EDIT: this rant is from a meta-gaming perspective
Modifié par 7Makaveli, 14 avril 2010 - 04:15 .
Samara thread
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Guest_Nadia73_*
, févr. 07 2010 01:16
#3426
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:13
7Makaveli
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hmm I'm starting to think that the whole idea of Morinth as a squadmate is a big intentional satire on the choices you can make. you gain pretty much nothing by having her. think about it, you're all of a sudden given this choice that is not even hinted at during the loyalty mission that you can recruit morinth. it challenges players to think rationally a little bit. you have a chance to gain the trust of a powerful ally in samara, but you can throw it all away if you want for no logical reason other than to satisfy your curiosity. so samara doesn't want to romance you, she rejects you. well you pick morinth, who not only desperately wants to romance you but she will kill you if you do. its a parody on choice, thats what I think.
EDIT: this rant is from a meta-gaming perspective
EDIT: this rant is from a meta-gaming perspective
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#3427
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:15
adriano_c
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JohnnyDollar wrote...
@Flamwielder
Here is another
thing to consider. You didn't have to kill Wrex in ME1 either, but he was killable and some players did kill him. How big of a role does he have in ME2? Just a cameo. I am not saying that this will be the case in ME3 with all of the squadmates. With that said, I have a pretty good source to go by and that is ME1 and ME2.
Different context, however. They were able to shelve ME1 characters with a clear idea of how they wanted to use them in the final installment. 2 to 3, providing there isn't a 4, doesn't offer them the same scenario.
-edit. Irritating! Seems I must always quote a post I want to reply to, otherwise I'll be interrupted!
Modifié par adriano_c, 14 avril 2010 - 04:16 .
#3428
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:17
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
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You make some good points and I hope it comes out that way. The problem I see with ME, and it really isn't a problem to me because I like the game, but it has been linear up to this point. The Council, Wrex,Parsini, Shiala, etc... don't really matter concerning completing and winning the game. They affect the story, but only slightly and they don't affect your main missions in the game. You go and buy ME2 off of the shelf wiithout ever playing ME1, and you can win the game with all of those people dead in the default. My guess is that it will not matter whether you have saved the Heretic Geth, Rachni, Council, Destroyed the Collector Base, killed Wrex, etc.. in ME3. I am afraid that this will also probably be done with the majority of the squadmates that have been in the series so far.7Makaveli wrote...
the thing about the squadmates continuity comes down to writer integrity. If you write a character, you want people to be drawn to them. not necessarily in a positive way but enough to make you feel a certain way about them. if enough people feel a certain way about a character then they have done their job. In Samara's case; mission accomplished. they want you to be awed by her in some ways, and in others to feel sorry for her even though you know she won't accept your pity. this is a multidimensional character worthy of more development like all the others are (I'm just using samara as an example here). so to make someone like this and then leave her within the context of one game is cheating writers integrity imo.
lets look at garrus and tali, the only two ME1 squadmates to rejoin you. they were featured in ME1 just enough to make you feel them. a male Shep may want to mold and shape garrus, and maybe learn about more and protect tali. well in ME2 this more or less comes to realization as their loyalty missions all involve the aforementioned actions. all of this was lightly foreshadowed in ME1. so if they've planted the seeds for Samara in ME2, then I can't wait to see the result in the next game.
EDIT: this rant did not take into account squadmate deaths.
Modifié par JohnnyDollar, 14 avril 2010 - 04:24 .
#3429
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:20
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
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You talking about Liara and Kaiden/Ash?adriano_c wrote...
JohnnyDollar wrote...
@Flamwielder
Here is another
thing to consider. You didn't have to kill Wrex in ME1 either, but he was killable and some players did kill him. How big of a role does he have in ME2? Just a cameo. I am not saying that this will be the case in ME3 with all of the squadmates. With that said, I have a pretty good source to go by and that is ME1 and ME2.
Different context, however. They were able to shelve ME1 characters with a clear idea of how they wanted to use them in the final installment. 2 to 3, providing there isn't a 4, doesn't offer them the same scenario.
-edit. Irritating! Seems I must always quote a post I want to reply to, otherwise I'll be interrupted!
#3430
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:29
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JohnnyDollar wrote...
My guess is that it will not matter whether you have saved the Heretic Geth, Rachni, Council, Destroyed the Collector Base, killed Wrex, etc.. in ME3.
that is what I fear the most. but read my post on the parody of choice, I think bioware writers are more clever than that. sure there may be only one true way to save the galaxy, but that doesn't limit the different premutations for getting there. decidedly renegade choices on the main decisions may leave humanity alone to fight in the end, while paragon choices may unite the races to fight. but shepard will destroy the reapers either through brash actions or more diplomatic approaches.
#3431
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:37
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
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Your right, they can still make a compelling story for the decisions, but the game will be won most likely regardless of those decisions throughout the series.7Makaveli wrote...
that is what I fear the most. but read my post on the parody of choice, I think bioware writers are more clever than that. sure there may be only one true way to save the galaxy, but that doesn't limit the different premutations for getting there. decidedly renegade choices on the main decisions may leave humanity alone to fight in the end, while paragon choices may unite the races to fight. but shepard will destroy the reapers either through brash actions or more diplomatic approaches.JohnnyDollar wrote...
My guess is that it will not matter whether you have saved the Heretic Geth, Rachni, Council, Destroyed the Collector Base, killed Wrex, etc.. in ME3.
I talked to one member one time who thought that they may make it to where your decisions did matter in the series in ME3. Basically making people that have not played ME1 or 2 to purchase them and play them and make the right decisions to win ME3. That sounded terribly rigid to me.
#3432
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:48
7Makaveli
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http://www.gifsoup.c...r.php?id=308505
this last burst of activity shows that this thread is far from burned out, not while I'm here
this last burst of activity shows that this thread is far from burned out, not while I'm here
#3433
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:53
7Makaveli
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JohnnyDollar wrote...
I talked to one member one time who thought that they may make it to where your decisions did matter in the series in ME3. Basically making people that have not played ME1 or 2 to purchase them and play them and make the right decisions to win ME3. That sounded terribly rigid to me.
see that's something I can't see happening. they need to seriously revise their business model if they do that.
#3434
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:59
NICKjnp
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So what classes do you guys/gals play usually? Since you like Samara does that mean you play biotic based classes? I play adepts or vanguards.
#3435
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 04:59
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
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I don't see it happening either. Doesn't sound like good business to me.
What do think of this avatar that I have now BTW?
What do think of this avatar that I have now BTW?
Modifié par JohnnyDollar, 14 avril 2010 - 05:00 .
#3436
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 05:04
7Makaveli
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JohnnyDollar wrote...
What do think of this avatar that I have now BTW?
fuggin awesome.
i play vanguards. stay mid-range to up close but don't really use charge that much. shockwave is a must to start any battle then work from there.
#3437
Guest_slimgrin_*
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 05:12
Guest_slimgrin_*
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NICKjnp wrote...
So what classes do you guys/gals play usually? Since you like Samara does that mean you play biotic based classes? I play adepts or vanguards.
Soldier and adept are my favorites.
#3438
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 05:13
BlackMetal
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NICKjnp wrote...
So what classes do you guys/gals play usually? Since you like Samara does that mean you play biotic based classes? I play adepts or vanguards.
3 Infiltrators, 1 adept, 2 vanduards.
#3439
Guest_yorkj86_*
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 05:14
Guest_yorkj86_*
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Frankly, I'm disappointed that Bioware was willing to sh** up the ME series just to accommodate new players from varying gaming backgrounds. Yeah, they're a business, and they love money, so woe is me, nothing I say matters, but that doesn't satisfy me.
I have the very strong belief that the traditional WRPG is dead, and that we will never see an RPG like BG or Arcanum again. Those old game developers depended upon the loyalty of a small, niche consumer-base to make their products profitable. With how much modern games cost to produce, there is no money in that business model. So, bastardize and casual-ify the genre as much as possible to maximize profit. From now on, "big decisions" will amount to a strongly-worded in-game e-mail, and players will accept that as a proper implementation of an element of roleplaying, instead of things tangibly affecting the game.
Also; onions on my belt, get off my lawn, etc.
I have the very strong belief that the traditional WRPG is dead, and that we will never see an RPG like BG or Arcanum again. Those old game developers depended upon the loyalty of a small, niche consumer-base to make their products profitable. With how much modern games cost to produce, there is no money in that business model. So, bastardize and casual-ify the genre as much as possible to maximize profit. From now on, "big decisions" will amount to a strongly-worded in-game e-mail, and players will accept that as a proper implementation of an element of roleplaying, instead of things tangibly affecting the game.
Also; onions on my belt, get off my lawn, etc.
Modifié par yorkj86, 14 avril 2010 - 05:14 .
#3440
Guest_yorkj86_*
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 05:15
Guest_yorkj86_*
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I play a Sentinel. I tend to play support classes in all of the games I play, so it fits.
#3441
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 05:37
Guest_JohnnyDollar_*
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I prefer Engineer and Sentinal. I like Infiltrator also, but a little less than the previous two.NICKjnp wrote...
So what classes do you guys/gals play usually? Since you like Samara does that mean you play biotic based classes? I play adepts or vanguards.
Modifié par JohnnyDollar, 14 avril 2010 - 05:39 .
#3442
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 06:08
BlackMetal
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Trek is on, Im of for the night, see you guys in the morning.
#3443
Guest_rynluna_*
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 06:21
Guest_rynluna_*
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NICKjnp wrote...
So what classes do you guys/gals play usually? Since you like Samara does that mean you play biotic based classes? I play adepts or vanguards.
I've been mainly playing my canon soldier so I love having Samara do all the Biotic ass kicking. I also always take her with me to the final battle w the human reaper, no matter what class I am playing.
#3444
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 06:25
scmadsen
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I don't bother about squad makeup when picking who comes with me. I take the ones I like having around. Samara is with me on every mission as soon as I can pick her up.
#3445
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 10:17
Kudara
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7Makaveli wrote...
JohnnyDollar wrote...
I talked to one member one time who thought that they may make it to where your decisions did matter in the series in ME3. Basically making people that have not played ME1 or 2 to purchase them and play them and make the right decisions to win ME3. That sounded terribly rigid to me.
see that's something I can't see happening. they need to seriously revise their business model if they do that.
Perhaps, but I think it's an interesting idea. I mean what if ME3 is intricate enough that your decisions from the other two games do matter to such an extent? ME1 - Council decision, Rachni; ME2 Collector Base, Geth. What if in ME3 the default game leaves you with a win but the incipitent signs of war between humanity and the other races as soon as everyone recovers because of your past choices? (Something I think very likely if your renegade)
Wouldn't you be interested in seeing what other outcomes you could achieve with different past choices?
I'd call that replayability actually.
#3446
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 10:21
Kudara
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As for Samara's role I'm hoping she plays a big part in getting the Council to believe you. I think that would be an incredible scene. The other role, as others have mentioned is her getting you support from the other justicars and the Asari in general.
#3447
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 11:42
Flamewielder
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My point is, if it was worth creating loyalty missions that are, in theory, optional in ME2, it's worth creating missions in ME3 for "dead" characters, especially if you decide to make the "No One Left Behind" scenario canon for new players (i.e.you're not forcing customers to buy in, other than for a starting bonus and recurring side characters).
#3448
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 01:04
Flamewielder
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Re-posting a nice one from Motivationals (credits to Cyberfrog81):
#3449
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 01:18
Kudara
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NICKjnp wrote...
So what classes do you guys/gals play usually? Since you like Samara does that mean you play biotic based classes? I play adepts or vanguards.
Vanguard or soldier, I have to say I really like having alot of different weapons options. In ME1 i got sniper and then consistently chose it as my bonus ability.
#3450
Posté 14 avril 2010 - 01:20
Kudara
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Flamewielder wrote...
My point is, if it was worth creating loyalty missions that are, in theory, optional in ME2, it's worth creating missions in ME3 for "dead" characters, especially if you decide to make the "No One Left Behind" scenario canon for new players (i.e.you're not forcing customers to buy in, other than for a starting bonus and recurring side characters).
Thats an interesting point, the idea of making the no one left behind the default. That would indeed make it more likely that we would see all the ME2 squad members back in one form or another.
