behave semi-rationally (yes I know, the AI in GoW was still retarded), I'd be able to blind fire, jump between cover, crouch, shoot more accurately, take less than 10 minutes to switch weapons, not have to fiddle with ammo types for their elemental rock paper scissors, have worthwhile melee, have grenades (again), have a reason to blitz, have turrets and occasionally varying combat rather than coming upon some crates and enemies coming out of a door at you, etc. etc.

The ammo was a minimal concession that changed gameplay negligibly, in my opinion. I hardly even ran out, and hardly run out on insanity, either, unless it's an infinite enemy room.

Also someone please tell me how it makes sense lore-wise or gameplay wise for there to be a "cool-down" on changing ammo types, and how this would even theoretically work. "Phew man, pressing that button on my gun to magically infuse it with elemental powers was exhausting, I gotta take a breather"

Modifié par RighteousRage, 07 février 2010 - 05:11 .

[DigitalLiquid I]

tetracycloide wrote...

finnithe wrote...

The thermal clips fix this, forcing you to switch weapons, and keeping you from staying in cover for too long.

Negative.  New damage system does this.  If clip capacity infinite superior weapon choices remain.  Protection counters paramount.

Clip capacity forces power usage.  A moderate positive.  Forces ammo hunting.  A massive negative.

I like you, not for your views or opinions, but for the way you present them. One day i'll give you a surprise hug, with full boner & everything.

[Jalem001]

Negative.  New damage system does this.  If clip capacity infinite superior weapon choices remain.  Protection counters paramount.

Clip capacity forces power usage.  A moderate positive.  Forces ammo hunting.  A massive negative.

Ammo isn't exactly limited.  Its scattered generally across the battlefield and shines red.  I, personally, find it slightly intense in the rare moments where I have to find the nearest ammo (or remember where the greatest concentration of now dead enemies were), and dart in and out of cover to get to it.

[LZIM]

So is Mass Effect supposed to be just another shooter in Star Trek clothing or an RPG in shooter clothing?

Guns that kill people makes exploring more fun, it makes exploration possible, being dead because you can't fire your gun in a universe where NO ONE ELSE has ammo issues, does not make the game more fun.
 
Bioware should be well beyond inflating gameplay with cancerous crap like this.

Modifié par LZIM, 07 février 2010 - 05:18 .

[finnithe]

tetracycloide wrote...

finnithe wrote...

The thermal clips fix this, forcing you to switch weapons, and keeping you from staying in cover for too long.

Negative.  New damage system does this.  If clip capacity infinite superior weapon choices remain.  Protection counters paramount.

Clip capacity forces power usage.  A moderate positive.  Forces ammo hunting.  A massive negative.

Thanks for presenting your post in such a creative way; you're not trolling AND you're reminding me of Joystiq, which has its fair share of impersonators.

In any case, I'm assuming you mean the ineffectiveness of certian weapons on certain types of protection (i.e. SMG's effectiveness on shields and barriers, but relative weakness vs. armor) when you say damage system. You are right, it does contribute to you switching weapons. But I would argue that the ammo system does so too, and ignoring this means you're ignoring my sniper rifle vs. Armature example.

Let's say, hypothetically, that you were faced with a fight with ME1's weapons system (ie infinite ammo). Your weapon choice would be decided on the protections of said enemy, but if you were draining your ammo fast/already low, you'd end up switching. There have been many situations where I have stopped myself from using the Sniper Rifle in ME2 because I knew there would be a stronger enemy for which I needed to conserve my shots for. Of course, the problem with this argument is that there are cases where ammo is so common, one wonders where it's all coming from. Here, I have trouble justfying myself, but I still think that ammo conservation contributes to weapon switching, even though it may not trump protections.

Stil, I don't think this so-called "Ammo-hunt" is as much a negative as you think it is. Dropped thermal clips glow, and fall near the enemies. This is of course ignoring the ammo that spawns by default.

[ThePatriot101]

Frictionless Materials don't block Overload tech used by enemies. And before you could use the Frictionless Materials you had to actually get them. Finally, in my experience I'd rather use damage-buff items instead of Frictionless Materials.



I've never had a problem in ME2 finding Thermal Clips, and the fact that they're universal across almost all firearms makes them easy to gather.

[tetracycloide]

Attempted authorship of codex entry:



Category: Secondary

Sub-Category: Weapons, Armor, and Equipment

Title: Small Arms



Post advent of the thermal clips combat zones were often littered with spent clips baring extraordinary amounts of heat, scaring everything they touched. A multi-species activist organization known as the Garden World Protection Group had long pointed out the irreparable damage done on so-called 'Garden' worlds during major combat operations but was ignored politically until the creation of the mascot "Smokie the Elcor" and his now infamous tagline "Emphatically: Only you can prevent garden world fires." With this rallying cry the group mounted ever increasing levels of support until the Council could no longer ignore them. Regulations where enacted that levied massive fines coupled with hours of community service searching uncharted worlds for resources from orbit for each thermal clip left on the ground. The ordinance industry quickly responded to produce materials that could dissipate heat quickly and allow for spent clips to be stored temporarily until they were again cool enough to operate a side-arm."

[YakoHako]

Jalem001 wrote...

Silvermistshadow wrote...

Not really. At least I would've enjoyed it if they'd let us let them cool off instead of forcing us to eject them. At this point, we were better off with the old system.

It really doesn't make any sense to shoot your weapon until its about to explode. 

Unless you can throw weapons, of course!

[Mister Mage]

YakoHako wrote...

Jalem001 wrote...

Silvermistshadow wrote...

Not really. At least I would've enjoyed it if they'd let us let them cool off instead of forcing us to eject them. At this point, we were better off with the old system.

It really doesn't make any sense to shoot your weapon until its about to explode. 

Unless you can throw weapons, of course!

I now demand that this become a thing.  Do I use the cheap, low-damage gun that I can then use as a thrown explosive?  Or do I use the expensive gun and hope the thing doesn't explode in my hands, the resultant flames burning away the flesh of my face?