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[Kudara]

For those interested in reading more Samara FanFiction I came across a new one today.


http://www.fanfictio...A_New_Beginning by Atarian

Modifié par Kudara, 15 mai 2010 - 05:54 .

[7Makaveli]

Kudara wrote...

For those interested in reading more Samara FanFiction I came across a new one today.


http://www.fanfictio...A_New_Beginning by Atarian

that fan fic was interesting, though I disliked the way Patriarch talked...referring to Aria as "girl" every five seconds gets kinda awkward. Aria would be a little intimidated by Justicars though, and I like how it went further into lore about some legendary Justicars that fought whole armies. Stories like that are probably why their mere presence would echo in any place they land on. I imagine they are fictionalized as much as humans sensationalize most of their mythos. But atleast you can say with certainty Asari Justicars have existed in their ancient times because they still exist today. Most of human ancient history is hotly debated for accuracy, or whether any of it holds basis at all, because their are few traces left in the modern world. I think they moved Asari into a more traditionalist type of people in this game, whereas we had known them as progressive and diplomatic thinkers only beforehand.



echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo echo

Modifié par 7Makaveli, 15 mai 2010 - 10:48 .

[BlackMetal]

yorkj86 wrote...

7Makaveli wrote...

 I think they moved Asari into a more traditionalist type of people in this game, whereas we had known them as progressive and diplomatic thinkers only beforehand.

How do you figure?   I'm not seeing it.   They're so interested in gaining all of the knowledge of other species that they possibly can.  They still play the diplomats.  They have a social stigma against Asari-Asari breeding.  They have multi-species universities on Thessia.

I agree with York, they seem like a very curious race which would not be as traditionalist as we are.

[Pacifien]

I think the Code would prohibit Samara from truly turning into a Robin Hood character. When talking to Shepard about the admiration she gets for being a Justicar, she points out how she'd kill the lot of them if it came between them and the Code. The only way she'd become a character working outside the system is if the system itself rejected the Code.

As for if she'd pursue a Robin Hood figure, it seems the biggest determining factor is if she actually witnesses that person breaking the law. She'd probably only bother if either a) the actions of such a person were leaving a visibly unjust trail or 2) she was specifically asked to investigate, leading to her catching the person breaking the law.

However, the existence of such a person strongly suggests failure in the system. So after she had brought him to justice, she'd probably set her sights on the person who asked her to investigate in the first place. It's as she said, her solutions rarely turn out the way the people who asked her for help hoped.

[Pacifien]

BlackMetal wrote...
I agree with York, they seem like a very curious race which would not be as traditionalist as we are.

Bit of both. Socially liberal, technologically and politically traditional. Just thinking about Matriarch Aethyta's story about how she had the blue laughed off her ass for daring to suggest the asari build their own mass relays. Or how Liara mentioned how her mother was pressing for the asari to take a greater role in galactic politics. The asari seem to be very much about exploring the freedoms of one's own body, but stop short of innovating the world around them.

[7Makaveli]

yorkj86 wrote...

7Makaveli wrote...

 I think they moved Asari into a more traditionalist type of people in this game, whereas we had known them as progressive and diplomatic thinkers only beforehand.

How do you figure?   I'm not seeing it.   They're so interested in gaining all of the knowledge of other species that they possibly can.  They still play the diplomats.  They have a social stigma against Asari-Asari breeding.  They have multi-species universities on Thessia.

To clarify I didn't mean they changed them into more traditionalist type, they are still diplomatic for sure, but with the introduction of this Justicar order I thought it was a conservative element of their depiction. An ancient monastic order of law that binds all Asari unquestioningly is a form of tradionalism. Its agents (justicars) are bound to see it through by any means, and the followers (free asari) wouldn't question it. That's what I meant. Now because of their centuries of evolution they have become more progressive thinking and centric, but I found it interesting how Law from another era still binds them. Its at the heart of the their fundamental philosophies, no?

[7Makaveli]

uh, oh



Do I see a conservative/progressive argument brewing?

[7Makaveli]

yorkj86 wrote...

7Makaveli wrote...

yorkj86 wrote...

7Makaveli wrote...

 I think they moved Asari into a more traditionalist type of people in this game, whereas we had known them as progressive and diplomatic thinkers only beforehand.

How do you figure?   I'm not seeing it.   They're so interested in gaining all of the knowledge of other species that they possibly can.  They still play the diplomats.  They have a social stigma against Asari-Asari breeding.  They have multi-species universities on Thessia.

To clarify I didn't mean they changed them into more traditionalist type, they are still diplomatic for sure, but with the introduction of this Justicar order I thought it was a conservative element of their depiction. An ancient monastic order of law that binds all Asari unquestioningly is a form of tradionalism. Its agents (justicars) are bound to see it through by any means, and the followers (free asari) wouldn't question it. That's what I meant. Now because of their centuries of evolution they have become more progressive thinking and centric, but I found it interesting how Law from another era still binds them. Its at the heart of the their fundamental philosophies, no?

I don't know if they're at the "heart" of things.  They seem to be more on the fringe, existing as whispers and legends, the guys who get sent in when the police and the SWAT team (equivalent) and the military guys all get killed trying to resolve a situation.  I still think the Justicars exist to this day because they're just that damn good  

Disagree slightly, they're on the fringe of practicality, meaning their usage in modern Asari law is limited, but what the central literature dictates must be at the heart of Asari philosophy, otherwise there is no sense in its integrity.

Modifié par 7Makaveli, 16 mai 2010 - 12:17 .

[7Makaveli]

you know what question we haven't asked? why did Samara see it necessary to become a Justicar in order to hunt down Morinth? Does it make her accessible/applicable to certain training exclusive to Justicars that she felt she would need to take her down? Would any Asari authority question her if she was just a really powerful fighter that was hunting her down, because I would think rogue AY would be pursued by any level of Asari law enforcement. This probably hints that there are more reasons, practical or personal, for why she took this specific path to take her down. (Maybe to remove herself emotionally from doing the deed?)

[7Makaveli]

yorkj86 wrote...

7Makaveli wrote...

Disagree slightly, they're on the fringe of practicality, meaning their usage in modern Asari law is limited, but what the central literature dictates must be at the heart of Asari philosophy, otherwise there is no sense in its integrity.

I think I need to know more about what you consider to be "traditionalism."  I'm not sure one instance of anachronistic historical holdover breaks the Asari entirely out of the classification of being progressive.

Im not saying their out of the class of progressiveness because of this one thing, its not just A or B when it comes to this imo. Being progressive in one aspect of their lifestyle should not make them unable to show a conservative/traditionalist aspect in any other regard. Why can't they be a blend of both? You're exrapolating what I'm saying.

[Pacifien]

yorkj86 wrote...
Can Samara become temporarily Chaotic Good if Lawful Good would make her the fist of the unjust?

Still don't think so. To the asari, the Justicar Code is the law. If the "lawful" branches of asari society needed the attention of a Justicar, it's because they had left the law behind and not the Justicar.

The only way Samara ceases to work under a Lawful Good morality is if asari society rejects the Justicar Code itself. As we see on Illium, the asari seem reluctant to do so in regards to asari society, but do seem to reject it when aliens with their alien beliefs are involved.

[Pacifien]

7Makaveli wrote...
you know what question we haven't asked? why did Samara see it necessary to become a Justicar in order to hunt down Morinth? Does it make her accessible/applicable to certain training exclusive to Justicars that she felt she would need to take her down? Would any Asari authority question her if she was just a really powerful fighter that was hunting her down, because I would think rogue AY would be pursued by any level of Asari law enforcement. This probably hints that there are more reasons, practical or personal, for why she took this specific path to take her down. (Maybe to remove herself emotionally from doing the deed?)

Samara does say that training to become a Justicar does have a high casualty rate, implying there is some very specific and perhaps exclusive to a Justicar's powers. Get the feeling a Justicar is trained to be entirely focused on the Code as well -- to become a Justicar is a binding oath to the cause. The hunt for Morinth just happens to fit into a Justicar's role.

Not only that, but being a Justicar allowed Samara great privilege within asari society. If she needs to break the neck of someone to get more information about Morinth, under asari beliefs, she is entirely within her right to do so as a Justicar.

Reminds me of something Shepard could ask Captain Anderson in the first game: if a Justicar goes rogue, who goes after the Justicar? I guess others of the Justicar order could declare one as no longer enjoying the benefit of the title, but how would a layman know when one is or isn't a Justicar?

Made me think of the biotic field Samara projected when she took her oath to serve Shepard. I wonder if a Justicar has to go through a certain ritual that changes their aura such that other asari could instantly recognize them as followers of the Code.

[7Makaveli]

yorkj86 wrote...


 I guess that wasn't the case.

Far from it, my friend.

To clarify I didn't mean they changed them into more traditionalist
type, they are still diplomatic for sure, but with the introduction of
this Justicar order I thought it was a conservative element of their
depiction