134 réponses à ce sujet

[WillieStyle]

CatatonicMan wrote...

What they should have done was implemented a hybrid system. You can use a single heatsink indefinitely and never run out of ammo, but you are very limited by the weapon cooldown. It would be good for short fights, but bad for longer battles.

You also have the option of exchanging the sinks out if you need to keep the weapon cool, which allows for longer battles while depleting your heatsink reserve.

Such a system would have allowed them to make the weapons (and even weapon mods) more complex (and existent).

This is what I thought they were going to do; it would have been far better than the senseless and bizarre changes they made to the canon and the game mechanics.

I mean, they didn't even implement the ammo system very well. Why don't the clips cool down on their own, given enough time? Why can't you store the used clips and let them cool outside the gun (other than the scalding of the flesh part, I guess). Why do they have different ammo reserve pools (other than as an arbitrary method to 'encourage' switching weapons)? Why not allow all the ammo from a clip to go into the gun you are using first (instead of distributing it evenly to 'encourage' the previous)? 

It just doesn't make sense.

Sigh!
The point of the thermal clip change was to make the game harder.  Infinite ammo makes it too easy. 
Your "hybrid" solution would be even worse as it has non of the weaknesses of either the ME1 or the ME2 systems. 

Making the player more powerful doesn't always make the game better.

[tetracycloide]

WillieStyle wrote...
1) Finite ammo does encourage weapon swapping.  If I didn't have finite ammo, I wouldn't swap to my heavy pistol to finish of a half-health mob in order to conserve Sniper Rifle ammo.

2) Searching for ammo is a positive in my opinion.  It encourages advancing on the enemy - as they tend to drop clips where they stand.  It also occasionally has me contelmplating wether I want to run out into the open to grab those ammo clips or switch to a weaker weapon and stay behind cover.

3) Finite ammo makes misses more costly - especially with the sniper rifle.  This increases the challenge and the fun for me.

Encourage, yes, not force.  Pistol low too?  Forces powers.

In battle a positive, not afterward.  Auto-loot post battle.  Best of both systems.

Only more costly if every clip necessary.  Not typically true.  Element is there.  Good point.  
Reiterate.  Auto-loot post battle.  Keep good discard bad.

WillieStyle wrote...

The point of the thermal clip change was to make the game harder.
...
Making the player more powerful doesn't always make the game better.

Also excellent points.  Often overlooked by both sides.

Modifié par tetracycloide, 09 février 2010 - 05:21 .

[CatatonicMan]

WillieStyle wrote...

Sigh! 
The point of the thermal clip change was to make the game harder.  Infinite ammo makes it too easy. 
Your "hybrid" solution would be even worse as it has non of the weaknesses of either the ME1 or the ME2 systems. 

Making the player more powerful doesn't always make the game better.

Make the game harder? Really?

I just don't see that. More likely it was there to 'encourage' use of your powers rather than just allowing you to forgo them entirely.

Regardless, you are dismissing my idea out of hand. There is absolutely no way you could evaluate its worth until you knew exactly where the balance was between heat generation/loss, ammo capacity, weapons/mod differences, etc. 

The idea behind the system is sound, as long as you put the balance in the right place.

Modifié par CatatonicMan, 09 février 2010 - 05:30 .

[thatguy212]

No they should keep the thermal clips, to quote Ocelot "I love to reload during a battle! There's nothing like the feeling of slamming a long silver bullet into a well greased chamber."

[Backflip_Chicken0]

I like the new ammo system a lot. I've always thought the ME1 system was a bit hokey, and BioWare did a good job retconning it plausibly. I like really complex menus and skill trees, but the way ME2 blended role-playing story mechanics with third-person action fights was brilliant, IMO.

I like tetracycloide's idea of auto-looting after fights, like how in ME1 killing things would randomly give you medi-gel and such.



The only inconsistency I have a problem with is that the clips aren't actually universal; it could be explained by saying different weapons produce different amounts of heat, thus the ammo limits, but that's not a perfect analogy. If they just patch that out or something, I bet most of you would quit complaining. The new system is fun and intense.

[Zimmy42]

tetracycloide wrote...

 Auto-loot post battle.  Best of both systems.

This is the only anti-thermal clip idea I've liked and I would fully support this. Ammo is still exactly as finite, just means after the fight there's less scrounging around.

During a long fight still need to conserve, switch etc.

[ZeroXraven]

HA Mass Effect 1's combat was a joke, as much as I love that game, Mass Effect 2's combat is PERFECT. And adding requirements for ammo make the combat way more exilerating and fun. Knowing you have a limited supply of bullets makes you think.

[-Skorpious-]

I like the new combat, but the idea of out-of-combat auto-cooling thermal clips would be a welcome addition if handled correctly.

[Satanicfirewraith]

tetracycloide wrote...

Attempted authorship of codex entry:

Category: Secondary
Sub-Category: Weapons, Armor, and Equipment
Title: Small Arms

Post advent of the thermal clips combat zones were often littered with spent clips baring extraordinary amounts of heat, scaring everything they touched. A multi-species activist organization known as the Garden World Protection Group had long pointed out the irreparable damage done on so-called 'Garden' worlds during major combat operations but was ignored politically until the creation of the mascot "Smokie the Elcor" and his now infamous tagline "Emphatically: Only you can prevent garden world fires." With this rallying cry the group mounted ever increasing levels of support until the Council could no longer ignore them. Regulations where enacted that levied massive fines coupled with hours of community service searching uncharted worlds for resources from orbit for each thermal clip left on the ground. The ordinance industry quickly responded to produce materials that could dissipate heat quickly and allow for spent clips to be stored temporarily until they were again cool enough to operate a side-arm."

THIS THIS THIS!!!!!!

[Darthain]

Sadja wrote...

There is little more tantalizing than the resonating deep BOOM of the anti-armor sniper rifle, followed by the satisfying ****** of the clip being ejected.

Please don't remove the clips. The ****** of the ejecting clip makes me purrrrrrr.
I don't want to watch my character wave the rifle around to cool it off while shouting HOTHOTHOTHOTHOTHOT and blowing on her fingers.

this is all the reason we really need, it gives that primative connection we love.  Racking the action of a rifle after a successful shot is glorifying triumph.